I Heard A Rumor

[TowerBuzz]

Does Tower Buzz read the posts before he opens mouth without engaging brain?

---Fair Game is Hitler or O.J. Simpson - public figures who were dastardly.

---non-public figures have rights of privacy to a greater degree than "celebrities" or people in the news.

You can take on Oedipus or people he hired for the radio, but you can't say Oedipus is responsible
for the passing of Nicole Brown Simpson and Ron Goldman unless you have the evidence.

That's why Lucille Ball got her photo off of the cover of The Stones' SOME GIRLS album, making it a bit of a collector's item - which was their plan all along (and to have Jesse Jackson go after the title track, which he did).

You're talking about Lucille Ball during a discussion of Toucher and Rich and you question my brain?. : Ok......I look forward to your next anti oedipus, anti republican rant when the thread concerns,.................Something like music played off of cd's vs direct feeds from a station's hard drive. Im sure you'll find a way to bring up Oedipus, payola, swift Boat vets and your "groundbreaking" public access dog and pony show. I say we institute a statute of limitations on references! what do you say? 20 years backward max?. That should be more than enough of a window for you to drudge up plenty of irrelevent facts to share. That gives you a whole two decades to choose from!.

have at it man.

NOW............l et's try to do this sands the insults, ok? HERE GOES:

Look a woman died and it's tragic. Toucher and Rich opted to go the way that many find offensive, Ill give you that and I do not disagree that it was not respectful of the poor woman's death at all. That does not change the fact that they did nothing wrong legally or by fcc standards. They did nothing wrong according to the rules that govern on air behavior SO writing a letter for the pubic file and the fcc like I said is an excercise in futility and it lessens YOUR credibility with those who you would want to listen to you when somethig in the future actually meets the standards that would ake it an actionable offense. It's not a personal attack on you JOE I am telling you the reality of the situation. An insensitive comment does not make anyone's infraction list. There it is.

 

[Lucylu]

Point of order: Stern was still on tape delay and making no money for the station at night when they started with the Patriots, but it was a good try to blame the down fall of BCN on him. I blame Mark Hannon, a brain-dead weasle that hasn't made one single move that anyone could say help the station, the company or Redstone. I'm guessing they just haven't found the right empty suit to replace him with yet. How many more will he throw under the bus to protect his job? I think the over and under is at 12 right now. :

 

[TowerBuzz]

Pretty harsh words Lucy!. I think Mr.Hannon probably didnt realize going in that rock radio stations should be handled differently than a station like Mix which he wanted to be very warm and fuzzy. WBCN isnt Mix and for a while had no edge but now for better or worse with Toucher and Rich and O and A they do or at least have more than they have for the past few years. WBCN to me now just seems somewhat soulless but so does terrestrial radio as a whole these days.

 

[Lucylu]

Hannon is a big toad, he can handle it. I haven't even gotten around to talking about how he ruined WZLX as well.

 

[Neanderpaul]

That is a complete crock. Whether or not someone is a 'public figure" should have no bearing, none. neanderpaul's examples were both poor examples, who in their right mind would have any sympathy for HITLER or to a lesser degree OJ? being a public figure means it's ok to make fun of death?

It has nothing to do with whether the person is a public figure at all. You may have misread what I was getting at.

I'm saying if the person's character warrants ridicule, then making fun of their death is going to be acceptable by the public.

And my examples were...Saddam Hussein; Nobody listening is going to have sympathy for a man who killed hundreds of thousands of his own people. Ridiculing his death is not in poor taste because the man deserves no respect due to his character. And my other example was Jeffrey Dahmer...no explanation necessary.

When making a joke about someone's death on the radio, the butt of said joke needs to be deserving of ridicule. Otherwise, it comes off as classless and mean. This woman was not. She was an innocent, and it's classless and serves no purpose.

Doesn't matter if they're a public figure, or not. They just have to be worthy of ridicule for the joke to be viewed as something other than malice, or shock for shock's sake.

