Forever 27 club

[radioman148]

i love this song....while I was watching your clip....I saw a clip, from I am guessing, Shin-dig, the real Crystals lipsynching to he's a Rebel...La La Brooks is going to town and It's Darlene voice coming out of her mouth..... Spector had to use Darlene Love because the real Crystals were still in NY..and he wanted to beat a competing version to the radio stations ,by of all people Vikki Carr...his version came out at the same time as Vikki's and her version died on the vine. Don't forget Al Pacino is currently filming the Phil Spector story, out soon on HBO. someone posted on the you tube clip that it was the Blossoms, I don't think the Blossoms had been invented yet..it was all session singers which included darlene Love and Cher LaPierre who at the time was the 15 yr old girlfriend of Spector go-fer Sonny Bono.

My Billboard Book of Number One Hits tells that same story, too, and they did indeed credit the Blossoms with recording "He's A Rebel." But I have found the occasional mistake elsewhere in that book.

Ironically Phil Spector wrote a lot of the material he recorded...except for "He's a Rebel" written by Gene Pitney..had he written It he may not have been in such a hurry to record and waited for the real Crytals to arrive from NY....even Whitburn refers to He's a Rebel as recorded by the Blossoms..since Cher was involved and she was not a Blossom, I think they retrospect the name the Blossoms which were formed after Bobee Soxx and Blue Jeans and bobbee soxx and blue jeans if i am not mistaken, were at the same time, or after the Crystals.

Was Cher actually singing on "He's A Rebel?"
BTW: Vicki Carr's version was a big hit in Australia. Why, I don't know.

 

[firepoint525]

Seems like there was a similar situation involving the Supremes, in which one of their singles, I believe it was "Come See About Me," had to be rush-released, probably by Holland Dozier Holland, or maybe even Motown itself, because a competing version (Nella Dodds?) was also out there, and climbing the charts.

Big difference from the '50s, when it seemed like songwriters wanted as many competing versions as possible of their songs out there.

 

[hornet61]

By most accounts since sonny was heavily involved with Spector productions Cher was used on several recordings...He's a Rebel is the most prominent one mentioned as Cher participating...the picture of Darlene love during a recording session shows Cher next to her..thiswas the photo used in the induction ceremony for Hall this past weekend.


thats an interesting story on the supremes ..there is alot of stuff that went on, that we are just finding about now...

 

[firepoint525]

Cher has a husky voice (for a woman) so if she did any vocal work on "He's A Rebel," wouldn't we have been able to hear it? (Unless her vocals were "buried" background vocals.) How old would she have been at the time? 16?

 

[firepoint525]

Using one group to record material credited to another group was tried again in the late '80s, this time to disastrous results! Google "Milli Vanilli"! ;D

Not saying that Spector was being deceptive (not this time, at least!), just that he was trying to rush-release a song or two.

 

[radioman148]

Cher has a husky voice (for a woman) so if she did any vocal work on "He's A Rebel," wouldn't we have been able to hear it? (Unless her vocals were "buried" background vocals.) How old would she have been at the time? 16?

I can't picture (hear) in my mind Cher in that song, but what do I know?

 

[hornet61]

Cher has a husky voice (for a woman) so if she did any vocal work on "He's A Rebel," wouldn't we have been able to hear it? (Unless her vocals were "buried" background vocals.) How old would she have been at the time? 16?

I can't picture (hear) in my mind Cher in that song, but what do I know?

See what happens when Do this from memory Cher was on The Next Crystals release The Doo Run Run, darlene love's a fine boy, and the Ronettes Be My baby....not he's a rebel, I remembered some bono interviews and he generalized I guess, when he said Cher was on early Spector Stuff out of hollywood. i have all these reference books I better start using them..my mind is going.. I am definitley using my Whitburn pop annual book , for the Abq High 1961 re-union fridayy night I get to play the good stuff 1955-1963 that's all they want,,they were very adamant NO Beatles,and alot of Elvis..

 

[radioman148]

Cher has a husky voice (for a woman) so if she did any vocal work on "He's A Rebel," wouldn't we have been able to hear it? (Unless her vocals were "buried" background vocals.) How old would she have been at the time? 16?

I can't picture (hear) in my mind Cher in that song, but what do I know?

See what happens when Do this from memory Cher was on The Next Crystals release The Doo Run Run, darlene love's a fine boy, and the Ronettes Be My baby....not he's a rebel, I remembered some bono interviews and he generalized I guess, when he said Cher was on early Spector Stuff out of hollywood. i have all these reference books I better start using them..my mind is going.. I am definitley using my Whitburn pop annual book , for the Abq High 1961 re-union fridayy night I get to play the good stuff 1955-1963 that's all they want,,they were very adamant NO Beatles,and alot of Elvis..

Ahh, my favorite music.

