Rush moves to 106.9, Monday, June 25th

[Bill_W]

It's on IQ's website.

 

[jhguthlac]

Given this is the Philadelphia market, it will be Fall before the listeners catch up with this move!

 

[DaveWilliams]

It will be interesting to see if the listeners go with him with the move. What happens then if they don't?.

 

[Krazyjoe]

It will be interesting to see if the listeners go with him with the move. What happens then if they don't?.

He's the number one most listened to show in America, and the last good host WPHT has left. The listeners will follow him. And WPHT will sink like the Titanic.

 

[Robbien]

They will. His audience is loyal to him. Like Stern's is to him. They won't stay for Smerco, they'll listen to Dom and then go to 106.9. The question will be whether they come back to 1210 after to listen to Buzz Bissinger or stay for Hannity who is God awful? But given what little I know about BB, other than he was a journalist for the Inquirer, he is probably more to the left if Smerco is saying he's thrilled about this. So I think that says all you need to know about which direction pht is going. The new Air America of Philly?

 

[pab]

He's the number one most listened to show in America

Debatable, but even if he is, he's NOT the most listened to in Philadelphia. There's a reason it took until 1991 to clear Limbaugh in Philly at all; the demographics and political breakdown of this market are tricky for him.

Merlin is making the same mistake you are making: treating Philadelphia like it's like every other market. Each market is different and unique.

 

[musichead1029]

He's the number one most listened to show in America

Debatable,

Not. Audited numbers based on ratings have consistently put him at the top nationally. If you don't like that methodology, then there are no ratings for anybody national.

but even if he is, he's NOT the most listened to in Philadelphia.

Source? Who is the most listened to talker in Philly?

There's a reason it took until 1991 to clear Limbaugh in Philly at all

Yeah, cloistered DB management thought shows had to be local to succeed until they noticed the audiences for the small AMers in the suburbs carrying Limbaugh (and WABC appearing in the Philly numbers). Guess they hadn't looked at Stern's numbers in his first 5 years here in morning drive either. He'd been number 2 or 1 in mornings for a few years. From New York. And I'm sure Premiere cut them a nice deal for the initial contract. But DB renewed for the second contract. They only relinquished Limbaugh when they decided to go cheap and CBS decided to bring 1210 back to prominence after a decade of neglect. DB was gone a year later. History is about to repeat.

the demographics and political breakdown of this market are tricky for him.

Typically in the lower half of the top 10 rated stations in Philly, WWDB shot into the top 3 immediately after picking up Limbaugh. Didn't seem that tricky for them. Surprising to DB management maybe.

Merlin is making the same mistake you are making: treating Philadelphia like it's like every other market. Each market is different and unique.

It's a cheap bet for them to place. They bought obscure 106.9 for a realistic price and they have the pick of top flight syndicated talk. Even if it doesn't ignite, it'll cost a fraction of the New York and Chicago debacles. And they'll have Limbaugh to brand whatever they end up with. PHT has no brand now, and likely no future in talk. With diminishing options for AM, I don't see how CBS comes out of this without serious losses. Even Philly doesn't need a 3rd Sports outlet, and it would be the only one without an FM presence. They could trimulcast with IP and broker out the remainder of the schedule, but there'd be little chance of 1210 being a viable station ever again. They had little competition after signing back on in the late 90s after years in the wilderness. Not today.

 

[aindik]

Source? Who is the most listened to talker in Philly?

If I had to, I'm guessing it's Preston & Steve going away.

 

[pab]

but even if he is, he's NOT the most listened to in Philadelphia.

Source? Who is the most listened to talker in Philly?

Question was not "talker," question was "show." Other shows routinely outpull Rush in Philly and always have.

the demographics and political breakdown of this market are tricky for him.

Typically in the lower half of the top 10 rated stations in Philly, WWDB shot into the top 3 immediately after picking up Limbaugh. Didn't seem that tricky for them. Surprising to DB management maybe.

And where is WPHT with Rush today? Fifteenth place. This is the first book that they actually beat WHYY-FM, and that was by a nose.

Also remember that Rush's audience is aging. His numbers put him well outside the money demo nowadays.

Merlin is making the same mistake you are making: treating Philadelphia like it's like every other market. Each market is different and unique.

