February's ratings are out

[Barry]

The trades are reporting today that SBS has once again stopped PPM encoding on its stations in New York, and several other markets. This was done within hours of hours of the lifting of a court injunction.
So it may be impossible until their dispute with Arbitron is settled, to compare the audience size of X96.3, and La Mega, (and WPAT FM).

 

[radioboy]

For the life of me I just don't understand this particular battle.

I understand that no system is perfect, nor will there ever be one that is. But what is the benefit of pulling the encoding? Seems like it would mean the stations just won't show up as well, if at all.

This just kind of showcases the bizarreness of the radio industry.

What if all this energy could be spent on improving the on-air product?

 

[BJSteigner]

I keep thinking that SBS has been ripped off because of the system.

 

[BJSteigner]

Its competition. Its seems X 96.3 is beating Mega, and badly too.

[/quote]

It's because WXNY is on a better reception and dial position.

 

[davideduardo]

It's because WXNY is on a better reception and dial position.

While different ESB signals may each have fringe area issues, neither of the two is really better or worse in covering the high density Hispanic zones of the New York metro survey area.

 

[moreno]

arbitron is killing sbs....http://www.foxbusiness.com/story/ma...awards-victory-spanish-broadcasting-arbitron/

 

[nd2023]

X96.3 is blocked in parts of Newark by Streetz 96.5, which now has more power and bleeds down to 96.3.

 

[badjef]

It's because WXNY is on a better reception and dial position.

While different ESB signals may each have fringe area issues, neither of the two is really better or worse in covering the high density Hispanic zones of the New York metro survey area.

I did not see any difference on 105.9 with the lower power while riding around in those areas as well. There was a difference in building penetration, but
I was dissapointed that power didn't mean as much as I would have liked.

Over the years, the signals have technically gotten stronger, but there have been more stations allocated, so the reception of most all of the Empires have shortened.

I picked up WQXR on 96.3 in 2003 in an airplane decending into LaGuardia. We were over the Cape May area. It wasn't good, to be sure, but it was there and unmistakable, with a digital tuned headset radio.

'QXR used to be my benchmark station. If I tuned across the dial while travelling, and stopped on a NYC freq., a lot of times there were similarly formatted stations, I would tune to 96.3 and see if it was a New Yorker or another station assigned as a co-channel.

There was problems in lower Manhattan with the WTC signals interfering with Empire and visa-versa, but I haven't noticed that same situation with 4TS and Empire. They are much closer to one another.

I don't think the signals are making a difference on a marketing standpoint.
Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[davideduardo]

I did not see any difference on 105.9 with the lower power while riding around in those areas as well. There was a difference in building penetration, but I was dissapointed that power didn't mean as much as I would have liked.

I should have mentioned that I meant "Full B's" from the ESB. 105.9, with 620 watts, is a really weak signal. I can recal being at the Omni Hotel across the street from the station at 52nd and Madison and not being able to get 105.9 in the room! If that was an issue about 15 blocks from the transmitter, imagine the signal in apartments in Queens or the UWS where big concentrations of listeners were found! Of course, the station doubled its ratings just by moving to 96.3 and broadening the format.

There was problems in lower Manhattan with the WTC signals interfering with Empire and visa-versa, but I haven't noticed that same situation with 4TS and Empire. They are much closer to one another.

4 TS for the most part is an auxiliary site. None of the B's runs from there on an ongoing basis, IIRC.

I don't think the signals are making a difference on a marketing standpoint.

It sure did with 105.9 going to 96.3!

 

[badjef]

I did not see any difference on 105.9 with the lower power while riding around in those areas as well. There was a difference in building penetration, but I was dissapointed that power didn't mean as much as I would have liked.

I should have mentioned that I meant "Full B's" from the ESB. 105.9, with 620 watts, is a really weak signal. I can recal being at the Omni Hotel across the street from the station at 52nd and Madison and not being able to get 105.9 in the room! If that was an issue about 15 blocks from the transmitter, imagine the signal in apartments in Queens or the UWS where big concentrations of listeners were found! Of course, the station doubled its ratings just by moving to 96.3 and broadening the format.

