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CITADEL AND SALEM MAKE MOODY'S BOTTOM RUNG LIST

TheBigA said:
There are still a few formats that work. Conservative talk appeals to a mass of listeners. Country music usually works. Formats that target older listeners work, like classic rock and oldies.

Gee, what do those formats have in common? They are the most likely to feature "live bodies behind the microphones". You'd think that somebody might notice the correlation.

TheBigA said:
Even with all the cutbacks, radio stations still have local staffs. They know their markets. They're involved in community events, and hear what the local people say. That hasn't changed. What's changed is the "Balkinization" of the local audience. They want what they want when they want it, and they want it for free and without any commercials. That's a very different situation than what radio faced before.

Must be you're living in a different market that the rest of us. The visibility of radio on the streets is a fraction of what it was a few years ago. Promotion staffs are skeletal or non-existant. Involvement in "community events" is mostly relegated to promos and VT mentions. People have fled radio not because of "Balkanization", but because there's a disconnect between programming and listeners. Once upon a time - in the not-too-distant past - jocks could give listeners a reason to sample a new song or group long enough to establish the familiarity required to help establish new artists.

Now, listeners are more willing to trust people on social networking sites because they have no relationship with out-of-town and/or VT "talent" on the radio. Even where there is local talent, formats are so restrictive that every break is a "selling" job. Listeners are too sophisticated to not know that they're being constantly "sold". They fled radio which they percieved to be a "corporate" voice, and not their voice. That's a fundamental shift over the last 20 years that is directly attributable to corporate policy, not a lack of available talent.

Some of us - both as radio professionals and listeners - are simply tired of being told that over-researched, bland, limpid radio is "good radio". It's not, and the continued reliance on VT and syndication is - and will continue - to drive both ratings and revenue down. With luck, it will drive the current crop of operators out of the business. Maybe a little creativity and attitude will creep back in.
 
SirRoxalot said:
TheBigA said:
There are still a few formats that work. Conservative talk appeals to a mass of listeners. Country music usually works. Formats that target older listeners work, like classic rock and oldies.

Gee, what do those formats have in common? They are the most likely to feature "live bodies behind the microphones". You'd think that somebody might notice the correlation.

Really? How would you know? Most of the most popular conservative talk hosts are syndicated.

There are lots of "live bodies behind microphones" at CHR stations, AAA stations, and urban stations too. Being live & local is no guarantee of any kind of ratings success. Ask the live DJs at WRXP in NY or the live DJs at Indie 103 in LA. How does a 1 share feel? Imagine being a live & local DJ and know you're being beat by JACK. That's what happened.

SirRoxalot said:
Must be you're living in a different market that the rest of us. The visibility of radio on the streets is a fraction of what it was a few years ago. Promotion staffs are skeletal or non-existant. Involvement in "community events" is mostly relegated to promos and VT mentions.

The ironic part about that is it's not always because of the station, but because the DJs view themselves as stars, and don't want to interact with the community. As I posted earlier on another group, I know of local DJs who have it written into their contracts that they don't have to do ANY local interaction at all. They have staffs who handle their emails. They don't make personal appearances. For all intents and purposes, they COULD be living in another town. No one would know.

Radio stations hire local talent for the local presence, and then those same local people shut themselves off from the community. They don't even do their own shopping, because they're afraid they'll have to speak with their listeners. Some even have their own bodyguards. I'm not kidding.

SirRoxalot said:
With luck, it will drive the current crop of operators out of the business. Maybe a little creativity and attitude will creep back in.

That's not what we're seeing. In every market where a big corporation has sold to a small local group, the formats have stayed the same, and the procedures have stayed the same. In some places, they've gotten worse.
 
OK, all of you who have your "peeps" answer your e-mail, raise your hands. All of you who have "no local interaction" written into your contracts, raise your hands. All of you who have somebody else do the shopping, and/or have your own body guards, raise your hands.

