If you could do it all over again.

[Mark Giardina]

Would you have stayed in radio or moved into another line of work?

Sounds like a silly question, but for those of us who are (or were) in the business for a number of years, it seems more and more people who have survived for 20 or 30 years are being shown the door with very little to show for it.

I mean it's nice to do what one loves to do, but there's a point that when that 60+ birthday rolls around and one has to depend on Social Security or what savings they have to survive the "golden years" a person asks the question; was it worth it?

Love to hear your comments, especially for those of you who have been around for a while.

Counting full and part-time, and my current Saturday gig at WYSL, this is my 38th year in the business. But again I'm only doing this one day a week, and that will soon be coming to an end, plus I'm a novice compared to some of you who have been in the business going on 40 years or more.

 

[Lee Rust]

If the current state of the economy in general and the radio business in particular could have been predicted and acknowledged 20 or 25 years ago, I probably would have made different choices. But they weren't, and I didn't.

Between the mid 1950's and mid 1990's, broadcasting and telecommunications in the US enjoyed an unusually long plateau of relative stability in market share, technology base, business model and cultural role. Most of us here are calibrated to the norms of that 40 year period, and perhaps were lulled into a state of complacency even in the face of the great changes of the past 15 years.

To me, broadcast radio is a beautiful way to communicate and entertain. Technically elegant and operationally efficient. I'll always hold those beliefs, but the rest of the world is moving on.

To the extent that we can adapt to the new normal, there will still be a small place for broadcasting in the telecommunications future.

 

[TheBigA]

Another great topic on the Buffalo board!

I owe a lot to my first radio gig. I was 17 years old, at a dying 1K AM. I was the youngest guy on staff. By a long shot. Most of the people were as old or older than my parents. The guy working the shift ahead of me had a son my age. And I'm on the air! I was very excited about my first gig, but after a couple years, it became apparent that this was a dead end. Everyone else was on the last job. And it hit me at a young age that I didn't want to be in my 50s doing the same thing a 17 year old could do.

My grandfather worked in a factory, where he basically turned the same wrench for 40 years. That's all he did. Once again, I decided I was not going to turn the same wrench or turn on the same mic my entire life. So I quit the 1K AM station and started a string of gigs that took me through every part of the business, from engineering, to programming, to sales, to management. Before I was 30. Getting fired from a union engineering job was another bit of luck. I was caught in the last-hired-first-fired thing, and the union just watch me leave. I never joined a union again.

The the advice I give college kids is simple: Don't get locked into any one thing. Don't get typecast. Because the minute something changes, you're odd man out. Broadcasting is a big industry, with lots of jobs one can do. I learned that it's not "if" you get fired, but "when." And I was only fired once. So I don't have to ask myself the question "would I do it all again," because I've had the opportunity to make that decision many times, and each time it was a great move and a great adventure. It still is, every day. That's all I ever wanted it to be.

 

[landtuna]

I realize this thread is directed at people who actually had careers in radio but here's perspective from one who decided otherwise at an early age.

From the age of 5-6 I listened to the radio, all sorts of stations from MOR, Country, Variety then RnR. As I travelled around the West I kept a log of all the stations I listened to. Still have that log book to this day. I used to hang out at local stations in my market and talk to everyone who would give me the time of day. I even tried out for a weekend gig as a sophomore in high school but came in 2nd to a college guy. After graduation I became a radioman in the navy and spent most of my spare time at sea DXing those faraway places - just as I had done from home with my gigantic tube-type floor model AM/SW radio.

I fully intended to get into some form of radio after my military service and was investigating an opening in a small, northern California AM when I happened upon that new-fangled device called a computer. Once I began programming I was hooked and radio became a hobby.

I've always wondered what a career in radio would have brought and sadly, in hindsight, it didn't measure up to my chosen career in IT.

