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Cumulus...treat him better

C

ChrisWright

I am not posting this to slam anybody. Cumulus has offered me jobs in the past and I very nearly accepted. Jan Jeffries treated me very well in the process. I want to give the company a chance to do the right thing by doing better for an employee who got stuck in a bad situation that was not his fault.

Rob Jenners has lost his job because Cumulus saw an opportunity to go after Star 94 with a great Bert Show finally getting the signal it deserves. If Jenners had done something to deserve being fired then 3 weeks pay would be sufficient, but he didn't do anything worse than accept a job on a station that was struggling. Jenners left a good gig in Miami and brought his family (wife and 3 kids) to Atlanta where he now has a mortgage but no job.

Cumulus - Bert and the gang will do you proud on 99.7 and you'll probably destroy Star 94. You'll make a ton of money. Please rethink your dismissal of Jenners and give him a better severance. If you do it will be noticed by a lot of talented people who want to work for a company that cares about the people it hires.
 
ChrisWright said:
Rob Jenners has lost his job because Cumulus saw an opportunity to go after Star 94 with a great Bert Show finally getting the signal it deserves. If Jenners had done something to deserve being fired then 3 weeks pay would be sufficient, but he didn't do anything worse than accept a job on a station that was struggling. Jenners left a good gig in Miami and brought his family (wife and 3 kids) to Atlanta where he now has a mortgage but no job.

Cumulus - Bert and the gang will do you proud on 99.7 and you'll probably destroy Star 94. You'll make a ton of money. Please rethink your dismissal of Jenners and give him a better severance. If you do it will be noticed by a lot of talented people who want to work for a company that cares about the people it hires.
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Rob Jenners was working without a contract. Since Georgia is a "Right to Work" state, the Dickey's could get rid of him without any reason. When was the last time you were canned in the real world? Usually you get sacked on a Friday at 4:00pm and the HR person cheerfully says, "We will pay you until the through the end of the week."

Jenners walked out of 99X with three weeks pay ($4500, my best guess). I agree that he is talented, he will find work somewhere.
 
Neil Millman said:
ChrisWright said:
Rob Jenners was working without a contract. Since Georgia is a "Right to Work" state, the Dickey's could get rid of him without any reason. When was the last time you were canned in the real world? Usually you get sacked on a Friday at 4:00pm and the HR person cheerfully says, "We will pay you until the through the end of the week."

Jenners walked out of 99X with three weeks pay ($4500, my best guess). I agree that he is talented, he will find work somewhere.
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Once again, Millman talks out of his butt. Jenners was NOT working without a contract. Jenners was screwed by a bad contract (his agent's fault, I'm guessing). Additionally, Neil, learn what "Right to Work State" means. It does not mean a company can get rid of you for any reason. It has nothing to do with that. Companies still must adhere to contracts. An employee can often be canned for "cause" even with a contract but bad ratings are not "cause".
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Neil,

If you want to be "elected" PD of Dave FM when you grow up... one of the first things you'll have to learn in contract law and personnel issues. First, you should try using Google to discover what a "Right To Work" state is and how it affect non-unionized employees. You should also actually READ a radio contract, since you'll be responsible for preparing and negotiating them.

Good luck with that! it would seem you have a long way to go...
 
Unless you are really "bigtime" and can really have your agent/attorney really put the screws to an employer, 9in a contract)there is usually an "out" for the employer-and sometimes for the employee too.
The radio business(in the programming department)is all about getting fired and hired. You know....the "up and down the dial" thing. Anyone who takes on financial reponsibility had better have a plan B - especially if your income is radio related.
 
Seriously, Jenners probably got fired for insubordination. Management repeatedly asked him not to suck and he consistently ignored this directive.
 
OutOfTheBiz said:
First, you should try using Google to discover what a "Right To Work" state is and how it affects non-unionized employees.
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Too many people mistake an "Employment at Will" state for a "Right to Work" state.

They are not the same thing.

"Right to Work" specifically means that one cannot be forced to join a union. Put another way, "closed shops" are illegal in "Right to Work" states. Every employer must have an "open shop."

