K.M. Richards
Program Director, The Eighties Channel™
I recognize from the display format what your source was, Chico, and you are correct in that conclusion.
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HD subchannels with high ratings
- Thread starter yeoldeschool
- Start date
I recognize from the display format what your source was, Chico, and you are correct in that conclusion.
KJZZ-HD2 in Phoenix started to pop up with a 0.3 once they removed the nighttime jazz from the main station. But, I'm under the impression that they don't separately encode the broadcast station and the stream like some stations do. You ever wonder why you see the streaming breakout for Audacy stations but not for iHeart? I'm under the impression that only select station groups/owners split OTA ratings from streaming.
That sounds like a challenge from a processing perspective. How do they handle the processing for the AM signal? Is it final peak limiting and clipping only, allowing everything else done by the FM processing, like AGC and multiband compression/limiting, to simply "play through?"
Not at all! I understand very clearly who it is really for, and why everyone would want to appear as #5 or #6 via combined shares, rather than as 11th or 22nd, as David illustrated for example.
I think there's just a minor misunderstanding here. Look at this market and note the way that KMXB is listed. It appears twice, as "KMXB-FM" and as "KMXB-FM-STR", even though both are exactly the same station/audio. That is why I was lead to believe that Nielsen did "break out" separate iterations of the same thing. It's then why I believed, based on the absence of separate broken out AM (or HD2) vs. FM simulcast/translator numbers, that Nielsen simply didn't collect broken out AM (or HD2) vs. FM simulcast/translator information -- and I couldn't understand why they wouldn't, if they were willing to collect separately for streams. Another example where I saw this occurring was L.A., where, again, you see separate numbers for two identical versions of the same audio product (KNX-FM and KNX-FM-STR), but no separate numbers for the KNX-AM version of that same audio product.
However, now that it's been explained that subscribing stations do get that information, my curiosity is satisfied. I simply didn't know that they made the separate "radio" vs. "internet" data public, but kept the separate "radio type X" vs. "radio type Y" data private for paying subscribers only.
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Subscribers don't automatically get that information, it is an extra report they have to pay extra for, and most don't ever bother to pay for it unless they need to... like if they are evaluating whether or not to keep stations in a simulcast.
"Radio" and "Internet" often have separate commercial loads and therefore will be listed separately, while AM/FM simulcasts are that, pure simulcasts - no differences in commercials, so no need for separate ratings.
K.M. Richards
Program Director, The Eighties Channel™
I have no idea. I'm the program director, not the chief engineer. I only know that 1100 receives 93.7 off-air because that's what I was told. I didn't ask for details.
OTOH, it's a 1kw daytimer that we don't believe anyone is actually listening to, so the question may be academic.
That sort of begs the question: Are streams pulling any numbers?
Yes, radio streams show up more often and with greater numbers than HD channels, though they still are not a major factor and the streams that show are generally those with greater TSL (like Sports stations), where one panelist listening to a stream for an extended time can generate enough listening to register.
Huff brings up a great point: the part of radio listening that advertisers look at is "how many are listening when my ad might run?" They do not usually, or even "ever", look at the number of total listeners a station has.
Fun fact: for the average radio station, about half of the total listeners (called "cume" or "cumulative listener total") it has produce nearly 90% of all the listening time.
Huff explained this a week or so ago here but I still don't understand why some operators choose to combine OTA and streaming shares in total line reporting and others separate. If subscribers can see the breakdown anyway I would think all operators would want total line reporting. Even if a stream takes just 0.5 or 0.8 of the monthly share that can still displace a station a spot or even two. And I'm sure there are folks that don't scroll down to the bottom to look at the bottom level shares where streams are often found.
I also have always wondered how many quarter hour detections a station needs to get to even register a 0.1 on a monthly. And if even one single detection gets a station a 0.1 on a weekly or daily. I have always (possibly incorrectly) thought enough 'regular listeners' are streaming out of market stations enough where an assortment of out of market stations would show up in certain monthlies with the same frequency of the 0.2 and 0.3 numbers an HD2/HD3 gets.
K.M. Richards
Program Director, The Eighties Channel™
Now that you mention it, a rideshare (don't remember which one; I have accounts with both) was the only place I ever heard an HD2 as well.
My 70 year old father discovered HD2 stations on his own several years ago and I noticed it on a visit when we got in his car. He was in love with a deep cut/album cut HD2 of a traditional classic rock station. He didn't even realize what an HD2 station was, just that it showed up when he had been scanning.
Generally, those streams that are listed separately are translators that do not 100% duplicate the OTA signal. Nielsen will not allow single line reporting in these cases?
Advertisers, for whom we buy the ratings, want the audience data about who will hear their spots. If the stream has separate spots, it can not be qualified for SLR.
The math depends on the size of the sample and the variables like age, gender and ethnicity. So in each market and for each subset the number is slightly different.
Here in Orlando all of the major iHeart stations (WXXL, WMGF, WTKS et al.) have single line reporting. The major Cox stations (WMMO, WDBO, WWKA et al.) separate OTA and streaming. Audacy separates WOMX and WJMH but WOCL is single line reporting.
This link has the full explanation from Nielsen and you can generate a list of stations that combine for reporting.
Not once, at least through happenstance. The only person I knew who listened to an HD2 was a relative whose dashboard I disassembled to retrofit with an aftermarket HD radio. And that was only as a surprise gift, after I noted her increasing disappointment over her favorite station's ever-evolving playlist (she had no clue it offered an HD2 with its old format).
She went on using it every day for years until the station suddenly canned the HD2 itself. Now all she uses is Pandora.
When the IBOC radios first came out, some home stereos and component radios had HD on them like Sangean, Denon, Yamaha, etc. Then the cars started getting 'em on many models.
Who buys "home stereos" or component audio systems today?
Some of us do. Not as many as in the old days. There's a Reddit group devoted to quality hifi gear and more then you think have nice set-ups.
People with taste, of course.
Which more and more these days naturally means the minority.
Might I trouble you for the link?
People with taste, of course.
Which more and more these days naturally means the minority.
Might I trouble you for the link?
I did have relatives come and say "My phone does it all." And they complain when their phone or the network craps out which happens now and then.
I PMed you a link - not sure if it's allowed here although some high end tuners have HD.
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