In a future filled with electric cars, AM radio may be left behind (off-topic)

[Daryl Lynn L.A.]

Within the industry the term "oldies" means, and only means, pop and contemporary hits mostly based in the 60's and fringe 50's and early 70's songs. "Classic hits" refers to an 80's core, with fringes in adjacent decades.

Stations can call themselves anything they want on the air. However, the two terms I have cited are the only ones the advertising business and Nielsen accept for those two format options.

That's very interesting. I am learning a great deal about the business of radio. Never realized that that "oldies" and "classic hits" were different formats. So then, KRTH 101 is programmed for "classic hits" of the 80's core, with fringes in adjacent decades. Thank you. - Daryl

 

[davideduardo]

That's very interesting. I am learning a great deal about the business of radio. Never realized that that "oldies" and "classic hits" were different formats. So then, KRTH 101 is programmed for "classic hits" of the 80's core, with fringes in adjacent decades. Thank you. - Daryl

Remember, though, that the USA has (unlike Canada or Venezuela for example) no format police. So the songs on one "classic hits" does not have to be the same as one in another market. The definitions are very generalized, and the industry terms used for sales guidance are just that: guidance... sort of how the strange way of diagonally measuring TV screens is universal, but cover a wide variety of screen resolutions, refresh rates and color gamuts.

 

[wadio]

And the 'angry' part relates to the typical motivation of a political talk show listener. They listen to the daily anti-left, anti-government, anti woke, anti immigrant, anti LGBTQ, anti Muslim, diatribe from the host. Talk show host's job is to push the right buttons of their audience, getting it fired up about something. That's likely never good or happy news, but something that gets their 60+ white, male, audience angry about the topic. Angry means commitment to the format and host.

Holy cow!! You really believe all that stuff, don't you. I can only assume you're hearing it 3rd hand because that's not at all what I'm hearing on the shows I listen to at all.

Could I make a deal with you guys?

The Talk board is very quiet these days. One possible reason is because every thread gets derailed by political swiping or someone pointing out that none of this matters because the demos are too old, etc. It's like a person visiting someone's model railroad display and saying, "This is a waste of time, railroads like this don't exist anymore, why don't you get a life? Some people seem to get some kind of pleasure out of trying to ruin someone else's enjoyment.

I'd like to start a thread on the Talk board asking about peoples' favorite talk shows, especially those outside the mainstream Hannity, Levin, Bongino, Travis and Sexton, etc, with an emphasis on what makes the shows unique -- the guests, the hosts' knowledge of history or sense of humor, for example. Which shows are interesting and fun, and which are repetitive and boring. (Limbaugh and Savage are no longer on the air, BTW.)

If I do that, wound the usual suspects promise not to fly over and drop the "angry old white man" bomb?

Deal? Thanks!

 

[TheBigA]

Holy cow!! You really believe all that stuff, don't you. I can only assume you're hearing it 3rd hand because that's not at all what I'm hearing on the shows I listen to at all.

No one's saying you do. But the majority of the talk shows that reach the widest number of people do. Are there a handful that don't? Sure! Some are at KFI, where they try to stay away from the typical topics. But the big names who reach the most people have very predictable patterns that lead to very predictable results.

 

[Kelly A]

Holy cow!! You really believe all that stuff, don't you. I can only assume you're hearing it 3rd hand because that's not at all what I'm hearing on the shows I listen to at all.

Okay, have you ever listened to:
Glenn Beck?
Laura Ingraham?
Hugh Hewett?
Rush Limbaugh?
Michael Medved?
Oliver North?
Kirby Wilbur?
Mark Levin?
Sean Hannity?
Janine Turner?
Dan Bongino?
Buck Sexton?
Clay Travis?
With the exception of Limbaugh today, this list is some of the many high-profile, "conservative" popular talk show hosts one hears on the AM band. So, are you saying that their popularity isn't based on getting their listeners angry about cultural or political agendas? Be honest now.

Could I make a deal with you guys?

The Talk board is very quiet these days. One possible reason is because every thread gets derailed by political swiping or someone pointing out that none of this matters because the demos are too old, etc.