"Employment at Will" refers to the ability of either the employer or the employee having the legal right to terminate the employment relationship at any time and for any reason without notice.

Those under contract may -- stress may -- fall under different rules from state to state. Contracted employees are subcontractors in many states and thus not "employees." Enforcement of notice, "just cause" and "non-compete" clauses vary -- even in "Employment at Will" states -- as a matter of contract law in that specific state. Consult a member of that state's Bar Association.

Because Jenner was not under contract and was an "employee" of Cumulus, he could be fired [in Georgia] at any time for any reason without notice or severance.

That may be cruel and it may seem unfair, but that's the state of the business and Jenner knew/should have known that when he took the job.

Hopefully, this will lead to an even better opportunity for him.
 
N_D_Radioguy said:
"Right to Work" specifically means that one cannot be forced to join a union. Put another way, "closed shops" are illegal in "Right to Work" states. Every employer must have an "open shop."
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While you're correct regarding "Right to Work" and whether or not you can be forced to join the union, you're not entirely correct on what "Right to Work" means. I live in a state that is not "Right to Work" (Missouri), and closed shops are still illegal (and have been for more than 20 years). However, whether or not you join the union, you must pay fees to the union if you work in a union shop. "Right to Work" simply means that those who don't join the union don't have to pay those fees.

"Employment at Will" refers to the ability of either the employer or the employee having the legal right to terminate the employment relationship at any time and for any reason without notice.
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Correct!

Those under contract may -- stress may -- fall under different rules from state to state. Contracted employees are subcontractors in many states and thus not "employees." Enforcement of notice, "just cause" and "non-compete" clauses vary -- even in "Employment at Will" states -- as a matter of contract law in that specific state. Consult a member of that state's Bar Association.
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I worked as a deputy for the State of Missouri's Department of Labor for a little over three years (I just left that job a few months ago), and part of my job was to enforce proper classifications of employees and subcontractors. I've also worked in radio (and still do part-time). I can tell you that a written contract does not necessarily make you a subcontractor, and, while my knowledge is limited to Missouri, businesses are generally prohibited from requiring people to sign away their rights as employees. Subcontract radio talents use their own equipment and are not told what to say. I've had this experience as a subcontracted voicetracker. I was faxed some liner cards, but I was not required to use them at any specific time. I was also faxed a music log. I wasn't told which songs to introduce. I was told where my voicetracks would be placed, but the radio station was not required to place them in any specific spot. As an example, when severe weather happened, my show did not air. However, I was paid a flat fee whether or not it aired and whether it took me 20 minutes or 5 hours to track my show.

With respect to most radio talents, a contract will normally specify a rate of pay, the shift worked, the amount of time the agreement is in effect, and possibly a few other requirements. It's not a waiver of employment rights, and, yes, it often includes ways out of the contract for both the employer and the employee.

Because Jenner was not under contract and was an "employee" of Cumulus, he could be fired [in Georgia] at any time for any reason without notice or severance.
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You're basically correct. The difference between employee and subcontractor is that an employer has the right to tell the employee how to do his job while he doesn't have such a right with a subcontractor. There are also usually liabilities when a subcontractor's job is terminated prior to completion, regardless of who terminated the job, while an employer does not normally incur a liability when terminating an employee.
 
I am surprised to not see any mention (unless I missed it) of the way Steve Craig's dismissal went down. Evidently, Jenners and Leslie Fram were dismissed after the morning show. This left Steve Craig during his show what his fate would be. He did his normal show, but had to find out. They dismissed during his shift and left Axel complete his last hour, without a chance to say goodbye to his loyal listeners. I know it is business, but I would not think Steve would have done anything to screw with Cumulus before leaving. He never had the chance to say "I was 99X."

Too bad for Jenners and Leslie Fram as well.
 
