Does Having A Low Channel Number Still Give You An Advantage?

[OhioMediaWatch]

San Diego has this, too.

The NBC O&O is "NBC7/39", and the Fox affiliate is "Fox 5" (KSWB/69).

North of L.A., Palm Springs is the same way. Just a few examples:

KESQ/42 (ABC, "NewsChannel 3")
KMIR/36 (NBC, "KMIR 6")
KPSP-LD/38 (CBS, "Local 2")
KDFX-CA/33 (Fox, "Fox 11")

 

[RadioDaze]

WCNC in Charlotte actually bucked the trend in the past few years, dropping their longtime NBC-6 branding to return to using their old analog channel 36.

On the subject of PSIP, that technology has been a blessing for both stations and viewers. For example, I was working at WRAL-TV in Raleigh during the early days of digital, a station as strongly associated with its analog channel 5 dial position as well as its call letters and city of license. Without PSIP, the station, post-transition, would have faced three options:

• Returning to their familiar VHF channel 5, a frequency as inferior for digital as it was superior for analog
  
• Rebranding as WRAL-TV 48 (the station was originally on out-of-core UHF 53 prior to 6/12/09, which would've meant two rebrands)
  
• Rebranding as simply WRAL with no mention of channel (as mentioned by bpatrick above, they've done this with news, but still feature their channel 5 logo frequently).
  

Competitor WTVD returned to VHF channel 11 post-transition from out-of-core UHF 52, and has suffered lots of signal problems (as have many other ABC O&O that stuck with their VHF frequencies, especially WPVI-6 in Philadelphia).

 

[cd637299]

Competitor WTVD returned to VHF channel 11 post-transition from out-of-core UHF 52, and has suffered lots of signal problems (as have many other ABC O&O that stuck with their VHF frequencies, especially WPVI-6 in Philadelphia).

Maybe, but I caught WTVD 11's DT 11 signal from my home in south Florida last spring! It was a heckuva tropo.

I have photos to prove it, but the problem with DTV "DX" is that it's hard to prove where I live, the picture is immaculate!

cd

 

[charlestondxman]

In our area, it still gave stations an advantage until just a few years ago. Fox was always the #4 station, because it was on Channel 24. Channel 36, the My affiliate (formerly UPN and WB), was last by a good distance, and it hasn't been until the last few years that the stations equalized.

 

[quadraphonic]

Competitor WTVD returned to VHF channel 11 post-transition from out-of-core UHF 52, and has suffered lots of signal problems (as have many other ABC O&O that stuck with their VHF frequencies, especially WPVI-6 in Philadelphia).

Maybe, but I caught WTVD 11's DT 11 signal from my home in south Florida last spring! It was a heckuva tropo.

I have photos to prove it, but the problem with DTV "DX" is that it's hard to prove where I live, the picture is immaculate!

cd

In the six months or so we've only had OTA, we have never picked up WTVD in Fayetteville NC. Picked up every other channel within 80 miles at one time or other from all directions, even some LP stations, but never WTVD.
Ain't no "maybe" to what he said.

 

[quadraphonic]

As for the original question of the thread,
I can't think of any benefit or advantage it would make today.
Either people have cable, or they have a remote.
Punching in 31-1 is pretty much the same as punching in 6-1, as far as the work goes.
Low numbers used to have more status, but technology has muddied all the advantages.

 

[JeeperOne]

Are you in a market where the CBS, ABC or NBC affiliate is on a virtual channel number above 13?

No but here in Denver, all of the Latin stations (Except KTFD 14, KZCO 27 & KWHD 53) are on virtual channels on cable which are either ON OR LOWER than 13 though.

They are as follows.....

KTVD (MyNetwork TV)

Original RF Channel - 20
Digital Channel - 19
Comcast Cable Channel - 5

KCEC (Univision)

Original RF Channel - 50
Digital Channel - 51
Comcast Cable Channel - 10

KDVR (Fox)

Original RF Channel - 31
Digital Channel - 32
Comcast Cable Channel - 13

Are their ratings for news and all day still lower than the other network stations, even though everyone is really broadcasting on a UHF channel? Do they offer as much news as stations with lower channel numbers? Do they run more infomercials and paid relgion to make up for lower ratings?

The answer to all those questions are all NO

Cheers

 

[jsu5381m]

I still don't get to this day how Huntsville wound up with all UHF numbers for its stations. It is far enough away from Atlanta that Huntsville/Decatur could have at least had a channel 11 full power station.

