I miss the old KNX

[nmoore6676]

Before Mr. Eduardo ( ) and his cohorts are able to hustle all the old coots off to the liquidation chamber
maybe some marketing genius out there in LALAland could invent GeezerRadio where The Lone Ranger might
ride again and Joe Friday could keep the scum off the streets of our fading imagination. I mean, WTF,
doesn't the crotchety old 55+ demographic have any money to blow? I don't get it. My move into Books-
On-Tape (MP3's, CD's, etc) is a direct result of my finding little I want to hear on RADIO anymore. Beats me.

Somebody already did...its the Radio Classics Channel on Sirius/XM satellite radio...been there for years and quite successful too!

---The problem with (subscription based) Sirius/XM is that the only commercials they have sell satellite radio service and never Signal Oil products, Chesterfields, or Lifebouy Soap.
It was a big mistake to ever let whippersnappers rule the world in my opinion.

Good point I miss the BEE OOOOOH commercials for Lifebouy.

However what may be needed is for terrestrial radio to develop a symbiotic relationship with other media such as the internet. I used to use newspapers to amplify and flesh out the stories I heard on radio or TV. Perhaps radio stations such as KNX could put the expanded stories on their web site to be used as I have used the print media to get the rest of the story, apologies to the late Paul Harvey. You don't have to kill of one thing to embrace another in all cases when there can be found a workable way to combine them to make the whole better than the individual entities.

 

[michael hagerty]

Actually, I miss the old, old KNX.

The one with Bob Crane in morning drive.

"17 and a half minutes after six on the KNX clock and here's Doris Day...to sing..."

 

[Uncle Rob]

Radio drama is not worth the effort, especially since so much of the 60-70 year old content is culturally insensitive today. Those who want it can find it on the Internet, which they couldn't do in the 70's.

Perhaps, but I think you might be confusing your personal tastes with how people really use the radio. Just simply putting something on the radio doesn't mean people want it or will listen to it. With radio drama, KNX is not going to have access to any more dramas that you have now online. If you'll recall, KNX presented the programs without commentary, so there's nothing they'd really add to your experience other than do the "picking" and maybe make it a little more convenient if you're in the car. That's assuming this is kind of programming you want in the car in the evening. And that's a big leap. So, what is a KNX listener looking for at night? I'm guessing, but maybe it's traffic, weather, news headlines, sports scores? Could be any of those. What you're saying is they'd rather hear a 60-70 year old radio drama, chosen by the station - one they could select, download and listen to anytime they choose in a variety of formats? I just don't buy your argument. I think there will always be a need for stations like KNX providing timely LOCAL information. But listeners don't gather around the family radio any more and listen like the RCA dog!

First off I know "How people really use the radio". I'm one of them. From some of the things you say i'm guessing you are a radio executive. The "programs without commentary" line. I don't need commentary. Just play the show. And what's with the "add to your experience"? I don't "experience" radio. I "listen" to it. When I was a DJ I was one of a very few at our station that hung out with "normal" people. All the others hung out with industry people and had a really, dare I say, bizarre view of their listeners. Forget about the buzzwords. Put down the paper about demographics. I don't know anyone who fits into any of these demographics anyways. Get out there and meet some ordinary people. Talk to them. It'll be eye opening.

And for the record, you won't find this on any paper I'm just going by personal experience, but for every person 60 or older I knew that listened to the drama hour, I knew 3 or 4 more UNDER the age of 60 (by 1,2,3,4, even 5 decades under the age of 60 that used to listen to it) One last thing while i'm on my high horse, If I download the OTR show online and listen to it, guess what I'm NOT listening too? Instead of listening to your station I'm listening to the Ipod.

 

[Uncle Rob]

Actually, I miss the old, old KNX.

The one with Bob Crane in morning drive.

"17 and a half minutes after six on the KNX clock and here's Doris Day...to sing..."

Was it KNX or KFWB where the DJ who played the last song before flipping to the news format said "We'll be right back after the news."

 

[Rudy Canoza]

The old format was better. The rocket scientists will eat crow when the numbers come in.

