is it me or are the powers that be out of touch?

[PSA_Man]

I feel compelled to ask ???why is it that this industry seems so determined to cater to the taste of a 30,40 and even 50 year old soccer mom that doesn't exsist? All the "studies" say that demo likes this and likes that, but as I travel around I have yet to find women or at least a majority of women who actually are happy with what Christian AC stations are forcing on their listeners.

Is it old consultants, program directors, record label reps etc...that have no idea of what it is to be cool, hip and/or were Christians all their lives and now are out of touch with the real soccer mom, so they just fight off change so that they don't lose their jobs? what is it gonna take for them to realize that soccer mom of today isn't mrs. beaver!!!!

So now that i've vented and feel so much better... I ask you is it me? or are the powers that be out of touch?

 

[neutralobserver]

The "powers that be" ask listeners and potential listeners what they want and then give it to them. They leave their own likes and dislikes out.

Man, this gets old........

 

[smashedcd]

I feel compelled to ask ???why is it that this industry seems so determined to cater to the taste of a 30,40 and even 50 year old soccer mom that doesn't exsist? All the "studies" say that demo likes this and likes that, but as I travel around I have yet to find women or at least a majority of women who actually are happy with what Christian AC stations are forcing on their listeners.

Is it old consultants, program directors, record label reps etc...that have no idea of what it is to be cool, hip and/or were Christians all their lives and now are out of touch with the real soccer mom, so they just fight off change so that they don't lose their jobs? what is it gonna take for them to realize that soccer mom of today isn't mrs. beaver!!!!

So now that i've vented and feel so much better... I ask you is it me? or are the powers that be out of touch?

wow..and i didnt post this ;D

 

[anotherguyTN]

Too many times the "powers that be" listen to only a select few listeners or sponsors (which is even worse) or go too much by their own biases. Meanwhile the people who see the need aren't in the position to do anything. That is why in a lot of places it takes a satellite network like EMF or WAY-FM coming in. Even after that happens some of the "powers that be" still don't get it or they think it takes the pressure to do anything geared toward younger listeners off them.

To be honest though, we're probably better off that some of the "powers that be" don't do a CCM format because some of them are so bad at even what they currently do that they would be even worse at trying to do CCM. :

 

[PSA_Man]

The "powers that be" ask listeners and potential listeners what they want and then give it to them. They leave their own likes and dislikes out.

Man, this gets old........

If it's true that they leave their own likes and dislikes out of it... why is it that the majority of "soccer moms" are unhappy with their local CCM station?
Why does it seem that the complaints about CCM station are common everywhere? It is quite obvious that the old school CCM artist can't get a hit but their singles are still being forced on listeners meanwhile "soccer moms" are asking for more Kutless, Jeremy Camp, Toby Mac, David Crowder, and the likes... If the listeners want what CCM stations are playing why is it that bands like Mercy Me, Thrid Day, Newsboys are changing up their styles and being a bit more aggressive. Notice how there are more 1 hit wonders now than ever... I believe this is all due to the demand that can't be ignored and "the powers that be" know yet are resisting; which in my opinion is why Christian music and stations are sooooo behind the times.

How quickly do you think CCM station would change if Clear Channel, Citadel, and the likes got into the CCM format? I would change in a heart beat... the only reason it hasn't yet is cause listeners have no other choice but to listen cause there is no competition.

 

[gr8oldies]

What research, other than asking friends, do you have to suggest that "soccer moms" don't like K-Love?

 

[Coronaextra]

To me, so much of Christian radio is out of touch. People who are too afraid to stray from what they've done for 25 years to actually make an impact. There are exceptions, but not enough, unfortunately.

I'm a narrator for several big Christian ministries and an imaging voice on a big Christian network. Until last summer when I decided to focus on freelance, I also worked for a big station in market 5.
I was at NRB in California a few years ago talking to someone from a HUGE Christian television network who looked at me and said sadly, "Oh, you're in secular radio." Then she sighed and added, "Oh well, I guess we do need Christians there to."

Say what???! Well, I hope so!

