FM Free NY said:
Uhh...who are you? ;D
NOW THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT!
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Jewelz leaves Pulse 87 again!
- Thread starter TonySantiago
- Start date
Uhh...who are you? ;D
NOW THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT!
FM Free NY said:
Ok so what familiar records do you that the average person would know that are less than 10 years old? You may have had one or two records from every year since 1999 that has crossover over to the mainstream. How are you going to bring people over to a station when the majority of people dont know the music? You dont understand your audience, with this theory. Joel is doing what he needs to do to program. As a fellow programmer in the Northeast, you need those 20 year old classics to survive. Im 35 years old, freestyle was big when I was in high school. My generation is part of that demo, dont forget the upper part of the demo. Thats bad programming
Dancerev889 said:
Here's some examples that the average person may recall.
1999:
SM Trax - Got The Groove
React - Let's Go All The Way
Razor N Guido - Do It Again
Vengaboys - We Like To Party
Stardust - Music Sounds Better With You
Fatboy Slim - Praise You
Lou Bega - Mambo No. 5
Jennifer Lopez- Waiting For Tonight
Madonna -Beautiful Stranger
Stars on 54 - If You Could Read My Mind
Cher- Believe
Armand Van Helden - You Don't Know Me
2000:
Sonique - It Feels So Good
Alice Deejay - Better Off Alone
Ian Van Dahl - Castles In The Sky
Sneaker Pimps - Spin Spin Sugar (Armand Van Helden Remix)
ATB - 9PM (Till I Come)
Zombie Nation - Kernkraft 400
Eiffel 65 - Blue AND Move Your Body
Groove Armada - I See You Baby
Daft Punk - One More Time
Melanie C - I Turn To You
Modjo - Lady
the biggest dance classic IMHO....Darude - Sandstorm
2001:
ATC - Around The World
Da Buzz - Let Me Love You
Kim Sozzi - Feelin Me
BT - Never Gonna Come Back Down (Soundtrack from Gone in 60 Seconds)
Barry Harris/Pepper Mashay - Dive In The Pool
S Club 7 - Never Had A Dream Come True (Mike Rizzo Remix)
Kosheen - Hide U (Creamer & Stephane K Remix)
Sarina Paris - Look At Us
Kylie Minogue - Can'tGet You Outta My Head
Digital Allies/Rich Luzzi - Without You
Faithless - We Come 1
Iio - Rapture
Nicole McCloud - One Good Reason
DJ Encore - I See Right Through To You
2002:
Daniel Bedingfield - Gotta Get Thru This
Reina - No One's Gonna Change You
Tina Ann - In My Dreams
Oscar G- Dark Beat
DJ Sammy - Heaven
Kylie Minogue - Love At First Sight
Perpetuous Dreamer - The Sound Of Goodbye
Gabry Ponte - Time To Rock
Goldtrix feat. Andrea Brown - It's Love
Oris Jay - Trippin On You
Dirty Vegas - Days Go By
Lasgo - Something
Paul Oakenfold - Reasy Steady Go
2003:
Iio - At The End
Amuka - Appreciate Me
Despina Vandi - Gia
Amber - Anyway
Jason Nevins feat. Holly - I'm In Heaven
Benny Benassi - Satisfaction
Jessy - Look At Me Now
The Roc Project - Never
Danni Minogue - I Begin To Wonder
Kylie Minogue - Come Into My World
Deborah Cox - Something Happened On The Way To Heaven (Valentin Remix)
2004:
The Roc Project - Deja Vu
Angel City - Love Me Right
Narcotic Thrust - I Like It
Tube & Berger - Straight Ahead
Wynonna Judd - I Want To Know What Love Is (Piper Remix)
Dance Remixes for Usher feat. Lil Jon & Ludacris - Yeah
Armand Van Helden - Hear My Name
Kylie Minogue - Slow
Shapeshifters (Shape UK) - Lola's Theme
Lucas Prata - Never Be Alone
Motorcycle - As The Rush Comes
2005:
Lucas Prata - And She Said..
