Classic Hits 80s

[radiophiler]

You've got to play the hits. The biggest, best testing hits.

Having said that, even before I read some of the above posts, I thought to myself, Can't listeners who want broader playlists be somewhat satisfied by a weekend specialty show of "lost hits"? This is also what I like about the AT40s from the 70s and 80s: There are songs that charted, especially below #15, that you don't hear on the radio much anymore.

SXM's 80s on 8 plays a lost hit every hour at about :45 after the hour. SXM has the luxury to do this because, if you don't like the lost hit, there's a good chance you'll stay on SXM and maybe go to the 70s, 90s, Classic Rewind, First Wave, etc.

Years ago, SXM's 80s played some lost hits every weekday during the noon hour (Eastern). About half the songs were regular playlist, half were ones you wouldn't hear as often.

And what does everyone think about playing lesser hits from a well known artist? Whether it's Elton John, Duran Duran, Madonna or Prince, some of their 80s hits test better today than others. Does it make a difference if the "lost hit" is from a well known artist or a one hit wonder?

 

[TheFonz]

You've got to play the hits. The biggest, best testing hits.

Can't listeners who want broader playlists be somewhat satisfied by a weekend specialty show of "lost hits"? This is also what I like about the AT40s from the 70s and 80s: There are songs that charted, especially below #15, that you don't hear on the radio much anymore.

Actually, listeners don't have to be satisfied with commercial radio. There are too many other options out there.

 

[TheFonz]

I think that people who listen view those old AT 40's much as they think about visiting a museum. Some things at a museum are still relevant today, some were passing fancies and others were just bad ideas. The fun is in looking back at the good, the bad and the ugly

Yes! You get it too.

 

[Avid Listener]

No, you just denigrate all of us as a group. Whenever any of us find a station that we like, you (and other corporate water-carriers) come on with your usual tired arguments of "well, it's number 30 in the ratings," or "it doesn't cover the downtown business district well enough," or some other similar such b.s.

The biggest BS of all is that the ratings are some sort of scientifically accurate measurement. They are not. They are, at best, a wet finger in the wind. but, because those who make decisions on spending advertising have been sold a bill of goods by the ratings companies, and believe their bogus numbers, and base their business decisions on those bogus numbers, there's an entire industry of insiders, consultants, and other suits who know how to play the ratings rules to milk the system for better numbers. If the reality of how bogus radio ratings really were would ever become known, they'd lose their seats on the gravy train.

It is obvious that you corporate guys don't actually LISTEN to the radio. Otherwise, you would understand our frustrations. Even if I hear a certain song now, and don't hear it again until next week, I am still left wondering why you didn't play their OTHER hit.

Man, you got that right!

 

[TheBigA]

because those who make decisions on spending advertising have been sold a bill of goods by the ratings companies, and believe their bogus numbers, and base their business decisions on those bogus numbers,

Not exactly true. Advertisers don't have to believe anyone. The bigger ones do their own research, and prefer to believe the numbers THEY pay for.

 

[AM/FMRAINMAN]

Hello David. So I wanted your opinion on an classic hits station centered on 80s music with some select late 70s and early 90s. Look at what WCBS-FM is doing. WOGL is 70s focused...I wish they switch to 80s. Do you think this will work or should they still be 70s based classic hits.

 

[davideduardo]

Hello David. So I wanted your opinion on an classic hits station centered on 80s music with some select late 70s and early 90s. Look at what WCBS-FM is doing. WOGL is 70s focused...I wish they switch to 80s. Do you think this will work or should they still be 70s based classic hits.

It really depends on the individual market. In some places, a 70's core does well in getting the 35-54's, and in others it takes less 70's and more 80's.

In the case of WOGL, the formula works in Philadelphia. Change will be gradual and slow.

 

[davideduardo]

The biggest BS of all is that the ratings are some sort of scientifically accurate measurement.