It's a cheap bet for them to place. They bought obscure 106.9 for a realistic price and they have the pick of top flight syndicated talk. Even if it doesn't ignite, it'll cost a fraction of the New York and Chicago debacles. And they'll have Limbaugh to brand whatever they end up with. PHT has no brand now, and likely no future in talk. With diminishing options for AM, I don't see how CBS comes out of this without serious losses. Even Philly doesn't need a 3rd Sports outlet, and it would be the only one without an FM presence. They could trimulcast with IP and broker out the remainder of the schedule, but there'd be little chance of 1210 being a viable station ever again. They had little competition after signing back on in the late 90s after years in the wilderness. Not today.

WPHT needs major surgery to turn it around, I don't deny. But a hard rightward turn like is being done by WWIQ is not the answer. Discounting WIP-FM (which, with sports, goes after a different and younger audience) none of the stations running to the right of WPHT beat them in the ratings. In fact, none of them got enough listeners (a .1) to even chart.

If you're going to take on an existing format you only divide up the numbers that are already there. The combined ratings for conservative talk in Philadelphia are 3.0. You are not going to get the 4 rating you need to break the top 10 magically because you pick up Rush and add two shows that already failed in Philadelphia.

My prediction? WPHT's numbers don't fall below 2.0. And once you're out of the first quarter or so, where you have curiosity fueling people tuning in, WWIQ's numbers plunge into the basement. Maybe the election will keep them in the top 15, but I doubt it. By January, they'll be lucky to be pulling a 1.0.

 

[badjef]

He's the number one most listened to show in America

Debatable, but even if he is, he's NOT the most listened to in Philadelphia. There's a reason it took until 1991 to clear Limbaugh in Philly at all; the demographics and political breakdown of this market are tricky for him.

Merlin is making the same mistake you are making: treating Philadelphia like it's like every other market. Each market is different and unique.

It is not debatable when you look at the number of stations, the number of listeners, and the longevity of each.

Philly is a clueless market. For a City with so much cultural history, most of the PC crowd is attempting to deny the good aspects of this Country. It would not surprise me if his ratings are not reflective of most other markets.

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[radiophiler]

Here are some interesting Arbitron numbers, courtesy of DCRTV.com, regarding WMAL in Washington, DC, which added a full market signal FM simulcast last year.

Overall, WMAL is 18th in the market. The only FMs that rank lower are a sports talker, out of market signals (suburban DC and Baltimore FMs), CBS's new all-newser and a religious FM.

In their dayparts, the local morning show ranks 15th; Rush ranks 16th; and Hannity ranks 16th.

WMAL had a rich history for many years as a news and talk station. IQ is starting from scratch.

So the question is: What does IQ have going for it that WMAL doesn't? As posted elsewhere, if anything, Philadelphia has been more adverse to Rush and his syndicated conservative talk cohorts than other markets. It was the LAST top 50 market to clear Rush on a major all-market signal. Beck and Hannity have been missing from the market for months.

It's not 1995 anymore. Rush doesn't have the draw he had then.

IQ has an incredible uphill battle ahead.

 

[musichead1029]

WMAL had a rich history for many years as a news and talk station. IQ is starting from scratch.

WMAL is a Cumulus station which, like WABC, has chopped away at its budget over the years and split up a formerly successful morning show to save money (veteran Andy Parks now does an entertaining afternoon show in tandem with Washington Times correspondents on 730 WTNT). They flushed their most recent morning co-host after she declined to develop a syndicated show in a few days without a support staff. And Washington is another difficult market for talk and for AM. News WTOP departed for FM with notable results a few years ago. WMAL's move to FM was probably smart given the difficulty of AMs covering the whole market. Whether or not they settle on a morning show may determine whether or not they gain some more traction. Meanwhile, the remainder of the talk talent is strewn accross several AMs with compromised power and/or signals. And the NPR outlet is often number 1. This is Washington. That said, WMAL essentially runs Cumulus' lineup and Limbaugh, Hannity and Levin (the FM side tried Imus back in an Oldies incarnation to no avail), so their costs are built in. And CBS has brought in a new FM all-news competitor to WTOP which has yet to make a ratings splash. It takes time.

So the question is: What does IQ have going for it that WMAL doesn't? As posted elsewhere, if anything, Philadelphia has been more adverse to Rush and his syndicated conservative talk cohorts than other markets. It was the LAST top 50 market to clear Rush on a major all-market signal. Beck and Hannity have been missing from the market for months.

As discussed earlier, Rush made a late debut in Philly because WWDB's programmers had their heads 'insulated from reality' for awhile. Once they belatedly added Limbaugh, the ratings soared. CBS cut the other two Premiere shows because they thought they could sell cheaper local shows. But they'd better have a sales staff that can shop low numbers.