Anna Vissi - Call Me
Freemasons - Love On My Mind
Jenn Cunetta - Come Rain Come Shine
Lola - No Strings
Bon Garcon - Freak U (Full Intention Remix)
Cascada - Everytime We Touch
Rachel Starr - Till There Was You
Global Deejays - What A Feeling (Theme From Flashdance)
Kelly Osbourne - One Word (Chris Cox Remix)
Pussycat Dolls - Don't Cha (Ralphi Rosario Remix)
2006:
Gorillaz - Dare (Dave Aude Remix)
David Guetta - Love Don't Let Me Go
Justin Timberlake - SexyBack Dean Coleman Remix
Peter Luts - What A Feeling
Mariah Carey - Say Something (David Morales Remix)
Mary J Blige - Be Without You (Moto Blanco Remix)
Taxi Doll - Waiting (Josh Harris Remix)
September - Satellites
Rihanna - Unfaithful (Tony Moran Remix)
Natasha Bedingfield - The One That Got Away (Valentin Remix)
Bob Sinclair feat. Steve Edwards - World, Hold On
2007:
Eric Prydz vs Pink Floyd - Proper Education
Cascada - Truly Madly Deeply
September - Cry For You
Jupiter Rising - Electropop
Rihanna - Umbrella (Seamus Haji Remix)
Ne-Yo - Because Of You (Josh Harris Remix)
Justice - D.A.N.C.E.
David Guetta - Love Is Gone
Filo & Peri - Anthem
If you do want to play classics, don't saturate it with freestyle. This is where the problem is here, not enough 90's and early 2000's dance classics to reach the 18-34 demo. I understand you want to reach the older demo as well, and that's fine, we can't completely kill freestyle or only play it once per shift, but at the same time, it's turning away the younger demo.
d21ofnj said:
I agree with you that you saturate it with Freestyle. But you still need to play records from that era. Looking at your list a lot of them werent in the mainstream. You got to remember if you are a fan of dance these tracks make sense, but to the average person they all dont. Digital Allies, I loved that record but not a big radio record. Wynonna Judd not a big record. I dont want to go down the list but one of the big issues with dance fans talking about dance stations, is the fact that they forget these stations are broadcast stations. They have to go after a very broad population if they want to succeed. Some of these records were successful at dance radio but some were not.
Brett,
For the record...NO ONE here is criticizing Joel Salkowitz; at least I'm not anyway.
I realize Joel has to do what he has to do for the market that is New York. However, the one thing that I continually hear is the overkill of music that is, on the average, 20 years old? For a station like 'KTU, that's understandable since 'KTU targets that older market. But with Pulse, and ONCE AGAIN not a criticism on Joel, there is a lot of current because of the type of station that it is. And as an 18-34, mainly (with some of us above that age) the demand is more about today's sound; at least that's what people want out of Pulse. To hear a classic dance track (not to pick on freestyle) once in a blue moon is one thing. And yes, you do need recurrents so no arguments there. But not to an extent like 1988. Not saying NEVER play freestyle but not an overkill.
Let's step off New York on this to give a different angle....as much as I LOVE classic house from the 80's, I would feel the exact same way if a Chicago station that was a dance current would play 3 tracks of classic house per hour. It's nothing wrong with the music (as is for freestyle in New York), but for people tuning in to a station that's supposedly current, they want more...or at the very least throw in some recurrents from recent years that Sam's list (d21ofnj) provides!
I would like to think of Pulse and Z88.9 as a "Z-100" / "Q-102" of dance music. And this touches on FM Free NY's post....would you expect one of those stations to put on, for example...Billy Ocean's "Caribbean Queen?", right after playing Akon, Kardinal Offishall and Jonas Brothers? People may not know of certain dance songs that air, but that's why you have an on-air personality, right? And in this day and age of the Internet, people can go on posting boards like this and find out! The most popular feature on my unofficial Pulse 87 fan board happens to be people inquiring about a song they might have heard during a remix show or somewhere during the day.
There's going to be a time down the road where you're going to have no choice but to "burn" those 20 year classics because then you further risk alienating a potential audience that is there to cater to us "50 or 60 somethings". And we can't be around forever. So in that sense you really don't need to go back that far.
10 years, give or take, seems good enough. Mix it all up with all genres. I like D21's list there.
It's really a matter of more exposure, regarding lack of a fan base. I mean, how can one truly know (myself included) the potential this music has if we keep restricting ourselves to what really can be something huge just as long as exposure gets pushed, and within that process, find that CORE artist that can take things to the next level for all affiliated.
It's there, and it's gotta take more than 7 current based terrestrial dance stations, satellite radio and the multitude of Internet streams to make it happen!
Change is a scary thing but we have to do it, and that's all around (not just radio). It's all about the music, right??
For the record...NO ONE here is criticizing Joel Salkowitz; at least I'm not anyway.
