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Public Radio Ratings in Rochester and Buffalo

M

Mark_Giardina

Guest
In the ratings war between WNED and WBFO, WBFO came out the clear winner dominating WNED in AQH Cume, AQH Persons Cume Share, Cume Rating and average TSL

In Rochester WXXI-AM and FM lost audience. Nothing close to the 3 share Bob Smith one said the station averages. Drop that one number lower and you are closer to what the latest book says Bob. But once you get that new, "experienced" afternoon drive host in place I'm sure your ratings will skyrocket back to the 3.4
share the station had when I left three years ago. ;D
 
Mark Giardina said:
In the ratings war between WNED and WBFO, WBFO came out the clear winner dominating WNED in AQH Cume, AQH Persons Cume Share, Cume Rating and average TSL

In Rochester WXXI-AM and FM lost audience. Nothing close to the 3 share Bob Smith one said the station averages. Drop that one number lower and you are closer to what the latest book says Bob. But once you get that new, "experienced" afternoon drive host in place I'm sure your ratings will skyrocket back to the 3.4
share the station had when I left three years ago. ;D


Traveling the state, as I do for my job, I manage to hear several public radio stations and I must say that WBFO and especially WAMC in Albany are exceptional. WAMC's "Roundtable" program is a perfect example of how professionally-crafted local programming can be both informative and entertaining. It is no wonder that WAMC makes so much money during their fundraising drives. As for WXXI-AM, I have been disappointed with their line-up of programs.
Diane Rehm has interesting guests, but her show is as stimulating as stale toast. As for Bob Smith's show, to be quite truthful I am surprised Mr. Smith's guests are able to get a word in at all considering how he monopolizes the conversation. And some of the topics are quite boring.
The woman who replaced Mr. Giardina as afternoon news anchor was just horrible on the air. I read here that the station recruited her right out of college. I hope they don't make the same mistake when hiring her replacement.
 
Mark Giardina said:
In Rochester WXXI-AM and FM lost audience. Nothing close to the 3 share Bob Smith one said the station averages. Drop that one number lower and you are closer to what the latest book says Bob. But once you get that new, "experienced" afternoon drive host in place I'm sure your ratings will skyrocket back to the 3.4 share the station had when I left three years ago.

Schadenfreude?
 
Schadenfreude?

If so, who can blame him? WXXI is pretty hard to like. Stictly for the Country Club set. Can't get Danny Wegman mad at them - he's a big contributor. AM 1370 doesn't have much to offer as far as local programming is concerned("we're not a community radio station," as they once wrote to me).

Anybody found out exactly how much money so called "CEO" Norm Silverstein makes a year? For the big bucks he makes off the faithful's money you think he could have been a little nicer to the Democracy Now committee of Metro Justice and let them all in to the meeting("not enough chairs" - empty chairs were seen inside the meeting room, or so I am told - I wasn't there).

As a rule I think indulging in shadenfreude is not a good thing - makes you weak in character in the long run. In WXXI's case, I'm willling to make an exception.

And yes, I once worked for them. Dreadful. The Walmart of local broadcasters. Strictly sweat shop. Norm needs his big salary.
 
Job Opportunity?

The good news is that there seem to be several former WHAM staffers available who should be able to improve the PM drive presentation on WXXI.

That is, of course, if they're not seen as "tainted" and "commercial" by the NPR zealots.
 
Re: Job Opportunity?

SirRoxalot said:
The good news is that there seem to be several former WHAM staffers available who should be able to improve the PM drive presentation on WXXI.

It is too late for that. I was told the station has already hired someone. A woman with no professional radio experience, but did host ATC at her college station in Ohio. Déjà vu all over again? ::)
 
It is too late for that. I was told the station has already hired someone. A woman with no professional radio experience, but did host ATC at her college station in Ohio. Déjà vu all over again?

Everytime I drive by Channel 13's studios on West Henrietta Road I can't help but wonder why WXXI can have similar facilities instead of their multi story site on State Street(a far cry from their original days in the basement of East High School)....if that were the case maybe they could invest more in people rather than posh office space for their overpaid execs(not to mention tv studio space they rarely use).
 
The Voice of Reason said:
As for WXXI-AM, I have been disappointed with their line-up of programs.
Diane Rehm has interesting guests, but her show is as stimulating as stale toast.

There is a colorful phrase I use in dismissing those who bore me to tears with esoterica, razor-thin niche topics that people will discuss for hours on end, and dreary highbrow discussions which seem to try and illustrate one's own knowledge of a topic rather than truly being interested in it - "you are so Diane Rehm second hour."