You guys at Citadel would like to be able to get on FaceBook, MySpace, or Twitter, wouldn't you? Too bad corporate has set up their firewalls to keep you out. Answering the phones would be more productive if you could use some phoners on the air, wouldn't it? Too bad you're not allowed, mostly because it will make the lack of interactivity on the VT shows stand out. Bummer, huh?

How many of you are "multi-tasking" while you're on the air, trying to keep up with all the other duties that have been dumped in your lap because of staff cutbacks?

BigA, you really need to get out of your corner office at corporate more. Most of what you're talking about doesn't happen at most radio stations. You cite examples of talent the contracts negotiated by a very, very small percentage of high-priced, likely syndicated talent at a few of the radio stations in a few major markets. A very small percentage of contracts contain the kind of language that you cite. Most contracts contain language direct from corporate and doesn't do talent any favors. Even in NY and LA, very few air personalities have the kind of contract that you're talking about.

Most of us are quite accessible, do our own shopping, do outside promotional gigs as often as sales can find somebody who'll pay cash and not trade because we get charged taxes on the value of the trade, and you can't PAY taxes with trade. For every successful "Jack", there are half a dozen "Jacks" who got their ass kicked by live jocks. How about Opie & Anthony. How'd they do nationwide?

It ain't all about NY & LA. Even they aren't interchangable when it comes to programming. Why anybody thinks that satellite-fed syndicated crap would work nationwide is beyond me.

New owners will either "get it", or get out, until somebody with half a programming brain gets their hands on a radio station and makes it relevant again.
 
SirRoxalot said:
BigA, you really need to get out of your corner office at corporate more. Most of what you're talking about doesn't happen at most radio stations.

You have no idea who you're talking to. There's no "corner office," because I'm not at "corporate." You're inventing an enemy, and throwing darts at a figment of your imagination. And then you attack me for not living in the real world.

SirRoxalot said:
You cite examples of talent the contracts negotiated by a very, very small percentage of high-priced, likely syndicated talent at a few of the radio stations in a few major markets.

But WHY would ANY of them insist on such a thing? Aren't they supposed to be communicators? Aren't they supposed to interact with the public? Isn't that their JOB? Am I asking for too much? What does this say to talent in smaller markets where they don't have contracts or agents? It builds an attitude of negativity, where air talent refuses to do these things, not because it's in their contracts, but because they feel it SHOULD be, or it should warrant additional pay. Community involvement should be voluntary, not paid. Broadcasters are supposed to be community leaders, and should give their time to non-profits NOT for money or because it's their job, but because they WANT to.

SirRoxalot said:
New owners will either "get it", or get out, until somebody with half a programming brain gets their hands on a radio station and makes it relevant again.

What I'm talking about has NOTHING to do with ownership. It has to do with people on the front lines with negative attititudes like yours who blame everything on unnamed and unseen people in "corporate" while they completely take their eye off the ball that is coming right at their face. It won't matter who owns the station if it's filled with employees who think they're stars and won't attend local community meetings or volunteer their time for area charities.
 
SirRoxalot said:
OK, all of you who have your "peeps" answer your e-mail, raise your hands. All of you who have "no local interaction" written into your contracts, raise your hands. All of you who have somebody else do the shopping, and/or have your own body guards, raise your hands.

I'm probably the only person on these boards to have ever had a bodyguard; when I owned stations in Ecuador and had half the agency billing in several markets, I was attacked various times and decided that eventually I would be killed... so I got a driver / bodyguard.

But as to contracts with no interaction or having somebody else ansswer e-mail, we are talking about a limited number of people who are stars and want $$$ for everything they do. It happens.

However, the "manager's secretary" has pretty much disappeared in the last decade or so due to technical advances that range from on line plane reservations to the near death of the letter typed on paper. People answer their own e mail unless it's a talent that gets big impossible rushes of mail... where it is understandable.

You guys at Citadel would like to be able to get on FaceBook, MySpace, or Twitter, wouldn't you? Too bad corporate has set up their firewalls to keep you out.

