My wishlist for the Boston radio dial....

[Eli Polonsky]

By "FM soundtrack station" do you mean show tunes and the like? Didn't some suburban AM bomb miserably with that back in the 80s? Sounds more appropriate as a specialty show on one of the "community" non-coms like WMBR.

Yes, it was WRCA 1330, in the late '80s. They gave it a good try. They got veteran local personality hosts like Jim Sands and the late Marcia Masters playing show tunes, movie soundtracks, Broadway musicals, popular stand-up comedians, etc... and they went AM Stereo for the format. But, the ratings and sponsors weren't there, and in just over a year the station went to the brokered ethnic format that it still has today.

WMBR did have a show tunes/soundtracks show for a number of years from the late '80s through the '90s. The show ended when the host, who has a very demanding computer job at MIT, no longer had time to continue it, which happens at an all-volunteer station.

 

[argytunes]

To answer Eli and oldbones...

The focus of the format should be on INSTRUMENTAL film scores as opposed to broadway show tunes. The latter definitely could be integrated into the programming. But when you consider how much better a piece of film music would sound on AN FM BAND...that's the reason for my suggestion.

I'm aware that there have been a few AM radio stations that have attempted a combination of movie and broadway music. But AM STEREO reproduction (particularly on the upper end of the AM dial) doesn't match the quality of the reception derived from an FM frequency.

Even if the film format was integrated into afternoon drive or early evening on a classical radio station...it would be something different for commuters...as well as listeners at home...to enjoy!

argytunes

 

[jane grant]

Argy, I wouldn't mind hearing film soundtrack music - anything on a film would be fair game -

1)Jerry Goldsmith's wonderful instrumental music to the first PLANET OF THE APES (Varese/Sarabande)

2)Chubby Checker's "The Twist" from Spiderman III

3)Coven's "One Tin Soldier" from THE LEGEND OF BILLY JACK (lookout Barry Scott, the film version is different from the 45 RPM) http://myspace.com/jinxdawson is Coven's lead singer

4)CSNY's WOODSTOCK (notice how Young got in even though he wasn't in the movie) - their version of the
Joni Mitchell tune is different on the film soundtrack than the 45 RPM, though WZLX seems to have played
the film version from time to time

5)Tubular Bells, of course

If Boston radio stations like WBCN pick up Opie & Anthony off of satellite, why doesn't anyone pick up internet radio - WRCA should strike a deal with http://www.radioparadise.com - even WNSH or other stations - why do the work when you can get the programming elsewhere.

 

[DG02816]

Airing Web streams is becoming common.Maybe not in what passes for mainstream radio these days, but you have an example of it in Boston now. WWZN is running R. G. Stair overnight. Bet they're just opening up Windows Media Player and and gioing to his Website, then running the audio. We did just that on WNWR last year during tthe summ er months.Stair's also heard on KXEL 1540 in Waterloo IA at night .

 

[FPB]

Do we really need foreign language broadcasts on 650, 800, 1200, 1230, 1300, 1330, 1430, 1470, 1490, 1550 and 1600AM?

No, obviously not. Just like we don't need three sports stations. And we don't need two so-called "business" stations (neither of which even has enough material for a full day of programming anyway!).

I like your suggestion of an oldies format on AM. Fact is, you could get music on the AM dial ANYWHERE else - any major city, AS WELL AS anywhere around Mass. outside the Boston market. The notion that music can't make on the AM in Boston is rediculous (like so many OTHER programming decisions around here).

So, on Boston's AM dial we're stuck with one station for really young people and one station for really old people. Either way, if you want to hear music on the AM around here ya have to be wearing a diaper!

 

[argytunes]

Jane...

I LIKE THE WAY YOU THINK!

There's a multitude of untapped soundtrack material out there. [I ought to know because I own a good portion of it on lps, cds, etc.]. What amazes me is how most radio programmers can completely ignore a musical gendre that...with the right marketing...could generate a lot of advertising and make many listeners happy!

Significant promotion and a good FM signal is the key. If the format is buried on an AM radio station with a weak signal...and the listeners have to find THE SOUNDTRACK STATION---it's an automatic kiss of death

argytunes

But to bury the format on an

 

[WLYNWAZNgm]

Do you honestly believe that this "genre" (note the proper spelling...), as a format, could
actually turn a profit? If it were to be advertiser supported, who do you believe
would be those advertisers? Just curious...

 

[jane grant]

The genre would absolutely be a hit. Provided you had a station people could actually hear. You couldn't put it on the tiny AM signals like WUNR that allegedly plays to Boston harbor, of course.