 

[bpatrick]

Look up in northwest Georgia between Rome and Dalton, and
you'll get a potential area where there might have been a
short-spacing problem between WXIA and a Channel 11 in
Huntsville. There's also a Channel 11 (analog) in Lexington,
TN, which might have been a potential short-spacing problem
to the west of Huntsville as well. Nothing like in the early days
of television when Channel 4 was assigned to New York, Washington,
and Lancaster, PA, but I suppose the FCC decided it had better play
it safe when it changed the channel allocation table during the "freeze"
(1948-52).

 

[dave73]

In Chicago during the analog days, the top 3 networks were on the VHF: CBS (WBBM-TV) on 2, NBC (WMAQ-TV) on 5, & ABC (WLS-TV) on 7. Then there was then Independent/WB/CW station WGN-TV on 9, then WTTW on 11, which started out as NET, then to their current PBS affiliation. These 5 stations still use their old channel number in their branding. On the UHF side, stations did use their channel number in their branding until about the late 1990's, then some slowly eliminated the channel branding. WCIU is still proud to use 26 in their branding, though they mainly call themselves The U & now on what used to be FBT (their former foreign language brokered programming), is The U Too. WYCC still uses 20 in their branding (for a while, they also included their real digital channel 21 in their branding too). WPWR-TV still uses 50 in their branding. WYIN no longer uses 56 in their branding, & instead uses Lakeshore Public Television for their main branding, but during station identification, they use their real channel of 17 in the station ID instead of 56, their former analog channel. WJYS still uses their old analog channel number in their branding, 62. All other Chicago stations that had analog station in the UHF no longer include it.

Since the digital transition, CBS & ABC have had problems problems with weak signals being on the VHF. While I was one of the few who got WBBM-TV (CBS) on both 3 & 12 & WLS-TV when they returned to 7, people with outdoor UHF antennas & those with rabbit ears can't get VHF stations as well, or not at all. WLS-TV has decided to give up on VHF as they must protect WOOD-TV, who decided to stay on 7, & can't get a big power increase. So they're now on 44 (WSNS's former analog channel) for the main channel (7 is their translator for now, but will be eliminated anyday) after WWAZ Fon Du Lac, WI changed their allocation from 44 to 5. Had WWAZ (not even on the air right now) not changed their channel number, WLS-TV most likely would have been stuck on 7, & had to use a translator, as originally planned on channel 32. While some people still have problems getting WBBM-TV, the complaints aren't as much as they were when they were on 3. In cases like these, I don't feell sorry for those who have outdoor antennas & refuse to get a VHF antenna, or those who can have an outdoor antenna where they live, but refuse to have an outdoor antenna at all (my Aunt Dawn being in this category), & insist on using rabbit ears. For those who can't use an outdoor antenna because of where they live at (apartment or condo), it's not really their fault. In a case like this, there needs to be a master antenna with a distribution amplifier.

 

[landtuna]

This whole digital TV fiasco has brought us full circle back to the 50's (albeit with a clearer picture.....when it works).

 

[quadraphonic]

Don't forget how much better use of the broadcast spectrum we have enjoyed [through auctions and whatnot]!

 

[rwells2265]

I still don't get to this day how Huntsville wound up with all UHF numbers for its stations. It is far enough away from Atlanta that Huntsville/Decatur could have at least had a channel 11 full power station.

BPatrick explained the situation with Channel 11. But had Werner Von Braun's rocket scientists - heck, WWII for that matter - if all those things happened five years sooner than they did, I'm sure HSV would have been dealt at least one V, most certainly 12 (at the expense of Chattanooga, who got lucky out of the deal with three of 'em).

Fact is, at the time of the freeze, Huntsville was a small city of barely 12,000 and Decatur was regarded as the 'hub' city of the region, and itself wasn't that large. And the FCC didn't have a crystal ball.

I've said this in the past, and here I go again: cable was already in Huntsville and Decatur proper, and even without it, Birmingham and Nashville could be pulled in with a modest rooftop aerial. It is beyond amazing how a market like Huntsville was able to grow itself a full market of all-UHF stations, late in the game (1960s), in the face of already-starting-to-gel viewing habits.

--Russell

 

[kilamanjero]

I've actually noticed that a lot of major network stations (or even minor) in the UHF channel range don't even use their channel number as an identity. For instance, the Fox affiliate in Providence, which is WNAC-TV channel 64 (virtual channel 12) is simply known as "Fox Providence." I think the Fox affiliate in Philly is like that, too. And I'm pretty sure WWJ is simply known as "CBS Detroit." I also know that in some areas, some stations actually identify themselves as their cable channel numbers. I think WCNC (36) in Charlotte is known as NBC 6, because that's the channel number that most cable systems carry it on. I think it's also true with KNSD in San Diego. Any others like this?