I disagree. You seem to be the only one upset or concerned about a demographic that you are likely a part of. There are plenty of 55+ people who participate in discussions on this site who don't come off as insecure or defensive at the prospect that they might fall under that demo.

It's like a person visiting someone's model railroad display and saying, "This is a waste of time, railroads like this don't exist anymore, why don't you get a life? Some people seem to get some kind of pleasure out of trying to ruin someone else's enjoyment.

Last time I checked, this was a discussion board, not an agreement board. If you disagree with someone, that's cool in my book. Put on your big boy pants and discuss. I for one am not willing to withhold my opinions or not point out actual facts just because you might get butt-hurt.

I'd like to start a thread on the Talk board asking about peoples' favorite talk shows, especially those outside the mainstream Hannity, Levin, Bongino, Travis and Sexton, etc, with an emphasis on what makes the shows unique -- the guests, the hosts' knowledge of history or sense of humor, for example. Which shows are interesting and fun, and which are repetitive and boring. (Limbaugh and Savage are no longer on the air, BTW.)

We've already established why the shows you listed get listeners in the 65+ white male age bracket. You seem to be under the impression that isn't the case.

If I do that, wound the usual suspects promise not to fly over and drop the "angry old white man" bomb?

What a strange thing to be upset about.

Deal? Thanks!

Nope, no deal.

 

[bobdavcav]

Not really.

You are nit-picking. There are industry standard format names that are specifically selected to make time buying easier, particularly for media planners and buyers who either don't listen to all their local stations or who have to place buys on multiple stations in dozens or more markets without ever having heard any of the stations.

So if a buyer knows a station is "oldies" it likely won't fit any of their buys, and if it is "classic hits" it will be for a buy that includes the higher end of 25-54.

This is all separate from how a station calls or positions itself on the air. No station uses "adult hits" or "Hot AC" as an on-air slogan. But an ad agency needs to know in non-confusing terms what a station does.

And most people in the business think of "oldies" as centered directly on Motown and the British Invasion. For anyone to like most doo-wop they have to be in their mid to late 70's.

Then of course there are those stations that really should be classified as other formats than what they are, specifically pointing to the Cox ACs here. WWRM in Tampa is so current it may as well be Hot AC. WSB in Atlanta is only slightly less so.

 

[TheBigA]

Okay, have you ever listened to:

Great list, but it didn't include any of the Salem hosts, such as Sebastian Gorka, Hugh Hewitt, Mike Gallagher, Dennis Prager, or Eric Metaxas. Some of them aren't particularly "angry." But they're not necessarily pleasant either. Gorka has problems that exceed his most recent employer.

 

[vchimpanzee]

So I had to listen to a small-town station today on AM, which happens to have a translator, but I don't need it. I don't know what's wrong with the station I usually listen to but it seemed to be off the air (though that one is considered successful so it must be a temporary problem). The station I listened to has lots of commercials for local businesses.

They had a recorded announcer telling us how the music is digitally remastered and digitally processed for the best sound.

Between two songs (there are no DJs) a recorded announcer came on saying the station played the 60s (I don't remember what song they played a brief sample of), 70s ("Come Sail Away" by Styx) and 80s ("Eye of the Tiger" by Survivor). During the entire time I was in the car I heard two songs from the 80s--"Promises, Promises" by Naked Eyes and "Smooth Operator" by Sade. I also heard "Good Golly Miss Molly" by Little Richard. The other songs I remember hearing were "Knowing Me, Knowing You" and "Fernando" by ABBA (about four hours apart), "Kodachrome" by Paul Simon, "Cloud Nine" by The Temptations, "Barbara Ann" by The Beach Boys, "Ain't No Mountain High Enough" by The Supremes, and ...

They want you!
They want you!
They want you for the new recruit!

Who, me?
But I'm afraid of water!
I get seasick just watching on TV!
What would I do in a submarine?

It's obvious what this format is called, but ...

