Possible Format Change At KOAS Las Vegas

[Jazz_Kat]

Hello everyone. This is my first post here, but I have been a reader on these forums for a couple of years now. I'm 25 and am a fan of real smooth jazz, I also miss Jones Radio Smooth Jazz.

I was on the 1057theoasis.com (Las Vegas' KOAS Smooth Jazz 105.7) website and it appears to have switched to an all Christmas format. Not just smooth jazz Christmas songs, but ones from all formats. I have not heard from the DJs yet. Looks like this station could be in for a format change after the holidays. If so, I will miss it. I used to listen to it a lot a few years ago.

 

[majaman78]

Hello everyone. This is my first post here, but I have been a reader on these forums for a couple of years now. I'm 25 and am a fan of real smooth jazz, I also miss Jones Radio Smooth Jazz.

I was on the 1057theoasis.com (Las Vegas' KOAS Smooth Jazz 105.7) website and it appears to have switched to an all Christmas format. Not just smooth jazz Christmas songs, but ones from all formats. I have not heard from the DJs yet. Looks like this station could be in for a format change after the holidays. If so, I will miss it. I used to listen to it a lot a few years ago.

Looks like another BA outlet bites the dust.

Contrary to all of the b.s. spewed by one moron out here...everything BA touches really does turns to s**t.

Good riddance, you won't be missed.

 

[davideduardo]

Contrary to all of the b.s. spewed by one moron out here...everything BA touches really does turns to s**t.

The issue is not with BA here. The issue is with the demographics of the format. With Las Vegas in PPM pre-currency, and with the known difficulties in the PPM for TSL based formats, the owner is apparently looking for a format that will get bigger numbers in the sales demos.

In fact, BA has attempted to do what no other company has done, either... lower the demos and increase the audience size. Jones failed. Most of the independents failed. BA managed to survive, and is attempting to build the format.

 

[passtheword]

Contrary to all of the b.s. spewed by one moron out here...everything BA touches really does turns to s**t.

Good riddance, you won't be missed.

It turns to "soot"?

 

[cklw800]

Brilliant insigt, DE. You're the best! Bash BA will they!

 

[SJFAN]

I just called the studio line for 105.7 fm KOAS and spoke to Lyn Briggs. The DJ staff is the same for the christmas format.

According to Lyn Briggs after December 26th the sation is going back to Smooth Jazz music.

They decided to pay christmas music for the holidays.

 

[davideduardo]

I just called the studio line for 105.7 fm KOAS and spoke to Lyn Briggs. The DJ staff is the same for the christmas format.

Checking further, I find that Lynn is neither the owner, nor the GM. Not the GSM, DOS or even the CE.

In other words, were a change on the way, this is not one of the people who would likely be in the know.

 

[cklw800]

Good point. Management tells staff only what they believe staff members will repeat to listeners and others in the industry. Management could actually tell the staff they're safe but really its' "just for today." Then they tell friends "we're going to be fine" followed by an announcement of a format change in the morning paper or Internet sources.

 

[AnotherCat]

Lots of stations go with holiday music now and don't flip formats when it's time to play real music again. But I worked for a company that took a station holiday then at 4pm on Christmas day called the jocks and told them the station was flipping and there would be a meeting to discuss their severance the next day... :'(

 

[Carmine5]

It was reported in Inside Radio yesterday that the Country format is skewing older, in the 45-54 range. Are we now to assume that, like Smooth Jazz, Country music will eventually be consigned to the format scrap heap and that we'll see Country stations all across the U.S. frantically flip away to some other format?

Or will agencies and the radio industry get a clue and realize that demographics as it relates to age is meaningless.

 

[AC Tones]

It was reported in Inside Radio yesterday that the Country format is skewing older, in the 45-54 range. Are we now to assume that, like Smooth Jazz, Country music will eventually be consigned to the format scrap heap and that we'll see Country stations all across the U.S. frantically flip away to some other format?

Or will agencies and the radio industry get a clue and realize that demographics as it relates to age is meaningless.

Let's hope the latter, Carmine. But I am not going to hold my breath. :

 

[Bill Harmonic]

It was reported in Inside Radio yesterday that the Country format is skewing older, in the 45-54 range.  Are we now to assume that, like Smooth Jazz, Country music will eventually be consigned to the format scrap heap and that we'll see Country stations all across the U.S. frantically flip away to some other format?

Or will agencies and the radio industry get a clue and realize that demographics as it relates to age is meaningless.

Country radio is doing something that smooth jazz did not do and that's to infuse younger acts into the brand. Taylor Swift, Sugarland, Brad Paisley, Carrie Underwood, Darius Rucker, Jason Aldean and Miranda Lambert are just some of the young guns making a name for themselves. Kenny Chesney, Toby Keith and acts like this are now the mature artists. George Strait and Alan Jackson are still getting some airplay but nowhere like they use to. Country sees the problem and is trying to address it. Smooth jazz either didn't see the problem or chose to ignore it altogether. Any good business knows you have to keep challenging yourself to stay on top because what is hip and hot today probably won't be that way tomorrow. So instead of embracing newer artists, which we did when the format started to grow, we screwed everything down so tight that the format couldn't breath and we strangled ourselves to death. We played the same artists with the same style of song and got the same stuff over and over and over. We did not dance with the thing that got us to the game to begin with. Old was safe and new was taboo. Wrong! The future of this music will involve a healthy mix of new artists and styles of both instrumentals and vocals.

