Spring 07 Part 2 Ratings are out

[Parttimer]

I see O&A as the main problem with the whole thing. They haven't had any success at all outside of NY, have they?

 

[Pratte4Life]

I think they had to be popular in Philadelphia- because I went out there for a concert in 2002 or 2003 and could not get over the amount of W.O.W. bumper stickers I saw.

 

[feeball]

I see O&A as the main problem with the whole thing. They haven't had any success at all outside of NY, have they?

O&A is the furthest thing from being the problem with The Zone. I once said many times that Kidd Chris was the main problem at K Rock and I still stand on that one. True Roth brought the numbers way down and O&A were not (nor could not) be expected to perform the greatest miracle ever in terrestrial radio. But what does CBS Radio do when the books come out and show a slight rebound, they force Kidd Chris into a market that did not want him and into a market he did not want to broadcast from.

As far as O&A's popularity, New York, Boston, Philadelphia, and to a lesser degree Cleveland who airs the show in the afternoons and gets good ratings have been solid O&A territories since the WNEW days. As for Pittsburgh, they should have went local mornings when Howard joined Sirius. Aside from Howard Stern, how many other syndicated morning shows have even finished in the top 15 in the market? Did Bob and Tom when they were on WRRK? Jim Quinn originates from Pittsburgh so he does not count. What about Imus or Mike and Mike on ESPN Radio? Pittsburgh radio will always be more successful if mornings are locally driven.

 

[Radio_Realist]

Pittsburgh radio will always be more successful if mornings are locally driven.

I didn't realize that Stern was a failure when he was on terrestrial radio. It always struck me that a good show attracts more listeners than a bad show, regardless of where the show originates. I've never heard anything about Opie and Anthony that made me want to tune in and sample them, but I would assume that if their ratings aren't good, it's because their show isn't particularly good.

I'll agree that a good local show beats a bad syndicated show. The 'DVE Morning Show isn't as good as it used to be, but it's still better than most other morning shows.

I also realize that I sound like a broken record on this subject, but if I didn't hang out in this internet forum, I wouldn't even know that Opie and Anthony were on the air in Pittsburgh, let alone what station they're on. I don't care how good a show is, if you expect people to tune you station in because some mysterious cosmic force causes them to suddenly retune thier radios, you expect something that ain't gonna happen.

Morning Drive Time show succeed because people listen to them in their cars while commuting to work. If your station has sucked for so long that almost no one has a preset button on their car radio set to your station, those listeners are never going to check out what new but secret programming you're offering.

 

[feeball]

I didn't realize that Stern was a failure when he was on terrestrial radio.

Actually I did not say that Stern was a failure in my original post. I asked aside from Stern, can anybody name another out-of-market syndicated morning show that aired in Pittsburgh that even cracked the top 15 shows in the market?

I think of Bob and Tom on WRRK pre-Bob FM, Mike and Mike on WEAE, as well as Don Imus on another AM radio station in Pittsburgh and even though these shows have done well in other markets, they are barely traceable.

Like you said if you didn't go to these boards, you probably would not know about O&A. If the old WRRK (back then Channel 97) did not advertise heavily during ABC's Monday Night Football, I would have never known that Bob and Tom were in the market.

 

[kenhawk1160]

Pittsburgh radio will always be more successful if mornings are locally driven.

I partially agree with that. It also has to be entertaining. If all it is is local, then it's going to get beat.

 

[corporateradiosucks]

I actually like the "we fired Bob" bit. I've always felt that the Bob stuff was the biggest negative about that particular presentation.

Not sure how you could manage all-requests-all-the-time, because there has to be SOME consistency for people to want to tune in. If McDonalds menu was pot luck everyday and you never knew what you were going to get (even though all of the items on the menu were foods that SOMEONE likes), how do you think they'd fare?

The problem with "playing what the listeners like" as a blanket statement is no two are alike. So how do you figure out what the listeners like? Maybe do some research? A music test? Nah, too corporate. Let's just take random phone calls. The people who have time to call in all the time for songs are the ones our advertisers want to reach anyway, right?

WQZS in Meyersdale (near Somerset) was all requests all the time when they first started, and they weren't faking it. You know they're not faking it when they play "Angel" by Aerosmith every hour on the hour because some dude keeps calling in and requesting it.

They got rid of it not because it wasn't successful, but because they didn't have the manpower.

Oh, and this was well before cell phones that everyone had with them all the time. All request (if you really did it) would kill people now.

 

[Radio_Realist]

All request (if you really did it) would kill people now.