I realize Joel has to do what he has to do for the market that is New York. However, the one thing that I continually hear is the overkill of music that is, on the average, 20 years old? For a station like 'KTU, that's understandable since 'KTU targets that older market. But with Pulse, and ONCE AGAIN not a criticism on Joel, there is a lot of current because of the type of station that it is. And as an 18-34, mainly (with some of us above that age) the demand is more about today's sound; at least that's what people want out of Pulse. To hear a classic dance track (not to pick on freestyle) once in a blue moon is one thing. And yes, you do need recurrents so no arguments there. But not to an extent like 1988. Not saying NEVER play freestyle but not an overkill.
Let's step off New York on this to give a different angle....as much as I LOVE classic house from the 80's, I would feel the exact same way if a Chicago station that was a dance current would play 3 tracks of classic house per hour. It's nothing wrong with the music (as is for freestyle in New York), but for people tuning in to a station that's supposedly current, they want more...or at the very least throw in some recurrents from recent years that Sam's list (d21ofnj) provides!
I would like to think of Pulse and Z88.9 as a "Z-100" / "Q-102" of dance music. And this touches on FM Free NY's post....would you expect one of those stations to put on, for example...Billy Ocean's "Caribbean Queen?", right after playing Akon, Kardinal Offishall and Jonas Brothers? People may not know of certain dance songs that air, but that's why you have an on-air personality, right?
And in this day and age of the Internet, people can go on posting boards like this and find out! The most popular feature on my unofficial Pulse 87 fan board happens to be people inquiring about a song they might have heard during a remix show or somewhere during the day.There's going to be a time down the road where you're going to have no choice but to "burn" those 20 year classics because then you further risk alienating a potential audience that is there to cater to us "50 or 60 somethings". And we can't be around forever. So in that sense you really don't need to go back that far.
10 years, give or take, seems good enough. Mix it all up with all genres. I like D21's list there.
It's really a matter of more exposure, regarding lack of a fan base. I mean, how can one truly know (myself included) the potential this music has if we keep restricting ourselves to what really can be something huge just as long as exposure gets pushed, and within that process, find that CORE artist that can take things to the next level for all affiliated.
It's there, and it's gotta take more than 7 current based terrestrial dance stations, satellite radio and the multitude of Internet streams to make it happen!
Change is a scary thing but we have to do it, and that's all around (not just radio). It's all about the music, right??
2001:
ATC - Around The World
Da Buzz - Let Me Love You
Kim Sozzi - Feelin Me
BT - Never Gonna Come Back Down (Soundtrack from Gone in 60 Seconds)
Barry Harris/Pepper Mashay - Dive In The Pool
S Club 7 - Never Had A Dream Come True (Mike Rizzo Remix)
Kosheen - Hide U (Creamer & Stephane K Remix)
Sarina Paris - Look At Us
Kylie Minogue - Can'tGet You Outta My Head
Digital Allies/Rich Luzzi - Without You
Faithless - We Come 1
Iio - Rapture
Nicole McCloud - One Good Reason
DJ Encore - I See Right Through To You
[/quote]
Hey, you forgot 2001's BIG hit by Amber.. "Yes!" Quite controversial because it contained the word 'breasts'....
ATC - Around The World
Da Buzz - Let Me Love You
Kim Sozzi - Feelin Me
BT - Never Gonna Come Back Down (Soundtrack from Gone in 60 Seconds)
Barry Harris/Pepper Mashay - Dive In The Pool
S Club 7 - Never Had A Dream Come True (Mike Rizzo Remix)
Kosheen - Hide U (Creamer & Stephane K Remix)
Sarina Paris - Look At Us
Kylie Minogue - Can'tGet You Outta My Head
Digital Allies/Rich Luzzi - Without You
Faithless - We Come 1
Iio - Rapture
Nicole McCloud - One Good Reason
DJ Encore - I See Right Through To You
[/quote]
Hey, you forgot 2001's BIG hit by Amber.. "Yes!" Quite controversial because it contained the word 'breasts'....
I agree , Tony. You nailed it ! Times have changed, people want new music more often.... since it's soo easy to get it online!!!! Radio needs to get with the times or else they will all fall behind and a perfect opportunity would have been Pulse since it wasn't a "Clearchannel" or big corporate monopoly. Noone has balls anymore to try something outside the norm. You can't program a station the same way as The Original Hot 97, all respect to it but back then noone had the internet to find new music. They could only hear it on the radio. I have respect for the old school, but i don't want to be in 6th grade 11 :'( years in a row. You get me?
That huge gap between 1997 and 2006 has been missing ! My favorites are all listed above. Those are all more relevant than a freestyle record. Just because i listened back then to Freestyle doesn't mean i still want to hear it. I don't tease my hair with hairspray anymore and wear Kavaricc's ... I'm over it already and have been for a very long time.
d21ofnj said:
Tony Santiago said:Brett,
For the record...NO ONE here is criticizing Joel Salkowitz; at least I'm not anyway.