 

[firepoint525]

See what happens when Do this from memory Cher was on The Next Crystals release The Doo Run Run, darlene love's a fine boy, and the Ronettes Be My baby....not he's a rebel, I remembered some bono interviews and he generalized I guess, when he said Cher was on early Spector Stuff out of hollywood. i have all these reference books I better start using them..my mind is going.. I am definitley using my Whitburn pop annual book , for the Abq High 1961 re-union fridayy night I get to play the good stuff 1955-1963 that's all they want,,they were very adamant NO Beatles,and alot of Elvis..

I would probably have to hit the door at a party like that. While I like and enjoy a lot of music from the late '50s to early '60s time frame (and it was before my time, mind you!), I have still GOT to have some Beatles. The crowd at that reunion would probably tell you that the Beatles "ruined" music, but some of the stuff from the early '60s was getting pretty sappy by the time they came along.

 

[firepoint525]

Found the Nella Dodds version of "Come See About Me," and I can see why H-D-H was concerned about the competition! This version is nearly identical to the Supremes!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ul_nCuTFd9A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwhsp_QWX2I&feature=related

Same audio in both of the above clips, but one of them shows a photo of Dodds, while the other shows the record label. She was on Wand records, same label as the Kingsmen, of "Louie Louie" fame.

A similar situation happened again in the '70s, in which the writers and producers of "Billy, Don't Be a Hero" by Paper Lace had to deal with a competing version by Bo Donaldson and the Heywoods. But in this case, they lost out to the Heywoods! But losing out to the competing version sort of turned out to be a blessing in disguise, because the followup, "The Night Chicago Died" became a bona fide hit for Paper Lace.

 

[radioman148]

Found the Nella Dodds version of "Come See About Me," and I can see why H-D-H was concerned about the competition! This version is nearly identical to the Supremes!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ul_nCuTFd9A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwhsp_QWX2I&feature=related

Same audio in both of the above clips, but one of them shows a photo of Dodds, while the other shows the record label. She was on Wand records, same label as the Kingsmen, of "Louie Louie" fame.

A similar situation happened again in the '70s, in which the writers and producers of "Billy, Don't Be a Hero" by Paper Lace had to deal with a competing version by Bo Donaldson and the Heywoods. But in this case, they lost out to the Heywoods! But losing out to the competing version sort of turned out to be a blessing in disguise, because the followup, "The Night Chicago Died" became a bona fide hit for Paper Lace.

The Paper Lace version of "Billy" was a huge hit in the UK.

 

[radioman148]

You're right the Nella Dodds version is very similar.

 

[firepoint525]

A similar situation happened again in the '70s, in which the writers and producers of "Billy, Don't Be a Hero" by Paper Lace had to deal with a competing version by Bo Donaldson and the Heywoods. But in this case, they lost out to the Heywoods! But losing out to the competing version sort of turned out to be a blessing in disguise, because the followup, "The Night Chicago Died" became a bona fide hit for Paper Lace.

The Paper Lace version of "Billy" was a huge hit in the UK.

You are correct. Evidently what happened was that while Paper Lace was trying to get a U.S. record deal, the Heywoods recorded and released their version. By the time Paper Lace got a record deal here in the states, it was too late. But they made lemonade out of their lemons, and still got a U.S. hit with "The Night Chicago Died."

 

[hornet61]

the divide between pre-beatles and post beatles is often expressed on this site..as a member of the original baby boom (sep 1946) and a high school graduate of 1964... we are fortunate to be on the fence separating both and we love both era's equally..at least I do, and most particants of the many re-unions that i do favor both era's equally..I am sure there exceptions..we get just as juiced with "Jailhouse rock" as we do with "she loves you" and "Wolly Bully".. "Sincerely" and "Close To You"

turned 65 or soon will be..Hornet61, bill Clinton, Cher. linda Rondstadt, george and Laura Bush, Sly stallone, Suzanne Sommers,marianne faithful,carl wilson, patti smith, jd souther, sally field, richard carpenter, justin hayward, daryll hall, millie small,paul le-mat, oliver stone, jo-el sonnier, barry gibb, billy preston,connie chung, keith moon, lesly ann warren, larry grahmn,john conlee,candice bergen,jonathan edwards, danny glover,vincent pastore, cheech marin,joe spano, ron silver,fred dryer, gilda radner,bonn scott, andre the giant,reggie jackson, dave mason,talia shire, tim curry, haley mills,john waters, stanley tucci, al green,lisa minnelli, david gilmour,tyne daly, sandy duncan, terry kath, gregory hine, naomi judd, dolly parton, david lynch,ronnie milsap, diane keaton,john paul jones, veronica principal (hey what was she doing with andy gibb---the original cougar)..robbie krieger..missed a few gotta stop....we are the lucky ones born tasting the best of both worlds..