The signals, eminating from the same place, are different inch by inch with a portable radio. Also the invisible RF in and around the building will play more of a part with the lower power. What side of the building? The buildings pay all sorts of havock. Why else would the FCC authorize UHF simulcasting through the 70's.
I'm not suggesting to stay with a station 10db powered down from the rest, in fact, I was happy when the New York Times made the deal they did. It could have been a complete loss of full time Classical on the NYC dial. It allowed the people over at WNYC more of a revenue steam than they had with an AM and 3 HD-x's. And since the AM is 50kw, they will be in a better position if the(ir) economy gets too tight to afford all three signals.

There was problems in lower Manhattan with the WTC signals interfering with Empire and visa-versa, but I haven't noticed that same situation with 4TS and Empire. They are much closer to one another.

4 TS for the most part is an auxiliary site. None of the B's runs from there on an ongoing basis, IIRC.

I don't think the signals are making a difference on a marketing standpoint.

It sure did with 105.9 going to 96.3!

When you said "broadening the format", why couldn't that be a contributing factor in doubling the ratings? We see it all the time and discussed examples on this web site as to the importance of imaging and perception.

It wasn't a latteral move. I was hoping to see them just move "la Kalle" to 96.3. But that didn't happen. I suspect it was just because 33.5 million would have had a definitive dollar figure attached to the decimal point rise or fall - not good for investors. (Try convincing them they are only paying $160/uw upgade.)
I arrive at that conclusion because what they had with "la Kalle" was profitable enough to allow them the capital to finance the purchase of 96.3.

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[davideduardo]

The signals, eminating from the same place, are different inch by inch with a portable radio. Also the invisible RF in and around the building will play more of a part with the lower power. What side of the building? The buildings pay all sorts of havock. Why else would the FCC authorize UHF simulcasting through the 70's.

SE corner, outside rooms... this is just one anecdote of the issues of hearing 105.9 on average receivers even within view of the ESB. Vehicle reception was OK, mostly, but since in NY's MSA so little listening is done in cars, the building penetration is critical.

[/quote]

When you said "broadening the format", why couldn't that be a contributing factor in doubling the ratings? We see it all the time and discussed examples on this web site as to the importance of imaging and perception.

Broadening means the areas where promotions are done, etc, took on the dimensions of the expanded coverage. The name was changed to avoid confusion with any recall of the old frequency, but the morning show was the same, and so on...

I arrive at that conclusion because what they had with "la Kalle" was profitable enough to allow them the capital to finance the purchase of 96.3.

The move had to do with being competitive in signal as well as programming. Whether Kalle was profitable or not is irrelevant... a strong presence in a major ad buying center is. For most of the 2000's, 105.9 billed less than 20% of the billing of WSKQ, for example.

 

[badjef]

The signals, eminating from the same place, are different inch by inch with a portable radio. Also the invisible RF in and around the building will play more of a part with the lower power. What side of the building? The buildings pay all sorts of havock. Why else would the FCC authorize UHF simulcasting through the 70's.

SE corner, outside rooms... this is just one anecdote of the issues of hearing 105.9 on average receivers even within view of the ESB. Vehicle reception was OK, mostly, but since in NY's MSA so little listening is done in cars, the building penetration is critical.

and don't even try to listen in the Subway to any station. The Subway is not radio freindly, never was.

When you said "broadening the format", why couldn't that be a contributing factor in doubling the ratings? We see it all the time and discussed examples on this web site as to the importance of imaging and perception.

Broadening means the areas where promotions are done, etc, took on the dimensions of the expanded coverage. The name was changed to avoid confusion with any recall of the old frequency, but the morning show was the same, and so on...

I arrive at that conclusion because what they had with "la Kalle" was profitable enough to allow them the capital to finance the purchase of 96.3.

The move had to do with being competitive in signal as well as programming. Whether Kalle was profitable or not is irrelevant... a strong presence in a major ad buying center is. For most of the 2000's, 105.9 billed less than 20% of the billing of WSKQ, for example.