 

[Neanderpaul]

Look a woman died and it's tragic. Toucher and Rich opted to go the way that many find offensive, Ill give you that and I do not disagree that it was not respectful of the poor woman's death at all. That does not change the fact that they did nothing wrong legally or by fcc standards. They did nothing wrong according to the rules that govern on air behavior SO writing a letter for the pubic file and the fcc like I said is an excercise in futility and it lessens YOUR credibility with those who you would want to listen to you when somethig in the future actually meets the standards that would ake it an actionable offense. It's not a personal attack on you JOE I am telling you the reality of the situation. An insensitive comment does not make anyone's infraction list. There it is.

I don't think they did anything to warrant a "public file" complaint either.

The problem is, there are those who pull the "broadcasting in the public interest" card, and try to call this a violation of such. Not at all the case.

It's just a desperate cry for attention. And quite frankly, I'm willing to bet it's getting more attention in this forum than from any Boston radio listener.

It's frustrating as a performer to see that this is what passes for entertainment. I like a good "offensive" bit as much as, if not more than, the next guy. But, the problem is filtering. You gotta know when, and why the bit will work. This one did not. On any level.

I was taught to ask myself "What's the angle?" before I do any bit. And in this case, the only answer is "to offend people and get people talking about us." A poor reason to do a bit. It serves no lasting positive purpose for a show that needs to gain listeners, not alienate them.

Desperate. Unentertaining. And ultimately will be remembered as mean-spirited, bad radio.

And radio in 2007 should be better than that.

 

[Varulven]

RKO added my Public File letter about Mike Savage - as you know most radio listeners don't even KNOW about
PF letters, the fact that this issue is so hot on radio-info makes such a filing valid. Some of us would like something decent to listen to.

 

[brightonboris]

[

Boris let's be honest Mancow Muller is about as medicore as it gets and a pretty big hypocrite. Dont you remembeer his little stunt when he was trying to make his name in SF?. After Clinton held the plane on the tarmack (sp?) to get his haircut, Mancow blocked the Golden Gate Bridge traffic by parking a large station vehicle ( I think it was an RV) across the two lanes of the bridge during the morning rush while on air stopping traffic in either direction, and got his hair cut. No one died during that stunt but what a reckless and dangerous move to pull during rush hour!. No one could have known that someone would die during the hold your wee promotion, it is about as freak an accident as they get. Mancow is another one who has never been able to pull off syndication he's been trying for over ten years and has failed with it and whenever anything happens tragically in radio there he is to comment. He only comments to promote himself, remember how he was everywhere during sex for sam talking about how he knew O and A and " I know Opie and Anthony these guys are scum bags" etc, and Opie has said repeatedly that they have never met, they share the same agent but that si all. Then he becomes ultra conservative when he moved to Chicago and becomes a commentator for Fox and MSNBC while he's still doing the in studio naked chick schtick as Stern. Mancow lecturing about medicority and who belongs on air doesnt hold a lot of water as far as Im concerned.
[/quote]

Let's put his questionable past aside for a second. So far, he's the only major radio person out there who's reaching out to help the three kids left behind. He's set up a fund and raising funds for her kids. Do you see anyone else in the industry doing this? Entercom, CBS Radio, Toucher and Rich, etc.? Doubt it.

I am not saying the guy is a saint and maybe some of it is good PR for him, but he's doing the right thing. Has anyone on this board thought about taking a similar initiative to help the victims' family?. Doubt it.

And about copying everyone's else schtick, this has been going on since the day entertainment industry was created. It happens every day everywhere. Fox-TV exploits mentally retarded on American IDols auditions the same way Stern would bring in his whack pack into a recording studio years ago. More people watch Idol in one week than listened to Howard in 20 years.

As for WBCN, they have a PD who has no idea what big-market radio is all about and how to handle a hertiage rock station. He's ruining the product, the image and the local radio culture. He's bringing in these 15-minute retreads from the farm system and they're all failing badly. THat was my point.

 

[Finn]

No one could have known that someone would die during the hold your wee promotion, it is about as freak an accident as they get.

Not to be a nudge, but it's actually well-known in the running community that drinking too much water is lethal - hence the sport drink industry which also replenishes potassium etc. I guess no one in radio is a runner or watches the marathon.

What I would like to know is whether anyone there knew of this or just thought it was a bad idea and either didn't say anything or tried to and was overruled.