I realize Joel has to do what he has to do for the market that is New York. However, the one thing that I continually hear is the overkill of music that is, on the average, 20 years old? For a station like 'KTU, that's understandable since 'KTU targets that older market. But with Pulse, and ONCE AGAIN not a criticism on Joel, there is a lot of current because of the type of station that it is. And as an 18-34, mainly (with some of us above that age) the demand is more about today's sound; at least that's what people want out of Pulse. To hear a classic dance track (not to pick on freestyle) once in a blue moon is one thing. And yes, you do need recurrents so no arguments there. But not to an extent like 1988. Not saying NEVER play freestyle but not an overkill.
Let's step off New York on this to give a different angle....as much as I LOVE classic house from the 80's, I would feel the exact same way if a Chicago station that was a dance current would play 3 tracks of classic house per hour. It's nothing wrong with the music (as is for freestyle in New York), but for people tuning in to a station that's supposedly current, they want more...or at the very least throw in some recurrents from recent years that Sam's list (d21ofnj) provides!
I would like to think of Pulse and Z88.9 as a "Z-100" / "Q-102" of dance music. And this touches on FM Free NY's post....would you expect one of those stations to put on, for example...Billy Ocean's "Caribbean Queen?", right after playing Akon, Kardinal Offishall and Jonas Brothers? People may not know of certain dance songs that air, but that's why you have an on-air personality, right?
There's going to be a time down the road where you're going to have no choice but to "burn" those 20 year classics because then you further risk alienating a potential audience that is there to cater to us "50 or 60 somethings". And we can't be around forever. So in that sense you really don't need to go back that far.
10 years, give or take, seems good enough. Mix it all up with all genres. I like D21's list there.
It's really a matter of more exposure, regarding lack of a fan base. I mean, how can one truly know (myself included) the potential this music has if we keep restricting ourselves to what really can be something huge just as long as exposure gets pushed, and within that process, find that CORE artist that can take things to the next level for all affiliated.
It's there, and it's gotta take more than 7 current based terrestrial dance stations, satellite radio and the multitude of Internet streams to make it happen!
Change is a scary thing but we have to do it, and that's all around (not just radio). It's all about the music, right??
Tony just curious, you seem to have a handle on a lot of radio information. Which station was it that you programmed?
M
Mixmaster Tony Rocca
Guest
I actually read the previous pages on this thread and am amazed..
You people need to understand one thing here, Pulse is a business...a business idea that was heavily flawed from the beginning because of many things.
One again I will say this as I have been saying since it went on the air...bad business model always equals going out of business. Last I heard Pulse is not getting a government bailout so it is just a matter of time. What I say is completely music independent it is business. If any of you people really understand business principals properly it should be just too obvious.
I wish Julez the best as she needs to make a proper living and do not blame her one bit..at least she woke up to the reality before the crash and burn.
BTW: nice song list that was posted...all good tracks some underplayed greatly because they were released in the heavy payola radio days..
You people need to understand one thing here, Pulse is a business...a business idea that was heavily flawed from the beginning because of many things.
One again I will say this as I have been saying since it went on the air...bad business model always equals going out of business. Last I heard Pulse is not getting a government bailout so it is just a matter of time. What I say is completely music independent it is business. If any of you people really understand business principals properly it should be just too obvious.
I wish Julez the best as she needs to make a proper living and do not blame her one bit..at least she woke up to the reality before the crash and burn.
BTW: nice song list that was posted...all good tracks some underplayed greatly because they were released in the heavy payola radio days..
Mixmaster Tony Rocca said:
Hey Tony which station are you on now I lost track ..
M
Mixmaster Tony Rocca
Guest
whatrusaying said:
Doing two internet radio shows currently..was thinking of doing NYC FM again..not sure yet because of time constraints...the FM show has to be done right like I was doing at MIX..Frankie Blue gave me all the latitude I wanted..basically playing whatever I wanted which how a show should be..and the fans loved it....
In reply to username whatrusaying. All I saw was my quote until I looked closely and saw your comment.
"What criteria did you use to create this list? The average person, please define. The average dance fan, the average core dance fan, or the average person who likes remixes of pop records they already know?"
All of the above. ??? I know, that's probaly gonna be your first reaction, but just think, how do you think the majority of dance fans get to the level of being the core fans of dance? A simple formula in which all other genres of music use in order to attract their listeners with the help of what is called....steps.