First, there was the almost constant moving. Very few on-air people managed to stay in a favorite place for very long. Living in a certain place was always one of my highest priorities so this was not a good match. Having a family and moving every few years was also a big problem (although a lot of people have managed). It was kind of like a career in the military. In fact, just this morning, the ex-radio guy who now hosts a morning TV show locally said he had 16 jobs in his first 15 years. That is probably an exaggeration but probably not by much.

Second, and this didn't occur to me for a very long time, was my interest in only certain aspects of the radio industry. It seems mobility is a prime requirement and the need to move between music genre's seamlessly adds greatly to your personal value. I could not see myself being on-air at a Country, Classical, Talk or MOR station and absolutely not at a godcaster. My lack of interest working at anything but a rock station would have ended sometime in the 80's - 20 full years before I was ready to retire.

Third, money, or more accurately can one earn enough to sock enough away investing for later in life? Many do and some become fabulously wealthy but the majority don't and many more leave radio and go into another type of career. My IT career coincided with the dawn of the business computer age and the money was good. Moreover, I was able to invest in the same industry which had its heyday in the 90's and allowed me to finance a stable retirement. Although I might have done as well in radio it is doubtful.

Lastly, and this are mostly esoteric reasons, it seems the more I hear from radio veterans the more "bad management" stories come out. I am not one to suffer fools easily and would probably have spent a considerable amount of time in the penalty box if I had worked for one of these fools. Although IT has its share of management idiots most don't own the business so their influence is muted compared to the owner of a radio station (obviously this was before the corporate consolidation).

Obviously there are a lot of radio people who are happy and satisfied working in this industry but for me personally, I'm happy with my decision to go elsewhere although radio will continue to be a major interest for the rest of my life.

 

[heydaybegone]

I concur Big A - good topic.

First : Would I do it all over again...YES. Radio was the best times of my life.

Second: Would I be there now after someone else decided I wouldn't be? No

WHY? Read this board

Third: Do you still have a passion for the business? ABSOLUTELY. If I could be a part of this monstrosity called "Radio" now, I would love the challenge of making something happen!

Fourth: I'm doing something now that I prepped for back in the 80's (new career if you will), when I saw this industry take a roll. I was able to "play" radio while pursuing a business degree to COVER MY ASS!! It has come in handy! I had many mentors in my career...each with their own input...and I had to decide what parts of their advisement I would take. Some were TOO pro radio, others had the foresight I was seeing.....

Fifth: Regardless of the outcome...I have a passion for Radio...have frustration for the state of affairs...have worked with a number of MAJOR professional broadcasters (NOT just the BIG names...just regular folks that did the job needed to be done).

That's why I'm here....

HDBG

 

[Paul_Warren]

I'm not sure what we all expected, but I ignored advice given me at one of my first jobs by a crusty old sales guy who'd once been on-air. He warned me, "Look around...there aren't many 50-year-old disc jockeys." So I can't say I wasn't warned!

Unlike Landtuna, and probably most of the rest of you, it wasn't music that drew me to the idea of working in radio. It was the idea that a guy sitting alone in a room with a pile of equipment could have the skill to transcend the technology, and be perceived as if he was alone with each individual listener, talking to a single person, at the other end.

The big Top-40 stations (especially WKBW) got me hooked, but ironically, I spent 30 years in the business without ever working at a Rock or CHR station. Lots of AC, some MOR, Country, Full-Service, Talk, even did news one summer for one of Salem's "Fish" stations, and loved it all.

I'm nostalgic now, not so much for those specific jobs, because I now produce audio content with freedoms I never had in radio, but for the days when the radio industry chose to be meaningful in the lives of listeners. Talk radio largely still is, but the music formats are pretty much all jukeboxes with no "glue" between the songs, and abusively-long stopsets.

The idea that we all could have gone into some other line of work and had a pension waiting has turned out to be unrealistic, too. THAT is actually the thing which would have been harder to see coming, although there were warnings by those opposed to the creation of Social Security that it would end up replacing, not augmenting, private pensions.