As said before, the ratings are accurate enough for the intended purpose, which is to provide a metric for ad rates.

They are, at best, a wet finger in the wind. but, because those who make decisions on spending advertising have been sold a bill of goods by the ratings companies, and believe their bogus numbers, and base their business decisions on those bogus numbers

As i have stated before... and you continue to ignore... there is an independent organization representing ratings users that audits the ratings right down to the market level. That organization was created as a result of a congressional investigation over 50 years ago and it has been the advertiser's "insurance" that ratings are highly reasonable estimates of audience sizes and compositions.

there's an entire industry of insiders, consultants, and other suits who know how to play the ratings rules to milk the system for better numbers.

That's simply not true. Programmers know, by understanding ratings and the audience patterns they show, how to please listeners and also how to avoid annoying them. That information and those techniques are public knowledge, with information available from Nielsen and a variety of analysts (who'd like to sell additional services to stations).

If the reality of how bogus radio ratings really were would ever become known, they'd lose their seats on the gravy train.

That "gravy train" is a figment of your imagination.

P.S. At least you did not trot out the chicken entrails this time. That was getting tiring.

 

[CTListener]

It really depends on the individual market. In some places, a 70's core does well in getting the 35-54's, and in others it takes less 70's and more 80's.

In the case of WOGL, the formula works in Philadelphia. Change will be gradual and slow.

And how do you explain WTRY Troy (Albany market) NY, which still calls itself Oldies 98.3 and is having a Beatles Weekend starting tonight? A real time warp of an oldies station that barely touches the late '70s, let alone the '80s. How could this sort of music mix be attracting the lower end of 35-54?

 

[Avid Listener]

As i have stated before... and you continue to ignore... there is an independent organization representing ratings users that audits the ratings right down to the market level. That organization was created as a result of a congressional investigation over 50 years ago and it has been the advertiser's "insurance" that ratings are highly reasonable estimates of audience sizes and compositions.

I don't "ignore" it, I disregard it. Self-serving "watchdog" bureaucracies are a dime a dozen.

P.S. At least you did not trot out the chicken entrails this time. That was getting tiring.

Would you prefer "casting lots"? How about reading tea leaves? Tarot? The point is that it is bogus. Finding other equally bogus fakery as an example isn't difficult, though "entrails of a chicken" has a certain je ne sais quoi.

 

[BostonRandy]

A few hours of a specialty show can't compare with regular weekday programming. A specialty show is supposed to be, well, special. That means doing things you don't do the rest of the time. They are mostly placed in off hours where radio tune-in is really low. They are intended to bring a few new listeners to the station without seriously breaking format.

So I would expect such a show to be more a museum than the kind of programming that is successful the rest of the time.

Exactly. That's why, on a Sunday between 7P-midnight, you'll get your local music shows, specialty programming like "Little Steven's Underground Garage" (if it's still out there) and programming that doesn't necessarily fit the full texture of the station. Another prime example is many stations airing their 30-minute weekly public service shows somewhere between 5-6AM on Sundays. It's the same premise: traditionally low-cume hours.

 

[davideduardo]

And how do you explain WTRY Troy (Albany market) NY, which still calls itself Oldies 98.3 and is having a Beatles Weekend starting tonight? A real time warp of an oldies station that barely touches the late '70s, let alone the '80s. How could this sort of music mix be attracting the lower end of 35-54?

Interestingly, the station manages to be 10th in 25-54, very good for an A. However, that market is a very strange one, with 3 distinct population centers with uneven terrain in between. Add in that there are far fewer full coverage B's than the normal northeastern major market... and so the A's fill in the gaps. Each part of the market has fewer signals than the metro population would seem to justify, so even a mediocre station has the opportunity to be in the top 10. So I think that station is not as much an exception to the rule as a player on an empty field.

 

[davideduardo]

I don't "ignore" it, I disregard it. Self-serving "watchdog" bureaucracies are a dime a dozen.

