KGIL Returns

[Cornflake the Destroyer]

The fires are still going as KGIL returns Monday as 1260 AM debuts its new news-talk format, replacing K-Mozart's classical music.

www.1260.am

Larry King (a one-day delay of the TV show), 6 a.m.
"The Wall Street Journal This Morning," 7-9 a.m.
Michael Jackson, 9-11 a.m.
Neal Boortz, 11 a.m.-2 p.m.
Dr. Joy Browne, 2-5 p.m.
Jackson repeat, 5-7 p.m.
pop standards music, 7 p.m.-6 a.m.

http://www.ocregister.com/column/fire-live-knx-1910298-one-fires

 

[Shoot From Hip]

The fires still burning and KGIL doing "news-talk" really are not related issues. Only one show on the station is local (Michael Jackson); the rest are syndicated shows...some of which (i.e. "Larry King" in morning drive recorded from the night before) are hours old. Even pm drive is a re-run of Jackson's show that aired live eight hours earlier. I don't believe they're adding any local staff, so any local news will have to come in the form of brief updates from Metro or some other service.

 

[RadioStarOne]

And we all ask in the meantime, How long before oldies returns to KGIL on the parade of formats from the one and only Saul Levine? The departed legends of LA radios past continue to roll over in their graves! And Saul Levine continues to ride the crest of the many LA radio waves. How much is Mr. Jackson paying Saul to let him be on the radio?

 

[nmoore6676]

I think Mr. Levine deserves credit for trying and not just pulling the plug or selling out to an out of town owner who would likely go ethnic or brokered, likely both as a matter of fact. My only objection is that he dropped the oldies and adult standards and put on what looks like a lukewarm attempt at talk radio, after the doomed foray with the classical.

I don't believe they're adding any local staff, so any local news will have to come in the form of brief updates from Metro or some other service.

The news is from Metro as the traffic has has always been on his stations. My personal format preference would have been going back to the "Great American Songbook" all day instead of just at night. Second choice, he had a decent "Oldies" format when he had that on in the KSUR days. I know everyone is going to say "he can't sell it" but those "Hoveround" people are standing by with money hanging out of their pockets.

 

[dbdigital]

Well, the complaints are beginning to roll in regarding KGIL's coverage.

This from the LA Radio website:

“Tell Michael Jackson to turn up the transmitters in Orange County. I get a lot of static on my way home from work on the 405 driving home Irvine to Long Beach. 1260AM is not coming in for the late afternoon for some reason.” – Randy Anderson, Long Beach

Another listener complained:

"my commute (is) from Seal Beach to Montebello...so far KGIL's signal is unlistenable for the entire ride up either the 605 or 710."

So while it's great having Michael Jackson back on the air (I've always enjoyed his wit and style), 1260 remains the dysfunctional step-child of Saul's stations.

db

 

[nmoore6676]

“Tell Michael Jackson to turn up the transmitters in Orange County. I get a lot of static on my way home from work on the 405 driving home Irvine to Long Beach. 1260AM is not coming in for the late afternoon for some reason.” – Randy Anderson, Long Beach

my commute (is) from Seal Beach to Montebello...so far KGIL's signal is unlistenable for the entire ride up either the 605 or 710."

Actually Saul has already turned up the power to 20KW day with 7.5 at night, from the 5KW day & night it had before. The problem for these listeners is the directional pattern that throws the signal to the west and south away from San Francisco co-channel (KOIT-1260). A search of the FCC database also shows a plethora of adjacent channel stations much too to close to LA as well. With all of this there are no options to broaden his service area on 1260. Wonder if they will rejoin with the AM signal at 540 from TJ as before?

 

[Shoot From Hip]

Wonder if they will rejoin with the AM signal at 540 from TJ as before?

KGIL may not have the rights to air their syndicated shows outside the LA metro (which would occur if simulcast on 540), but if that is not an issue, he might consider it if Jackson pays more for the air time...keeping in mind that simulcasting eliminates another revenue stream.

 

[nmoore6676]

KGIL may not have the rights to air their syndicated shows outside the LA metro (which would occur if simulcast on 540), but if that is not an issue, he might consider it if Jackson pays more for the air time...keeping in mind that simulcasting eliminates another revenue stream.

I doubt that the revenue stream is a consideration , XESUR has vanished off the Arbtiron radar. It had it's highest ratings during the Adult Standards period (better than the LA ratings) "The Geat American Song Book" is already the nighttime fare on KGIL. If MJ is paying for airtime he would want the listeners that he is missing, so it in his interest to get on the signal out of Mexico.

So maybe return music to 540 except for when Michael Jackson is on, since syndication rights might be an issue?

