B98.5 #1 Rated station

[RAME]

Kabrich,

I was the one who brought up the point about Radio's Cume and how it affects advertising along with the point about audience erosion in TV due in part to DVR's. You are definitely wrong for the following reasons:

1) If the clients are setting the agenda then you would know that the only important piece of information to that client would be a Station's Cume. A client wants to know how many potential customers he can gain by advertising on a particular station and that is found through the Cume#, not Average Quarter Hour Ratings. Clients want their cash register to ring so they can stay in business. I have never heard a client say, "What is your Average Quarter Hour Rating"...never!!! The Advertising Agencies are the ones who care about Average Quarter Hour Ratings. Agencies place buys based on their designated Cost Per Point (What the Agency is willing to pay for 1 Average Quarter Hour Rating Point). A Cost Per Point allows the Agencies to make an apples to apples comparison with different Radio Stations. The Radio Station's Average Quarter Hour Rating is what is used to figure what a Radio Station can charge to reach the Agency's Cost Per Point.

Summary: Client's care about Cume and Agencies care about Average Quarter Hour Ratings/Cost Per Points.

2) The research might show that people are watching more TV because of DVR's but it is not mentioning all those DVR watchers who are skipping the commercials. The whole purpose of a DVR is to watch a program at your convenience and to blow through commercials. Anyone out there who owns a DVR knows what I am talking about. If you owned a business and needed to advertise wouldn't you be a little concerned that your commercial is getting skipped over?

One more thing...In my example I define a Client as the Owner/Decision Maker. I do not define a Client in this exercise as a Marketing Manager, Advertising Manager, etc.

RAME

 

[RTibbs]

Kabrich,

I was the one who brought up the point about Radio's Cume and how it affects advertising along with the point about audience erosion in TV due in part to DVR's. You are definitely wrong....

RAME

Uh oh, here we go this is going to get good. We just need DavidEduardo to breakdown HDHA, throw some popcorn in the microwave and sit back and enjoy the sword fight.

 

[RAME]

Instigator

 

[RoddyFreeman]

Reach & frequency models are based on a combination of AQH and Cume. But achieving a designated reach and frequency means buying a certain number of rating points, which means using AQH ratings to get them. Of course, new reach & frequency models will need to be done based on the PPM's lower AQH and higher cume. But we'll still be buying rating points (GRP's), meaning AQH as opposed to cume.

The Radio Advertising Bureau can use cume to show radio reaches a huge number of consumers. But an advertising schedule is never going to reach anywhere near a station's cume. If an advertiser's spot ran every hour, its reach would be fairly close to the cume. But that doesn't happen.

As a buyer, I use cumes and TSL to guide me regarding how many spots per hour to buy. For example, I tend to place more spots on a station with a low TSL but high cume than on a station with high time spent listening, in order to get sufficient frequency on both stations. I also look at which stations a high cume/low TSL station duplicates with as a way of getting frequency. In other words, where do all-news station listeners go after they get the latest headlines?

 

[Kabrich]

Kabrich,

I was the one who brought up the point about Radio's Cume and how it affects advertising along with the point about audience erosion in TV due in part to DVR's. You are definitely wrong for the following reasons:

1) If the clients are setting the agenda then you would know that the only important piece of information to that client would be a Station's Cume. A client wants to know how many potential customers he can gain by advertising on a particular station and that is found through the Cume#, not Average Quarter Hour Ratings. Clients want their cash register to ring so they can stay in business. I have never heard a client say, "What is your Average Quarter Hour Rating"...never!!! The Advertising Agencies are the ones who care about Average Quarter Hour Ratings. Agencies place buys based on their designated Cost Per Point (What the Agency is willing to pay for 1 Average Quarter Hour Rating Point). A Cost Per Point allows the Agencies to make an apples to apples comparison with different Radio Stations. The Radio Station's Average Quarter Hour Rating is what is used to figure what a Radio Station can charge to reach the Agency's Cost Per Point.

Summary: Client's care about Cume and Agencies care about Average Quarter Hour Ratings/Cost Per Points.