The MRC, if you look at its structure, function and personnel, is anything but a "watchdog bureaucracy". It's a very qualified group of people who are extremely dedicated to making sure electronic media ratings services have acceptable methodologies and practices.

I had the opportunity to work closely with several officers of the MRC when there was an industry initiative to cause Arbitron to create stratification variables among Hispanics for language "preference" and the degree of investigation done by the MRC was impressive and extensive.

 

[K.M. Richards]

I don't "ignore" it, I disregard it. Self-serving "watchdog" bureaucracies are a dime a dozen.

Well then, there is no point in your thinking that anything you say will have an impact on the industry. The first step in gaining credibility is to accept the industry's existing standards, institutions, and conventions. When you say outright that you are disregarding same, no one in the business will take your suggestions seriously.

Period.

 

[Avid Listener]

Well then, there is no point in your thinking that anything you say will have an impact on the industry. The first step in gaining credibility is to accept the industry's existing standards, institutions, and conventions. When you say outright that you are disregarding same, no one in the business will take your suggestions seriously.

Period.

I am not speaking to the suits who currently run the industry. I am speaking to my fellow listeners who realize that the suits simply defend themselves automatically. Take Mr. Gleason's defense in the post before yours. Does he provide evidence that the people in the MRC know what they are doing? No! He praises their dedication. Does he claim that they have accurate methodologies and practices? Nope! He praises them for acceptable methodologies and practices. It doesn't matter if they are right or wrong, it only matters that other suits "accept" them. Like I've said, it's no different from tribal chieftains finding the shamans' skills at reading the entrails of a chicken "acceptable".

Remember: that statistics and studies are also often wrong, or at least varied in accuracy. Statistics can sometimes be construed to support either side of an argument. Sometimes studies don't account for "something" that changes the outcome. For example: Asbestos used to be deemed safe until it was discovered not safe (I think they forgot to ask, "safe for what?"). And scientists thought the world was flat, until is was discovered to be round. The same can be thought for anything and everything we know and believe to be true today, right here, right now.

 

[oldies76]

As I said, outliers always think their perspective is superior to that of the broader group.

Most people who listen to classic hits like the format, so they are fans of the genre and it's music. We're all "outliers" then.
Try listening to WOGL this holiday weekend, might give you some better perspective of what's really going on in the radio world , outside of L.A. or La Quinta.

 

[oldies76]

These corporate guys hijack literally every thread on this board.

So true, we can never have a discussion w/o interruptions. Music and radio fans need to validate their opinions too.

 

[TheBigA]

Statistics can sometimes be construed to support either side of an argument. Sometimes studies don't account for "something" that changes the outcome.

Regardless, statistics aren't the goal here. Statistics are just one way the station presents itself to advertisers. The goal is to make money. You show us a way to make more money with larger playlists and album cuts, we'll do it. We don't need statistics to justify what we do. That's not the point. As shown in this thread, there are some stations that choose to do things musically that the bigger stations don't do. So there is no music agenda for radio. The agenda is "We do whatever works for us." You can either choose to believe or not believe the statistics. We don't care. Buy yourself a radio station and do what you want to do. Hopefully you'll have the deep pockets to pay for it without appealing to advertisers.

 

[TheBigA]

So true, we can never have a discussion w/o interruptions. Music and radio fans need to validate their opinions too.

So you would prefer a circle jerk to having someone actually address your issues? Makes no sense to me.

 

[K.M. Richards]

So you would prefer a circle jerk to having someone actually address your issues? Makes no sense to me.

Yes, A, they would ... because we all know that discussing things only with people who agree with us will fix everything.

If this were a case of "we're only trying to have a discussion amongst ourselves" was true, they would ignore you, me, David, and anyone else from the industry who "hijacked" the thread. Instead, they choose to continue arguing their points with us, as if it mattered.

Sorry guys, you can't have it both ways. If you want to have your discussion without "corporate types", you will have to resist answering us.