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FM TALK: NOWWWWWWWWWWW IT BEGINS...
- Thread starter Holland Cooke
- Start date
I suspect you meant "AS I said..."
You must think I'm a-glutton-for-punishment, jousting with anonymous denizens as-gleefully-as-I-do here.
"Glutton?"
Guilty!
And I'll prove it Thursday.
"Punishment?"
Whattya think, I'm somekinda MASOCHIST or something???
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUzRDwErYWM
BUT SERIOUSLY...having-opened-that-door, would you care to offer YOUR aircheck?
You must think I'm a-glutton-for-punishment, jousting with anonymous denizens as-gleefully-as-I-do here.
"Glutton?"
Guilty!
And I'll prove it Thursday.
"Punishment?"
Whattya think, I'm somekinda MASOCHIST or something???
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUzRDwErYWM
BUT SERIOUSLY...having-opened-that-door, would you care to offer YOUR aircheck?
And whoever said it was wrong. Another friggin' bromide that I hate. Something you'd EXPECT to hear on talk radio. C'mon Silkie. You're better 'n that.Silkie said:There are talk FMs around the country that have been around for years.
"Those who can't do teach", I believe someone once said. If you can't do it you have no business teaching it.
Three doors down lives a chemical engineer who worked in the NASA program but was laid off. Good fellow. Went back to college to get his teaching certification and now teaches high school chemistry. Think he can't do it? Take the "teaching" axiom and lose it. Tommy Lasorda is also another good example. As is Bill Belichick. How many Superbowl rings?
Holland Cooke said:You must think I'm a-glutton-for-punishment, jousting with anonymous denizens as-gleefully-as-I-do here.
"Glutton?"
Guilty!
And I'll prove it Thursday.
"Punishment?"
Whattya think, I'm somekinda MASOCHIST or something???
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUzRDwErYWM
BUT SERIOUSLY...having-opened-that-door, would you care to offer YOUR aircheck?
My "airchecks" always hit the nail on the head - never failed yet. But you have a good time Thursday while the rest of us are with family and friends.
Element9 said:And whoever said it was wrong. Another friggin' bromide that I hate. Something you'd EXPECT to hear on talk radio. C'mon Silkie. You're better 'n that.Silkie said:There are talk FMs around the country that have been around for years.
"Those who can't do teach", I believe someone once said. If you can't do it you have no business teaching it.
Three doors down lives a chemical engineer who worked in the NASA program but was laid off. Good fellow. Went back to college to get his teaching certification and now teaches high school chemistry. Think he can't do it? Take the "teaching" axiom and lose it. Tommy Lasorda is also another good example. As is Bill Belichick. How many Superbowl rings?
A chemical engineer who did the job and now teaches chemistry.
I'm sure Tommy Lasorda and Bill Belichick have played football.
Many technically trained people have a second career after retiring, many go teach. Sort of a way to keep busy and active, using their mind, and they get to give something back. So they can do and still they go teach.
Not everyone though can be a teacher. Just having the knowledge isn't enough. We've all known or even had people who were teachers who were horrible. They had the head knowledge, but sure didn't have that special thing that good teachers have where they can make a boring subject interesting and help make a difficult concept clear to a struggling student without making the student feel stupid, etc.
I know of a extremely gifted concert pianist who rather than performing on concert stages around the world making tons of money and having fame, recording options, etc, chose to work at a regular 9-5 non-music job making far less money and definitely far less glamour, etc. He uses his talent in music in his local church for free, because he saw more value for that than having the big splashy career as a concert pianist. So there are those who can, but choose the "lesser" way, because they see more value where what they may do might benefit people better.
So getting this back to radio, Holland good luck guest hosting a network radio talk show. Who knows, maybe ABC radio or whomever will soon be promoting the new talker with a different spin on things, the Holland Cooke Show. At any rate, enjoy your moment in the spotlight.
Not everyone though can be a teacher. Just having the knowledge isn't enough. We've all known or even had people who were teachers who were horrible. They had the head knowledge, but sure didn't have that special thing that good teachers have where they can make a boring subject interesting and help make a difficult concept clear to a struggling student without making the student feel stupid, etc.
I know of a extremely gifted concert pianist who rather than performing on concert stages around the world making tons of money and having fame, recording options, etc, chose to work at a regular 9-5 non-music job making far less money and definitely far less glamour, etc. He uses his talent in music in his local church for free, because he saw more value for that than having the big splashy career as a concert pianist. So there are those who can, but choose the "lesser" way, because they see more value where what they may do might benefit people better.