Admittedly, a strong presence in better accomplished with the stronger signal, but they started out either on, or a pitstop on, Long Island's 92.7, before 105.9, didn't they?

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[davideduardo]

Admittedly, a strong presence in better accomplished with the stronger signal, but they started out either on, or a pitstop on, Long Island's 92.7, before 105.9, didn't they?

Who or what was on 92.7? The 96.3 morning show certainly was not.

Before briefly simulcasting 105.9, 92.7 was in English. And for the last several years, 92.7 has been a Regional Mexican station, serving the significant Mexican population in Queens and Western Long Island.

 

[badjef]

Admittedly, a strong presence in better accomplished with the stronger signal, but they started out either on, or a pitstop on, Long Island's 92.7, before 105.9, didn't they?

Who or what was on 92.7? The 96.3 morning show certainly was not.

Before briefly simulcasting 105.9, 92.7 was in English. And for the last several years, 92.7 has been a Regional Mexican station, serving the significant Mexican population in Queens and Western Long Island.

92.7 was English rocker WLIR and then WDRE. I believe they switched back to WLIR after the legal action was completed which is why they switched to WDRE in the first place (I do not recall the legal problem).

Did Mega/WADO purchase it during that time?
I admitedly have some pieces missing when it comes to a non-english station transfer in a market I wasn't in at the time. The simul was about a year or 2 as I recall?

I guess the point was, it was a multi-step migration to the point of a full B signal.

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[davideduardo]

92.7 was English rocker WLIR and then WDRE. I believe they switched back to WLIR after the legal action was completed which is why they switched to WDRE in the first place (I do not recall the legal problem).Did Mega/WADO purchase it during that time?

Mega is owned by SBS. WADO was owned by Hispanic Broadcasting. They bought 105.9 in 1999, and WLIR in very late 2003.

I admitedly have some pieces missing when it comes to a non-english station transfer in a market I wasn't in at the time. The simul was about a year or 2 as I recall?

WCAA and 92.7 simulcast for about two years, '04 to early '07. Then 92.7 changed to WQBU and Regional Mexican, as it is now.

I guess the point was, it was a multi-step migration to the point of a full B signal.

No, WCAA had 92.7 in sumulcast for a couple of years, then had nothing but 105.9 till the "trade plus cash" for 96.3 late last year.

 

[badjef]

92.7 was English rocker WLIR and then WDRE. I believe they switched back to WLIR after the legal action was completed which is why they switched to WDRE in the first place (I do not recall the legal problem).Did Mega/WADO purchase it during that time?

Mega is owned by SBS. WADO was owned by Hispanic Broadcasting. They bought 105.9 in 1999, and WLIR in very late 2003.

My mistake, I was interupted when posting. Mega is sitting at 97.9. Which is another interesting set of circumstances. With the exception of competition, my questions were directed to the eventual Spanish (language) format on 96.3. And the steps that were taken in that process.

I admitedly have some pieces missing when it comes to a non-english station transfer in a market I wasn't in at the time. The simul was about a year or 2 as I recall?

WCAA and 92.7 simulcast for about two years, '04 to early '07.

Was there an intention at any time to permanently keep the simul or was that too redundant or rule violation?

Then 92.7 changed to WQBU and Regional Mexican, as it is now.

I guess the point was, it was a multi-step migration to the point of a full B signal.

No, WCAA had 92.7 in sumulcast for a couple of years, then had nothing but 105.9 till the "trade plus cash" for 96.3 late last year.

Considering the NYC stations, if somebody is looking for something than the same top 20 songs and "Classic Hits", the "other than English" speaking formats, offer a choice, it is part of the reason I was glad of the traditions of WQXR being attempted on 105.9.

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[davideduardo]

Was there an intention at any time to permanently keep the simul or was that too redundant or rule violation?

The tiny gain for WCAA via the simulcast was all in areas covered by 105.9, so it seemed better to serve the growing and, till then, unserved Mexican origin population.