On balance? I was warned radio was a bad career bet, that the attrition rate was brutal, that comfortable retirement from radio was rare. There were plenty of examples, like George Hamberger, of radio performers I admired, but who left the business for other careers that penciled out better. I stayed in as long as I could, and I have no regrets.

The only question that haunts me a little now is, should I have stayed and tried to make a go of it in Buffalo or Rochester, close to home, or was I right to take the opportunities that came my way in bigger markets like Atlanta and Portland? I would have missed out on lots of great experiences and friendships, but I might have paid off a mortgage. I guess there's no good answer. Had I stayed in Buffalo, I'd still be wondering, "what if?"

I need to stop now, before I start sounding like my grandfathers. One spoke frequently of how much he missed working with teams of horses after cars became common. The other was a railroad telegrapher who probably had mixed feelings about the advent of telephones and radio.

 

[Mike Sheridan]

For me, all I can say is I stayed too long. If I had looked at my skills and career objectively I would have realized that my chance of success in radio just wasn't on air. That leaves sales and engineering. A salesman I'm not, engineer maybe but my math skills beyond basic algebra suck.

The MOR station I worked for did have some 50+ year old disc jockey's but most of them were nice guys who drank way too much, that should have been a warning but it wasn't.

Being in radio for me was like the Gene Pitney song "Looking Through The Eyes of Love". Some things you just don't see or don't want to see. I got out when radio just wasn't fun anymore. I went back to do some part time while I was between IT jobs but quit again because I was just a warm body, the computer could run things fine without me and the pay was beyond awful. With the price of gas I might have been coming out a little better than even.

I got a 401K way too late. Working in radio I never stayed anywhere long enough to get vested in a retirement plan. So when I hit 66 that's when I'll pay for all the fun I had in radio, a business that I still love.

 

[Deleted User]

let's see. I went from radio to TV in the 80's, but still only part time while doing my day gig as a manufacturing engineer, the economy tanked, I was offered a job driving a bus.

Took the gig because it was union and government.

Didn't return to the business until 2004. I work PT as a bored op for a friend.

In the mean time my day gig was paying good money, and I was going to be able to retire by the time I was 50.

Do I regret being 52 years old, retired, set for life, and only working at the radio gig one day a month? HELL NO!

I turned down weekend on air overnights last year in a top 10 market, and they were paying real money too!

I got to be on air and work as a Chief Engineer back when radio was fun! The music was great, Rock, disco, punk, new wave ! Consolidation had not reared it's ugly head. There was local ownership. CE's were Gods, a First Class ticket was your resume. No Pirates!

You couldn't pay me to do what you people do now!
I'll do my one shift a month, have a little fun, and never regret walking away from broadcasting as a career.

P.S. when I was about to flunk out of college, my Dad had a little talk with me about priorities. in 1976 he told me radio was a bunch of people stabbing each other in the back for a seven dollar an hour job. That set me straight in a hurry. 35 years later his words are still true if you ask me.

 

[Bob1370]

Mark's question is one of the most thought-provoking posed on this site in a long time.

I've got a different perspective because I went into radio literally before my adult life began (February 1970, 2 months short of my 17th birthday). Had a good run over the next ten years, finishing grad school while working newsrooms in Ithaca, Syracuse, and Rochester--and after grad school, several years as news voice of WBEN's market-leading morning show back when Buffalo was a top-30 market.

But then I took a few years away from it in the 80s, when I joined my late father in his industrial business, and got a taste of what real world competition in manufacturing was all about. Paid well, so I could even afford a Cadillac if I'd wanted one (never did buy one). But the money wasn't making me satisfied with my working life. After my father passed away in 1985 I realized I'd come into the business to help him, rather than out of any desire to be a businessman. I missed being on the air and covering/talking about breaking news too much to stay away for good...so I started thinking about a way to get back into radio if a good opportunity came up. Looked at buying a couple of small market stations and coming back that way but in the end, opted for my current gig in the spring of '88 and never looked back.

No regrets. A few years away from the mike convinced me I didn't want to be off the air again.