So getting this back to radio, Holland good luck guest hosting a network radio talk show. Who knows, maybe ABC radio or whomever will soon be promoting the new talker with a different spin on things, the Holland Cooke Show. At any rate, enjoy your moment in the spotlight.
RE "enjoy your moment in the spotlight"
I sure did!
And, after sitting in for Jim Bohannon, I did three nights for John Hancock on WBT/Charlotte's mighty night pattern.
Got calls and Emails from all over.
THAT was a kick too.
Possibly because it was just-for-fun.
I hadn't been on-air for the-13-years-I-was-a-management-suit when I suited-up for WBIG Oldies100/Washington 1n 1995.
None of the studio equipment was the same (where'd the vinyl go?).
But it really WAS "like riding a bike."
And, as I admitted up-above, I figured I'd finally played a few games in The Bigs.
But what made it fun was that it wasn't my job, fulltime.
I'd do a weekend shift here and there, or do middays or afternoon drive for a week.
Then, a couple weeks later, there'd be this check.
I thought I was there for therapy!
"Recreational jocking" as the PD put it.
Doing TALK radio recently was less-about unfinished business than having fun.
And it sure was.
Two what-did-I-learn moments were familiar HC lore, both things that Rush-wanna-be's and anonymous denizens here HATE:
1. Come-to-the-point as-QUICKLY-as-possible, rather than obscuring what-this-hour-is-about behind 6 minutes of blah blah blah off-the-top. PPM data we're seeing reinforces how every...single...syllable matters, or listeners are off-like-a-prom-dress. Some of the hosts I work with do something that strikes me as REAL smart: they don't go into-delay until AFTER the first spots...so listeners hear why-to-become-callers 7-seconds-quicker.
2. Set the table, then, make callers the star. NOTHING I've advocated has gotten me more-flamed here in radio-info Land, but when it's one well-screened-caller-after-another, the show takes wings.
My first-ever hour on WBT (http://getonthenet.com/WBT-greenshoots.mp3) became two hours, because listeners were so responsive to the topic, and were talking-to-each-other on the radio. This was August, after Ben Bernanke's "60 Minutes" interview, in-which he coined the term "green shoots," apropos early anecdotal indications that recovery has begun (however gradually). So I asked "Have you seen-the-green? Or are things still getting worse?"
Three almost-in-a-row callers:
a.) a restaurant manager said "the specials are working, but we don't dare discontinue 'em."
b.) trucker who hauls produce says "we can't deliver it fast enough."
c.) ANOTHER trucker who hauls ag equipment said "it's busier now."
Those three callers represented, end-to-end, the food-chain of food.
And they showed up for a stranger, because they were invited.
As I also said, up-above various insults above, I'm writing shorter memos now too.
Happy Thanksgiving from your FAVORITE turkey,
HC
www.HollandCooke.com
I sure did!
And, after sitting in for Jim Bohannon, I did three nights for John Hancock on WBT/Charlotte's mighty night pattern.
Got calls and Emails from all over.
THAT was a kick too.
Possibly because it was just-for-fun.
I hadn't been on-air for the-13-years-I-was-a-management-suit when I suited-up for WBIG Oldies100/Washington 1n 1995.
None of the studio equipment was the same (where'd the vinyl go?).
But it really WAS "like riding a bike."
And, as I admitted up-above, I figured I'd finally played a few games in The Bigs.
But what made it fun was that it wasn't my job, fulltime.
I'd do a weekend shift here and there, or do middays or afternoon drive for a week.
Then, a couple weeks later, there'd be this check.
I thought I was there for therapy!
"Recreational jocking" as the PD put it.
Doing TALK radio recently was less-about unfinished business than having fun.
And it sure was.
Two what-did-I-learn moments were familiar HC lore, both things that Rush-wanna-be's and anonymous denizens here HATE:
1. Come-to-the-point as-QUICKLY-as-possible, rather than obscuring what-this-hour-is-about behind 6 minutes of blah blah blah off-the-top. PPM data we're seeing reinforces how every...single...syllable matters, or listeners are off-like-a-prom-dress. Some of the hosts I work with do something that strikes me as REAL smart: they don't go into-delay until AFTER the first spots...so listeners hear why-to-become-callers 7-seconds-quicker.
2. Set the table, then, make callers the star. NOTHING I've advocated has gotten me more-flamed here in radio-info Land, but when it's one well-screened-caller-after-another, the show takes wings.
My first-ever hour on WBT (http://getonthenet.com/WBT-greenshoots.mp3) became two hours, because listeners were so responsive to the topic, and were talking-to-each-other on the radio. This was August, after Ben Bernanke's "60 Minutes" interview, in-which he coined the term "green shoots," apropos early anecdotal indications that recovery has begun (however gradually). So I asked "Have you seen-the-green? Or are things still getting worse?"