There is no restriction in using social networks on one's own compueter, is there? The issue at many companies... not just radio... is bandwidth. Business networks have costs related to total throughput, and people who stream or view graphics intensive websites slow down the business use of networks for things like updating national contracts, AP and AR, etc. Of course, that does not even take into account the security issues or exposure to malware, workms, viruses, rootkits, etc.

Many stations have a separate DSL or T1 for the operations area where the connectivity for sites that assist programming can be used.

Answering the phones would be more productive if you could use some phoners on the air, wouldn't it? Too bad you're not allowed, mostly because it will make the lack of interactivity on the VT shows stand out. Bummer, huh?

That is just not so... some formats use less phoners than others due to mood, and some do them in determined dayparts.

How many of you are "multi-tasking" while you're on the air, trying to keep up with all the other duties that have been dumped in your lap because of staff cutbacks?

Let's see. When I was first on the air, all the spots were on 5" reels and they ran on two Maggies, so I had to rewind one while the other played. Same for IDs and promos. Music was on records, and I had to pull the stuff while other songs were playing and file the used ones... the library was in a separate room, too.

Then I had to listen for the network cues, backtime my last music cut to hit the net news. I had to do the transmitter logs each half hour, also in a different room down the hall. Then I had to answer the phone, fill out the program logs, and figure out what to play and cue it up on the turntables. Most fun was had by all when the stylus on one of the tone arms broke and the whole thing had to be done with one turntable.

Of course, we had to learn how to use the restroom for whatever wee needed in less than 3 minutes.

Let's see... today we have all the music and spots on a digital storage device. No cuiiing, no running the stopset from carts manually, no searching for the right jingle... it's all done and ready. The time saved can be used to get ready for each talk location in the log, talk to listeners and record them on the Vox Pro or Shortcut, edit the call, do contests, answer studio e mail, look for facts about an artist or event online, and much more. Heck, there aren't even any readings to do anymore except logging occasionally an EAS test.

Most contracts contain language direct from corporate and doesn't do talent any favors. Even in NY and LA, very few air personalities have the kind of contract that you're talking about.

In the big markets and even many medium ones such contracts are common. Most contracts today are to guarantee that both parties understand their obligations and to leave nothing to verbal agreements. In that way, they benefit both sides.

How about Opie & Anthony. How'd they do nationwide?

Some things work, others don't. Look at each year's TV schedules from the Big 4 networks... half or more of the new shows fail, many not making it through mid season. Radio, when it tries talent based solutions, will have a similar batting average.

It ain't all about NY & LA. Even they aren't interchangable when it comes to programming. Why anybody thinks that satellite-fed syndicated crap would work nationwide is beyond me.

Yeah, who wudda' thunk that Gunsmoke, The Honeymooners, Bonanza, Seinfeld, Jay Leno, Idol or Survivor would have worked in every city town and village in the country? Or Jack Benny, the Green Hornet and the Lone Ranger. Howdy Doody musta' been a local show cuz there is no way it could have worked nationally, as every city is so different. Those Ludlum, Grisham and Steele novels only sell in one city or two at best.
 
Oh, so now TV and novels are the same as radio when it comes to appeal? People use them the same way, relate to them the same way, and expect the same things from them?

So, how's that workin' out for you, ratings-wise and revenue-wise?

As far as interactivity is concerned, don't you thing that it would be much more useful if it was IMMEDIATE, not hours after the fact? Communicating with listeners during the airshift would seem to be much more effective. Besides, how many contracts prohibit any public contact that's not approved by the company and/or its representatives? There's a reason that I post under a pseudonym - company policy.

David, I'd think that you might have more important things to occupy your mind since Univision is one of the companies on Moody's "bottom rung".
 
SirRoxalot said:
So, how's that workin' out for you, ratings-wise and revenue-wise?

Every market is off, some as much as 40% last month. But then again, so is the stock market.

Ratings have never been better on the average.

As far as interactivity is concerned, don't you thing that it would be much more useful if it was IMMEDIATE, not hours after the fact?