 

[Carmine5]

It was reported in Inside Radio yesterday that the Country format is skewing older, in the 45-54 range. Are we now to assume that, like Smooth Jazz, Country music will eventually be consigned to the format scrap heap and that we'll see Country stations all across the U.S. frantically flip away to some other format?

Or will agencies and the radio industry get a clue and realize that demographics as it relates to age is meaningless.

Let's hope the latter, Carmine. But I am not going to hold my breath. :

Well the reality, AC, is that the entire U.S. population is growing older. Mark Ramsey, on his blog today, stated that by 2010 only a third of the population will be under 35. The majority of the U.S. population will be 45 years and older. This means that for agencies and radio to chase after a younger demo, they're actually chasing after an audience that is growing smaller.

It's inevitable that, at some point, they are going to have to stop and ask themselves: do we start catering to a growing audience of older listeners or do we continue to ignore them? Unfortunately for broadcasters, by the time they get around to asking that question, the majority of older listeners will be listening online--which is certainly the case with the Smooth Jazz crowd now.

C5

 

[davideduardo]

This means that for agencies and radio to chase after a younger demo, they're actually chasing after an audience that is growing smaller.

Agencies and radio have nothing to do with this. Agency clients, the advertisers themselves, do.

The advertisers understand who uses and buys their products and service and they know how much it costs to make a sale by age group. Older consumers require lots more impressions to be sold, so the profit on the sale is often minimal or nonexistent since the ad costs are higher. So advertisers go for the points where ads are effective and cost efficient, and where the possibility of creating brand loyalty exist.

Radio simply programs for the demos where advertisers will spend money. If there is no money being spent to reach persons over 55, then no station will target that group.

This is not going to change at the radio level until advertisers go after 55+. In fact, the trend is away from 25-54 as the sales demo and towards 18-49!

 

[AC Tones]

Bill/C5,

We are teetering on a subject matter that is bound to draw an old friend out of the woodwork . Oh no, TOO LATE!!!! ;D I agree with both of you, BTW. Internet programmers and those not under the control of the gorilla have gotten the message, as have syndicated guys like Ted Hasiuk, Mark Stanley, and Bill. I do believe we can turn this format around, but it is going to take time, as well as a commitment to new and innovative marketing strategies.

Chris

 

[davideduardo]

It was reported in Inside Radio yesterday that the Country format is skewing older, in the 45-54 range. Are we now to assume that, like Smooth Jazz, Country music will eventually be consigned to the format scrap heap and that we'll see Country stations all across the U.S. frantically flip away to some other format?

Or will agencies and the radio industry get a clue and realize that demographics as it relates to age is meaningless.

Country stations will make efforts to lower the ages of the listeners so that the advertisers who tell their agencies what ages to buy will continute to buy them.

 

[davideduardo]

Bill/C5,

We are teetering on a subject matter that is bound to draw an old friend out of the woodwork . Oh no, TOO LATE!!!! ;D I agree with both of you, BTW. Internet programmers and those not under the control of the gorilla have gotten the message, as have syndicated guys like Ted Hasiuk, Mark Stanley, and Bill. I do believe we can turn this format around, but it is going to take time, as well as a commitment to new and innovative marketing strategies.

And your business model is based on what?

Either you have a hobby station, and need no revenue, or you have to provide a medium that advertisers will wish to use. In that case, the same conditions that affect terrestrial radio will be in play.

 

[AC Tones]

Bill/C5,

We are teetering on a subject matter that is bound to draw an old friend out of the woodwork . Oh no, TOO LATE!!!! ;D I agree with both of you, BTW. Internet programmers and those not under the control of the gorilla have gotten the message, as have syndicated guys like Ted Hasiuk, Mark Stanley, and Bill. I do believe we can turn this format around, but it is going to take time, as well as a commitment to new and innovative marketing strategies.

And your business model is based on what?

Either you have a hobby station, and need no revenue, or you have to provide a medium that advertisers will wish to use. In that case, the same conditions that affect terrestrial radio will be in play.

I am making it up as I go along, how about that? But fortunately because of little or no overhead, I am not bound to the same "rules" your big market terrestrial buddies are bound to. The prohibitive cost of maintaining a full time staff to operate, maintain, and market the station; renting a building and paying for utilities; and paying big $$$ for consultants are all expenses that have NO impact on my balance sheet. Therefore, since I operate under a different set of "rules," I can be more discretionary about the kind of listeners I seek to have and the advertisers/sponsors that might be interested in their dollars.