Step One: The average person.
Now, for the average person into how the list fits into what the public hears, the average person will not know the name and artists of the song, they are just going to know it by the beat and how it sounds. You don't really need radio that much to just hear a beat, the general public may have heard these songs from a nightclub, a bar, a baseball game, an ice rink, a bowling alley, etc. I guarentee you, you ask the average person do you know "Alice Deejay - Better Off Alone." Sure, they are not going to know what you're talking about, but give them a sample to hear and they will know it by the beat. This is what radio needs to do with dance, instead, they don't because I think there's that reason that still sits in the business, and the reason behind the issue with dance music not getting it's fair push is not only the start of the "Disco Sucks" campaign created by Steve Dahl and Gary Meier, but it also leads before the idea was even brought up, all because of a group with no common sense and could care less of what people "truly" love as music, create unprofessional and offensive comments shooting at us for respecting our taste into what they say is "mindless" and "repulsive." That group was "The Young Nationalists." This is how the radio industry got their poison injected, and just focused on certain types of music being played. If anyone killed radio and getting music shoved down our throats, it was the young nationalists who started this mess. If only radio had the grapefruits to say "give the people what they really want" and allowed top 40 statons to play "everything" all in the mix, including dance, then you'll see the average person knowing a little about dance music.
Step Two: The average pop remix fan.
To the average person that enjoys pop remixes. This is IMHO, the reason these fans get into dance music. Thank the top 40 stations who air mixshows at night, whether it's from NYC, Philly, The Jersey Shore, Scranton, PA, Binghamton, NY, or all over the world. Why do they like pop remixes, because it dares to be different and you get to know that there's a different variety of the sound that pulsates to your ears and something in that beat just makes you want to hear more. With mixshows, you can add more to the flavor and put in a couple of a solid dance track that's not pop remixed and they will enjoy the sound as well. How does these listeners get to know who remixed the song and what other track was played as well? Well, some radio stations will say it's their "special ingredient" that you can't hear anywhere else. WHAT KIND OF A PUSH IS THAT FOR A GENRE OF MUSIC?!?! The only thing you're pushing is to hog up everyone to only listen to your station and be isolated to everyone else. Another injection of poison to the radio industry, self-centered, selfish jocks that only focus on getting ratings instead of "spreading the word of music" they only spread the word of their station. There's nothing wrong with spreading the word of your station, but to kill a genre of music like dance by saying "it's OURS," come on now. What it's really doing is say if the pop remix fan finds out the dj who remixed it and hears it somewhere else and gives out the proper information. That station just lost a listener. I know what you gotta do to promote yourself, but just "playing politics" not only kills the music, but leads to losing in the ratings for your station. Some stations, however, will tell their listeners what remix was played as well as the dance track. They will also list their tracks to their respective website of what was played on that mixshow. So, you got "Britney Spears - Stronger (Pablo Flores Transformation Remix) playing, then sthe next track in the mix is "Sandstorm by Darude," they may not know the track info yet, but they sure as hell loved the sound of how much energy is in it. Next thing you know, the listeners ask what that track is and they will ask if it can be played again, or if they gonna buy the track. So, the tracks on the list are gettinig familiar now, but not quite yet.
Step Three: The average dance fan.
Now that we got the average person and average pop remix fan in depth just by supplying information, and their opinions to see if they want more, this leads to yet the same reason on how to get the average dance fan. Yes, it's still mixshows, but also what helps, mixtape compilations. Found in your local music store and mixshows found on your local preset. This creation is what makes the sound of mixing pop remixes and dance makes the listener say, "hey, that sounds really great." The difference with the mixshow and the mixtape, the mixtape has all the info listen right on the package. The mixtape tells you the artist of the song, the track of the song, and sometimes the remixer of the remix edited song. This is how the average person and the pop remix fan gets to know the genre of dance a little bit more, and when they hear that sound from another station, a club or bar, etc., they will know the name of the song first hand, then the artist. If they can't hear pure dance it on the radio, then that will lead them to buy more mixtapes and listen to mixshows to see if the mixshows can supply them with more pure dance.
The last and final step: The average core dance fan.