Since many religious broadcast types are a wee bit quick to jump to conclusions, I thought I should explain that my handle "coronaextra" is an old radio story about the first time my show was number one so don't freak. In reality, I don't even drink.

 

[Coronaextra]

Sorry, double post

 

[MarkLaRoi]

There are still quite a few "powers that be" in different cities allover the country and even in network positions who put what they enjoy on the air. Not all check to see what the listeners want because many believe that they already know.

In some cases, this confidence is a good thing, otherwise the programming would change weekly as they tried to chase trends. If the programmer has the experience and discernment to put great stuff on the air, he should.

At the other extreme are those who load what they like just because they like it.

To be painfully honest, I think the average person is somewhat out of touch with what needs to be happening in a given situation, which is why great leaders stand out: they're rare. No, I don't mean this as a personal insult to anyone.

 

[BehindTheLines]

I'll agree that having a developed sense of what your listener wants is essential in a good programmer.

However, that alone in today's marketplace is increasingly less sufficient. Those who continue to believe that they can do their absolute best without the benefit of scientific research on their listener are setting themselves up for a spotty performance.

Why not use every tool available to you? Why not utilize every outlet that is provided? Isn't that just wisdom and good stewardship? I'm not suggesting swearing allegience to the cyber Gods and bowing before their throne with burnt offerings. But I am suggesting that we quit being apparently scared or offended in some way by the notion that proven research might have something to offer us.

 

[rbrucecarter5]

I've pretty much given up trying to get my show on Christian radio, or trying to change Christian radio in my community. Those "powers that be" have the stations, they have the money, they have the monopoly - and are happily letting their potential audience dribble away to secular stations.

Ichabod.

--- shaking dust off my feet as I exited the station I used to be on for the last time.

 

[neutralobserver]

If...

"If?"

...it's true...

Oh, it's true.

...that they leave their own likes and dislikes out of it...

They do. At least, for the most part. I can think of one guy in particular who kinda does what he wants, but he's on the more aggressive side. You'd probably like him, but he's getting beat by a station that does what its listeners want.

...why is it that the majority...

"The majority?" 51+%? Please provide the numbers and cite your source.

...of "soccer moms"...

"Soccer moms?" What, exactly, does that mean, and what is its relevance?

...are unhappy...

"Unhappy?" What, exactly, does "unhappy" mean, and to what does "unhappy" apply?

...with their local CCM station?

"Local?" How are you defining "local?"

"CCM?" What does that mean for the purposes of our discussion?

Why does it seem...

"Seem?" No "seem"..."is," "isn't," "does," or "doesn't," please. Why get into personal guessing and speculation when the truth is out there?

...that the complaints about CCM station...

"The complaints?" What complaints? What qualifies as a "complaint?" From whom are the "complaints?"

Please list the complaints.

...are common...

"Common?" What does "common" mean for this discussion? Pervasive...consistent...what?

...everywhere?

"Everywhere?" Really? Please list every market where you've determined whatever these complaints are are common.

It is quite obvious that the old school CCM artist can't get a hit but their singles are still being forced on listeners...

I have no idea what that means. If an artist can't get a hit, how and/or why could and/or would a song get "forced" on listeners? Can you please name the songs that have been "forced" on listeners? Also, please cite the research or evidence you have that the songs you list were not liked by the audience but received significant airplay anyway.

...meanwhile "soccer moms" are asking for more Kutless, Jeremy Camp, Toby Mac, David Crowder, and the likes...

Gee...no kidding?

Here's the "top ten" of one of the format's biggest stations:

JEREMY CAMP What It Means
TOBYMAC Made To Love
CASTING CROWNS Does Anybody Hear Her
CHRIS TOMLIN How Can I Keep From Singing
NICOL SPONBERG Resurrection
SWIFT Nothing But The Blood
BEBO NORMAN I Will Lift My Eyes
MAT KEARNEY Nothing Left To Lose
BRANDON HEATH I'm Not Who I Was
BIG DADDY WEAVE Let It Rise

Here's another:

BEBO NORMAN I Will Lift My Eyes
MAC POWELL By His Wounds
MARK SCHULTZ Walking Her Home
TOBYMAC Made To Love
MICHAEL OLSON On The Third Day
MERCYME No More No Less
DAVID CROWDER BAND Wholly Yours
PHILLIPS, CRAIG & DEAN Your Name
KUTLESS Strong Tower
CHRIS TOMLIN Made To Worship

Here's the "top twenty" of another:

BARLOW GIRL Enough
LINCOLN BREWSTER Everlasting God
DECEMBERADIO Drifter
SALVADOR Shine
JEREMY CAMP What It Means
CHRIS TOMLIN Made To Worship
MERCYME Hold Fast
BIG DADDY WEAVE Let It Rise
BEBO NORMAN I Will Lift My Eyes
JARS OF CLAY Dead Man (Carry Me)
AARON SHUST Give It All Away
ECHOING ANGELS You Alone
JOHN WALLER The Blessing
AYIESHA WOODS Big Enough f/Tobymac
MARK SCHULTZ Walking Her Home
TOBYMAC Made To Love
CASTING CROWNS Does Anybody Hear Her
MATT REDMAN You Never Let Go
STELLAR KART Me & Jesus
KUTLESS Strong Tower

I could list the most-played currents, recurrents, and gold of the format, and all three lists would be loaded with the artists you mention.

Once again, I have no idea what you're talking about.

If the listeners want what CCM stations are playing why is it that bands like Mercy Me, Thrid Day, Newsboys are changing up their styles and being a bit more aggressive.

MercyMe, Third Day, and Newsboys are all core artists of the format...they are what the stations are playing! Your attempted argument folds in on itself.

And they're becoming more "aggressive" because they can....it's where the audience is now.

Notice how there are more 1 hit wonders now than ever...

For example? I can think of some, but I don't understand what the point could possibly be.

I believe this is all due to the demand that can't be ignored...

How and why could and/or would real demand be "ignored?" Who would do it?

...and "the powers that be" know yet are resisting...

I have no idea what you're talking about. Who's "resisting?" Please list the stations and/or names and then prove that they're "resisting."

...which in my opinion...

What is the factual basis of your opinion? There isn't one, so your opinion is invalid and worthless.

...is why Christian music and stations are sooooo behind the times.

Christian music and stations are more contemporary than they've ever been!

Sure, virtually all are still "behind" at least a bit, but I'm not aware of many that are "sooooo" behind.

On the other hand, if the listeners are saying what they want and rating the music, who's to say the stations are "behind" at all?

How quickly do you think CCM station would change if Clear Channel, Citadel, and the likes got into the CCM format?

: Clear Channel and Cox are already in the format, and they sound a lot like other Christian ACs. The Clear Channel station is like your typical Clear Channel / McVay AC, and the Cox station is like any of Cox's second-tier adult-targeted stations.

Susquehanna was in the format until they sold and was doing quite well with it.

So, uh, what was your question again?

...the only reason it hasn't yet is cause listeners have no other choice but to listen cause there is no competition.

No other choice?? Many markets already have two, and XM, Sirius, and internet options exist everywhere. And people can always play CDs.

Plus, CCM stations compete with every other station in the market. Competition is by no means limited to stations that play the same or similar music!

I have no idea what you're talking about. Care to try to explain and not just make charges that have no factual basis?

 

[Don62]

I've pretty much given up trying to get my show on Christian radio, or trying to change Christian radio in my community. Those "powers that be" have the stations, they have the money, they have the monopoly - and are happily letting their potential audience dribble away to secular stations.

Ichabod.

--- shaking dust off my feet as I exited the station I used to be on for the last time.

Bruce,
What type of show did you solicit?
Was it music based? Solid gold CCM? Ministry? News-talk?
I've seen your posts and am curious.

 

[anotherguyTN]

The comments I made were aimed at the local management in some areas, not at satellite networks. Actually things are better in West TN than they have ever been, but it's mainly because of EMF and WAY-FM coming in. If they hadn't come in and proved there was a market for CCM radio I believe the owners of the local CCM station group here would still be doing nothing but Southern Gospel. They actually have a decent set of CCM stations now. EMF coming in actually improved competition here.