 

[radioman148]

the divide between pre-beatles and post beatles is often expressed on this site..as a member of the original baby boom (sep 1946) and a high school graduate of 1964... we are fortunate to be on the fence separating both and we love both era's equally..at least I do, and most particants of the many re-unions that i do favor both era's equally..I am sure there exceptions..we get just as juiced with "Jailhouse rock" as we do with "she loves you" and "Wolly Bully".. "Sincerely" and "Close To You"

turned 65 or soon will be..Hornet61, bill Clinton, Cher. linda Rondstadt, george and Laura Bush, Sly stallone, Suzanne Sommers,marianne faithful,carl wilson, patti smith, jd souther, sally field, richard carpenter, justin hayward, daryll hall, millie small,paul le-mat, oliver stone, jo-el sonnier, barry gibb, billy preston,connie chung, keith moon, lesly ann warren, larry grahmn,john conlee,candice bergen,jonathan edwards, danny glover,vincent pastore, cheech marin,joe spano, ron silver,fred dryer, gilda radner,bonn scott, andre the giant,reggie jackson, dave mason,talia shire, tim curry, haley mills,john waters, stanley tucci, al green,lisa minnelli, david gilmour,tyne daly, sandy duncan, terry kath, gregory hine, naomi judd, dolly parton, david lynch,ronnie milsap, diane keaton,john paul jones, veronica principal (hey what was she doing with andy gibb---the original cougar)..robbie krieger..missed a few gotta stop....we are the lucky ones born tasting the best of both worlds..

I'm right behind you in age, but right with you on the music. I love pre-& post Beatles (and Beatles of course). Anything from 55--70 is right up my alley and there's some good stuff in the 70s too. No problem for me enjoying all the music. I would like to see more station feature 50s music, but I understand why they don't.

 

[radioman148]

A similar situation happened again in the '70s, in which the writers and producers of "Billy, Don't Be a Hero" by Paper Lace had to deal with a competing version by Bo Donaldson and the Heywoods. But in this case, they lost out to the Heywoods! But losing out to the competing version sort of turned out to be a blessing in disguise, because the followup, "The Night Chicago Died" became a bona fide hit for Paper Lace.

The Paper Lace version of "Billy" was a huge hit in the UK.

You are correct. Evidently what happened was that while Paper Lace was trying to get a U.S. record deal, the Heywoods recorded and released their version. By the time Paper Lace got a record deal here in the states, it was too late. But they made lemonade out of their lemons, and still got a U.S. hit with "The Night Chicago Died."

That's a reversal of the 60s, when so many artists in the UK covered almost everything in America.

 

[firepoint525]

It's interesting that the subject line of this thread is "forever 27 club," because I was about 27 (in 1991) when top 40 radio began to lose relevance for me. Of course, I was beginning to age beyond their demographic. As for me, I love everything from the '50s up through the late '80s. I grew up with a station that played the then-current stuff ('70s), but also played a lot of '50s and '60s, so I grew up with a lot of that, too.

 

[firepoint525]

A similar situation happened again in the '70s, in which the writers and producers of "Billy, Don't Be a Hero" by Paper Lace had to deal with a competing version by Bo Donaldson and the Heywoods. But in this case, they lost out to the Heywoods! But losing out to the competing version sort of turned out to be a blessing in disguise, because the followup, "The Night Chicago Died" became a bona fide hit for Paper Lace.

The Paper Lace version of "Billy" was a huge hit in the UK.

You are correct. Evidently what happened was that while Paper Lace was trying to get a U.S. record deal, the Heywoods recorded and released their version. By the time Paper Lace got a record deal here in the states, it was too late. But they made lemonade out of their lemons, and still got a U.S. hit with "The Night Chicago Died."

That's a reversal of the 60s, when so many artists in the UK covered almost everything in America.

Wasn't "Billy, Don't Be a Hero" about the Civil War? Don't know, just asking.

 

[radioman148]

A similar situation happened again in the '70s, in which the writers and producers of "Billy, Don't Be a Hero" by Paper Lace had to deal with a competing version by Bo Donaldson and the Heywoods. But in this case, they lost out to the Heywoods! But losing out to the competing version sort of turned out to be a blessing in disguise, because the followup, "The Night Chicago Died" became a bona fide hit for Paper Lace.

The Paper Lace version of "Billy" was a huge hit in the UK.

You are correct. Evidently what happened was that while Paper Lace was trying to get a U.S. record deal, the Heywoods recorded and released their version. By the time Paper Lace got a record deal here in the states, it was too late. But they made lemonade out of their lemons, and still got a U.S. hit with "The Night Chicago Died."

That's a reversal of the 60s, when so many artists in the UK covered almost everything in America.

Wasn't "Billy, Don't Be a Hero" about the Civil War? Don't know, just asking.

You're right it was about the Civil War, although most people thought it was about Vietnam because of the timing.

 

[radioman148]

It's interesting that the subject line of this thread is "forever 27 club," because I was about 27 (in 1991) when top 40 radio began to lose relevance for me. Of course, I was beginning to age beyond their demographic. As for me, I love everything from the '50s up through the late '80s. I grew up with a station that played the then-current stuff ('70s), but also played a lot of '50s and '60s, so I grew up with a lot of that, too.

Top 40 lost relevance for me also in the 90s even though I was in my 40s then. So maybe it wasn't an age thing as much as the quality of music.