We love the music, got to understand who's who and who's remixing. We want more than mixshows and mixtapes. We go get that key and look for more sources. The Internet. The main key to basically any genre, but more for us dance fans, since the radio industry killed that opportunity. Very few stations are trying to give back to the listeners and supply us with what we loved the most. Hot 97 back in the day gave us freestyle and early 90's dance. KTU then gave us the gap between 1993-1996, and continued to fill the gap in 1997-2000. During the period of 1996-1998, other people, I'm sure were filling the gap as well, for example Alan Freed with his creation of Beat 97.7 in Minneapolis, C 89.5 in Seattle, note that this a HIGH SCHOOL radio station. Let's add a third station to the map that also helped in 1998-2000. Party 105 in Long Island. I'm not sure when WLIR started to add dance in their rotation, but I do remember listening to them in the afterhours around 2000-2002. Then, the industry starts to grow with few more FM stations (Party 93.1 Miami, 95.3 Party Orlando, 92.7 Party San Francisco, Energy 92.7 & 5 Chicago, Mega 99.3 Austin, TX (I may be wrong on the frequency) and the best thing, these stations streamed online for everyone else to hear, and that's how the average core dance fans finally get their source of music. That is, whether underplayed, not a big hit, or well played, everybody in this criteria knows the songs on the list provided, even if they only know it "by sound."
What happened after?
The listeners that were left out of the opportunity and were trapped into the "poison" that was injected by their station were following the steps of the young nationalists and the disco sucks campaign, and this is what lead to the demise of some stations (energy, mega, KTU, even Party 105 at times.) What Tony and the NY Dance Music Coalition is not trying to shove dance down everyone's throat (Philly Board, you hear this?) All we want is our fair share and for the biggest thing the dance music industry wants. "Chance" Everybody deserves a chance, so why not hear for it yourself. I can see where Pulse is leaning to in it's direction, and yes, it is a scare to the core fans, but if we want this chance to occur, we got to slowly follow this process. That is, if the station decides to listen to their listeners, instead of listening to their "listeners." What I mean by "listeners" is the higher ups. Then maybe, just maybe, radio won't be a business.....radio would be a lifesyle, and would STILL get their ratings and their revenue.
"What criteria did you use to create this list? The average person, please define. The average dance fan, the average core dance fan, or the average person who likes remixes of pop records they already know?"
All of the above. ??? I know, that's probaly gonna be your first reaction, but just think, how do you think the majority of dance fans get to the level of being the core fans of dance? A simple formula in which all other genres of music use in order to attract their listeners with the help of what is called....steps.
Step One: The average person.
Now, for the average person into how the list fits into what the public hears, the average person will not know the name and artists of the song, they are just going to know it by the beat and how it sounds. You don't really need radio that much to just hear a beat, the general public may have heard these songs from a nightclub, a bar, a baseball game, an ice rink, a bowling alley, etc. I guarentee you, you ask the average person do you know "Alice Deejay - Better Off Alone." Sure, they are not going to know what you're talking about, but give them a sample to hear and they will know it by the beat. This is what radio needs to do with dance, instead, they don't because I think there's that reason that still sits in the business, and the reason behind the issue with dance music not getting it's fair push is not only the start of the "Disco Sucks" campaign created by Steve Dahl and Gary Meier, but it also leads before the idea was even brought up, all because of a group with no common sense and could care less of what people "truly" love as music, create unprofessional and offensive comments shooting at us for respecting our taste into what they say is "mindless" and "repulsive." That group was "The Young Nationalists." This is how the radio industry got their poison injected, and just focused on certain types of music being played. If anyone killed radio and getting music shoved down our throats, it was the young nationalists who started this mess. If only radio had the grapefruits to say "give the people what they really want" and allowed top 40 statons to play "everything" all in the mix, including dance, then you'll see the average person knowing a little about dance music.
Step Two: The average pop remix fan.
To the average person that enjoys pop remixes. This is IMHO, the reason these fans get into dance music. Thank the top 40 stations who air mixshows at night, whether it's from NYC, Philly, The Jersey Shore, Scranton, PA, Binghamton, NY, or all over the world. Why do they like pop remixes, because it dares to be different and you get to know that there's a different variety of the sound that pulsates to your ears and something in that beat just makes you want to hear more. With mixshows, you can add more to the flavor and put in a couple of a solid dance track that's not pop remixed and they will enjoy the sound as well. How does these listeners get to know who remixed the song and what other track was played as well? Well, some radio stations will say it's their "special ingredient" that you can't hear anywhere else. WHAT KIND OF A PUSH IS THAT FOR A GENRE OF MUSIC?!?! The only thing you're pushing is to hog up everyone to only listen to your station and be isolated to everyone else. Another injection of poison to the radio industry, self-centered, selfish jocks that only focus on getting ratings instead of "spreading the word of music" they only spread the word of their station. There's nothing wrong with spreading the word of your station, but to kill a genre of music like dance by saying "it's OURS," come on now. What it's really doing is say if the pop remix fan finds out the dj who remixed it and hears it somewhere else and gives out the proper information. That station just lost a listener. I know what you gotta do to promote yourself, but just "playing politics" not only kills the music, but leads to losing in the ratings for your station. Some stations, however, will tell their listeners what remix was played as well as the dance track. They will also list their tracks to their respective website of what was played on that mixshow. So, you got "Britney Spears - Stronger (Pablo Flores Transformation Remix) playing, then sthe next track in the mix is "Sandstorm by Darude," they may not know the track info yet, but they sure as hell loved the sound of how much energy is in it. Next thing you know, the listeners ask what that track is and they will ask if it can be played again, or if they gonna buy the track. So, the tracks on the list are gettinig familiar now, but not quite yet.