 

[automationasphyxiation]

[

Boris let's be honest Mancow Muller is about as medicore as it gets and a pretty big hypocrite. Dont you remembeer his little stunt when he was trying to make his name in SF?. After Clinton held the plane on the tarmack (sp?) to get his haircut, Mancow blocked the Golden Gate Bridge traffic by parking a large station vehicle ( I think it was an RV) across the two lanes of the bridge during the morning rush while on air stopping traffic in either direction, and got his hair cut. No one died during that stunt but what a reckless and dangerous move to pull during rush hour!. No one could have known that someone would die during the hold your wee promotion, it is about as freak an accident as they get. Mancow is another one who has never been able to pull off syndication he's been trying for over ten years and has failed with it and whenever anything happens tragically in radio there he is to comment. He only comments to promote himself, remember how he was everywhere during sex for sam talking about how he knew O and A and " I know Opie and Anthony these guys are scum bags" etc, and Opie has said repeatedly that they have never met, they share the same agent but that si all. Then he becomes ultra conservative when he moved to Chicago and becomes a commentator for Fox and MSNBC while he's still doing the in studio naked chick schtick as Stern. Mancow lecturing about medicority and who belongs on air doesnt hold a lot of water as far as Im concerned.

Let's put his questionable past aside for a second. So far, he's the only major radio person out there who's reaching out to help the three kids left behind. He's set up a fund and raising funds for her kids. Do you see anyone else in the industry doing this? Entercom, CBS Radio, Toucher and Rich, etc.? Doubt it.

I am not saying the guy is a saint and maybe some of it is good PR for him, but he's doing the right thing. Has anyone on this board thought about taking a similar initiative to help the victims' family?. Doubt it.

And about copying everyone's else schtick, this has been going on since the day entertainment industry was created. It happens every day everywhere. Fox-TV exploits mentally retarded on American IDols auditions the same way Stern would bring in his whack pack into a recording studio years ago. More people watch Idol in one week than listened to Howard in 20 years.

As for WBCN, they have a PD who has no idea what big-market radio is all about and how to handle a hertiage rock station. He's ruining the product, the image and the local radio culture. He's bringing in these 15-minute retreads from the farm system and they're all failing badly. THat was my point.
[/quote]

Mancow is just trying to exploit a tragedy. Starting a fund is a admirable idea, though I believe the family will end up with more money than Mancow when this is said and done. (That is just how our legal system works and not a judgement of liability by anyone involved)

 

[TowerBuzz]

It's all about self promotion and PR for Mancow as he does not have his act together at this moment, since he's out in Chicago he's dissapeared from the general thought bubble of the American mainstream (not that he ever was a big part of it, everyone has heard of Stern like him or not, most people in America have no idea who Muller is.) ANYWAY it's the right thing for his own purpouse so in a sense everbody wins.

 

[TowerBuzz]

RKO added my Public File letter about Mike Savage - as you know most radio listeners don't even KNOW about
PF letters, the fact that this issue is so hot on radio-info makes such a filing valid. Some of us would like something decent to listen to.

And he's still on the air, yes?. So much for the power of your public file letter. Savage at least is worthy of complaint if one were a gay person I could understand having objections to his content, Savage is not Toucher and Rich using a clip which is just a tasteless joke in a show promo. BIG difference Joe, but if one is used to just writing letters ANYTIME he sees an opportunity to satisfy his own feelings of anger at an industry that has not accepted him..........

Well, no more need be said about it.

 

[Neanderpaul]

Let's put his questionable past aside for a second. So far, he's the only major radio person out there who's reaching out to help the three kids left behind. He's set up a fund and raising funds for her kids. Do you see anyone else in the industry doing this? Entercom, CBS Radio, Toucher and Rich, etc.? Doubt it.

Do you actually think he cares?

This clown made his name by exploiting listeners, and show members for over a decade, and now he's calling out the industry for its behavior?

This is a disgraceful, blatant opportunist move on his part. In case you were unaware, his show lost its home base, he's losing affiliates all over America, and his career's been on the slide for a few years.