2) The research might show that people are watching more TV because of DVR's but it is not mentioning all those DVR watchers who are skipping the commercials. The whole purpose of a DVR is to watch a program at your convenience and to blow through commercials. Anyone out there who owns a DVR knows what I am talking about. If you owned a business and needed to advertise wouldn't you be a little concerned that your commercial is getting skipped over?

One more thing...In my example I define a Client as the Owner/Decision Maker. I do not define a Client in this exercise as a Marketing Manager, Advertising Manager, etc.

RAME

Then I would suggest you have all clients drop their Advertising Agencies and buy directly with the station. There are plenty of good Account Execs that will be happy to sell them time. The "final customers" don't do that, instead, investing their money with Ad Agencies who's advice they pay attention to.

If you are truly the client and you want Cume, then the power is in your hands to make the change - not the radio stations. BTW, you will need to change the model for every other form of advertising as well.

Good Luck!

 

[RAME]

Kabrich,

Earlier you said Agencies do what the Client says and now you are saying that Clients pay their Agencies for their advice. My argument was based on your original statement but now you are moving the argument. I am done with that discussion.

Agencies play a vital role in developing and implementing the right Marketing Plan for clients and I am not arguing that point. My point was that Radio should be included in the Media Mix at the same levels as Broadcast TV or even be a substitute for TV.

My final point in which I agree with you on: The Advertising/Buying Model does need to change and it is. Getting Results for Clients at the right price is all that matters at the end of the day.

I appreciate the debate.

RAME

 

[Mitchell]

Bummer.

A spirited debate, gentlemen!

 

[OutOfTheBiz]

Here are the top 30 stations AQH, 12-plus in Atlanta covering September 18 through October 15, 2008

1- WSB-AM, 2- V-103, 3- Kiss 104.1, 4-Kicks 101.5 5- (tie) B98.5 5- Praise 7-River 8-Q100 9-95.5/The Beat 10- Hot 107.9

11- Star 94 12- El Patron 13- Grown Folks 14- Project 15- WABE-FM (yes, now we can have noncommercial stations numbers, too) 15-(tie) Viva 17- 104.7/The Fish 18- Smooth Jazz 107.5 19-Dave 92.9 20- True Oldies 106.7

21- 94.9/The Bull 21 (tie) -680/The Fan 23- WGST-AM 24- Rock 100.5 25- 790/The Zone 26- Legends 96.7 27- La Raza 102.3 28- J93.3 28 (tie) 920/WGKA-AM 30- WAOK-AM

True Oldies and their 5,000 song playlist moves from #12 to #20.

Where is GoodTimeOldies to tell us for the 50th time about how the station is on "fire"!

Well, there's smoke coming from the building. But I don't think that's the kind of "fire" he thinks it is.

 

[Mitchell]

Hey, for some interesting reading on this subject we've discussed here, check out Tom Taylor's column today (11/7) here on R-I. In particular, what Lew Dickey had to say about it.

 

[Kabrich]

Kabrich,

Earlier you said Agencies do what the Client says and now you are saying that Clients pay their Agencies for their advice. My argument was based on your original statement but now you are moving the argument. I am done with that discussion.

Agencies play a vital role in developing and implementing the right Marketing Plan for clients and I am not arguing that point. My point was that Radio should be included in the Media Mix at the same levels as Broadcast TV or even be a substitute for TV.

My final point in which I agree with you on: The Advertising/Buying Model does need to change and it is. Getting Results for Clients at the right price is all that matters at the end of the day.

I appreciate the debate.

RAME

No, advertising agencies are the client for Radio and Radio sells the Client (Ad Agencies) what they want to buy (Rating Points).

Unfortunately, those who you claim want only to have their cash register ring do not know how to get results so they turn to advertising agencies and follow their advice. As stated, there are many radio salespeople out there that will be happy to help them if they so desire, but as all big advertisers have an agency, the smaller companies believe that they must as well.

Again, Radio is not in a position to change the metrics (Cume v Rating Points) of what the Client wants, nor is radio about to bite the hands that feeds it (the ad agencies).