Three almost-in-a-row callers:
a.) a restaurant manager said "the specials are working, but we don't dare discontinue 'em."
b.) trucker who hauls produce says "we can't deliver it fast enough."
c.) ANOTHER trucker who hauls ag equipment said "it's busier now."
Those three callers represented, end-to-end, the food-chain of food.
And they showed up for a stranger, because they were invited.
As I also said, up-above various insults above, I'm writing shorter memos now too.
Happy Thanksgiving from your FAVORITE turkey,
HC
www.HollandCooke.com
Element9 said:The 12-24 demo thinks Rush, Hannity and Savage are "crazy old white guys" not because they've been brain-washed by the liberal (cough) media, but because they may have heard mom and dad listening to these guys and they didn't like what Rush, Hannity & Savage were saying. There is no second generation of Rush listeners. He is your father's Oldsmobile. There's a big difference between name recognition in this case and actually seeking out the programming. So the kids might... might... recognize the name, but they sure don't want to listen to his bombast.
And how is this any different than when the boomers were that age? While talk radio wasn't as prevalent in the 60s & 70s as it is today, even by the mid 70s lots of AMs were transitioning to talk at night. I doubt there were many 20somethings tuning in then either. Talk radio, then as now was a 45+ format.
As far as ideology goes, it wasn't cool to be conservative if you were in your 20s in the 70s either.
Who knows what today's 20 year olds will listen to when they hit middle age. Note that talk radio didn't evolve into what it is today until the boomer generation hit their 40s. What ever it is, it'll likely be their generation speaking their language.
Rush would NEVER admit it...
Good point!
In-the-wake-of Tricky Dick, "young Republican" was an oxymoron.
With-the-benefit-of-hindsight, we appreciate Gerald Fordnow than we did then.
The Profile in Courage Award the Kennedy's gave him recognized his courage in pardoning Nixon.
We were SO angry at Republicans then that the-long-view was obscured.
Rush would NEVER admit it, but President Obama is lots better for his business than a President McCain and Veep Palin would've been. Limbaugh, Hannity, et al had-a-tough-time-keeping-a-straight-face while Bush Jr. couldn't find his veto pen, and the Republican Congress spent money our kids won't have.
Track the progress of the vaunted "Talk Radio Revolution" and you'll see how its big stars hit-their-stride when they were the-party-on-the-outs, as they are again now.
Projecting present trends, and witnessing radio's sad atrophy, it's hard to believe they'll be using AM/FM the way people do now.
Oldbones said:As far as ideology goes, it wasn't cool to be conservative if you were in your 20s in the 70s either.
Good point!
In-the-wake-of Tricky Dick, "young Republican" was an oxymoron.
With-the-benefit-of-hindsight, we appreciate Gerald Fordnow than we did then.
The Profile in Courage Award the Kennedy's gave him recognized his courage in pardoning Nixon.
We were SO angry at Republicans then that the-long-view was obscured.
Rush would NEVER admit it, but President Obama is lots better for his business than a President McCain and Veep Palin would've been. Limbaugh, Hannity, et al had-a-tough-time-keeping-a-straight-face while Bush Jr. couldn't find his veto pen, and the Republican Congress spent money our kids won't have.
Track the progress of the vaunted "Talk Radio Revolution" and you'll see how its big stars hit-their-stride when they were the-party-on-the-outs, as they are again now.
Oldbones said:Who knows what today's 20 year olds will listen to when they hit middle age.
Projecting present trends, and witnessing radio's sad atrophy, it's hard to believe they'll be using AM/FM the way people do now.
Used to be that 18-34s could "morph" into news-talk when they hit 40+. As a former news-talk PD, it pains me to say this, but I think those days are over for a number of reasons, the Internet and the "on demand" product being foremost. Here's a very worthwhile presentation, The Future of News by Jeff Cole, offered by Minnesota Public Radio. It's about 40 minutes, but it's well worth viewing and hearing.
And how is this any different than when the boomers were that age? While talk radio wasn't as prevalent in the 60s & 70s as it is today, even by the mid 70s lots of AMs were transitioning to talk at night. I doubt there were many 20somethings tuning in then either. Talk radio, then as now was a 45+ format.
There were a lot of twentysomethings and teens that listened, particularly in markets where the host was allowed to be "hot" or controversial. Many of them tried to call in and derail the host, becoming the first crank callers.