 

[wadio]

Okay, have you ever listened to:
Glenn Beck?
Laura Ingraham?
Hugh Hewett?
Rush Limbaugh?
Michael Medved?
Oliver North?
Kirby Wilbur?
Mark Levin?
Sean Hannity?
Janine Turner?
Dan Bongino?
Buck Sexton?
Clay Travis?
With the exception of Limbaugh today, this list is some of the many high-profile, "conservative" popular talk show hosts one hears on the AM band. So, are you saying that their popularity isn't based on getting their listeners angry about cultural or political agendas? Be honest now.

I disagree. You seem to be the only one upset or concerned about a demographic that you are likely a part of. There are plenty of 55+ people who participate in discussions on this site who don't come off as insecure or defensive at the prospect that they might fall under that demo.

Last time I checked, this was a discussion board, not an agreement board. If you disagree with someone, that's cool in my book. Put on your big boy pants and discuss. I for one am not willing to withhold my opinions or not point out actual facts just because you might get butt-hurt.

We've already established why the shows you listed get listeners in the 65+ white male age bracket. You seem to be under the impression that isn't the case.

What a strange thing to be upset about.

Nope, no deal.

I just skimmed through this post. My reaction -- you're not angry and upset?!

You hate conservative talk radio. Why do you spend so much time compiling lists and obsessing about it?

 

[Kelly A]

I just skimmed through this post. My reaction -- you're not angry and upset?!

You hate conservative talk radio. Why do you spend so much time compiling lists and obsessing about it?

Not to go down some additional weird rabbit hole topic from the OP; but I never said anything about liking or hating conservative talk radio. Honestly, if I still owned stations, and advertisers wanted to reach males 12-24 who liked farting sounds, I'd program a station with those sounds 24/7. You're the one who got all offended and started calling me a racist for pointing out that conservative talk radio listeners mainly fell into the 60+ angry, white, male, demographic. As David and BigA pointed out; that's a well known fact, not an opinion.
Now here you are accusing me of hating talk radio. I listen to all forms of radio, because I'm in the broadcasting business. Have been for over 30 years. It's a business to me, not some political hill to climb and plant a flag on.

 

[wadio]

It's a business to me, not some political hill to climb and plant a flag on.

Then why do you spend all this time on a forum slamming conservative talk radio? What's it to you? Why not get back to business?

 

[Kelly A]

Great list, but it didn't include any of the Salem hosts, such as Sebastian Gorka, Hugh Hewitt, Mike Gallagher, Dennis Prager, or Eric Metaxas. Some of them aren't particularly "angry." But they're not necessarily pleasant either. Gorka has problems that exceed his most recent employer.

Listened to a pretty good podcast from WNYC's On The Media arm called: The Divided Dial. The podcast series had it's ups and downs, but what I found particularly interesting; was an expose' on Salem, including an interview with their programming guy, Phil Boyce, who discovered and coached most of that list. I highly recommend listening to what Phil had to say in the interview. He's pretty slick, and carries the Salem water quite well. Folks like you and I can read between the lines though. I got several chuckles out of his comments that the much younger interviewer missed.

 

[Kelly A]

Then why do you spend all this time on a forum slamming conservative talk radio? What's it to you? Why not get back to business?

When did I slam conservative talk radio? By saying the majority of the audience consists of angry, white, males, 60+? That's just a fact.

 

[wadio]

When did I slam conservative talk radio? By saying the majority of the audience consists of angry, white, males, 60+? That's just a fact.

You're something else! 😄

 

[davideduardo]

You're something else! 😄

Kelly is actually right. The bulk of the audience is, indeed, over 60. It's nearly all white. It's nearly all male. And its almost entirely people who are not happy about current social trends in society in this country.

Those are statistics, not opinion.

 

[wadio]

Kelly is actually right.

Fine. But why does he feel it necessary to interrupt every discussion of talk radio with his "angry old white male" discourse? If I dropped into every thread about vintage music to remind people that it's an old and irrelevant audience, you might want to ban me or at least tell me to cool it.

The bulk of the audience is, indeed, over 60. It's nearly all white. It's nearly all male. And its almost entirely people who are not happy about current social trends in society in this country.

Those are statistics, not opinion.

Really? Is there actually an "anger" metric in the stats?

