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Missing Format in New York City Radio

vchimpanzee said:
Radio stations playing these artists also play Sinatra. Even WPLJ played Sinatra on their last day!

Surely a noncommercial station could be created to play that kind of music in a place like NYC!
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By whom? And how would they obtain the license? I don't think there's an open frequency on FM in the city, so they'd have to buy it from some existing entity, right? OK, suppose Fordham University were to decide that it didn't want to have a radio station anymore and put WFUV up for sale. I have a feeling it would attract some interest. Would some little fraternity of fans of standards and easy listening oldies have a prayer of being the high bidder?
 
Conversely, do you have examples of alt stations that are playing edgier music and are getting better ratings?

From what I can see, the music seems to be at a low point right now.
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WXRK when it played Active Rock currents earned OK but not great ratings. When WXRK went more female alt - the ratings stunk. When WXRK went mostly classic rock (last format before flipping to CHR/Pop) - the ratings stunk.

New Rock 101.9 was not as wimpy as Fault 92.3 and earned better ratings (despite having a much smaller budget) than the present-day Fault 92.3.

I do completely agree that the alternative format is at a musical low point right now; most people should've seen this coming from a mile away.

If it were me - I'd dump alternative altogether and flip the station to Throwback Hip-Hop and R&B. If programmed correctly, the format can generate ratings over a multi-year period. Urban AC, Soft Rhythmic AC, and Soft AC are additional options worthy of serious consideration.

As far as contemporary rock stations go, I do really enjoy the new sound of 95.9 in Stamford.
 
MarkW said:
New Rock 101.9 was not as wimpy as Fault 92.3 and earned better ratings (despite having a much smaller budget) than the present-day Fault 92.3.
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The big complaint about that station was the large amount of classic alt on the station. But they got their best ratings when they played consensus alt.
 
CTListener said:
Have you ever heard of credit cards? That's how younger "broke" demos spend money they don't really have.

Are you over 55? Do you rush out and try every new chain restaurant that comes to your area and advertises on radio? Do you binge-buy the newest soft-drink flavor if you hear an ad for it? I sure don't, and I used to when I was young, gullible and stupid (the advertiser's dream target). Now, do you buy generic/store brand groceries? I sure do, more and more every trip to the supermarket, it seems. In fact, I'm spending more of my food dollars at Aldi, which carries practically nothing but store brands. I'm living, breathing proof that the advertisers are right. They are wasting their money trying to sell much of anything to me.
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I'm over 55 and stopped trying every new ANYTHING a long time ago - and I DON'T go crazy over the newest soft-drink flavor, even after hearing an ad. I buy some store brand groceries, eat mostly organic, use coupons to save big bucks, baby, when I can, and YES, I go to Whole Foods Market. And yes, I agree with you - advertisers are REALLY wasting their time trying to sell much of ANYTHING to me! - #60AndLovingIt
 
CTListener said:
Since there's no way to monetize a deep-oldies format on an HD subchannel,
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or on ANY channel, for that matter - demos are NOT there - advertisers are NOT GOING to run to an HD2 or 3 channel to sell their products to people 40-65 - PERIOD!
 
DavidEduardo said:


That's not true.

Advertisers... meaning the clients of ad agencies... know who their best prospects are.

Smaller accounts that use agencies, like local car dealerships, know who buys. They know by observation that the consumer that can be persuaded by advertising will finance (extra money in most states), while the older buyer comes in due to past experience, brand loyalty, quality of the service department, etc.

Big accounts such as consumer goods and services (think P&G) have loads of research based on analysis of advertising and purchasing including significant data mining. They know that the cost of changing brand preferences is very high among older lifetime-habit consumers.

The only exceptions are products that have primary or exclusive usage and appeal among older consumers. Beyond the obvious examples of medications and health products that respond to the effects of aging we have categories like cruise and vacation travel, comfort items like the dreaded MyPillow, investment services, purveyors of gold, reverse mortgages, legal firms specializing in cases against defective drugs, etc.
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and, David, those very things that you mentioned in the last paragraph are NOT the kind of things that are going to run ads on a "deep" oldies station on an HD2 or 3 format...

#WCBSFM 1984-2005
 
andreajesus said:
or on ANY channel, for that matter - demos are NOT there - advertisers are NOT GOING to run to an HD2 or 3 channel to sell their products to people 40-65 - PERIOD!
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However, the major groups are using their HD channels as loss leaders now to see if there really is serious interest in these fringe formats.
 
TheBigA said:
However, the major groups are using their HD channels as loss leaders now to see if there really is serious interest in these fringe formats.
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and yet, as much as it used to be a SUCCESSFUL format in NY radio from 1984-2005, I can't see ANY oldies station of ANY kind sustaining serious interest - from fans or from advertisers - even on an HD2 or 3 channel these days
 
andreajesus said:
and, David, those very things that you mentioned in the last paragraph are NOT the kind of things that are going to run ads on a "deep" oldies station on an HD2 or 3 format...
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You are spot on here!

The kind of products that advertise to seniors are very dependent on visuals. Medicines that let you walk the dog on the beach. Products that allow you to go out even with incontinence. Reverse mortgages that let you stay in your family home. Cruises to exotic places. All sell sizzle and not substance all need pictures. The advertise, but not on radio.
 
It's simple with WABC ratings so low it doesn't matter that they may not have advertisers for music... the new PD could put music on then their rating would be better than its now.
 
MusicRadioUSA said:
It's simple with WABC ratings so low it doesn't matter that they may not have advertisers for music... the new PD could put music on then their rating would be better than its now.
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Talk programming can make money even with bad ratings. By running lots of infomercials and host live spots. Not very conducive for music.
 
I can see 103.9 flipping to Classic Hip Hop. I don't think going after BLS is working for them. Someone needs to buy them first. Who would buy 103.9? As for Alt, they do need to play more variety...they play entirely too many Red Hot Chili Peppers songs...they need a countdown show, perhaps more presence in the community. Play live and local artists on a night show once a week. I also think 94.7 can dump nash nights live and go more local.
 
MusicRadioUSA said:
It's simple with WABC ratings so low it doesn't matter that they may not have advertisers for music... the new PD could put music on then their rating would be better than its now.
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Cumulus would not do that because as of 2019 we have to contend with whoever is leftover on FM and how to get the maximum audience size on their podcasts and apps though. And in some cases newer cars made in the past 3 years have internet radio included in the dashboard.



https://www.apple.com/ios/carplay/

https://www.android.com/auto/
 
MusicRadioUSA said:
I was just thinking of an easy listening format of Artist from the 60s & 70s like Roger Miller, Judy Collins, Gordon Lightfoot, Carpenters, Barry Manilow, Carol King, Ann Murry, etc. is missing from the radio in New York City. I already heard advertisers won't support in but was wondering why advertisers won't support it ?
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Also the criteria of easy listening format would have to change based on who the money demos think they are though. OK Ill take my picks and its going to have to lean in the 2000's though Jason Mraz, Train, John Mayer, Pink, Michelle Branch, Vanessa Carlton would be my candidates but I'm talking about easy listening in the form of whoever is leftover on FM according to the OP. It would have to be close to "The Breeze" though.
 
TheBigA said:
That's being done by the college stations around town. WFUV and WFMU. You see how it's working for them.
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I did that on a commercial rock station in a very large market... a #1 station in fact... and the numbers tanked miserably and ruined the rest of Sunday evening's ratings, too. And the show was well done, with good... but totally unknown... songs and artists.

The problem was that most of our target was over 30. Their interest in new rock was minimal, although we played one to two currents an hour and lots of stuff from the last decade. But all new stuff in a show just was not appreciated.
 
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