Coast to Coast AM

[Jul]

Does anyone think that 1210 WPHT should drop Coast To Coast AM and go with a live and local show during the overnight hours, during the week and weekends?

 

[FredLeonard]

Does anyone think that 1210 WPHT should drop Coast To Coast AM and go with a live and local show during the overnight hours, during the week and weekends?

Should? Yes.
Will? No.

You tune the AM band at night and in addition to IBOC hash, all you hear are the same two or three overnight shows. What a waste of the ionosphere.

 

[wprt949]

Now that's one show i would like to see IQ 106.9 pick up

 

[Jul]

Now that's one show i would like to see IQ 106.9 pick up

I won't be shocked if that happens.

 

[jmtillery]

The problem with adding live and local talk programming during the overnight hours, even in the major markets such as Philadelphia, is cost. Overnight is the least listened day-part and has the fewest sponsors and has the lowest rate schedule. It's difficult, if not impossible, to turn a reasonable ROI with local and live overnight programming; hence the reason why stations carry syndicated Coast-to-Coast AM and other similar programs.

 

[ProducerGuy]

Figure out a way to make money on overnight radio and you'll be a hero.

 

[John1]

All the statements about overnight radio are true, but at one time it really was a time for creative and innovative programming, like Bill Corsair & The Rascals on WCAU (& Jack McKinney before that) & even the syndicated "Nightcaps" on Mutual from Salt Lake City. Plus all the overnight country music shows aimed at truck drivers with national road conditions, all on 50,000 watters like WWVA, WRVA, WMAQ, WWL, WLW. It was great fun to turn the AM dial overnights & hear such diverse shows. Now a handful of boring syndicated shows replaced all the creativity. OK, rant over...

 

[ProducerGuy]

If I had my druthers I'd love doing overnights if there were people listening and calling. But those days are over.

 

[FredLeonard]

The problem with adding live and local talk programming during the overnight hours, even in the major markets such as Philadelphia, is cost. Overnight is the least listened day-part and has the fewest sponsors and has the lowest rate schedule. It's difficult, if not impossible, to turn a reasonable ROI with local and live overnight programming; hence the reason why stations carry syndicated Coast-to-Coast AM and other similar programs.

Doesn't explain why stations are syndicated the rest of the time (with the possible exception of morning drive).

John1 makes a good point. Innovation and creativity in radio a long gone. So are most advertisers. In their place are bean counters focused only on quarterly numbers.

 

[TheBigA]

Innovation and creativity in radio a long gone. So are most advertisers. In their place are bean counters focused only on quarterly numbers.

You make it sound like that's something new. The creativity was never on the ownership side. Why do you expect it now? Back in the days of Alan Freed, DJs took a chance buying brokered time at night on stations and sold it themselves. They believed in themselves and their talent. Alan's sponsor was a Cleveland record store. He was the DJ as well as the account exec. No bean counter to blame. That's the kind of innovation missing from radio today. DJs view radio as an hourly job, like being a greeter at a Wal Mart. Hey! Where are my benefits? If someone went to a radio station today and made the same offer Freed did, they'd get a job. But no one would ever be so stupid. That's why stations run syndication.

 

[ProducerGuy]

Doesn't explain why stations are syndicated the rest of the time (with the possible exception of morning drive).

Actually it very accurately explains why most stations are mostly automated. It's cheaper than live programming, and the listeners don't care enough to not listen. Sure, most people SAY they'd prefer local hosts, but they will listen to syndicated stuff just as much.

 

[jmtillery]

The problem with adding live and local talk programming during the overnight hours, even in the major markets such as Philadelphia, is cost. Overnight is the least listened day-part and has the fewest sponsors and has the lowest rate schedule. It's difficult, if not impossible, to turn a reasonable ROI with local and live overnight programming; hence the reason why stations carry syndicated Coast-to-Coast AM and other similar programs.

Doesn't explain why stations are syndicated the rest of the time (with the possible exception of morning drive).

The other day-parts were not explained because the subject is overnights. However, to answer your question regarding why syndication is also on during other day-parts, it's the same as why it's aired during the overnight. It's less expensive. In many cases syndicated programming is 100% bartered. While I agree that local and live programming presented correctly is more desirable, it is also more expensive to produce which means the station airing said local and live programming has to generate higher billing than is necessary with the syndicated programming to get the same ROI and an even higher billing to surpass the same ROI as the station can generate using syndicated programming.

 

[jmtillery]

Figure out a way to make money on overnight radio and you'll be a hero.

... and also hopefully very wealthy.

 

[FredLeonard]

JMTilliery has just shared with us the bean counter, B-school gospel that has crippled radio and US business, in general.

And yes, BigA, managers have traditionally come from sales and have traditionally been short-sighted money grubbers. But for a long time, they had the sense to stay out of the kitchen (or PDs had the cajones to keep them out of the kitchen).

I guess no one connected to broadcasting has ever read Deming.

 

[John1]

Unfortunately most of the brokered shows are bad copies of commercial shows, amateurs trying to be opinionated talk show hosts or infomercials for financial advisor businesses. The exceptions are 'old timers' like Jimmy Parsons 'The Cannonball' playing doo-wop oldies on WNJC or WVLT, but he & others like him have also drifted to the internet on 24/7 "Sounds of Philadelphia" & "Philly Gold Radio". I would assume anyone, especially younger, would take that route, streaming on the internet, rather than buying time on a multi-format AM station, so that says there's no future for innovative local programming.

 

[TheBigA]

And yes, BigA, managers have traditionally come from sales and have traditionally been short-sighted money grubbers. But for a long time, they had the sense to stay out of the kitchen (or PDs had the cajones to keep them out of the kitchen).

And for a long time, radio was a monopoly, and could simply increase rates to meet increasing content costs. All that ended about 15 years ago. The only real card a PD has in keeping management out is success. Once that card disappears, he has nothing.

Once again, the easy solution is for creative people to make an offer that managers can't refuse. But really creative people know they can make more money on TV or radio syndication. If you're really smart and creative, why work in one market when you can easily do the same work and be heard in hundreds? There is no motivation for really talented people to work nights on single market AM stations any more.

 

[FredLeonard]

And for a long time, radio was a monopoly, and could simply increase rates to meet increasing content costs.

In what alternate universe was that? Advertisers have always had other options. So have audiences.

 

[TheBigA]

In what alternate universe was that? Advertisers have always had other options. So have audiences.

Not to the degree they have now. And most of those other options are a lot cheaper.

And this thread is dealing with the daypart with the lowest audience.

The easy solution is do what Freed did. Work the night shift on an AM station and sell the time yourself. Would you be willing to do that?

 

[rtetro]

The problem with adding live and local talk programming during the overnight hours, even in the major markets such as Philadelphia, is cost. Overnight is the least listened day-part and has the fewest sponsors and has the lowest rate schedule.

And yet, 1210's sister station, WBZ in Boston, just elected to stay "live and local" by hiring a new overnight person rather than run a network show, following the departure of Steve LeVeille last year. If CBS has the wherewithal to do it Boston......

 

[TheBigA]

If CBS has the wherewithal to do it Boston......

WBZ is the #1 station in Boston. WPHT is the lowest rated station in the cluster. They're not going to throw good money after bad.