Soundtrack fanatics know their stuff, be it Randy Edelman (husband of
Jackie DeShannon) or Danny Elfman. But the pop records created specifically for soundtracks, the alternate version of Roberta Flack's
"Making Love" (University of New Hampshire's Michael Ontkean (was he a d.j. at UNH???) as a rookie hetero and it doesn't work with
the chick Kate Jackson; were they both in THE ROOKIES?)
http://the-rookies.com/ontkeangallery.htm or Cher doing Betty Everett's THE SHOOP SHOOP SONG (It's In His Kiss) from one of her dizzy movies.
Very cool stuff. It would attract both the film audiences and the music of your life and pop audiences. Bob Bittner should consider doing a daily soundtrack couple of hours - it would drive even more listeners to his station if the word got out. You just can't put it on UNR or stations like that with absolutely no reception.

 

[JIBGUY]

1600 is a better facility than 740 is. Both have similar daytime signals but 1600 has full night service. Yes, I know that English-spreaking people don't venture often to that end of the dial, but if one puts on an real attractive format on the air then word will spread. More of a killer than the 1600 signal to this proposed SOUNDTRACK format is your suggestion of it being instrumental-heavy. - WJIB-740's success in attracting a large listening audience is mostly due to DE-emphasizing instrumentals. Most people like words with their music. Five years ago, when WJIB-740 reversed the instrumental-to-vocals ratio, the ratings went significantly upwards. Another thought..... most people are not movie experts.. I would assume that the "movie crowd" would draw the same amount of listeners for a SOUNDTRACK format as "Let's Talk About Radio" used to draw radio-geeks like us.... again, a small percentage of the population.

 

[argytunes]

For Jane...

I think you might be correct about Michael Ontkean being from NH?

For the WLYN-gm....why worry about spelling? You can't see words on any radio station!

For Bob Bittner:

You don't have to be a MOVIE BUFF to appreciate great music!

argytunes

 

[jane grant]

Bob, although I like Argy's idea of surf sounds and Planet Of The Apes soundscapes, note that my posts talked about the alternate movie versions of pop hits - "Making Love" by Roberta Quack, I mean, Flack, Shoop Shoop Song/"It's In His Kiss" by Cher & Share alike, Woodstock by CSNY from the Soundtrack DVD not on the Soundtrack triple disc or on their Deja Vu album, the cool "alternate" versions of songs made specifically for film. Dare I say it - Joe Brooks doing "You Light Up MY Life", or the chick from the movie soundtrack who Joe Brooks let Debbie Boone sing over on the very same track. There are 3 versions of the same song...and you could throw in for fun Carole King's "You Light Up My Life" which was a minor hit but had nothing to do with the movie - same time period.

The vocal versions of movie songs - lots of Petula Clark which WJIB plays - GOODBYE MR. CHIPS soundtrack - in fact - a good friend of Jeff Kline's from WAZN has a site about film soundtracks http://filmsoundtrack.blogspot.com

 

[argytunes]

Jane...

Call me crazy, but I still the possibilities for a soundtrack format are present! 8)

Listen to most radio stations...including those that claim to have an "alternative format" and you usually come up with the same songs after a few days? [Although I must admit that I like Cher's version of "THE SHOOP SHOOP SONG" better than Bette Everett's]. GOODBYE MR. CHIPS is definitely an interesting soundtrack to listen to.

My point is this. There's a listening audience for soundtracks and film scores out there. And if the format is hosted by enthusiastic film people who LOVE this music---advertisers (not just video rental stores) are likely to buy time!

argytunes

 

[WLYNWAZNgm]

This might fly for a given program for an hour or two per week - will never fly as a "format".
Too limited an audience. Sorry to disappoint you [EDIT]


[EDIT-inflammatory]

 

[jane grant]

Argy, I just visited the 1 year old Border Books in Burlington. With Barnes & Noble and Border Books audiences eating up movie soundtracks, and with sponsorship from one or both (heck, if the Red Sox can have Shaws and Stop & Shop, why can't a soundtrack station have competing booksellers) not to mention Amazon, eBay and other corporations that could benefit, I think you are on to something.

Soundtrack audiences are huge. What percentage of the movie-going audience do you think makes up the Soundtrack fan-base, Argy? This appears to be a format that radio execs think about for a second or two and then dip back to their research and antiquated ideas. This is certainly something that could launch on Sirius and XM and then flip over to terrestrial radio. Good one, argy.

 

[argytunes]

Hi Jane!

If you count dvd and vhs movie watchers...who often buy movies in order to enjoy the film scores, I'm going to bet the listening audience for a SOUNDTRACK FM STATION would be HUGE! I can't give you an accurate percentage, but there are very few people who don't relate to a score by John Williams, Henry Mancini, Jerry Goldsmith, Dave Grusin...well, you get the idea!

The format could be presented as a hybrid of any classical music presentation. It could focus on cover tunes used in the closing credits---similar to the Cher reference you made earlier in this thread...or take a totally different direction? How successful it would be with advertisers is based upon the tempo of the music, along with the knowledge of the "air personality/film experts" who are making the format come to life?!

