BIG changes coming to Mid-Ohio

[ATyler]

Turnover

Interesting points..

My thing is this: The same SONG by the same artist in the same hour? NO. NEVER. Different songs by the same artist in the same artist? If it's a core artist (i.e., Mariah, Kelly, Usher, Nelly, 50 Cent, Black Eyed Peas, Eminem, Gwen Stefani), sure, as long as you separate them sufficiently.

When you say, in regard to WNCI, "3 same artist songs in 90 minutes," I assume you're referring to a particular artist having 2 or 3 (if one of the records is a power rotation record for the station) songs played in that 90 minutes? If that's the case, there's nothing wrong with that, particularly given the short attention span of the listener.

ALSO, how do you treat, for example, a Ludacris or someone else who not only has their OWN songs in rotation, but is ALSO on other artists' records? In the case of my current library, I have a Ludacris song (Pimpin' All Over the World) in light rotation, two that he is a significant part of (Yeah! and Sugar) in power recurrent, and another (Ciara- Oh!) that he is a significant part of in sub-power rotation... Sometimes, I struggle to get sufficient separation on him.

It all comes down to the style of programmer that is doing the music... If they're more concerned about "3 same artist songs in 90 minutes" than they are about "playing the HITS," then they have no business being a CHR programmer. In the end, it comes down to how well the person knows what they're doing and how they separate their artists.

Oh yeah... and those annoying things called diaries, too. <P ID="signature">______________
Aaron Tyler
Afternoons / MD
WVZA / Marion - Carbondale, IL
www.kissfm927.com

Weekends / Swing
KSLZ / St. Louis
WAKZ / Youngstown, OH
</P>

 

[THEintern]

Re: Y105/KISS music

>
> The New Y-105 is in the works and making the transition from
> my understanding. It is to be Implemented on Sept. 1st same
> with the switch to 3 Towers Of Power.


It would seem to be a work in progress, as many of the old sweepers still run, just the jocks have changed the positioning statement.
80's at 8 also ran tonight. That's not a way to win over a CHR demo. I'd expect it to be dropped soon.

 

[zradionet]

Re: Y105/KISS music

> >
> > The New Y-105 is in the works and making the transition
> from
> > my understanding. It is to be Implemented on Sept. 1st
> same
> > with the switch to 3 Towers Of Power.
>
>
> It would seem to be a work in progress, as many of the old
> sweepers still run, just the jocks have changed the
> positioning statement.
> 80's at 8 also ran tonight. That's not a way to win over a
> CHR demo. I'd expect it to be dropped soon.
>


I meant to say a work in progress. Thanks for the correction. I'm just passing along information I know of. From what I told Y-105 will start adjusting to CHR and the effective date will be September 1st. Of course in radio there are delays but this is what I was informed of from the inside. How true it is well...we will have to wait to see.

I agree. keeping 80's at 8 is a little strange this late in the game. Could it be the final week?

 

[scoob]

Re: Y105/KISS music

They're definitely not 100% converted yet, especially with the KISS dual frequency simulcast still very much intact. The early Sept. rollout of changes makes sense. Probably not fair to criticize the music flow on 'YHT just yet.


> >
> > The New Y-105 is in the works and making the transition
> from
> > my understanding. It is to be Implemented on Sept. 1st
> same
> > with the switch to 3 Towers Of Power.
>
>
> It would seem to be a work in progress, as many of the old
> sweepers still run, just the jocks have changed the
> positioning statement.
> 80's at 8 also ran tonight. That's not a way to win over a
> CHR demo. I'd expect it to be dropped soon.
>

 

[JohnnyMorganWXJX]

Re: Turnover

> Interesting points..
>
> My thing is this: The same SONG by the same artist in the
> same hour? NO. NEVER. Different songs by the same artist
> in the same artist? If it's a core artist (i.e., Mariah,
> Kelly, Usher, Nelly, 50 Cent, Black Eyed Peas, Eminem, Gwen
> Stefani), sure, as long as you separate them sufficiently.