Now that's just stank. Even I would have let The Big Watusi say goodbye. He seemed like a nice fellow.

top16 said:
I am surprised to not see any mention (unless I missed it) of the way Steve Craig's dismissal went down. Evidently, Jenners and Leslie Fram were dismissed after the morning show. This left Steve Craig during his show what his fate would be. He did his normal show, but had to find out. They dismissed during his shift and left Axel complete his last hour, without a chance to say goodbye to his loyal listeners. I know it is business, but I would not think Steve would have done anything to screw with Cumulus before leaving. He never had the chance to say "I was 99X."

Too bad for Jenners and Leslie Fram as well.
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Anyone in radio should know you could be fired at any time for anything with or without a contract! Where there's a will, there's a way, whether it's valid or not. In Atlanta just in the last year that seems pretty obvious. I'm certain the guy from 99X knows it if he's lasted this long in the industry. A contract doesn't protect anyone but the employer!
 
Kent said:
While you're correct regarding "Right to Work" and whether or not you can be forced to join the union, you're not entirely correct on what "Right to Work" means. I live in a state that is not "Right to Work" (Missouri), and closed shops are still illegal (and have been for more than 20 years). However, whether or not you join the union, you must pay fees to the union if you work in a union shop. "Right to Work" simply means that those who don't join the union don't have to pay those fees.
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I was going for the simplified Reader's Digest version -- after all, this is radio; we gotta use small words and stuff -- but I appreciate you adding the nuance. "Right to Work" outlaws BOTH closed shops and requiring dues payment. Some states only prohibit one or the other and, thus, are not "Right to Work" states.

...while my knowledge is limited to Missouri...
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As I said, laws vary from state to state. One is best served by consulting a member of the Bar in the appropriate state, rather than counting on guys like us. :)
 
N_D__radioguy, my new best friend.

When will you doubters ever learn? Why must you attempt to knock me down? If I write it down on this little board, it is the truth. Every time you attempt to dispute me; you make yourself look even more inept. Now I must add a space on my trophy case for the heads of Wooders and Out of the Biz. Don't worry, Clark Kent can keep you company.
 
Interesting points but we've lost track of what I was saying in my original post. I completely understand that companies have a right in many cases to fire people with no cause and no warning. My point is that it's not the right thing to do from a personal or professional standpoint. My last company actually gave me a Christmas bonus two hours after I handed in notice. Would I recommend that company to a talented friend looking at a job opportunity? Of course I would. Do you think Jenners will recommend Cumulus to his friends? I doubt it, and he has a lot of VERY talented friends. He has always been very well thought of at the Bitboard conventions which host 100 or so morning show people each year from some of the best shows in the country. I promise you that every one of those people and a whole lot more are looking at this and making a mental note to consider if Cumulus ever wants them to come on board.

Is it the worst thing a radio company has ever done? no.
Is it illegal? no.
Will it have an effect on Cumulus's ability to hire good people in the future? I believe it will but I also believe here's still time to make it a positive effect by giving Jenners a better severance package. Just think of it as an investment.

Flame me if you want but if we don't expect much from our employers we won't get much.
 
ChrisWright said:
...we've lost track of what I was saying in my original post...
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Honestly, you've just lost track of how things work in the real world.

It would be nice if everything were sunshine and unicorns with everyone in radio, from ownership down to weekend part-timers, holding hands in a circle and singing "Kum By Ya."

But it just ain't that way.

You want to fantasize about how you believe radio ought to be... and, to be fair, maybe you're right...

But, at the end of the day, the rest of us are talking about how radio actually IS.

Sorry to be the one to tell you that there's no Santa Claus, but...
 
Do you think Jenners will recommend Cumulus to his friends? I doubt it, and he has a lot of VERY talented friends.
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Maybe Cumulus should've hired one of these people and the morning show wouldn't have inhaled so vigorously. Then Leslie could've kept her job and wouldn't have to sell handbags full-time.

By the way, Jim V at 99Xwatch http://www.99xwatch.org/ has a great comment from former 99X-er Wally. He sounds really pleased (or maybe just vindicated) that Fram is finally getting her just desserts after tossing everyone else overboard to save her own skin. Got schadenfreude?
 
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