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Is KKSF Safe?
- Thread starter sfradio
- Start date
I think KKSF's numbers are relatively good, especially in the Summer. They average about 2.5 throughout the year and that's pretty decent in a signal crowded market like the Bay Area. Plus, they market well, have a strong local connection and seem to have put in the effort it takes to establish themselves and gain a strong, loyal following in this market. KTWV/L.A. and KYOT/PHX are other very successful outlets that have the same general approach. WQCD and many others never really put in the effort and time it takes to establish a presence in their markets.
I hope KKSF will be around for a long while, but you really never know in radio!
I hope KKSF will be around for a long while, but you really never know in radio!
What KKSF really has going for it are no employee's. Now that makes for a healthy bottom line.
So why change anything.
So why change anything.
sfradio said:
Do you have a demographic breakout of KKSF, or are you going by overall 12+ ratings? Remember that nobody cares about 12+ because nobody buys 12+. They buy specific demos, so a station can rank low in the overall Arbitrons and yet sell really well because they have desirable demos.
DavidKaye said:
It's 12th 25-54 in the trend that came out this week.
sfradio said:
Using that logic is like saying it's better to own a station with a 23 share in Albany, GA than one with a 5 share in San Francisco because it gets better numbers. If given the choice, would you rather own WJIZ Albany, GA or KOIT? I know which I'd pick! A 2.7 in New York or Washington may be worth less than a 2.5 in San Francisco. The total 12+ share doesn't matter much, if at all. What matters is how well the station is doing in its target demo relative to its competitors.
vcm said:
The only smooth jazz stations flipped in Denver, Washington and New York. That's really not going to be a factor. If a station can't serve enough of an audience to make money, it's not really filling a need. I hate to say that because I like smooth jazz, and I don't think flipping WJZW to oldies or KJCD to sports fills much of a need either. Also, given all the troubles some of the rock stations New York have had, I can imagine some people there saying, "Geez! Another f#@%*&g rock station!" However, if they start making more money, dumping smooth jazz will have turned out to be the right move.
For the record..
KKSF has not been around as long as WQCD in NY.
Smooth Jazz is not sold for the #'s, but for the affluent demo it attracts...read those who don't fill out diaries for a couple a bucks.
KKSF is owned by CC, so it is NOT safe, regardless of numbers and revenue...they always think they can make more with another format.
KKSF has not been around as long as WQCD in NY.
Smooth Jazz is not sold for the #'s, but for the affluent demo it attracts...read those who don't fill out diaries for a couple a bucks.
KKSF is owned by CC, so it is NOT safe, regardless of numbers and revenue...they always think they can make more with another format.
"KKSF is owned by CC, so it is NOT safe, regardless of numbers and revenue...they always think they can make more with another format."
But in the San Francisco market, CC has changed very little in the ten years they've owned most of their local stations. In that time, I can only think of 3 real format changes: They flipped KABL 960 AM from standards to talk. They flipped 910 AM KNEW from a K-101 repeater to talk. K-101 became "Star 101.3," but they really didn't change the format very much. They flipped 98.1 from K-Big 70s Oldies to Classic Soul KISQ, but that was shortly after they acquired the station, and they haven't changed the format since.
KYLD, KMEL, and KKSF all have the same formats they had when CC acquired them.
But in the San Francisco market, CC has changed very little in the ten years they've owned most of their local stations. In that time, I can only think of 3 real format changes: They flipped KABL 960 AM from standards to talk. They flipped 910 AM KNEW from a K-101 repeater to talk. K-101 became "Star 101.3," but they really didn't change the format very much. They flipped 98.1 from K-Big 70s Oldies to Classic Soul KISQ, but that was shortly after they acquired the station, and they haven't changed the format since.
KYLD, KMEL, and KKSF all have the same formats they had when CC acquired them.
I trust your knowledge of heritage in the market over mine having only been here for a few years.
But I know Clear Channel, and having worked in their big markets on the format around the country, they are not a fan, and only prop it up since they own a stake in BA.
That is not to say KKSF will flip, but I wouldn't bet against it either looking at the landscape of the format and CC's reputation for always thinking they can do more with a station then they already are.
But I know Clear Channel, and having worked in their big markets on the format around the country, they are not a fan, and only prop it up since they own a stake in BA.
That is not to say KKSF will flip, but I wouldn't bet against it either looking at the landscape of the format and CC's reputation for always thinking they can do more with a station then they already are.
"That is not to say KKSF will flip, but I wouldn't bet against it either looking at the landscape of the format and CC's reputation for always thinking they can do more with a station then they already are."
I was only pointing out that - at least in the Bay Area, CC has been quite cautious about format changes. KKSF is a shadow of it's former self, but I never found it very compelling to begin with, so I won't cry if "smooth jazz" goes away. But they do have the format to themselves...if you call yuppie muzak mixed with the same tired old 70s "old school" soul hits a "format."
The question is: what format could they put in at 103.7 that would do any better? Hey, KIFR - how about Q 103.7?
I was only pointing out that - at least in the Bay Area, CC has been quite cautious about format changes. KKSF is a shadow of it's former self, but I never found it very compelling to begin with, so I won't cry if "smooth jazz" goes away. But they do have the format to themselves...if you call yuppie muzak mixed with the same tired old 70s "old school" soul hits a "format."
The question is: what format could they put in at 103.7 that would do any better? Hey, KIFR - how about Q 103.7?
Interloper said:
San Francisco is a highly transactional market, and agency sales are based on numbers, and qualitative is not that much a factor. For example, in LA the Spanish AC gets more Lexus business than The Wave.
KKSF is 9th in the market on household income over $75,000. It is beaten by mundane stations such as KQED, KGO, KOIT, KCBS, KSFO, KDFC, KFOG, and KIOI.
On the other hand, Clear owns Broacast Architecture which consults programming and researches for the format.
KKSF is one of the top billing radio stations in the country. WQCD was never a top billing station. According to someone I know who works for a trade publication WQCD wasn't billing enought and thats why it flipped. KKSF bills more than twice of what WQCD bills at. KKSF is as strong as KTWV and KYOT.
SJFAN said:
Actually, KKDF and WQCD, in 2006, were within about $2 million of each other.
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