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P1 12+ Ratings: Same as it ever was...
- Thread starter KOHS
- Start date
Dr. Akbar said:
25-54 listed in the "other" ratings trend.
KTAR about 0.6 above KFYI 25-54, and KTAR AM and KFYI are within 0.1 of each other.
Ummmm...David....0.6 or 0.1 which is it? Take a look again at the "Gold" medal...final score...Mass Appeal...12+...5.2 to a 3.2...ummmm...KFYI leads by 2 shares. That's a blowout...the AM is whooping the FM and has been since the FM switcheroo. The fact is KFYI will still be whooping KTAR FM in 20 years with it's current lineup.
Now the FM News/Talk stations in New Orleans and Pittsburg are working due to the line-up...not the band. WNRO is the NO station...Rush and Hannity are the ratings monsters that help here. Now if WWL lost the AM they would dissappear because of line-up inferior thing.
Now the FM News/Talk stations in New Orleans and Pittsburg are working due to the line-up...not the band. WNRO is the NO station...Rush and Hannity are the ratings monsters that help here. Now if WWL lost the AM they would dissappear because of line-up inferior thing.
redbullfan said:
KTAR FM is beating KFYI in 25-54 by 0.6, and KFYI is only 0.1 apart from KTAR AM.
12+ is not a sales demo. 25-54 is the sales demo. KTAR FM beats KFYI in the sales demo. The rest of KFYI's listeners are 55+ and that is not a marketable demo.
Stations don't care if they are beaten outside the sales demos. 12+ is given away for free as it is of no sales or programming value at all. Right now, the winner in Phoenix in 25-54 is KTAR FM
It's both. But look at all the other examples, from KSL to KIRO to the Cox stations in Jax and Dayton to Clear in Tallahassee and Charleston to WIBC in Indianapolis where 25-54 have improved considerably with the move or simulcast. Of course, the big one is WTOP... off a 50 kw AM and on an FM and the 25-54 increase moved them up by about 20%.
AM has little future in any format.
WTOP...big city...all news...what dramatic move up...6.1 share from the upper 5...it was higher at a 6.6 share 12+...in it's normal range. WTOP is all News...with no Talk...so compare News/Talk with News/Talk. WIBC has shown an upward trend so I will give a little here, but still they have no competition. KSL has a TV station too...so that is not a fair comparison to list.
The most recent Seattle book did not factor in the FM KIRO. In Jacksonville it is a AM and FM...with the AM you have the better signal and where everybody tunes in...the FM doesn't really cover the entire market well...and the ratings are flat overall...if there is 25-54 growth it sure ain't showin up in the final score...seriously it is #1 in the market anyway.
David you can crow about Tallahassee...there is a clear and dramatic increase in the ratings. The Move to FM helped here and furthermore they don't have any competition to speak of either.
The most recent Seattle book did not factor in the FM KIRO. In Jacksonville it is a AM and FM...with the AM you have the better signal and where everybody tunes in...the FM doesn't really cover the entire market well...and the ratings are flat overall...if there is 25-54 growth it sure ain't showin up in the final score...seriously it is #1 in the market anyway.
David you can crow about Tallahassee...there is a clear and dramatic increase in the ratings. The Move to FM helped here and furthermore they don't have any competition to speak of either.
redbullfan said:
If there were no competition, then the fact that the audience grew on moving to FM shows that there are many people who do not listen to n/t in 25-54 who will if the format is on FM.
Bingo. Thanks for proving my point.
In the cases of the simulcasts the 25-54 growth has avoided the gradual decline of most AM n/ts all over the US. For example, WIBC moved well inside the top 10 25-54, stopping the erosion of prior years.
Let's compare KTAR and KFYI to Michael Phelps and the 2nd place guy...the 2nd place guy can crow all he wants...man I have a better body more whatever...but who won the gold..who won the race in the end KFYI. KFYI is making more money and that is fact so deal with it. They won fair and square and the final ratings overall ain't even close. And yeah I know they won the Sales Demo...whoopi man...they still lost and lost big overall.
AM is not dead or dying. The move to FM has stopped because the results are anemic at best.
AM is not dead or dying. The move to FM has stopped because the results are anemic at best.