I appreciate Diane's ability to go deeper than the usual surface populism or bombastic rhetoric one gets on commercial talk radio, but her show is made for podcasting (played back at double speed when she is hosting - I haven't heard delivery that slow since VOA Special English). For every insightful program delving deep into current events with someone who actually has knowledge of the issues, there is a show with an Albanian poet celebrating the release of her new book on Asian Haikus for Kosovo. Kill me now.

If you go to her archives on the website, there are one or two hours a week that are *really* good stuff, and it's worth listening, once you get past her delivery (which isn't her fault by the way). But the rest of it is the radio equivalent of a coffee table book in a waiting room.

As for Bob Smith's show, to be quite truthful I am surprised Mr. Smith's guests are able to get a word in at all considering how he monopolizes the conversation. And some of the topics are quite boring.

As compared to what else on the radio? Bob Lonsberry? Bob Smith's show as a podcast would get far more attention from me when I actively listen to radio programming (I power walk my way up and down Elmwood every afternoon usually with BBC World Service Newshour or something else along those lines). But I would be lost in fascination as well hearing Bob Smith talk with guests about history topics or other things which get absolutely no attention on the radio. I have heard far, far worse in monopolizing talk show hosts. The worst ever was Casper Citron, who hosted a radio show for decades five nights a week in New York City, typically from a upper crust NYC hotel he wormed free room and board from and recorded the show in their dining room (complete with table bussing heard quite clearly in the background). He wanted to make sure his guests knew he read their books, so he constantly interrupted them and finished their sentences to prove it. After that, Bob Smith's on air interviews don't bother me at all. I suspect some of the time, he's talking to fill time waiting for some calls to show up.

raymond_shaw said:
Schadenfreude?

If so, who can blame him? WXXI is pretty hard to like. Stictly for the Country Club set. Can't get Danny Wegman mad at them - he's a big contributor. AM 1370 doesn't have much to offer as far as local programming is concerned("we're not a community radio station," as they once wrote to me).

I think the better word here is "elitist" at least with some of their programming. I think there is an opportunity for people to run a public radio station that actually connects with the entire community, not just potential donors. I think most of them are in more rural communities. Listening to Wyoming's public radio stations, for example, shows they are quite willing to talk to the common man and woman in the mountain west. A lot of community interest programs with local flavor. Alaska's public radio stations have compelling local programming as well. It's amazing what some stations can pull off on a shoestring and provide a meaningful service to the community. Others have millions and well, they want to make sure they have those millions.

For the big bucks he makes off the faithful's money you think he could have been a little nicer to the Democracy Now committee of Metro Justice and let them all in to the meeting("not enough chairs" - empty chairs were seen inside the meeting room, or so I am told - I wasn't there).

Metro Justice and Norm have no love for one another, so I'm not surprised. MJ wants Democracy Now on public radio and the management of WXXI has drawn a line in the sand with their absolute refusal to run it. It isn't going to matter how many people show up to protest. And WXXI is correct if they've told you they are not a community radio station. They haven't been for sometime. WGMC and WRUR are more "community" than WXXI is these days.

And yes, I once worked for them. Dreadful. The Walmart of local broadcasters. Strictly sweat shop. Norm needs his big salary.

As I've written before, once you visit their headquarters, you'll never pledge another dollar.
 
Element9 said:
Schadenfreude

For those of you who don't speak German, Schadenfreude it means: "Malicious or smug pleasure taken in somebody else’s misfortune."

What I stated was the truth. The fall book of 2003 showed WXXI-AM with a 3.4 rating 12+. I left in March of 2004 and in the winter book of 2004 the station dropped to a 1.9 share 12+. It's been over three years and WXXI-AM remains in the low 2 share range. This by no means is an ego trip on my part, but I can tell everyone who reads this that during my 14 years at that station I busted my a$$ to make sure that I did the most professional job I could and I could not have been happier that the book showed the AM station’s ratings were so high.

Now if you believe I get some sort of satisfaction out of this, or am being smug, then you don't know me. Besides it's not the people who do the actual work that should be concerned about the malaise in the station's ratings, but those who are in charge.

If you compare WXXI's ratings to WBFO, WBFO has more listeners. If you compared the amount of money raised during fundraising drives between WXXI and WAMC, WXXI averages around $110 thousand dollars; WAMC takes in over $700 thousand. The last time I looked Rochester had a larger population than Albany but yet an Albany public radio station pulls down several times the amount of money in a pledge drive than a station in a much larger market.