Most jocks I know have the ability to answer text messages and emails immediately while on the air... obviously, they can't answer all of them any more than they can answer every phone call.

Communicating with listeners during the airshift would seem to be much more effective.

Not if it is a disctraction. And not if is not useful to the format.

Besides, how many contracts prohibit any public contact that's not approved by the company and/or its representatives?

That policy relates to speaking in public or making public statements on behalf of the company. There are all kinds of legal reasons why you don't want everyone doing that. But, agian, much different from someone texting a DJ about something in their show.

David, I'd think that you might have more important things to occupy your mind since Univision is one of the companies on Moody's "bottom rung".

And we all have a lot of trust for Wall Streeters' advice... like Cramer recommending the buy of AIG, for example. Taking financial advice from the usual sources is about, I have found, like taking movie advice from the print media critics. Not a single movie I have enjoyed in the last few years has gotten top reviews, and winning an Oscar is a kiss of death for me... Same with advice from traditional brokers and guides.
 
First of all, BigA, most of the jocks I know DO interact with their listeners and the public. Sometimes it's for free IF it's done during their airshift or if it's for charity. If it's outside their regular business hours, or if it's for a sponsor, most jocks will request payment. There are very, very few of the "pampered" jocks you go on and on about.

There are some very high profile people who shun that kind of contact. Possibly it's because they've got a controversial point of view, possibly it's because they're paranoid, and possibly it's because they CAN. NONE of them are in smaller markets. I don't know a single "star" who doesn't give time and talent - as well as money - to charity. Can they fill ALL the requests? No. Do they donate their OWN time and not regular working hours? Yes. If there's any decline in the number of hours, it's because there's no support staff anymore since corporate has cut promotions and engineering to shreds, and because EVERYBODY at the local level is working a lot more hours, for significantly less money.

As I mentioned before, David, Citadel has restricted access to social networking sites, and there's very limited access to e-mail. Many stations don't even post e-mail addresses for jocks, but filter everything through and increasingly overworked PD. There are no "station" phones for text messaging, and you don't really expect jocks to give out personal cell phone numbers publicly, do you? Some jocks have their own websites, but it's at their own expense, and management is lukewarm about the idea at best.

As far as a "negative" attitude is concerned, you'll never hear it on the air. But don't expect guys who know better to accept management's forecast of "rain" when they know that they're getting p*ssed on.
 
SirRoxalot said:
TheBigA said:
There are still a few formats that work. Conservative talk appeals to a mass of listeners. Country music usually works. Formats that target older listeners work, like classic rock and oldies.

Gee, what do those formats have in common? They are the most likely to feature "live bodies behind the microphones". You'd think that somebody might notice the correlation.

Well, they also have a certain "ugliest audience specimens known to humankind" element in common, which fuels into radio's nagging *image* problem...
 
Where's T Boone Pickins when we need him? A nice corporate take-over would do many of these looser-ran companies good. The Dickies need to have their stock taken from them for what it currently goes for. They made the mess, let them get what they built. The sooner the industry flushes the quicker we can get on with things and make this back into a business. Radio isn't broken. McRadio was broken from day 1 of it's exisitance. It's time for local and regional owners with a some balls and a few bucks to come in a make an enterprise of things. Radio went through some of this in the 80s here in OKC. Many good things came of it eventually. After a while though the big guys just paid to much and did too many stupid things. This is the day we all preached about for years and years. Too bad good people are getting caught in the middle, but the day had to come. You just can't keep overpaying and running things on stupid this long with no negative results. Game over big drizzling companies! The sooner the lever is pulled the sooner this stinky one will go down and things can start smelling nicer again.
 
OKCRadioGuy said:
Where's T Boone Pickins when we need him? A nice corporate take-over would do many of these looser-ran companies good.

I thought that's what happened 12 years ago. I don't think anyone with any brains will be buying radio stations any time soon. Warren Buffett got his butt handed to him when he bought up a bunch of General Electric stock. It lost 50% of value in a couple months. The smart money is sitting this one out.
 
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