Absolutely not. Come on--you're all about playing the hits. There's no way I'm going to monopolize my playlist with Nelly just because he's a core artist. Top 40/CHR/whatever it's being called this week doesn't have "core artists". It has whatever's popular at that moment in time. (Remember Britney Spears? Isn't she a core artist?) But at some point you have to get out of "the book" and realize that what you're programming and rotating is objectively absurd.

> When you say, in regard to WNCI, "3 same artist songs in 90
> minutes," I assume you're referring to a particular artist
> having 2 or 3 (if one of the records is a power rotation
> record for the station) songs played in that 90 minutes? If
> that's the case, there's nothing wrong with that,
> particularly given the short attention span of the listener.

Your Number One shouldn't be played inside of 80-90 minutes apart (60 in drive time). Substantial portion of the Top Ten, if not all, should appear inside of 90-110 minutes. Next 10 (11-20) should be played sparingly, with emphasis on repeat artists and "hitbounds". Anything below that, and gold, should only be filler. Once or twice. No more.

> ALSO, how do you treat, for example, a Ludacris or someone
> else who not only has their OWN songs in rotation, but is
> ALSO on other artists' records? In the case of my current
> library, I have a Ludacris song (Pimpin' All Over the World)
> in light rotation, two that he is a significant part of
> (Yeah! and Sugar) in power recurrent, and another (Ciara-
> Oh!) that he is a significant part of in sub-power
> rotation... Sometimes, I struggle to get sufficient
> separation on him.

Assuming Ludacris isn't paying for play (Eliot's on the phone now), if it's in light rotation, then it can be scrapped without anyone noticing. If he's already appearing 3x, then his own song doesn't need to appear much, if at all, huh? And you've got three songs by him, two in power rotation--you've got 90 minutes between them. His third "collaboration" (hip-hop speak for: I'm gonna yell and grunt over this sampled and stolen backing track), if sub-power, well...you're just gonna have to work with that. Is it going up, or coming down?

> It all comes down to the style of programmer that is doing
> the music... If they're more concerned about "3 same artist
> songs in 90 minutes" than they are about "playing the HITS,"
> then they have no business being a CHR programmer. In the
> end, it comes down to how well the person knows what they're
> doing and how they separate their artists.

Disagree. You have a wealth of music now--even in hip-hop--that's hit material (plus pop, plus rock--that Jet song popular now, "Look What You've Done," is over two years old). Any good programmer, and an MD who's worth his salt, will know on it's face that it's a problem to play the same artist inside of 90.

I notice that NO ONE is defending the two Gwen Stefanis inside 10 SONGS (that's 30-40 minutes, assuming no stop sets...then, maybe 50), or defending the two Kelly Clarkson inside 10 songs, either. I'd LOVE to see someone explain that witha straight face.

I don't care what you say--Ludacris is not the Beatles. There was a time when a single artist could garner repeat performances inside of 10 minutes, let alone an hour, let alone 90 minutes. Ludacris is not taking the country by storm (he's actually considered old news in hip-hop); this is not 1964; and there are NOT other Top 40/CHR stations to turn to if you get annoyed. Complacency has set in with Top 40/CHR programmers. They're not THINKING.

But there are Hot ACs, and if you insist on giving me Ludacris, or Gwen Stefani, or Kelly Clarkson everytime I turn on my radio, that's where I'm heading.

> Oh yeah... and those annoying things called diaries, too.
>

Yeah, but when you've got 14 year olds filling them out (see the last C-Town book), what worth are they? Unless you like that sort of thing.

 

[JohnnyMorganWXJX]

Re: Y105/KISS music

> If it's apparant you don't care why post? Not being smart
> just would like to hear your opinion besides short comments.

I assume this was meant for me, since I'm the one who wrote that it's apparent I don't care (see above, from 8/15). I post because I'm trying to educate those who insist that Top 40 listeners are too stupid to realize that Kelly Clarkson was just played 10 songs ago. I also post because the turnover rate in Top 40 is not 10 songs. If you're doing your job, you'll ahve them stick around a little longer, I'd hope. Yes, Top 40 is more interested in cume than TSL, but at some point it becomes absolutely absurd to focus on one.