I pointed out, correctly, that Bob Smith, whom I consider a friend, is always mentioning how WXXI-AM averages a 3 share. That has not been the case in at least three years and I (in jest) pointed that out to him. I know that Bob gets my meaning; sorry others took it the wrong way.
 
Mark Giardina said:
Element9 said:
The last time I looked Rochester had a larger population than Albany but yet an Albany public radio station pulls down several times the amount of money in a pledge drive than a station in a much larger market.

If I'm not mistaken, Albany has a boatload of repeaters upstate and into at least 1 New England state. So, all things being equal........all things are not equal.
 
alw said:
If I'm not mistaken, Albany has a boatload of repeaters upstate and into at least 1 New England state. So, all things being equal........all things are not equal.
Yes that is very true. But most of those repeaters are from AM stations in smaller or rural markets. 1370 covers the Rochester metro area yet WAMC pulled in 700 grand to XXI's 100 grand. That says a lot right there.
 
Mark Giardina said:
Element9 said:
Schadenfreude


What I stated was the truth. The fall book of 2003 showed WXXI-AM with a 3.4 rating 12+. I left in March of 2004 and in the winter book of 2004 the station dropped to a 1.9 share 12+.
n the station's ratings, but those who are in charge.

Question for you.
Wasn't the 3.4 you cite in Fall/03 sort of a fluke??? I mean, what were the ratings in the books leading up to that?
Isn't 1.9 or 2.1 about what WXXI has traditionally pulled over the past 10 or 15 years?
Not trying to be pejorative here,...just asking
 
Kohoutek said:
Question for you.
Wasn't the 3.4 you cite in Fall/03 sort of a fluke??? I mean, what were the ratings in the books leading up to that?
Isn't 1.9 or 2.1 about what WXXI has traditionally pulled over the past 10 or 15 years?
Not trying to be pejorative here,...just asking

It is very possible that book was a fluke but there were other books over the years when I worked there that the station managed to obtain a 3 share. What was odd was the huge drop in ratings from Winter 03 to Spring 04. That is something I don't remember ever happening before. Normally the station's ratings stayed the same.
 
Getting back to the subject of "Democracy Now" airing in Rochester. If the Metro Justice folks want the show to be aired in the Flower City, perhaps they should take a different approach. Namely, give up on WXXI, and approach other stations in the market.
WRUR would have been a good station to air the show. But now that WXXI is more or less running the show there, it's not about to happen.
I doubt WGMC would be interested, since they pride themselves on playing great Jazz music without breaking for talk and news shows.
WITR is the closest thing Rochester has to a true "community" radio station (in my view anyway), so perhaps they would be willing to add the show to their lineup.
Or, as a last resort, MJ could do what Niagra Independent Media did, and lease the time to carry the show on a commercial station. I'm sure Entercom would sell them the time on 950.
Here in the Finger Lakes, I know the program has a huge following. So I don't see why the same woulnd't be true for Rochester.
 
JakeLongwell said:
Getting back to the subject of "Democracy Now" airing in Rochester. If the Metro Justice folks want the show to be aired in the Flower City, perhaps they should take a different approach. Namely, give up on WXXI, and approach other stations in the market.
WRUR would have been a good station to air the show. But now that WXXI is more or less running the show there, it's not about to happen.
I doubt WGMC would be interested, since they pride themselves on playing great Jazz music without breaking for talk and news shows.
WITR is the closest thing Rochester has to a true "community" radio station (in my view anyway), so perhaps they would be willing to add the show to their lineup.
Or, as a last resort, MJ could do what Niagra Independent Media did, and lease the time to carry the show on a commercial station. I'm sure Entercom would sell them the time on 950.
Here in the Finger Lakes, I know the program has a huge following. So I don't see why the same woulnd't be true for Rochester.
Here is another option for the Democracy Now advocates. Instead of wasting time trying to get on WXXI, WRUR or even WGMC, if they managed to raise the capital needed they could purchase 1330-AM. I read on this board that someone had completed the necessary paperwork for a station on that frequency and wants to sell it to a prospective buyer. The station would be located in the Town of Ontario in Wayne County. Granted the signal might not cover the metro Rochester area, but if the new owners started streaming their programming over the world-wide web, they could air not only Democracy Now but other programs of their choice. It's just a suggestion.
 