That's why the "all request" promo should be about as real as the existence of an actual person named "Bob". However, since I made my last post about that, I had another idea. Set up a voice-mail system for requests. Every request call would go to voice-mail, and you could have some intern retreive the requests every day or so. '

 

[Parttimer]

All request (if you really did it) would kill people now.

That's why the "all request" promo should be about as real as the existence of an actual person named "Bob". However, since I made my last post about that, I had another idea. Set up a voice-mail system for requests. Every request call would go to voice-mail, and you could have some intern retreive the requests every day or so. '

Like Sirius does it....

I think Mike & Mike on ESPN might be the one other syndicated morning show that has done OK. ESPN does a good job of getting them into the market for appearances and live broadcasts.

I always thought Lex & Terry actually would have been a far better choice for RRK than Bob & Tom were. Edgier content, no canned laugh track, and one of them was from Pittsburgh. I have a friend (who was a Pittsburgh PD and now runs another big market) who thought John Boy & Billy would have played well (wrestling and NASCAR, could have given the Madden crowd a run for their money).

 

[feeball]

I always thought Lex & Terry actually would have been a far better choice for RRK than Bob & Tom were. Edgier content, no canned laugh track, and one of them was from Pittsburgh. I have a friend (who was a Pittsburgh PD and now runs another big market) who thought John Boy & Billy would have played well (wrestling and NASCAR, could have given the Madden crowd a run for their money).

I still think Lex and Terry will end up in Pittsburgh, especially if the X would go back to a syndicated show. Lex and Terry should have a bigger syndicated audience than they currently have. I have an issue with Clear Channel cramming Bob and Tom down people's throats. If you ever go through the Cleveland/Akron area, B&T are on two stations and it's a freakin' nightmare for anyone writing in the diaries. It's one of those, "did I listen to WRQK or WMMS?" This is one of the stupidest moves I have ever seen a company make.

As for John Boy and Billy, I don't know where they would do their show from in Pittsburgh. The big issue with JB&B is that they attract too much of the "redneck" crowd. It could work on a country station or a traditional classic rock format, but it would be like fingernails on a chalk board on an active rocker or any other format.

 

[Parttimer]

As for John Boy and Billy, I don't know where they would do their show from in Pittsburgh. The big issue with JB&B is that they attract too much of the "redneck" crowd. It could work on a country station or a traditional classic rock format, but it would be like fingernails on a chalk board on an active rocker or any other format.

And WRRK was also where it was thought they would work They also feed a country version of their show with appropriate music for the format (if the Frogs ever lost Jimmy?)

 

[feeball]

WRRK was classic rock enough back then that it could have worked. It would have been a better than Bob and Tom especially if they could have had a deal with PRN for Nascar coverage.

I don't know why I think Lex and Terry would work well on the X, I just have one of those feelings that their show can draw better numbers than Allen Cox or Tim Benz ever did. They would do well, but they still would not get the numbers the X had with Howard Stern.

Just my thoughts, and they can be wrong. But we won't know because we will probably never hear it or see it happen.

 

[Pratte4Life]

For what it's worth, John Boy and Billy WERE carried in Pittsburgh in the early part of the decade on WBGG (then "The Burgh," now "FOX Sports 970").

Every Sunday morning JB & B did a specialized and syndicated NASCAR show. It would have the week's news, some interviews with NASCAR figures, and a bunch of their comedy bits.

I believe it was a part of the FOX network programming, but I can't swear to that.

It was unquestionably a Southern Fried morning show- one where nobody in Shadyside was going to listen to it- so perhaps that's why WBGG never gave it any promos.

But I think the people in the Mon Valley from Pleasant Hills on South would have gotten up early and gathered around their radios for two hours to listen to it.

 

[Snafu]

JB&B were here pre Fox. The show was actually syndicated by MRN and was worse than awful. The France family couldn't wait to pull it. I am sure that it didn't make it to the last race of the season in Atlanta.

JB&B would die in this market faster than you could put up the billboards. Part of the reason country can't dominate in this market is that this stereotype is still alive and well out there that says country listeners have an IQ of 3, 4 teeth, 5 cars up on blocks out front, 6 huntin' dogs, 7 pair of blue jeans and the #8 on everything else they own. Play into that stereotype in this market and your numbers will be on the bottom of the Mon with the B-25.

 

[feeball]

JB&B were here pre Fox. The show was actually syndicated by MRN and was worse than awful. The France family couldn't wait to pull it. I am sure that it didn't make it to the last race of the season in Atlanta.

JB&B would die in this market faster than you could put up the billboards. Part of the reason country can't dominate in this market is that this stereotype is still alive and well out there that says country listeners have an IQ of 3, 4 teeth, 5 cars up on blocks out front, 6 huntin' dogs, 7 pair of blue jeans and the #8 on everything else they own. Play into that stereotype in this market and your numbers will be on the bottom of the Mon with the B-25.