 

[LKellerIII]

Actually, I miss the old, old KNX.

The one with Bob Crane in morning drive.

"17 and a half minutes after six on the KNX clock and here's Doris Day...to sing..."

Was it KNX or KFWB where the DJ who played the last song before flipping to the news format said "We'll be right back after the news."

A radio urban legend. The fateful day in 1968 when KFWB flipped to all news, Gene Weed, the last Top 40 DJ reportedly closed out the last song by saying "We'll be back with more music right after the news." It's a great story. But it was also attributed to Johnny Holiday, the last DJ at 1010/WINS in New York, who reportedly said the same thing 3 years earlier (1965) when WINS went all news. WINS and KFWB were Westinghouse sister stations, by the way.

Holliday still denies it ever happened. Weed passed away some years ago, but I believe he denied it too.

KNX was a very news-intensive MOR station, and also ran a lot of variety programming (Art Linkletter's House Party, Arthur Godfrey, etc), Even after they became KNX "Newsradio," they had a lot of other programming, like Mike Roy's local cooking show, and so forth. So there was never an actual day when KNX flipped to all news - it more or less evolved into that over the years, during the 1970s.

 

[Fornax]

Radio drama is not worth the effort, especially since so much of the 60-70 year old content is culturally insensitive today. Those who want it can find it on the Internet, which they couldn't do in the 70's.

Perhaps, but I think you might be confusing your personal tastes with how people really use the radio. Just simply putting something on the radio doesn't mean people want it or will listen to it. With radio drama, KNX is not going to have access to any more dramas that you have now online. If you'll recall, KNX presented the programs without commentary, so there's nothing they'd really add to your experience other than do the "picking" and maybe make it a little more convenient if you're in the car. That's assuming this is kind of programming you want in the car in the evening. And that's a big leap. So, what is a KNX listener looking for at night? I'm guessing, but maybe it's traffic, weather, news headlines, sports scores? Could be any of those. What you're saying is they'd rather hear a 60-70 year old radio drama, chosen by the station - one they could select, download and listen to anytime they choose in a variety of formats? I just don't buy your argument. I think there will always be a need for stations like KNX providing timely LOCAL information. But listeners don't gather around the family radio any more and listen like the RCA dog!

First off I know "How people really use the radio". I'm one of them. From some of the things you say i'm guessing you are a radio executive. The "programs without commentary" line. I don't need commentary. Just play the show. And what's with the "add to your experience"? I don't "experience" radio. I "listen" to it. When I was a DJ I was one of a very few at our station that hung out with "normal" people. All the others hung out with industry people and had a really, dare I say, bizarre view of their listeners. Forget about the buzzwords. Put down the paper about demographics. I don't know anyone who fits into any of these demographics anyways. Get out there and meet some ordinary people. Talk to them. It'll be eye opening.

And for the record, you won't find this on any paper I'm just going by personal experience, but for every person 60 or older I knew that listened to the drama hour, I knew 3 or 4 more UNDER the age of 60 (by 1,2,3,4, even 5 decades under the age of 60 that used to listen to it) One last thing while i'm on my high horse, If I download the OTR show online and listen to it, guess what I'm NOT listening too? Instead of listening to your station I'm listening to the Ipod.

I thought you were complaining about people questioning how old you are? It's pointless for you to "guess" what I do or who I hang out with. Just because you were a DJ at some time in the past doesn't mean you understand now or ever understood how the business works. With each post you continue to share your personal tastes while revealing just how little you know about the radio business.

 

[davideduardo]

The old format was better. The rocket scientists will eat crow when the numbers come in.

The numbers come in every Monday, while every fourth week the numbers come in on a Wednesday.

 

[michael hagerty]

Actually, I miss the old, old KNX.

The one with Bob Crane in morning drive.

"17 and a half minutes after six on the KNX clock and here's Doris Day...to sing..."

Was it KNX or KFWB where the DJ who played the last song before flipping to the news format said "We'll be right back after the news."