The classic country "ZOO" format is not getting it and they could get back the Sinatra fans and increase the reach of Michael Jackson to a willing audience. That way they keep News Talk on 1260, though with the companion programming it may as well be music here as well.

 

[david]

Wonder if they will rejoin with the AM signal at 540 from TJ as before?
KGIL may not have the rights to air their syndicated shows outside the LA metro (which would occur if simulcast on 540), but if that is not an issue, he might consider it if Jackson pays more for the air time...keeping in mind that simulcasting eliminates another revenue stream.

There would be an issue with Neal Boortz who airs in SD on San Diego 1700 AM. Larry King and Dr Joy Brown do not air in SD so there would not be an issue there.
Michael Jackson is an employee. He is not paying Saul Levine for his 4 hours. If that were the case, the show would have to be billboarded as a paid program.
The outcry from folks about the signal suggests that people are listening or at least seeking out the station, which is a good thing. I'm holding out hope that some combo of 1260, 540, and 830 eventually emerge as Southern California's Talk Super Stations. (Similar to how Roy Laughlin touts KDAY as a Super Station as it is the only station with sticks in both LA and the IE!!)

 

[dbdigital]

“Tell Michael Jackson to turn up the transmitters in Orange County. I get a lot of static on my way home from work on the 405 driving home Irvine to Long Beach. 1260AM is not coming in for the late afternoon for some reason.” – Randy Anderson, Long Beach

my commute (is) from Seal Beach to Montebello...so far KGIL's signal is unlistenable for the entire ride up either the 605 or 710."

Actually Saul has already turned up the power to 20KW day with 7.5 at night, from the 5KW day & night it had before. The problem for these listeners is the directional pattern that throws the signal to the west and south away from San Francisco co-channel (KOIT-1260). A search of the FCC database also shows a plethora of adjacent channel stations much too to close to LA as well. With all of this there are no options to broaden his service area on 1260. Wonder if they will rejoin with the AM signal at 540 from TJ as before?

With KGIL's transmitter being out in the Granada Hills area, Saul may have to content himself with having a Valley station with some coverage into downtown L.A. and let it go at that.

Either that or join forces with Clear Channel, find a property somewhere in the L.A. Basin and build the biggest, nastiest antenna system in So. Cal. which both could share. KFI and KGIL.

db

 

[K6JHU]

Is it time to resurrect 1500 AM

 

[nmoore6676]

With KGIL's transmitter being out in the Granada Hills area, Saul may have to content himself with having a Valley station with some coverage into downtown L.A. and let it go at that.

Either that or join forces with Clear Channel, find a property somewhere in the L.A. Basin and build the biggest, nastiest antenna system in So. Cal. which both could share. KFI and KGIL.

With the issue trying to rebuild their single tower KFI would have little enthusiasm for building a joint system since they are authorized to be non directional on a single half wave tower. KGIL has a 4 tower directional array using 1/4 wave antennas for 1260KHZ. If KGIL could move to La Mirada, they would get better Orange County coverage but lose most of LA. Also that would require a change of city of license as they could not have primary coverage of Beverly Hills. Getting an FCC nod on all of that would be difficult and require expensive engineering surveys.

KFI can not move closer to Simi Vally because of short spacing to KIRN at 670. They would have to go directional which would give up their grandfathered privileges on 640. That is why they are jumping through hoops to keep the same location. Then you add in all of the zoning and NIMBY issues it becomes nearly impossible to achieve in our lifetimes.

 

[davideduardo]

Either that or join forces with Clear Channel, find a property somewhere in the L.A. Basin and build the biggest, nastiest antenna system in So. Cal. which both could share. KFI and KGIL.

KFI has the luxury of being a clear channel station, and can locate optimally in an area that puts much of the signal on land, and can be placed in the area of best ground conductivity.

KGIL is wedged in by co channel and adjacent channel stations. For example, 1280 in Long Beach restricts it from moving south. The chances of moving it anywhere outside the region of the existing site, even with a redesigned directional system, are minimal. At night, were it to move soutward, it still has to protect 1260 in San Francisco, so it would lose the SF Valley area. Moving east hits 1240 in San Bernardino and 1250 in 29 Palms. Too far ssouth, and 1270 in Tijuana is a factor.

 

[nmoore6676]

KFI has the luxury of being a clear channel station, and can locate optimally in an area that puts much of the signal on land, and can be placed in the area of best ground conductivity.

A move to another location would still mean risking their existing status, which is their reason for fighting the powers that be in order to stay put. Mostly the original clear channels located on what was at the time remote rural land, close enough to serve their cities and far enough away to avoid the NIMBY's of that time. I recall hearing stories from the old timers about farmers living near those transmitters getting music on their fences and bedsprings, especially in Mason Ohio when WLW was at 500KW.