D
DocWashburn
Guest
Undoubtedly. Most Rush fans don't get the opportunity to hear as much of his show as they would like to. It is irrelevant that they are hearing Thursday's show on Saturday (or Friday's show on Sunday) because of the talent involved. There is a reason this guy is still "head and shoulders" above everyone else in the industry. If you understand what attracts listeners to him in the first place, then you'll get why "Best of Rush" weekend shows make sense too. After 21 years (and all that money), he still brings it every day. He never phones it in...and to paraphrase an old NBC TV liner "if you haven't heard it before, it's new to you"!Holland Cooke said:smedge2006 said:Just because I'm working on my patio deck Saturday afternoon doesn't mean I want to hear somebody talking about patio decks.
Most weekend listeners would prefer hearing what-was-OBVIOUSLY Limbaugh's Thursday show, complete with references to real-time events on a muted studio Fox News monitor at the time?
Very true a best of lineup will beat the crap out of Kommando, Brinker and the homeimprovement guys anyday. If you can get dollars on the local fix it show, great. if you can't... play the hits.DocWashburn said:Undoubtedly. Most Rush fans don't get the opportunity to hear as much of his show as they would like to. It is irrelevant that they are hearing Thursday's show on Saturday (or Friday's show on Sunday) because of the talent involved. There is a reason this guy is still "head and shoulders" above everyone else in the industry. If you understand what attracts listeners to him in the first place, then you'll get why "Best of Rush" weekend shows make sense too. After 21 years (and all that money), he still brings it every day. He never phones it in...and to paraphrase an old NBC TV liner "if you haven't heard it before, it's new to you"!Holland Cooke said:smedge2006 said:Just because I'm working on my patio deck Saturday afternoon doesn't mean I want to hear somebody talking about patio decks.
Most weekend listeners would prefer hearing what-was-OBVIOUSLY Limbaugh's Thursday show, complete with references to real-time events on a muted studio Fox News monitor at the time?
What about all news?
How about FM news? NPR/MPBN up in Maine has begun covering local news and has weather reports for the state. This has made any interest from me in the AM dial decrease (I used to listen to WBZ). If an all news (or mostly news) format were to get up and going out of Portland it would probably make my preset. If WBZ were to get on a strong FM stick it would probably increase its listenership. We have television stations all over the country upping their local news coverage (with some national content) for 5 or more hours a day. Why doesn't radio figure out that there are people interested in an all news format? How many times do all news formats have to wallop the ratings books before people in radio wake up. People want all news and they want it on FM. Talk is strong enough to pull in folks to the AM dial. These are destination listeners and they want to hear their hot heads. Putting them on FM squanders the signal, which could be used to bring in a broad swath of listeners and at the same time kills the AM property- genius Mr. Holland! For low-performing rimshot FMs that can go mono I can see some interest in going talk, but I submit many would do better with an all-news operation. You can get large quantities of time covered by the Network at the top and bottom of the hour. Then add in weather channel updates. Finally fill in with top stories from a local vantage and a couple local hosts.
How about FM news? NPR/MPBN up in Maine has begun covering local news and has weather reports for the state. This has made any interest from me in the AM dial decrease (I used to listen to WBZ). If an all news (or mostly news) format were to get up and going out of Portland it would probably make my preset. If WBZ were to get on a strong FM stick it would probably increase its listenership. We have television stations all over the country upping their local news coverage (with some national content) for 5 or more hours a day. Why doesn't radio figure out that there are people interested in an all news format? How many times do all news formats have to wallop the ratings books before people in radio wake up. People want all news and they want it on FM. Talk is strong enough to pull in folks to the AM dial. These are destination listeners and they want to hear their hot heads. Putting them on FM squanders the signal, which could be used to bring in a broad swath of listeners and at the same time kills the AM property- genius Mr. Holland! For low-performing rimshot FMs that can go mono I can see some interest in going talk, but I submit many would do better with an all-news operation. You can get large quantities of time covered by the Network at the top and bottom of the hour. Then add in weather channel updates. Finally fill in with top stories from a local vantage and a couple local hosts.
That is expensive and won't work in anything but the biggest markets.
And the reason it takes a big market...
ANY format will do better on FM than AM, since roughly 80% of TSL is there.
But the format's strength is its weakness. Because all-news is "instant gratification" radio, it has only found success in markets where there's enough available cume for many-shorter-occasions-of-listening to aggregate into salable AQH.
You're correct about those off-to-the-side FMs going-Talk-in-mono. And, like all-news, they'll bear a higher spot load than any music format. And being Talk Radio, they can sell "things," not just numbers. Properly done, weekends can be a gold mine.
robbbc said:Mr. Holland! For low-performing rimshot FMs that can go mono I can see some interest in going talk, but I submit many would do better with an all-news operation. You can get large quantities of time covered by the Network at the top and bottom of the hour. Then add in weather channel updates. Finally fill in with top stories from a local vantage and a couple local hosts.