A radio urban legend. The fateful day in 1968 when KFWB flipped to all news, Gene Weed, the last Top 40 DJ reportedly closed out the last song by saying "We'll be back with more music right after the news." It's a great story. But it was also attributed to Johnny Holiday, the last DJ at 1010/WINS in New York, who reportedly said the same thing 3 years earlier (1965) when WINS went all news. WINS and KFWB were Westinghouse sister stations, by the way.

Holliday still denies it ever happened. Weed passed away some years ago, but I believe he denied it too.

KNX was a very news-intensive MOR station, and also ran a lot of variety programming (Art Linkletter's House Party, Arthur Godfrey, etc), Even after they became KNX "Newsradio," they had a lot of other programming, like Mike Roy's local cooking show, and so forth. So there was never an actual day when KNX flipped to all news - it more or less evolved into that over the years, during the 1970s.

Llew:
Not only did Weed deny it....the aircheck exists. He never said it. You can hear it for yourself at Reelradio.com

 

[ChannelFlipper]

The old format was better. The rocket scientists will eat crow when the numbers come in.

The numbers come in every Monday, while every fourth week the numbers come in on a Wednesday.

Nobody in radio ever eats crow. They get fired, they move onto other stations or formats or start selling real estate, but the next programmer or talent who says their approach was not the "right" one and that they got the whole concept or format wrong, will be the first.

 

[Uncle Rob]

I thought you were complaining about people questioning how old you are? It's pointless for you to "guess" what I do or who I hang out with. Just because you were a DJ at some time in the past doesn't mean you understand now or ever understood how the business works. With each post you continue to share your personal tastes while revealing just how little you know about the radio business.

I'm just following the advice of some other poster who told me I should learn the lay of the land before saying something. So being that I see plenty of people jumping to conclusions I thought I'd do the same. Whenever I see someone using buzzwords that puts up red flags all over the place and by your response i'm guessing I hit the nail right on the head. Get out of the station and meet some real people, better yet, talk to them too.

You're welcome.

 

[RicoGregg]

The old format was better. The rocket scientists will eat crow when the numbers come in.

The numbers come in every Monday, while every fourth week the numbers come in on a Wednesday.

Nobody in radio ever eats crow. They get fired, they move onto other stations or formats or start selling real estate, but the next programmer or talent who says their approach was not the "right" one and that they got the whole concept or format wrong, will be the first.

Golden West Broadcasters President & GM Bill Ward went to his grave kicking himself over his decision to change KMPC from a successful MOR/Standards format to All-Sports. The sports programming turned out to be a disaster, ratings plummeted, and Ward lamented in an interview with the LA Weekly that if he had the chance to do it over again, he would leave KMPC as it was. He said the same thing to a former Program Director he had fired to make way for the sports format, when he took him to lunch a few years later.

This is the same man who changed The Edge into the re-incarnation of K-Lite.

I don't know if The Edge would still be around or not if Ward had left it alone, but in my opinion, it was one of the best rock stations LA ever had.

I worked at GWB from 1987 to 1991. During that time, the 101.9 frequency had four different formats. I saw a lot of talented, intelligent people come and go on what seemed like one man's whims.

 

[michael hagerty]

The old format was better. The rocket scientists will eat crow when the numbers come in.

The numbers come in every Monday, while every fourth week the numbers come in on a Wednesday.

Nobody in radio ever eats crow. They get fired, they move onto other stations or formats or start selling real estate, but the next programmer or talent who says their approach was not the "right" one and that they got the whole concept or format wrong, will be the first.

Golden West Broadcasters President & GM Bill Ward went to his grave kicking himself over his decision to change KMPC from a successful MOR/Standards format to All-Sports. The sports programming turned out to be a disaster, ratings plummeted, and Ward lamented in an interview with the LA Weekly that if he had the chance to do it over again, he would leave KMPC as it was. He said the same thing to a former Program Director he had fired to make way for the sports format, when he took him to lunch a few years later.

Rico:
I'd love to see Arbitrons from the last two years of the music format at KMPC. I know it was huge (by AM standards) from its reboot in 1983 (following a failed talk format) but my impression from about 1990 on was that Jackie Autry had begun estate planning for Gene, cutting overhead and preparing the station for a sale.