Step Three: The average dance fan.
Now that we got the average person and average pop remix fan in depth just by supplying information, and their opinions to see if they want more, this leads to yet the same reason on how to get the average dance fan. Yes, it's still mixshows, but also what helps, mixtape compilations. Found in your local music store and mixshows found on your local preset. This creation is what makes the sound of mixing pop remixes and dance makes the listener say, "hey, that sounds really great." The difference with the mixshow and the mixtape, the mixtape has all the info listen right on the package. The mixtape tells you the artist of the song, the track of the song, and sometimes the remixer of the remix edited song. This is how the average person and the pop remix fan gets to know the genre of dance a little bit more, and when they hear that sound from another station, a club or bar, etc., they will know the name of the song first hand, then the artist. If they can't hear pure dance it on the radio, then that will lead them to buy more mixtapes and listen to mixshows to see if the mixshows can supply them with more pure dance.
The last and final step: The average core dance fan.
We love the music, got to understand who's who and who's remixing. We want more than mixshows and mixtapes. We go get that key and look for more sources. The Internet. The main key to basically any genre, but more for us dance fans, since the radio industry killed that opportunity. Very few stations are trying to give back to the listeners and supply us with what we loved the most. Hot 97 back in the day gave us freestyle and early 90's dance. KTU then gave us the gap between 1993-1996, and continued to fill the gap in 1997-2000. During the period of 1996-1998, other people, I'm sure were filling the gap as well, for example Alan Freed with his creation of Beat 97.7 in Minneapolis, C 89.5 in Seattle, note that this a HIGH SCHOOL radio station. Let's add a third station to the map that also helped in 1998-2000. Party 105 in Long Island. I'm not sure when WLIR started to add dance in their rotation, but I do remember listening to them in the afterhours around 2000-2002. Then, the industry starts to grow with few more FM stations (Party 93.1 Miami, 95.3 Party Orlando, 92.7 Party San Francisco, Energy 92.7 & 5 Chicago, Mega 99.3 Austin, TX (I may be wrong on the frequency) and the best thing, these stations streamed online for everyone else to hear, and that's how the average core dance fans finally get their source of music. That is, whether underplayed, not a big hit, or well played, everybody in this criteria knows the songs on the list provided, even if they only know it "by sound."
What happened after?
The listeners that were left out of the opportunity and were trapped into the "poison" that was injected by their station were following the steps of the young nationalists and the disco sucks campaign, and this is what lead to the demise of some stations (energy, mega, KTU, even Party 105 at times.) What Tony and the NY Dance Music Coalition is not trying to shove dance down everyone's throat (Philly Board, you hear this?) All we want is our fair share and for the biggest thing the dance music industry wants. "Chance" Everybody deserves a chance, so why not hear for it yourself. I can see where Pulse is leaning to in it's direction, and yes, it is a scare to the core fans, but if we want this chance to occur, we got to slowly follow this process. That is, if the station decides to listen to their listeners, instead of listening to their "listeners." What I mean by "listeners" is the higher ups. Then maybe, just maybe, radio won't be a business.....radio would be a lifesyle, and would STILL get their ratings and their revenue.
d21ofnj said:
APPLAUSE!
That's all we're sayin! Dance music wants its respect alongside the other contemporary genres of music. And if we have to "fight" (in parenthesis because our fight would be in terms of getting publicity, talking to mainstream press, getting at the ignorance, etc...nothing physical or harmful; all positive and proactive) in order to get it, so be it.
So to that....whatrusaying, whatrudoing? ???