Something else about the demo makeup of Tallahassee might be fairly young due to it being a small market that has a big university there...plus no competition. Don't get cocky now...one market proves your point and you think that proves your point. It appears to be the exception rather than the rule!
Dr. Akbar,
You took my comments out of context...let me remind you that AM is not dead or is it dying...let me state DE favorite Sales Demo says that the #1 station in Dallas 25-54 is a AM Sports Station. 2nd of all..."the move to FM has stopped because the results are anemic at best" that whole conclusion is about the News/Talk format. The difference between Pittsburg and Phoenix is below:
Phoenix- AM KFYI has a powerful lineup beats the FM rival at the Finish Line in a landslide because the KTAR simply is weak.
Pittsburg- The FM Rival is closing in because of the Line-up with Rush and Sean...not the band they are on.
Personalities make the difference and it is completely obvious.
News/Talk is about Politics mainly and how does anyone know the age of the listener is aging by 18 months...what BS is that seriously.
You took my comments out of context...let me remind you that AM is not dead or is it dying...let me state DE favorite Sales Demo says that the #1 station in Dallas 25-54 is a AM Sports Station. 2nd of all..."the move to FM has stopped because the results are anemic at best" that whole conclusion is about the News/Talk format. The difference between Pittsburg and Phoenix is below:
Phoenix- AM KFYI has a powerful lineup beats the FM rival at the Finish Line in a landslide because the KTAR simply is weak.
Pittsburg- The FM Rival is closing in because of the Line-up with Rush and Sean...not the band they are on.
Personalities make the difference and it is completely obvious.
News/Talk is about Politics mainly and how does anyone know the age of the listener is aging by 18 months...what BS is that seriously.
redbullfan said:
Sorry, Fan of Red Bull...
We aint buyin any of this "AM is not dying" line of unreasonable reasoning. Fact of the matter is the dinosaur is quickly becoming extinct as a method of reaching most people under the age of 60. The Nurse and I give KFWhyEye their props for hangin in a lot longer than even we thought possible. Sure the Master Blogger has wasted a lot of time in sleighing the dinosaur, but eventually he'll get 'em. That's why we suggested to the CCU suits they sacrfice one of the weaker FMs and put KFWhyEye on it - and that was two years ago this summer!
Thanks for writing!
Dr Akbar 'n Nurse Jeff (fans of Night Train Express)
redbullfan said:
The sales figures show KTAR FM outbilling KFYI. Now who won what?
You obviously have no access to 25-54 numbers, so you don't see how huge the growth in those demos is when a traditional news/talk or news station moves to FM.
Just three weeks ago, historic, legendary, great KIRO moved to FM. No simulcast. It's about 25-54 and nothing else.
redbullfan said:
Simple. In Maximiser (there is a comparable way coming in PPM) you make a combo of all the AMs in a market, and you run the combo in the Programmers Package for the average age report. You do it for 4-book averages for every year. Run multiple markets and add them, weighting for market population.
Each year and a half, the average age of all AM stations goes up by one year. I used a sample of 10 of the top 20 markets for my evaluation, but you can do it on more if one likes. It does not change.
I also ran the same type of study using only AMs that are in the top 20 12+, to exclude the very nice religious and ethnic stations. The result is the same: each 18 months, the average age of the AM listener increases by 12 months. This is why the well known, heritage AMs from KEX to KOGO to WSB to KMOX are more 55+ and less 25-54 each year.
OMG...you just said KFYI is dead? Ya serious...hmmm #1 in the market 12+...yeah yeah it's not 25-54, but it is still winning when you add everything up...it ain't going anywhere for years my friend...yes KTAR may beat them by a hair in Revenue, but with KFYI's line-up...KTAR can't beat them 12+ at least for the next few years. Clear Channel isn't going to change a thing until the beauty contest changes significantly.
OK to the "Wise One" ...what is the exact age of WBAP today vs 10 years ago? I don't buy the fact that Young Conservatives aren't tuning in to hear Rush and Hannity on AM radio...that would be NEW BLOOD on AM.
OK to the "Wise One" ...what is the exact age of WBAP today vs 10 years ago? I don't buy the fact that Young Conservatives aren't tuning in to hear Rush and Hannity on AM radio...that would be NEW BLOOD on AM.
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