The airchecks I've heard from '90 and '91 show a corresponding drop in the quality of sponsors.

I'm wondering whether Ms. Autry left Ward any choice but to try something new...what kind of numbers they had left by '92...and, if it hadn't been tampered with, how many years they could have gotten out of adult standards on AM before demographics alone made it unprofitable for a station of KMPC's size.

 

[davideduardo]

I'd love to see Arbitrons from the last two years of the music format at KMPC. I know it was huge (by AM standards) from its reboot in 1983 (following a failed talk format) but my impression from about 1990 on was that Jackie Autry had begun estate planning for Gene, cutting overhead and preparing the station for a sale.

Here are the numbers in the form of four book averages for KMPC from 1975 to 1990

1975 4.3
3.9
3,7
3.3
3.3
1980 2.7
2.3
2.6
2.8
3.0
1985 3.5
2.9
2.7
2.3
2.3
1990 2.9
2.7
1.4
0.7
0.8

 

[RicoGregg]

I'd love to see Arbitrons from the last two years of the music format at KMPC. I know it was huge (by AM standards) from its reboot in 1983 (following a failed talk format) but my impression from about 1990 on was that Jackie Autry had begun estate planning for Gene, cutting overhead and preparing the station for a sale.

The airchecks I've heard from '90 and '91 show a corresponding drop in the quality of sponsors.

I'm wondering whether Ms. Autry left Ward any choice but to try something new...what kind of numbers they had left by '92...and, if it hadn't been tampered with, how many years they could have gotten out of adult standards on AM before demographics alone made it unprofitable for a station of KMPC's size.

You're not kidding about the cutting of overhead. It reached ridiculous proportions. We were literally hiding scissors and sharpies from each other. I wish I was kidding about that. I'm not.

One longtime air talent left the company after 31 years to take a job in the Bay Area. He just plain got fed up. His disgust was with both Mrs. Autry and Ward. He told me that GWB had been a great company until "she" arrived on the scene.

It's my understanding that the decision to take 710 all-sports was Ward's decision alone. We had been hearing internal rumblings about this possibility since the advent of WFAN in NYC.

One of the biggest ironies in my radio life was KMPC going all-sports AFTER Ward gets rid of capable, competent radio sports people like Steve Bailey, unceremoniously dumped after 33 years at the station, Stan Spero, and Tony Albano. Going to a sports format was when they needed these talented people the most. I'm confident that the format would have been more successful if those people and others who left had remained on board.

There's little I can say about the quality of station sponsors. I can say that around '91 & '92, there was some internal intrigue, company politicking if you will, behind-the-scenes soap opera dramas going on within the Sales Dept. that resulted in a busy revolving door. Perhaps this had an adverse affect.

With all that said, I miss the old KNX also, but I get it that things change over time. Change is about the only thing in life that is consistent.

 

[michael hagerty]

I'd love to see Arbitrons from the last two years of the music format at KMPC. I know it was huge (by AM standards) from its reboot in 1983 (following a failed talk format) but my impression from about 1990 on was that Jackie Autry had begun estate planning for Gene, cutting overhead and preparing the station for a sale.

Here are the numbers in the form of four book averages for KMPC from 1975 to 1990

1975 4.3
3.9
3,7
3.3
3.3
1980 2.7
2.3
2.6
2.8
3.0
1985 3.5
2.9
2.7
2.3
2.3
1990 2.9
2.7
1.4
0.7
0.8

So in 1990 and 1991, they were as good as they were in 86 and 87.

 

[michael hagerty]

Looking over those numbers, I'm guessing KMPC could have, had they not gutted the operation, managed at least another 5 years in the adult standards format...maybe longer.

Of course, at the 5 year point, they would have had to deal with the death of Robert W. Morgan (assuming that he wouldn't have jumped ship to join Drake and Steele at K-Earth in 1992 anyway).

Beyond 2000...who knows? But with the demos and ethnic makeup of the market, I'm betting that even if they'd done everything exactly right, we still wouldn't have KMPC as a music station today.