I know I left out the most of the restrictions for KGIL but David summed them up pretty well. There are other as well, because KGIL was licensed after WWII to serve the city of San Fernando, which was probably how they got a permit to build. If they had asked for Los Angeles as the community of license it might not have gone through. I can't find my old Whites' radio log books but I think it was 5KW, though it might have been 1KW at the start. I believe that it has always been tightly directional to protect the existing stations on 1260 and adjacent frequencies.

I think they are pretty much locked in where they are, especially not that they have increased power, and even if KFI wanted or had to move the Mission Hills site is way too close to KIRN to be considered.

 

[davideduardo]

I know I left out the most of the restrictions for KGIL but David summed them up pretty well. There are other as well, because KGIL was licensed after WWII to serve the city of San Fernando, which was probably how they got a permit to build. If they had asked for Los Angeles as the community of license it might not have gone through. I can't find my old Whites' radio log books but I think it was 5KW, though it might have been 1KW at the start. I believe that it has always been tightly directional to protect the existing stations on 1260 and adjacent frequencies.

Here are some White's for you to peruse: http://www.davidgleason.com/Whites_Complete_Issues.htm

 

[SuperRadioFan]

Here are some White's for you to peruse: http://www.davidgleason.com/Whites_Complete_Issues.htm

Wow thanks for the trip down memory lane, David! I wasn't alive when any of those covers came out, but I remember my brother (who's 10 years older than me) had some of the White's Logs from the late 50s I believe. I don't know if he still has them but maybe I can ask him --- I should call him- He's in New Jersey. He might also have some Vane Jones Logs too.

PS I like that ad at the end of the Spring 1948 edition... "SEE FOR YOURSELF HOW I TRAIN YOU AT HOME TO BE A RADIO TECHNICIAN"


And from nmoore6676: "I recall hearing stories from the old timers about farmers living near those transmitters getting music on their fences and bedsprings, especially in Mason Ohio when WLW was at 500KW."

I remember seeing a small article in the newspaper maybe in the late 80's early 90s about people living near the (then) KDAY 1580 AM towers hearing rap music vibrate through their fences.

 

[davideduardo]

Wow thanks for the trip down memory lane, David! I wasn't alive when any of those covers came out, but I remember my brother (who's 10 years older than me) had some of the White's Logs from the late 50s I believe. I don't know if he still has them but maybe I can ask him --- I should call him- He's in New Jersey. He might also have some Vane Jones Logs too.

In case you did not notice, there are also a number of Radex magazines from the submenu page... I have more, but have not had the time to scan them.

 

[robnokshus06]

Sure is a lot of yammering on here about a station that nobody is going to listen to.

So, at what intervals do the tower lights blink anyways?

 

[nmoore6676]

Sure is a lot of yammering on here about a station that nobody is going to listen to.



So, at what intervals do the tower lights blink anyways?

1) Maybe the fascination of Michael Jackson and the AM-1260 format of the day.

Somebody counts the blinks. I know of a station that got cited for a violating the beacon flash rate.

 

[dbdigital]

With KGIL's transmitter being out in the Granada Hills area, Saul may have to content himself with having a Valley station with some coverage into downtown L.A. and let it go at that.

Either that or join forces with Clear Channel, find a property somewhere in the L.A. Basin and build the biggest, nastiest antenna system in So. Cal. which both could share. KFI and KGIL.

With the issue trying to rebuild their single tower KFI would have little enthusiasm for building a joint system since they are authorized to be non directional on a single half wave tower. KGIL has a 4 tower directional array using 1/4 wave antennas for 1260KHZ. If KGIL could move to La Mirada, they would get better Orange County coverage but lose most of LA. Also that would require a change of city of license as they could not have primary coverage of Beverly Hills. Getting an FCC nod on all of that would be difficult and require expensive engineering surveys.

KFI can not move closer to Simi Vally because of short spacing to KIRN at 670. They would have to go directional which would give up their grandfathered privileges on 640. That is why they are jumping through hoops to keep the same location. Then you add in all of the zoning and NIMBY issues it becomes nearly impossible to achieve in our lifetimes.

Actually, I was being facetious with that suggestion.

More realistic is the idea of putting KGIL's programming on 540. Of course, that won't help the commuter who complained that he can't hear 1260 on his commute between Seal Beach and Montebello. 540 hardly comes in at all in that region. In fact, I would say Saul has a real AM coverage hole throughout much of the South Bay.

Oh well, them's the breaks.

db