It's not 1995 anymore. Rush doesn't have the draw he had then.

That's true, but no one has come along to replace him. The younger skewing lifestyle "hot" talk formats have failed to draw a significant audience in just about every market where they've been tried. You can only have so many low-rated sports stations in a market (DC has 3). Conservative talk is the strain of the format that continues to draw consistent numbers. Whether or not it needs younger hosts with more variety in delivery is open for debate.

IQ has an incredible uphill battle ahead.

Maybe, but it won't be due to competition or lack of programming. PHT's ratings will be Phillies dependent now that their schedule is full of undistinguished talent with no one but Dom and the shell of Smerconish as names. WNTP doesn't compete in the same arena as other talkers. That leaves 106.9. If they can establish a compelling news-talk morning show and use the cream of the syndicated crop for the remainder of the day, their costs will be low and the potential for revenue good. I think there are still enough advertisers who are savvy to the manufactured 'boycotts' that pop up from time to time when a liberal dunk tank get's it underwear bunched, that there is revenue to be had. That plus the FM advantage makes it likely, if not a sure thing, that IQ will be one of Merlin's more profitable ventures (how are the Chicago music stations doing?).

IQ should give us an indication of whether a single talker with a good lineup can thrive in Philly. PHT has always been compromised by either the Phillies or cheap programming decisions (Imus for years). IQ has a clear field to establish whether Philadelphia is really a 'special' market or whether its predecessors were just not up to programming the format to its best advantage.

 

[DToTheJ]

... that says all you need to know about which direction pht is going. The new Air America of Philly?

You write as if Philly actually had an Air America affiliate. It was actually a station in the Poconos - but Air America considered it a Philly clearance on their website.

 

[musichead1029]

...and a brief (6 months) lease of WHAT's noon to 6pm block for Franken & Rhodes. To negligible ratings, plus it dragged down the rest of WHAT's urban format. HAT was sold shortly thereafter (for $5M to try 'alternative' rock on AM) Franken of course sequed into elected office. Rhodes is now syndicated by Premiere, though she's still heard on only a handful of liberal talk outlets.

 

[rdcuffpa1]

It's not 1995 anymore. Rush doesn't have the draw he had then.

IQ has an incredible uphill battle ahead.

I've stayed on the outside of the discussion but I think that's the most salient point. Rush and his market are aging. He'll get a bump by switching to FM, but it won't be a seismic shift.

WPHT won't be saved by the Phillies- only the 45,000 in the stadium care on a given night that WPHT has the game...because they do so without any IBOC delay.

WPHT will likely go the way of WWKB in Buffalo - a 50 kW signal that has a (relatively) low-performing progressive-talk ("Air America") format that Entercom owns only because it doesn't want to lose the frequency to a competitor that could then lure away the content airing on Entercom's WBEN (AM).

In Buffalo, it somewhat surprises me that Entercom is more interested in wasting the kW at WWKB than selling the station and pocketing the cash, but it appears you make more money by blocking competition and wasting a signal than you do by selling a moribund station and letting someone else have a go. But that appears to be the problem of radio (especially AM radio) overall nowadays.

As with WWKB, the radio purist in me thinks it's a shame to waste an ND 50kW clear channel slot this way...you would think even an updated "Music of your Life" a la Toronto's AM 740 / CFZM format would do better.

Richard in Allentown

 

[Robbien]

Assuming the 45,000 in the stadium are actually listening to the radio while they are the game. Are they?

 

[aindik]

Assuming the 45,000 in the stadium are actually listening to the radio while they are the game. Are they?

When I'm there, I am. Most of the other people are not.

Unless listening over the PA while you're in the concourse buying food counts.

 

[DG02816]

Richard,

WWKB is directional at all times with one pattern :

http://fccinfo.com/CMDProEngine.php...bSearchType=Appl&sAppIDNumber=314204&sHours=U .

I do agree that a CFZM-type of format on a station here would be a welcome addition.

 

[rdcuffpa1]

Richard,

WWKB is directional at all times with one pattern :

Yeah, I knew that...the ND reference was specific to WPHT and my grammar was sloppy. But still it's sad when a 24/7 50 kW signal becomes a pawn in a turf war.

R in A

 

[RadioVeep]

Even in 2012 Rushstill has a draw and it will br strongest this election cycle. I think WWIQ will come out of the box with a 1, which will be an incredible debut. In a year they will force WPHT to FM.