Define dominate the market?

Last I checked one of the top stations in the market is Y108. If it's a thing about the quantity of country stations being in the top 10, then of course not. The top 10 stations in this market are about as different as night and day. There's a heritage rocker, news talk, country, classic hits, soft rock, poli-talk, variety (or adult hits), urban, adult standards, and CHR. Pittsburgh has no real dominant format but has a great variety in dominant stations.

Closest thing Pittsburgh has to a dominant format is in the amount of Soft Rock/AC stations and based on what Star has been doing, that number might decrease soon. I don't include Froggy in the country equation in Pittsburgh since some of those stations are out of East Liverpool, Steubenville, etc. and only simulcast from whatever local Froggy station is in Pittsburgh.

 

[Interested Observer]

Part of the reason country can't dominate in this market is that this stereotype is still alive and well out there that says country listeners have an IQ of 3, 4 teeth, 5 cars up on blocks out front, 6 huntin' dogs, 7 pair of blue jeans and the #8 on everything else they own.

Define dominate the market?

Last I checked one of the top stations in the market is Y108. If it's a thing about the quantity of country stations being in the top 10, then of course not. The top 10 stations in this market are about as different as night and day. There's a heritage rocker, news talk, country, classic hits, soft rock, poli-talk, variety (or adult hits), urban, adult standards, and CHR. Pittsburgh has no real dominant format but has a great variety in dominant stations.

Closest thing Pittsburgh has to a dominant format is in the amount of Soft Rock/AC stations and based on what Star has been doing, that number might decrease soon. I don't include Froggy in the country equation in Pittsburgh since some of those stations are out of East Liverpool, Steubenville, etc. and only simulcast from whatever local Froggy station is in Pittsburgh.

I agree and disagree with you feeball. I agree in the fact that country is as dominant as any format in this market, but I disagree about not counting the Froggy numbers. Granted, they are on the fringe but their numbers count in the market as much as anyone else's despite where they are located. Add them all together, and you get a pretty dominant number for the market.

As for the stereotype of the country listener Snafu, have you ever been to a country concert? There are all walks of life out there. As a mater of fact, the biggest audiences out at Starlake are country concerts. Toby Keith was the lead draw out there for several years over any and all formats.

 

[Pratte4Life]

Conventional wisdom is country has picked up a lot of listeners during the past 20 years because of the rise of rap.

Today's country is much, much more mainstream.

 

[Parttimer]

If Skynyrd and the Eagles came down the pike today they'd be considered country acts.

 

[feeball]

Part of the reason country can't dominate in this market is that this stereotype is still alive and well out there that says country listeners have an IQ of 3, 4 teeth, 5 cars up on blocks out front, 6 huntin' dogs, 7 pair of blue jeans and the #8 on everything else they own.

Define dominate the market?

Last I checked one of the top stations in the market is Y108. If it's a thing about the quantity of country stations being in the top 10, then of course not. The top 10 stations in this market are about as different as night and day. There's a heritage rocker, news talk, country, classic hits, soft rock, poli-talk, variety (or adult hits), urban, adult standards, and CHR. Pittsburgh has no real dominant format but has a great variety in dominant stations.

Closest thing Pittsburgh has to a dominant format is in the amount of Soft Rock/AC stations and based on what Star has been doing, that number might decrease soon. I don't include Froggy in the country equation in Pittsburgh since some of those stations are out of East Liverpool, Steubenville, etc. and only simulcast from whatever local Froggy station is in Pittsburgh.

I agree and disagree with you feeball. I agree in the fact that country is as dominant as any format in this market, but I disagree about not counting the Froggy numbers. Granted, they are on the fringe but their numbers count in the market as much as anyone else's despite where they are located. Add them all together, and you get a pretty dominant number for the market.

As for the stereotype of the country listener Snafu, have you ever been to a country concert? There are all walks of life out there. As a mater of fact, the biggest audiences out at Starlake are country concerts. Toby Keith was the lead draw out there for several years over any and all formats.

Only issue with Froggy is that the same station is simulcast on five or six different frequencies. If the same thing was done with Y108, the numbers would be weakened as well. If there was just one Froggy station out there, the numbers would be a lot different.

If Skynyrd and the Eagles came down the pike today they'd be considered country acts.

For whatever reason, I was thinking of Jimmy Buffet and Sammy Hagar (yes that Sammy Hagar) leaning more into the country waters these days.

 

[Pratte4Life]

So is Bret Michaels of Poison.