ANY format will do better on FM than AM, since roughly 80% of TSL is there.
But the format's strength is its weakness. Because all-news is "instant gratification" radio, it has only found success in markets where there's enough available cume for many-shorter-occasions-of-listening to aggregate into salable AQH.
You're correct about those off-to-the-side FMs going-Talk-in-mono. And, like all-news, they'll bear a higher spot load than any music format. And being Talk Radio, they can sell "things," not just numbers. Properly done, weekends can be a gold mine.
Just about every market has at least a couple of redundant music FMs that would be better off with some variation of a spoken-word format... ;D
What happened?
Hey!
What's goin' on here?
A whole page with NO snarky put-downs???
Hey!
What's goin' on here?
A whole page with NO snarky put-downs???
OK, how about Music... and NEWS!
I know, the concept of a full service radio station is pretty whack-a-doodle, but how about creating a Mix station with news at the top and bottom of the hour? People come for the top stories and stay for the music. Definitely would put one of my Mix stations at the top of my preset lists. Right now, the all music formats are getting a bit stale and a little differentiation would help.
I know, the concept of a full service radio station is pretty whack-a-doodle, but how about creating a Mix station with news at the top and bottom of the hour? People come for the top stories and stay for the music. Definitely would put one of my Mix stations at the top of my preset lists. Right now, the all music formats are getting a bit stale and a little differentiation would help.
Re: The suggestion of music and regular news updates on one station:
New Jersey 101.5 out of Trenton seems to be doing quite well with this on weekends. From Friday night through Saturday and Sunday, they play 70s and 80s hits along with top of the hour news, and frequent weather and traffic updates.
During the week, of course, they're live and local talk.
This may not work everywhere, but I'm surprised more FM stations haven't tried this approach. You could even restrict the talk to 5 AM to 7 PM weekdays to keep costs lower. Nights and weekends, play classic hits that appeal to a 35-54 audience.
New Jersey 101.5 out of Trenton seems to be doing quite well with this on weekends. From Friday night through Saturday and Sunday, they play 70s and 80s hits along with top of the hour news, and frequent weather and traffic updates.
During the week, of course, they're live and local talk.
This may not work everywhere, but I'm surprised more FM stations haven't tried this approach. You could even restrict the talk to 5 AM to 7 PM weekdays to keep costs lower. Nights and weekends, play classic hits that appeal to a 35-54 audience.
Very true a best of lineup will beat the crap out of Kommando, Brinker and the homeimprovement guys anyday. If you can get dollars on the local fix it show, great. if you can't... play the hits./color]
Holland, is this true?
I'm not a big Rush listener, one hour is usually tops before I lose interest completely and have to change stations. Hannity maybe 5-10 minutes. I enjoy the NPR entertainment talk shows on weekends, Car Talk, Wait wait don't tell me, What da ya know with Michael Feldman, You Bet your garden , Fresh Air Weekend - depending on who's being interviewed. My question is, Rush/Hannity's fans generally are loyal and listen most weekdays. Wouldn't those folks want something different on weekends rather than a repeat of what will now be old news stories. Nothing like hearing a story from last Monday on Saturday. I find it hard to believe that a news/talk station does better playing an entire afternoon of the best of Rush/Hannity rather than topical talk, handyman talk, gardening talk, computer talk (Kommando), sports talk, college sports, or even political talk other than Rush/Hannity, or some sort of music suited to the demo that listens to Rush/Hannity.
As much as I like Car Talk, if I had listened to it all week long, I'd want a break on the weekend.
Holland, is this true?
I'm not a big Rush listener, one hour is usually tops before I lose interest completely and have to change stations. Hannity maybe 5-10 minutes. I enjoy the NPR entertainment talk shows on weekends, Car Talk, Wait wait don't tell me, What da ya know with Michael Feldman, You Bet your garden , Fresh Air Weekend - depending on who's being interviewed. My question is, Rush/Hannity's fans generally are loyal and listen most weekdays. Wouldn't those folks want something different on weekends rather than a repeat of what will now be old news stories. Nothing like hearing a story from last Monday on Saturday. I find it hard to believe that a news/talk station does better playing an entire afternoon of the best of Rush/Hannity rather than topical talk, handyman talk, gardening talk, computer talk (Kommando), sports talk, college sports, or even political talk other than Rush/Hannity, or some sort of music suited to the demo that listens to Rush/Hannity.
As much as I like Car Talk, if I had listened to it all week long, I'd want a break on the weekend.
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