Believe me, if someone came out with a book that said play the Number One and Two repeatedly, some poor sap would do it. And it might not be our friends in Alliance, but might be a KISS station.

> Also I agree...cut them a little slack but...watch repeating
> songs so often. It is a turn off. I belive that is why
> alot of people are switching to either Country or Classic
> Rock, or like Lenks posted...IPODS - Satelite. People want
> variety.
>
> The New Y-105 is in the works and making the transition from
> my understanding. It is to be Implemented on Sept. 1st same
> with the switch to 3 Towers Of Power.
>
> Let's wait and see what happens. From my understanding I
> have reason to be opitmistic

I also don't care because this is Mansfield. I don't listen, but I do like to cause people to think a little bit more. And start trouble.

 

[network]

Welcome to 2005

> Absolutely not. Come on--you're all about playing the hits.
> There's no way I'm going to monopolize my playlist with
> Nelly just because he's a core artist. Top 40/CHR/whatever
> it's being called this week doesn't have "core artists". It
> has whatever's popular at that moment in time. (Remember
> Britney Spears? Isn't she a core artist?) But at some
> point you have to get out of "the book" and realize that
> what you're programming and rotating is objectively absurd.

Why are you commenting on a format:
1. You "don't care" about (as you stated earlier)
2. Most importantly, don't have any experience and/or success in

CHR doesn't have "core artists"??!! That comment clearly points out you know absolutely nothing of the format.

> Your Number One shouldn't be played inside of 80-90 minutes
> apart (60 in drive time). Substantial portion of the Top
> Ten, if not all, should appear inside of 90-110 minutes.
> Next 10 (11-20) should be played sparingly, with emphasis on
> repeat artists and "hitbounds". Anything below that, and
> gold, should only be filler. Once or twice. No more.

That is extremely outdated. Check that calendar Mr. Morgan. It's now 2005.

> Assuming Ludacris isn't paying for play (Eliot's on the
> phone now), if it's in light rotation, then it can be
> scrapped without anyone noticing.

Was that supposed to be funny?

> If he's already appearing
> 3x, then his own song doesn't need to appear much, if at
> all, huh? And you've got three songs by him, two in power
> rotation--you've got 90 minutes between them. His third
> "collaboration" (hip-hop speak for: I'm gonna yell and grunt
> over this sampled and stolen backing track), if sub-power,
> well...you're just gonna have to work with that. Is it
> going up, or coming down?

Again, you shouldn't be commenting on a format you have no clue about. There's a reason why research is done and a PD/MD "worth their salt" (to use your terminology) knows how to use research effectively and responsibly (read = to their advantage). Just because a song is a recurrent doesn't mean it's disposable.

> Disagree. You have a wealth of music now--even in
> hip-hop--that's hit material (plus pop, plus rock--that Jet
> song popular now, "Look What You've Done," is over two years
> old). Any good programmer, and an MD who's worth his salt,
> will know on it's face that it's a problem to play the same
> artist inside of 90.

So why aren't you at least an MD in CHR? I'd love to see how you do with your philosophy.

> I notice that NO ONE is defending the two Gwen Stefanis
> inside 10 SONGS (that's 30-40 minutes, assuming no stop
> sets...then, maybe 50), or defending the two Kelly Clarkson
> inside 10 songs, either. I'd LOVE to see someone explain
> that witha straight face.

It's called turnover and I'll even say error. Especially with a station just flipping, you're bound to have some errors here and there. Anyone who's worked at a station during a format flip or tweak can attest to that. Work the bugs out now before the book. It's gonna happen no matter how many bases you thought you covered.

> I don't care what you say--Ludacris is not the Beatles.

And no one said they were. You're the one who's made reference to them TWICE in this thread. Ludacris IS a core CHR artist. Disagree all you want. That's a fact. Period!