I'm not going to retire at 50, that milestone came and went seven years ago. But it's been a good run, still got some distance to go. It's a busy life, producing and hosting two hours of talk every weekday. But "never a dull moment" is a pretty good description, and I hope that's as true for listeners as it is for me...

 

[GeneSavage]

I absolutely love the amazing memories I have from the past nearly 25 years in radio: the crazy phones at the local top 40, the fan mail at the CCM station, launching my own program, setting up a station from scratch (& spending the night in a field trying to figure out how we were going to get a replacement air conditioner for the transmitter shack in the middle of nowhere), live coverage of a crippling ice storm, co-ordinating the fireworks music to air on three different stations, generating ratings with a dual-cassette deck on an AM stick, beat-mixing live in the studio on turntables, weekend voicetracking the AOR I was doing weekday news on, having the honor of announcing the 75-yr old calls on a 50kw clear-channel, helping get the first live stream of a radio station in the state set up, creating a "co-host" listeners never heard but constantly called about...

...but if I knew now what I didn't know then... I'd have done everything I could have to talk myself out of it.

My radio career, which started off with such a bang, has now died with a whimper. I may pick up an occasionally part-time gig running ball games or voicing a news story here or there, and I still have my internet radio station to try to feed my radio addiction (it's a weak substitute) but I'm trying to get into a company like AT&T or DirecTV where I can use my voice but also move up in the company & get decent hours & benefits.

Do I miss radio? Desperately. It's all I've ever wanted to do, since I was about 5. From an early age I've been complimented on my voice & asked if I've considered radio. (Amusingly, it wasn't ever as much about speaking on the air as it was producing live shows, as much as I enjoy hosting.)

However, the phone has completely stopped ringing, and even rejection letters are few and far between anymore. I've paid the dues and paid the dues and paid the dues... and discovered after all that... it's time to pay the dues again.

I just don't have the energy to keep kissing radio's @$$ anymore.

It only hurts when I'm doing [any job besides radio] and people say, "you have such a nice voice... you should be in radio!"

Yeah... here's the phone numbers of all of the PDs in town... YOU try telling 'em that.

And now I'm glad I didn't know
The way it all would end the way it all would go
Our lives are better left to chance
I could have missed the pain
But I'd of had to miss the dance

 

[umtrr-author]

As many of you already know, in order to answer this question I would have to invert it:

"If you could do it all over again, would you have pursued radio or stayed with the other line of work?"

And although I think the answer is that I would have continued to pursue my other line of work (and by my count, I've had three "careers" of sorts thus far), there are times I wish that I hadn't "settled down" into stable, responsible employment quite so quickly. (And I was single at the time, so that's not why I "settled down.")

While I think the window was rapidly closing for this in the early 1980s, it's certainly possible that I could have found a part time position at one of the small stations in New Jersey-- or at least I could have tried. It's certainly questionable whether I would have lasted very long. (I think I had a highly exaggerated self-assessment of my own talent for radio, though my co-workers and customers have generally told me I have good communications skills.)

I might have fulfilled the dream of being on the air with my own shift, played some records, taken some calls, and told my audience about the great deals to be had down at Reliable Furniture and Appliance. And then I could have gone "back to reality" or whatever passes for it these days.

On balance, though, I've done OK. I do have friends in the biz, and I was "the CEO of the Allan Harris Show" as a frequent caller. And I have certainly fulfilled other lifelong dreams.

Plus, I could still win Powerball and buy that small station somewhere.

 

[Tom Wells]

All great stories. I'll add some data to this confession I've given before.

Hmmm... I'd still be there at WNWI, age 11, cutting teletype copy off the API witht the steel ruler.
at 15, I'd still be wondering what was happening to playlists,
wishing I still had time to hang out at WNWI...