Tony Santiago said:
I currently look after 10 dance labels some radio some not. I spend my day not worrying about what the dance stations are or aren't doing. At this point air play is only a piece to the puzzle. Social sites, video's, viral marketing, cross promotion with products, sync including movies, club reaction and most importantly video sites like youtube, are when combined a equal if not a larger part of the picture. Yes I do work with the stations as well and I make sure I provide the best tools I can. I have spent many years working radio stations, and I have come to understand the trails and tribulations of their plight. Record labels and radio stations don't always have the same objective but are reliant on each other. One for content the other for it's distribution. Strange bedfellows. You can pontificate all you like about what is good for listeners and what could work, the fact is each station or chain has their objective, revenue, and it sometimes comes at the expense of it's content. Therefore the better plan is to work with them and make the best possible collaboration and do all the other things you should be doing to make it happen. In fact I would guess if those things are done first, it makes the run at radio much easier.
Okay. Just wasn't quite sure where you were coming from, but I do hear you, whatrusaying!
I'll be the first to admit, a lot of times I am looking way ahead on the "road". There is a lot of potential for this music to grow. Radio is part of the solution, no doubt, but we're trying to push further in terms of education, the ignorance that is out there. And yeah, Internet sources and other aspects that were "alternative" but have now become "mainstream" (such as YouTube) do matter since people can hear and learn from those sources.
Believe me, I want to work alongside those in the industry in terms of whatever can be done. Sometimes I feel that despite what we try to come up with as a possible idea, there is a certain stubbornness out there not to want to go along with it. I will be the first to admit if an idea is bad and do not mind being called out on it. A lot of what we do is about "brainstorming" and looking at things "differently". But if something that may never have been tried before is blocked and automatically shot down without being given a chance, then how can things progress?
Hey, it may fail. Sure. But at least it has been tried.
I am sensing that I know who you are whatrusaying! I'll keep it quiet
I'll be the first to admit, a lot of times I am looking way ahead on the "road". There is a lot of potential for this music to grow. Radio is part of the solution, no doubt, but we're trying to push further in terms of education, the ignorance that is out there. And yeah, Internet sources and other aspects that were "alternative" but have now become "mainstream" (such as YouTube) do matter since people can hear and learn from those sources.
Believe me, I want to work alongside those in the industry in terms of whatever can be done. Sometimes I feel that despite what we try to come up with as a possible idea, there is a certain stubbornness out there not to want to go along with it. I will be the first to admit if an idea is bad and do not mind being called out on it. A lot of what we do is about "brainstorming" and looking at things "differently". But if something that may never have been tried before is blocked and automatically shot down without being given a chance, then how can things progress?
Hey, it may fail. Sure. But at least it has been tried.
I am sensing that I know who you are whatrusaying! I'll keep it quiet
P
PSA_Man
Guest
The problem is targeting a specific audience. Remember when you could scan through the FM dial and know what station it was without looking at the dial? If you heard Debbie Deb, Irene Cara, Cover Girls, TKA, Shannon etc... you knew you were on Hot 103.5, if you were hearing George Michaels, The Bangles, New Kids On The Block you knew you were on Z-100, if you would hear De la Soul, LL Cool J, Gladys Knight, etc... you were on 98.7 Kiss FM, When you heard Culture Club, Men At Work, Elvis Costello, Fock Of Seguls, etc... it had to be WPLJ (prior to "power 95").
Targeting "Demo's" has Sean Kingston on Z-100, WPLJ, KTU, Lite FM etc... Station's no longer have Identities,What ever happened to Station just identifying themselves by the type of records they would play rather than the "demo" they are after.
Targeting "Demo's" has Sean Kingston on Z-100, WPLJ, KTU, Lite FM etc... Station's no longer have Identities,
What ever happened to Station just identifying themselves by the type of records they would play rather than the "demo" they are after.PSA_Man said:The problem is targeting a specific audience. Remember when you could scan through the FM dial and know what station it was without looking at the dial? If you heard Debbie Deb, Irene Cara, Cover Girls, TKA, Shannon etc... you knew you were on Hot 103.5, if you were hearing George Michaels, The Bangles, New Kids On The Block you knew you were on Z-100, if you would hear De la Soul, LL Cool J, Gladys Knight, etc... you were on 98.7 Kiss FM, When you heard Culture Club, Men At Work, Elvis Costello, Fock Of Seguls, etc... it had to be WPLJ (prior to "power 95").
Targeting "Demo's" has Sean Kingston on Z-100, WPLJ, KTU, Lite FM etc... Station's no longer have Identities,
Welcome to deregulation
And now, unfortunately, good people are paying the "price" of corporate's crazy thinking (past and present) by losing their jobs.
Yes, I do remember those days well PSA. You just "knew".
- Status