Philly's FOX O&O now goes by "FOX 29", and WCNC-TV in Charlotte now goes by "Carolina's NewsChannel 36" brand.

 

[kilamanjero]

San Diego has this, too.

The NBC O&O is "NBC7/39", and the Fox affiliate is "Fox 5" (KSWB/69).

North of L.A., Palm Springs is the same way. Just a few examples:

KESQ/42 (ABC, "NewsChannel 3")
KMIR/36 (NBC, "KMIR 6")
KPSP-LD/38 (CBS, "Local 2")
KDFX-CA/33 (Fox, "Fox 11")

About 4 weeks ago, KNSD dropped the "NBC 7/39" brand for "NBC San Diego" branding full time.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

About 4 weeks ago, KNSD dropped the "NBC 7/39" brand for "NBC San Diego" branding full time.

Yeah, I saw that shortly after I posted here. They were "NBC 7/39" for a LONG time.

Am I missing other SD stations that brand by cable channel number, aside from the already mentioned KSWB 5/69? Oh, yes, KUSI 9/51...though it looks like they've deemphasized the channel branding, too.

 

[kilamanjero]

I still don't get to this day how Huntsville wound up with all UHF numbers for its stations. It is far enough away from Atlanta that Huntsville/Decatur could have at least had a channel 11 full power station.

BPatrick explained the situation with Channel 11. But had Werner Von Braun's rocket scientists - heck, WWII for that matter - if all those things happened five years sooner than they did, I'm sure HSV would have been dealt at least one V, most certainly 12 (at the expense of Chattanooga, who got lucky out of the deal with three of 'em).

Fact is, at the time of the freeze, Huntsville was a small city of barely 12,000 and Decatur was regarded as the 'hub' city of the region, and itself wasn't that large. And the FCC didn't have a crystal ball.

I've said this in the past, and here I go again: cable was already in Huntsville and Decatur proper, and even without it, Birmingham and Nashville could be pulled in with a modest rooftop aerial. It is beyond amazing how a market like Huntsville was able to grow itself a full market of all-UHF stations, late in the game (1960s), in the face of already-starting-to-gel viewing habits.

--Russell

Actually, Huntsville was between 13,000-15,000 inhabitants during the freeze.

 

[BRNout]

A lot of this is a self-fulfilling prophecy on the part of stations. For example, a number of large-market U's have been discussed here as far as their de-emphasis on 'channel numbers'. Well, the Chicago area provides another example: our FOX affiliate, WFLD is unlike any other Fox O&O in a top market in that it totally ignores it's former channel position (32) and simply goes by FOX Chicago. Meanwhile, we also have CBS-2, NBC-5, ABC-7, WGN-9 and WTTW-11.

Our FOX affiliate also seems to have the worst rated news department of any major market FOX O&O as well. A coincidence? Perhaps. But it makes you wonder because the branding does imply a 'second tier' station when compared with the other, more established, players in the market.

Despite the fact that the V vs. U argument is now irrelevant, there is clearly still psychology involved. And you still see the big former VHF with the lower mapped channel number doing well in most markets. Perhaps it's a legacy thing. But it does make for an interesting topic.

 

[fybush]

Despite the fact that the V vs. U argument is now irrelevant, there is clearly still psychology involved. And you still see the big former VHF with the lower mapped channel number doing well in most markets. Perhaps it's a legacy thing. But it does make for an interesting topic.

I think it's absolutely a legacy thing in a lot of markets. Does WWL-TV do well because it's on "channel 4" - or because it's a 60-year-old institution in a fairly non-transitory market (and one that happens to be on "channel 4" because of its age)? Is WGCL a relatively minor player in Atlanta because it's on "channel 46" - or because it's a relatively new player (and thus on "46" instead of "2" or "5") in a market with much longer-established news operators?

In the end, there's no way to completely separate WWL's "WWL-ness" from its "channel 4-ness." But there will be some interesting tests coming up, like the new "channel 4" in Atlantic City. My gut tells me that no amount of low-number branding for that new station will ever begin to make up for its status as a brand-new, low-budget entrant in a small market. I'd love to be proved wrong.

 

[ngriffin]

I was watching WBBH/WZVN's coverage of Hurricane Charley back in 2004 over the web, and there was some confusion in the studio when one of the anchors was suggesting people continue watching the station on portable TV's (power was going on by then). However, nobody in the studio knew the OTA channel numbers. A minute later one of the engineers came on to explain that while most people were used to watching them on channels 2 and 7, viewers with a portable TV would need to tune to channel 20 or 26.