I was 30 miles from Chicago, and in the great glare of the 60s-70s war between WCFL and WLS,
I never ever dreamt that I was an on-air person. But I knew was destined somehow to make that
incredible sound that made the radio itself transparent. The tight production, the sound that just wasn't there
on other stations. Maybe I would be a recording engineer....
I had also really enjoyed silver photography in 4 x5 cameras and at 15 was working for the Hobart Gazette
as a freelance and processing photos as well as school news/yearbook photog/teacher.
My brother, 4 years older preceded me at Valpo Tech, where WNWI was located, and I was still
certain I wanted the full RF-thru-mainframe schooling...
1976- Mr. L. Lujack personally advises a good friend and I on the idiocy of entering the business..
1979- very uncertain what the heck was going on in radio formatting, but still in love with electronics and radio in particular.
1982- Graduated from VTI into major recession while employed at United States Steel in process control computer dept.
Advised to stay out of radio by instructors, FCC 1st class ticket turns into mirage.
1988- Went into printing, found a great postion where analog skills are appreciated...
time passes, 1991 a little SW RF piracy to make sure I can still engineer a transmitter...
and a slight change in employers 2003 to 2009, just a different manufacturer of presses, but also
an industry leader.
2009 - Economy slips, I went to one of the customers where I'd installed machines..

As others have noted, not moving is an issue. I've moved twice, and live 47 miles from where I grew up
and am exactly in the place I'd most like to be. That has required that I have travel jobs.
If I could do it over again, I doubt that I'd get advantages I simply lucked into the first time.

I'd still rather draw x10 schematics of an AC/DC 5 tube superhet than a microprocessor data bus...
And at 49 I'm still ready to give up printing electronics/computers/PLCs and take up radio when enough of the even older engineers retire.

Like, This afternoon I'm ready, already.

"puker vfx on" "Heyifyourebythewaterfallinchicago besurean lissen to 1620 for hardestlistening ever!"

 

[TheBigA]

If I had looked at my skills and career objectively I would have realized that my chance of success in radio just wasn't on air.

And my realization of that at a very early age is probably why I'm still in radio today. And why it's still as much fun today as when I was 17.

 

[Philip_Airtime]

Let me add my kudos to Mark for introducing such a thought-provoking topic.

I consider myself blessed. On June 8th, I'll be celebrating 30 years at WBFO, though now in a part-time capacity. I did leave full-time employment at BFO for a few years in the late '80s, thinking the grass would be greener in PR. It wasn't, though I must admit I had a blast working with the legendary Dan McBride at his ad agency. So, I got my old job back at WBFO in 1992. Then last year, the University at Buffalo made it worth my while, and I took early retirement. Now, I'm embarking on an encore career that includes helping a couple of non-profits with their marketing and commmunications and filling in when needed at WBFO.

Like many others here, I was pulled into this profession by listening to WBEN, KB and the other great radio stations of the '60s and '70s. I didn't have the pipes and talent to make it as a DJ. But I found a place in the radio newsroom. Early on, I thought WBFO would be a stepping stone to WBEN or the old WEBR. But I found public radio journalism to be quite rewarding. And it didn't get any better than hearing Bob Edwards introduce a piece you filed with the network, "From member station, WBFO..." I enjoyed a very satisfying career and continue to do so. No regrets on my part. I certainly would do it all over!

 

[ex_producer]

This is a great topic, I have really enjoyed reading what everyone has said about their experiences...

For me, I would've gone into something like computers or web design or something like that. I have been in radio for 10 years and still do it part time. I really enjoy radio it's what I always dreamed of doing, I remember as a kid listening to the radio non-stop and playing DJ with a plastic microphone in my bedroom. I still do on-air shifts from time to time and get excited and pumped up, just like I did when I stepped foot into a radio station more than 10 years ago as an intern. Radio is my passion, radio is where my heart is at, it's in my blood.

All that being said, radio scares me. I've seen alot happen with tenured folks walking in to work one day and being gone the next hour and I'm sure that some that read this board have been through that. My first FT radio gig came after someone was let go, I gained experience while that person had to look for a new job. I have never been fired from a radio job, but I would dread that happening to me, I hate the feeling of rejection. That is why I would've gone in to something else, just more profitable than what I do now.