He doesn't care about this woman, or her family. Who, by the way are thisclosetobeing well-cared for financially, trust me.

Eric Muller is as credible as professional wrestling.

 

[TowerBuzz]

Let's put his questionable past aside for a second. So far, he's the only major radio person out there who's reaching out to help the three kids left behind. He's set up a fund and raising funds for her kids. Do you see anyone else in the industry doing this? Entercom, CBS Radio, Toucher and Rich, etc.? Doubt it.

Do you actually think he cares?

This clown made his name by exploiting listeners, and show members for over a decade, and now he's calling out the industry for its behavior?

This is a disgraceful, blatant opportunist move on his part. In case you were unaware, his show lost its home base, he's losing affiliates all over America, and his career's been on the slide for a few years.

He doesn't care about this woman, or her family. Who, by the way are thisclosetobeing well-cared for financially, trust me.

Eric Muller is as credible as professional wrestling.

Exactly what Im saying Paul. His syndication NEVER worked, never, he never made it outside of Chicago where he routinely beat Stern because Chicago hates anything New York another great city rivalry. He had one AM affilliate in LA but that was as far as he got. The rest were the level of south carolina, a brief shot in Providence, an AM in Worcester, in short his syndication was about as successful as Matty's attempt was a few years ago. Mancow is an opportunist nothing more. As I said before he did the right thing for his own selfish purpouse and that is all it was. So if the famaily gets a little coin in the process good for them but dont be fooled by his motives. His name has been dead since he got the axe at Q101, in fact you rarely heard anything about him when he had a home base in Chicago like Neander said. Dont paint him as a saint is all Im saying, he's as much of an opportunist as you wil ever see in the business.

 

[Cueburn]

How much further off the original topic can we stray? ???

 

[Finn]

How much further off the original topic can we stray? ???

Fair question Cueburn. I am interested in an underlying theme of this thread, which is whether there are standards for content on the radio.

Jocks in another city (so almost no chance the family will hear it) made jokes about an accidental death that resulted from folks who were uninformed about human biology (I guess people were not paying attention during health class). This is apparently beyond the pale for many of the folks on this board. I agree, the joke about the dead woman IS classless and in poor taste.

But, people say horrible things about totally innocent people ALL THE TIME. What Michael (Savage) Weiner says about gay people is just as heinous, and goes on every single day. They are completely innocent - they've done nothing wrong, yet have to endure constant awful harrassment from people on the radio constantly. Why is it okay to say horrible things about gay people, but it is not okay to make a joke in another city about a woman who died in an accident? Is it because it's radio-related? Are we empathizing with the family? or, the radio folks?

I interested to know where the lines should be. Who currently on the radio crosses the line? What content do you consider to be crossing the line? Should radio have any standards beyond trying to get the highest ratings? And if not, do you have any predictions at to where we might end up if we continue to appeal to our worst appetites?

Re my comment about (Savage) Weiner - you are right, I was off topic. I sometimes find the urge to take shots at bullies irresistable. Sorry for that. It was after I read paragraphs 5 and 8 in this: http://dir.salon.com/story/news/feature/2003/03/05/savage/index.html?pn=3 In 10 years we may find out he has a slow growing tumor in his brain that caused his personality disorder. In the meantime, he's got millions of AWMs listening to him on a nightly basis.

P.S. TowerBuzz, glad we are on the same page re bigots. Re Joe's letter - who knows, maybe they keep them on file and when there is an actionable issue they pull them out.

 

[Varulven]

Public File letters, generally, go into the "circular" file. Many radio stations refuse to abide by the rules because the basic PF letter is bound to be more critical than congratulatory. Of course, some P.D.s might have phantoms write glowing letters while disposing of the more damaging comments.

A person writing a Public File letter should alert the press and the FCC:

"This letter was sent to the WBCN public file regarding... Good journalists should go to the WBCN offices and see that the letter, indeed, was put in that file as required by law. Failure to put the letter in the Public File can result in...

It's the only way to hold radio people accountable. Otherwise they "might" trash the letters

 

[MoLarryMoLarry]

you know what's amazing? that this thread could get so far off the original track and yet STILL contain no mention of Stephen Mindich!