If Sirrus and XM can offer soundtracks...why can't a conventional FM station?

There are definitely musical outlets (like Borders) who have a broad soundtrack selection. [I should know because I've bought several of them!].

argytunes

 

[WLYNWAZNgm]

If there was sufficient audience for this, and money to be made, somebody would already be doing it. ..
Those who actually work in the radio business know this...

Even if you had 200 hours worth of suitable material -- a station on the air 24/7 will burn through that in a couple of weeks before they start repeating selections... Not viable as a format...not gonna happen...

 

[Oldbones]

If Sirrus and XM can offer soundtracks...why can't a conventional FM station?

XM & Sirius offer lots of channels that would never make it in the "real world". All of them combined probably have fewer listeners than WTTT, but they've got your subscription & don't care if anyone actually listens. Commercial radio has to find something that will pay the bills.

 

[merlin843]

I'm always suspicious when someone makes this statement "Those who actually work in the radio business know this..." The Telecommunications Act of 1996 stifled radio - it isn't radio's fault and how dare some people try to disrupt threads by acting like know-it-alls. I like what Argytunes and Ms. Grant are preaching.

Actually, there is quite a bit of money to be made in niche marketing. I also question what level of business people are in. Rob Barnett was a huge force at CBS, but he seems to have put his money on David Lee Roth.
A betting man would have tried to get Van Halen together, not have Eddy Van Halen's son do a radio show.

Some people sell air-time and think they are in radio. They are actually salespeople. Other types babysit computers all day and don't do any saleswork. But they get a paycheck in the radio industry. That doesn't mean they know radio. There are many good formats that would work very well but they don't even get a chance to fly. There are other formats that work in parts of the country aren't allowed on the air because of the agendas certain corporations have.

There are interns who think because they've been at a station for 10 years they know radio. They know something about radio, but they are still interns.

Heard "The Loco-Motion" by Little Eva last night on Dan Akroyd's Trading Places movie. It was like a twilight zone episode where every time they went into a party scene, even 20 minutes later in movie time, it was still the same song playing. Awesome. I would love to hear Little Eva's Loco Motion on any format - it is short and sweet and hardly an "oldie", it's a perpetual winner. it worked back then and could work now. I'm NOT in the radio business and know what I like. I know what my friends like. The movie producers also gave it their vote, so people- please stop being so condescending on this board, because many of the pay-for-play stations just aren't radio - they might as well be selling Fuller brush. Few want to hear these tiny stations (that is, if you can even get them!) and you rarely - if ever - see them get ratings.

 

[WLYNWAZNgm]

Gee - maybe you could start the LocoMotion channel -- all LocoMotion, all of the time! You could fill a whole 20 minutes worth of airtime with different cover versions! Let's see you make it actually happen. Commercial radio is not some lame public access cable channel that cable companies are required to maintain to keep their operating license. So far, it looks like this groundbreaking "format" that you propose would have an audience you can count on your fingers and toes.

Yea, like when I go skiing: everybody riding the chairlift is an expert. Just ask them - they'll tell you! They have all of the answers - until they get down on the ice themselves, that is...

Brokered radio is, indeed, the alternative for many people. It is, indeed, the niche marketing that you are proposing! The intended audiences love it - they listen for longer periods of time, and do so enthusiastically. Maybe it is not your demographic - it is not mine either, as a listener... Happy listeners, happy management that gives me free reign for the most part, stations that make a profit, regular work hours, holidays, vacation, 401K plan, doing what I love to do and getting paid for it -- sure sounds desperate to me! ;D Any pro's out there who would disagree?

Oh - and for the record - Little Eva was pretty much a one-hit-wonder, Merlin was a fictitious character, and the Fuller Brush man disappeared decades ago...Please stop being so simplistic and naive...There are plenty of people out there, with a list of songs that they personally like, who think they know how to program a radio station...Talk about misplaced condescension!

 

[TSBench]

If Sirrus and XM can offer soundtracks...why can't a conventional FM station?

XM & Sirius offer lots of channels that would never make it in the "real world". All of them combined probably have fewer listeners than WTTT, but they've got your subscription & don't care if anyone actually listens. Commercial radio has to find something that will pay the bills.

There are close ot 500 offerings on Sirius/XM combined, and of all of them, perhaps a dozen generate, nationwide, an AQH which would allow them to survive as a stand-alone terrestrial station in a major market. Stern and Fox News are probably the only two 'sure things.'

If the Satcasters ever go to ala carte pricing (7 bucks/month for 50 channels, up-pick-em, is the major proposal) you can bet that the ones not getting many, or any, paying customers are going to disappear.

The current busines model for satellite radio doesn't work, and everyone knows it, especially Mel. You can only deny reality for so long before the economics catch up to you.

Regards,
TSB