 

[JustPastBuffalo]

I'm thinkin' this post should be like a 14 second talk-up rather than trying to work three PSAs and a weather forecast into the intro of Papa Was a Rolling Stone. All things being equal, I'd say yes. It was a good ride. But all things in the future are not equal, so maybe not. BTW, if you listen closely you can hear Steely Dan "Do it Again" up and under, cold segued to "My Way" from Frank. Savor the day!

 

[Mike Sheridan]

If I had looked at my skills and career objectively I would have realized that my chance of success in radio just wasn't on air.

And my realization of that at a very early age is probably why I'm still in radio today. And why it's still as much fun today as when I was 17.

I was lucky enough to work at some big stations which gave me just enough encouragement to keep at it. The one good thing was I was allowed to plan my own show, the music, everything. I feel bad for the kids on the air today who don't know that kind of freedom. All they can do is follow a Selector list. My favorite gig was playing Oldies and Standards weekends on a 50Kw blowtorch AM.

When I tell people outside of radio the going rate for part-timers they can't believe it's so little. Not worth getting in the car for these days.

 

[Element9]

Most of the posters here appear to be Men 40+ so instead of asking "If you would do it all over again," a better question would be, "Knowing what you know about the business, would you want you kids to go into broadcasting?" Would you want your daughter to be the "hottie" on a Morning Zoo, or a sales rep rebuffing the not-so-subtle advances of a GM or SM twice her age? Would you want your son to be a lifetime board-op (a few steps above being a Wilson Farms lifer) or being a geek for a Morning Zoo? Would you encourage or discourage your kids if they wanted to be "in radio?"

 

[SirRoxalot]

Perhaps we need another thread, entitled "If I had other marketable skills, would I still be doing this?"

 

[JimMcGrath]

I have been thinking about this ever since Mark posted it. Good thread Mark. Thanks.

I guess I got the “jones” way back just dx-ing stations like WKBW, WLS, WCFL and listening locally to WSAY, WBBF AM and WHAM in the overnight with Bill Ardis. That listening continued with my USN (1965-1968) days listening to border blaster XERB and others when stateside on the west coast. I actually remember when I was in Chicago waiting for a plane home “I Wish It Would Rain” by the Temptations was released that day (12/21/67) and whoever it was played that song every other song for 4 hours straight. Those days are gone but I loved it. I ended up living in Chicago after a time back here so I could listen to Larry Lujack and Dick Biondi and the rest while in my car. A treat for sure.
I was introduced to John Davlin and WGSU during the early 70’s which had a permanent effect on me so that to this day I think in the terms of segues when listening to music
I went to “broadcasting school” in Chicago i(1973) so then I was acquainted with Triad Radio. A true communal station that was never replicated. Back again here with a First Class FCC license and still no radio but the first chance I had I quit a good job at WOKR to work at WXXI FM during the first year. That was the benchmark for my “career” for I saw everyone working very hard to make the station work. iIt only lasted less than a year but it was what you think of as radio. It ended quickly but by then I had the bug but also definite ideas on how radio should feel. I carried that to WITR while I worked a day job at RIT with nights at the station and to WXXI AM with which I was with for about 17-18 years.
So with all that said my answer to the question is yes I would do it over again. I had no illusions that it was going to make me rich and I could pay my bills (more or less) with what I made and have some fun along the way. I met a lot of great people who to this day are still my friends.
I am of the firm belief that at least one time during your life you should have a fun job. Radio was fun. I could turn people on to music that they probably didn’t hear anywhere else on the dial and to me that was fun. Also, I worked overnights which was my one talent (staying up all night) so all I had was the listeners. Overnight DJ’s are a daytime myth to most management. They know that they exist but really have no actual proof.

I think the only regret now is that most employers don’t look at radio as a job. Say you’ve been in radio on the application you can see in their eyes they want to ask “but where did you work”.

So that’s my story and I’m stickin’ to it.