> There was a time when a single artist could garner repeat
> performances inside of 10 minutes, let alone an hour, let
> alone 90 minutes. Ludacris is not taking the country by
> storm (he's actually considered old news in hip-hop); this
> is not 1964;

And it's not 1997 either. This is what happens when people who've been in this industry for awhile fail to adapt. You wind up looking IN from the outside.

> and there are NOT other Top 40/CHR stations to
> turn to if you get annoyed. Complacency has set in with Top
> 40/CHR programmers. They're not THINKING.

It has nothing to do with "not thinking." Again, why aren't you MDing somewhere and show us how it's (allegedly) done? It's all about the listeners. You should whip out the TSL's for CHR's (overall). Once you do then you might understand the quick turnover on powers. What listeners are griping about today is no different than what they were griping about 2 or 5 years ago. They want to hear their hit music NOW!!!

> But there are Hot ACs, and if you insist on giving me
> Ludacris, or Gwen Stefani, or Kelly Clarkson everytime I
> turn on my radio, that's where I'm heading.

Guess what? Hot AC's are turning over their powers roughly every 2 hours.

> Yeah, but when you've got 14 year olds filling them out (see
> the last C-Town book), what worth are they? Unless you like
> that sort of thing.

Another comment that shows how out of touch you are with CHR. 14-year olds are your audience in CHR.

 

[JohnnyMorganWXJX]

Re: Welcome to 2005

Ahhh, the obligatory "show me yours" post. Surprised it took so long for you to post it.

Give it up, Dick.

 

[network]

Re: Welcome to 2005

> Ahhh, the obligatory "show me yours" post. Surprised it
> took so long for you to post it.

No, actually it wasn't.

> Give it up, Dick.

If that's all you bring to the discussion, you'd be better off not responding at all and leaving it at that.

 

[JohnnyMorganWXJX]

Re: Welcome to 2005

> > Ahhh, the obligatory "show me yours" post. Surprised it
> > took so long for you to post it.
>
> No, actually it wasn't.

You asked me at least three times (and I'm being generous here) why I wasn't an MD, etc. That's calling out--i.e., "show me yours". I have nothing to prove to you or anyone. I'm content in my success, and content in my description of a successful CHR format.

> > Give it up, Dick.
>
> If that's all you bring to the discussion, you'd be better
> off not responding at all and leaving it at that.

Hey, you're the guy with the screenname--I was being polite and conversational by addressing you by first name. But looking back, you did call me Mr. Morgan, so I should have referred to you as Mr. Head. My apologies.

Look, we have different philosophies. No reason to call me out, nor I you (which I've never done). I try to be as polite as possible.

Let's end this here, both of us secure in our beliefs.

And for the record, I don't care that much about CHR today: most stations are shabbily and cheaply run, and the music offered by the labels is substandard. Hopefully one or both will change soon.

 

[afw7962]

Re: Y105 goes Hits and Kiss goes Rock

> Makes sense.
>
> Look for Y105 to take a WNCI-ish approach musically.
>
> What they'll do with the Y105 airstaff is the 10 Million
> Dollar question.
>
>
> > > Why the fox on three signals though?
> > >
> >
> > It's Clear Channel, they save money this way and dont need
> a
> > studio for 98.3/107.7 in Ashland after the sale goes thru
> of
> > 93.7 and Kiss has to move, by putting 102.3's Fox format
> on
> > 98.3/107.7 its one less studio in Ashland
> >
> > Im kinda sad to see Kiss possibly leave 98.3/107.7, Y105
> has
> > never been a true CHR, growing up I remeber listening to
> > them when they leaned CHR, it was always watered down
> before
> > CC got a hold of them and they segued to Hot AC.
> >
>
I'm crushed behind the Kiss FM cluster being flipped to some "Tricasting" experiment! I'm in the Akron radio market and had chosen to listen to 107.7's CHR formula which was the absolute best. They always had the freshest playlists and IMHO bested my more local WAKS Kiss 96.5. Up here in Cuyahoga Falls, 107.7 starts to get a little clipped by 107.9 WENZ, but that never bothered me none, until now. Toss the best CHR format out with the bath water I guess