Here is another option for the Democracy Now advocates. Instead of wasting time trying to get on WXXI, WRUR or even WGMC, if they managed to raise the capital needed they could purchase 1330-AM. I read on this board that someone had completed the necessary paperwork for a station on that frequency and wants to sell it to a prospective buyer. The station would be located in the Town of Ontario in Wayne County. Granted the signal might not cover the metro Rochester area, but if the new owners started streaming their programming over the world-wide web, they could air not only Democracy Now but other programs of their choice. It's just a suggestion.

This leads me to a question I'm sure someone on this board can answer. If a program is all over the web in webcasts & podcasts why would anyone buy a radio station to broadcast it also? Is there any advantage to broadcasting it, probably to an audience that will not sustain the program, along with the webcastings? This question is not necessarily exclusively for "Democracy Now" but for any format/programming initiative. BTW "Democracy Now" is broadcast on Ch. 15 Public Access in Rochester at various times throughout the day.
 
This leads me to a question I'm sure someone on this board can answer. If a program is all over the web in webcasts & podcasts why would anyone buy a radio station to broadcast it also? Is there any advantage to broadcasting it, probably to an audience that will not sustain the program, along with the webcastings? This question is not necessarily exclusively for "Democracy Now" but for any format/programming initiative. BTW "Democracy Now" is broadcast on Ch. 15 Public Access in Rochester at various times throughout the day.

Well, why broadcast anything over the radio if you can get the same or similiar programming over the web or podcasts? You can download your favorite music, often for free, from the web so why listen to the local station that plays your kind of music.

Right now, Ipods and Podcasting are fairly new. That may change will. Also many people(including me) still have dial up connection. Downloading a one hour podcast would take time, even if it's spoken word programming(such as Democracy Now). Radio's big advantage(as of right now) is that it's easy and portable.

Democracy Now is speciality programming, to be sure. But it has a small, but very strong local base. They would sustain the program, that's for sure. They already have a war chest. There is a strong passion to get DN on the air locally. Ask Norm Silverstein about the tons of postcards Metro Justice tried to present to him from local DN supporters(of course, since WXXI is on record as saying 1370AM/WXXI is not a community radio station he did not have to give MJ supporters the time of day). In a City Newspaper interview, Norm also accused MJ of telling it's members to spam him on the WXXI website(though there are no records of MJ members trying to sell him discount rx drugs, stock tips or other promotions of a dubious nature).
 
raymond_shaw said:
Ask Norm Silverstein about the tons of postcards Metro Justice tried to present to him from local DN supporters(of course, since WXXI is on record as saying 1370AM/WXXI is not a community radio station he did not have to give MJ supporters the time of day). In a City Newspaper interview, Norm also accused MJ of telling it's members to spam him on the WXXI website(though there are no records of MJ members trying to sell him discount rx drugs, stock tips or other promotions of a dubious nature).
This is ironic that I am sticking up for Silverstein but in all fairness WXXI was threatened by a group, I am not sure which one, that unless WXXI carried Democracy Now, this group would petition the FCC to have the station's license revoked. Now if that is not intimidation I don't know what is. From what I was informed other public broadcasting stations across the country that refused to carry Democracy Now were also threatened in the same manner.
So there is two sides to each coin, if you know what I am saying?
 
Mark_Giardina said:
raymond_shaw said:
This is ironic that I am sticking up for Silverstein but in all fairness WXXI was threatened by a group, I am not sure which one, that unless WXXI carried Democracy Now, this group would petition the FCC to have the station's license revoked.

But also let's be fair about the fact said letters would go straight into the round file at the corner of the desk during license renewal time. I don't know anything about this particular part of the 'campaign,' but it would be wholly ineffective to attempt to blackmail a station to get a show on the air.
 
Phillip Dampier said:
But also let's be fair about the fact said letters would go straight into the round file at the corner of the desk during license renewal time. I don't know anything about this particular part of the 'campaign,' but it would be wholly ineffective to attempt to blackmail a station to get a show on the air.

Oh I am in total agreement with you Phil that a letter-writing campaign for Democracy Now would not have changed the minds of management. But using a tactic, which I consider to be blackmail, isn't the answer either.

Here is what I would have suggested to the Democracy Now people. If they are regular contributors to WXXI, they should have combined their donations into one large sum of money and said to Silverstein we are willing to underwrite this program so find a place for this program on either WXXI or WRUR. If not, then we will donate the money to another not-for-profit agency.

Remember its green power that counts. Hey if it wasn't for one local billionaire, WXXI would still be trying to raise money for their HDTV campaign.
 
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