I don't dispute, or really care, about the stats. I don't believe you can paint all conservative radio with the same broad brush. There are younger people entering the field -- Rich Valdes and David Van Camp, for example. Maybe they can help change the demos. Wouldn't that be a good thing? Why can't we discuss the FORMAT without always having some wiseguy chime in to throw cold water on the whole thing.

 

[davideduardo]

Fine. But why does he feel it necessary to interrupt every discussion of talk radio with his "angry old white male" discourse? If I dropped into every thread about vintage music to remind people that it's an old and irrelevant audience, you might want to ban me or at least tell me to cool it.

We... as in a batch of frequent posters... often post notes about repetitive messages regarding personal favorite songs that don't test with the broad audience. I get a bit tired of saying "stations test their music" but I know there are newcomers to the board and we have to say the same thing yet again for their benefit.

Really? Is there actually an "anger" metric in the stats?

---> Yes. Talk stations and shows do research about their content. When they find "hot buttons" they push them. Subjects that anger big percentages of listeners are the hottest.

I don't dispute, or really care, about the stats. I don't believe you can paint all conservative radio with the same broad brush. There are younger people entering the field -- Rich Valdes and David Van Camp,

And their AQH audience and number of affiliates is?

for example. Maybe they can help change the demos. Wouldn't that be a good thing? Why can't we discuss the FORMAT without always having some wiseguy chime in to throw cold water on the whole thing.

We see occasional stories about a dog that has raised an abandoned kitten. That is an exception to the rule, and that's why it's a good news story. There are few exceptions to the "angry old white male" definition of talk radio listeners.

And we are not going to change the demos on a majority of AM radio talk stations... younger demos are not going to use such sources no matter what. So stations focus on the existing available audience.... angry, old, white males.

 

[wadio]

We... as in a batch of frequent posters... often post notes about repetitive messages regarding personal favorite songs that don't test with the broad audience. I get a bit tired of saying "stations test their music" but I know there are newcomers to the board and we have to say the same thing yet again for their benefit.

---> Yes. Talk stations and shows do research about their content. When they find "hot buttons" they push them. Subjects that anger big percentages of listeners are the hottest.

And their AQH audience and number of affiliates is?

We see occasional stories about a dog that has raised an abandoned kitten. That is an exception to the rule, and that's why it's a good news story. There are few exceptions to the "angry old white male" definition of talk radio listeners.

And we are not going to change the demos on a majority of AM radio talk stations... younger demos are not going to use such sources no matter what. So stations focus on the existing available audience.... angry, old, white males.

David, I'm disappointed with your attitude. It's one thing to quote the demos as you often do, but, to me, the phrase, "angry, old, white male," is the equivalent of calling a person with a cognitive disorder a "nutcase," or a physically disabled person a "cripple." It's just not nice.

And again, isn't it possible to discuss talk shows here on an individual basis without some angry forum-dweller throwing insults at the entire genre?

 

[Kelly A]

David, I'm disappointed with your attitude. It's one thing to quote the demos as you often do, but, to me, the phrase, "angry, old, white male," is the equivalent of calling a person with a cognitive disorder a "nutcase," or a physically disabled person a "cripple." It's just not nice.

Again: "Old," "white", "angry" "male" reference isn't the same as speaking disparagingly about handicapped/disabled people. 65+ males angry about political content is also not a protected status.

And again, isn't it possible to discuss talk shows here on an individual basis without some angry forum-dweller throwing insults at the entire genre?

You might want to visit the Formats/Hot Talk section, which features like-minded folks discussing talk radio, rather than trying to inject the topic into a discussion about AM radio in EV's. It likely includes "conservative" talk radio discussions, or would be a appropriate place to stick your little poll. I only wish I could warn them to be prepared when someone says something you don't agree with, they can expect to have their credibility attacked, and called names like racist. Here's a link: https://www.radiodiscussions.com/forums/hot-talk.765/
You're welcome in advance.

 

[TheBigA]

And again, isn't it possible to discuss talk shows here on an individual basis without some angry forum-dweller throwing insults at the entire genre?

I don't understand how it's an insult. That would imply that the radio they do is either accidental or a fraud.

These hosts are seeking to reach an audience, and it worked. Some have even said that it saved the AM band.

https://radioink.com/2020/02/05/rush-saved-am-radio/