However I know there are still areas where the local "powers that be" either won't give CCM a chance or do a poor job of it. They're the reason that the satellite networks are dominant in CCM radio now. I know that some people hate EMF, but if it weren't for them many areas wouldn't have CCM radio, including mine.

 

[R.D.P.]

Since switching over to "Classic Christian", our local AFR station has become more popular.  I now hear people speak wonderful things about WAQU.  Even my own Preacher is finding himself listening to them.

I must admit, "Classic Christian" is impressing me.  I've been checking them out and like what I'm hearing.  This is coming from a person that usually listens to the Contemporary sounding stuff.

Glad that WAQU is now playing music, that appeals to a mass audience.  I even called up AFR recently and told them how much I enjoyed this mix of music. 

They did thank me, for the wonderful comments.

For a time now, I thought that AFR wasn't going anywhere and was destined to be a failure, in my market.  Thank God that didn't happen.  With their new music format, they're doing much better.

In this market, Traditional based Gospel is the ticket to success.  Glad that AFR made that change and is having success with it. 

Hope Moody will too experience that same kind of success, when they sign on with WRNF 89.5 FM.  I'm looking foward to hearing them sign on, within the next few months. 

R.D.P. <><

P.S. Glad that my market has Christian radio, period. If it wasn't for American Family Radio and Moody Bible Institute, West Central Alabama wouldn't have any Christian radio on its airwaves.



 

 

[anotherguyTN]

I've said this before, but I think that AFR's CCM network has good music, but their imaging sounds exactly like their inspo network, which sounds "older". Nothing is being done to differentiate the two networks, and both are just referred to as Amrrican Family Radio. AFR needs to come up with a different name for the CCM network and give it a livelier sound to reach younger listeners. I will give them credit though for the local programming in Jackson, because they are more youth oriented at night. However with the possibility of Air 1 and WAY-FM expanding into the area soon I wonder what will happen to them.

 

[R.D.P.]

Nothing!!! Your AFR station may leave things alone and keep their programming as is.

Speaking of AFR, they have three different formats:

Inspiro (WAQU started out as this)
Classic Christian (WAQU's Current Format)
CCM (Haven't Been Exposed to that One Yet)

Hope you soon get Air-1, in your area.

I'm still thankful that we have AFR and Moody. They are providing my area, with Christian Radio period.

I know that many of you reading, are not into Classic and Inspirational based Christian music but where I live, that's the ticket to success.

To mess with AFR's current format and/or Moody, would lead to failure and cause Christian Radio to go away. If that were to happen, it would be a sad day for West Central Alabama.

I'm still counting my blessings, for the stations we have and will be getting. This includes WRNF and the one, I'm still pursuing.

 

[brian.marchand]

AFR changed several of their stations to classic gospel at the start of this year that can be viewed at afr.net under station listings. The excel listings is the one most recently updated. I would never listen to the classic gospel format as I do not like southern gospel but I think may help some stations gain more audience or support in areas where they had competition from other ccm stations like K-Love.

 

[William_Yeager]

Although it's only one station for now, AFR actually has a fourth format: Christian CHR.

I've heard the Christian AC, and the music selection isn't bad, but AFR won't get the leverage with it that a full-time music station would.

 

[anotherguyTN]

William,
Where is AFR's CHR station? I haven't heard about that yet.

If they make their imaging like the other stations ("Older" sounding bumpers and announcers and just calling it American Family Radio with nothing else to differentiate it from the other networks) I wonder how effective that will be. I know that even when the music is the same I'd prefer listening to WAY-FM, Air 1, or K-LOVE because they have a livelier sound.

RDP,
It sounds like Selma would be a perfect area that needs a station like K-LOVE or WAY-FM. Are AFR and Moody the only Christian stations of any kind in your area, or are the others ultra-traditional or only interested in making a buck and will never give CCM a chance? That sounds like more problems caused by the "powers that be".

I know you've been trying, but don't give up. I was never in a position to do anything to bring a CCM station into West TN other than to pray for it to happen and it took at least 15 years, but God answered the prayers of myself and others and it eventually happened. I definitely believe God will bless your efforts and it will eventually happen for Selma as well.