 

[majaman78]

Bill/C5,

We are teetering on a subject matter that is bound to draw an old friend out of the woodwork . Oh no, TOO LATE!!!! ;D I agree with both of you, BTW. Internet programmers and those not under the control of the gorilla have gotten the message, as have syndicated guys like Ted Hasiuk, Mark Stanley, and Bill. I do believe we can turn this format around, but it is going to take time, as well as a commitment to new and innovative marketing strategies.

And your business model is based on what?

Either you have a hobby station, and need no revenue, or you have to provide a medium that advertisers will wish to use. In that case, the same conditions that affect terrestrial radio will be in play.

I am making it up as I go along, how about that? But fortunately because of little or no overhead, I am not bound to the same "rules" your big market terrestrial buddies are bound to. The prohibitive cost of maintaining a full time staff to operate, maintain, and market the station; renting a building and paying for utilities; and paying big $$$ for consultants are all expenses that have NO impact on my balance sheet. Therefore, since I operate under a different set of "rules," I can be more discretionary about the kind of listeners I seek to have and the advertisers/sponsors that might be interested in their dollars.

Seriously, what's the point of crying about terrestrial?

AC nailed it, the game is changing. The future of radio is cheap delivery, and the delivery of any content you desire without the overhead and the rest of the riff-raff that goes with running a bloated, debt-laden capital structure.

Go ahead terrestrial, cater to the 25 and under crowd. I could care less! I won't be listening!!

NOBODY will be listening! Even those 25 and under folks think terrestrial is inferior! It will be extremely interesting to see where ad revenue moves to during the next decade and beyond (hint: it won't be terrestrial radio)

Everyone will finally get to listen to what they want, not what someone or somebody else wants them to.

It's already here, smooth jazz fans, and I couldn't be more excited!

 

[Bill Harmonic]

It was reported in Inside Radio yesterday that the Country format is skewing older, in the 45-54 range.  Are we now to assume that, like Smooth Jazz, Country music will eventually be consigned to the format scrap heap and that we'll see Country stations all across the U.S. frantically flip away to some other format?

Or will agencies and the radio industry get a clue and realize that demographics as it relates to age is meaningless.

Country stations will make efforts to lower the ages of the listeners so that the advertisers who tell their agencies what ages to buy will continute to buy them.

And then why didn't smooth jazz stations try to make the same adjustment as country is doing? Maybe those who controlled the direction just missed the boat and what they are attempting to do now is too little and way too late. As always David, you offer nothing new to the discussion and if you could, please refrain yourself from always trying to educate the heathen. I don't mind being hipped to the facts but I do mind being talked down to. I'll ask you again to please help make this a productive, forward moving collection of ideas instead of a myopic glare into the rear view mirror.

C5 is right that the boomers are the "pig in a python" (a huge lump) moving through the population. This group is just one of the problems that terrestial radio and smooth jazz is facing in the immediate future. Chris Mays who's been a very successful PD and is now a consultant had an interesting view on Arbitron and PPM in the December 2nd "Taylor 0n Radio-Info" which follows:

“The PPM methodology is ‘drive-by’ listening, coming at the expense of all the special P1-loyal stations.” Thoughts from Seattle-based major-market PD and consultant Chris Mays, ahead of today’s House Oversight Committee grilling of Arbitron over the People Meter’s effect on minority stations and listeners. Chris emails me to say “While I am sympathetic to the plight of Hispanic and Urban stations, it seems to me that they have had a slightly unfair advantage over the years with the diary methodology. Their loyal fans were able to ‘vote’ with their pens in a way that may or may not have accurately reflected listening.” But Chris says there’s a larger story. “The PPM methodology is affecting radio in a bigger way. It is ‘drive-by’ listening, which moves the stations that are very few peoples’ P1 stations, but everyone’s P2 or P3 station, to the top. This is coming at the expense of all special P1-loyal stations. The most generic, cume-friendly stations are rising, while the stations based on loyal fans are falling. This includes AAA in most markets. And Smooth Jazz.” She says “This is sad. It is making owners take fewer chances and radio formats more generic in general.” Chris specializes in the adult alternative format, and she’s at [email protected] and  206-547-4268  206-547-4268."

(By the way, if you don't know what Chris if refering to, Hispanic and Urban diarys in Arbitron's old methodology are weighed heavier than other diaries. In other words, one diary counts more, which I believe was a vital reason for the urban vocal slant of smooth jazz stations.)

So, we have an aging audience that does not appeal to advertisers (which advertisers?), huge trouble with the ratings system and a format direction that's riding with Thelma and Louise but the audience is still there and the music is still viable. It's no longer about "broadcasting" but serving the niche. I'd rather have 100 who love me than a 500 who think I'm as important as their toaster. The new world is about serving the "Tribe" and the "Tribe" is heading to new hills to connect. Smooth jazz still has the ability to take a smaller audience and make it profitable. That's the way it started out and that's the way it will be done again.