Summer Phase II numbers

[Raymond]

Some months back, it was rumored, that CC issued an edict of sorts, limiting jock 'patter' to 20 secs max. In addition, more 'no-talk' segs were added. The idea is, with PPM, call letters, jingles, etc are not needed. Add to that, the fact that clutter is the enemy of good PPM results. All of this may, in part, explain the change in approach.....I'm just sayin'.......As far as the 'less exciting' part is concerned, you're preaching to the choir here. I guess there's a lot I don't understand (lol)....however, it is difficult to argue with success.

You are correct John. I have a few friends over there and that is exactly what happened. Top that with some very bad automation, and it's not the upbeat station we knew and loved. Has anybody else noticed how some songs play out all the way til the end and some burp start at the beginning?

I'll also chime in here, if you'll indulge me. When 3WS was owned by Shamrock, they were EVERYWHERE. Very promotion intensive, and heck, they had a listeners' club even before email existed! Now everyone has them because they can be done cheaply through the station's websites. They also had a cooperative agreement where you could buy their gear at Sears. As a listener, you really felt like you were a part of the station. You don't have that anymore.

That's because 3ws has different management. They are not a priority within the cluster. Resources are not put forth in the capacity they use to. I think old management knew what the station is all about and the one now doesn't pay attention to the station as they should. You also have to remember, what we all think 3ws is was 15 years ago. Today, a whole new management scene.

Clarke, I sense you would've managed the station much differently than Gene Romano. Thus, DVE light as the nickname of 3ws. 3ws was stripped of its fun.

 

[cingram]

Some months back, it was rumored, that CC issued an edict of sorts, limiting jock 'patter' to 20 secs max. In addition, more 'no-talk' segs were added. The idea is, with PPM, call letters, jingles, etc are not needed. Add to that, the fact that clutter is the enemy of good PPM results. All of this may, in part, explain the change in approach ...

So...what you're saying is that the PPM, which was supposed to prove that "content is king," and make PDs important again, is instead, going to make radio even more boring.

Great.

I guess there's a lot I don't understand (lol)....however, it is difficult to argue with success.

Depends on the reason for success. Is 3WS doing well because it's a better radio station, or is it doing well because its listeners really have no other choice than WJPA or the Pickle? KDKA was a dominant station for years, much of it apparently by inertia.

And so it goes.

C.

 

[cingram]

Clarke, I sense you would've managed the station much differently than Gene Romano. Thus, DVE light as the nickname of 3ws. 3ws was stripped of its fun.

It's really not my place to second-guess Gene Romano, who is now the Executive VP/Programming for all of Clear Channel, while I'm working at a couple of suburban AM stations.

But there was a time when we were equals, back in the day when I was PD of B94 and he was PD of DVE.

I congratulate him on his savvy, and his success.

And, yes, I would have managed 3WS differently.

C.

 

[kenhawk1160]

Is 3WS doing well because it's a better radio station, or is it doing well because its listeners really have no other choice than WJPA or the Pickle?

I think 'top of mind recall' plays a huge role in it. You have a roll-off-the-tongue moniker like 3WS that's not only formatically nondescript, but 27 years of market heritage.

 

[johnsummers]

Clarke,
Regarding your post above....not every big radio company has decided on this approach. The thing to do, I think, is to give 'em something every time you crack the mic, but make it brief. The old 'on and gone' is more imortant than ever. But you simply must have the fun and humanity coming through the speaker(s) or it becomes an I-Pod. Just an opinion. Luckily, both my company and PD agree. We'll see how PPM treats us on November 5th. Apparently, there is more than one way to skin a cat. But, one way is a lot more fun to hear than the other.

 

[cingram]

I think 'top of mind recall' plays a huge role in it. You have a roll-off-the-tongue moniker like 3WS that's not only formatically nondescript, but 27 years of market heritage.

I agree. 3WS, like DVE, wins at least partially on its heritage and longevity.

C.

 

[cingram]

Regarding your post above....not every big radio company has decided on this approach. The thing to do, I think, is to give 'em something every time you crack the mic, but make it brief. The old 'on and gone' is more imortant than ever. But you simply must have the fun and humanity coming through the speaker(s) or it becomes an I-Pod. Just an opinion. Luckily, both my company and PD agree. We'll see how PPM treats us on November 5th. Apparently, there is more than one way to skin a cat. But, one way is a lot more fun to hear than the other.

John, point out one Pittsburgh station that hasn't turned into an iPod.

Don't count the non-music stations, like WPGB, WORD-FM, and so on.

Don't count DVE -- they're an aberration. Don't count the suburbans.

Go ahead. I'll wait.

C.

 

[kenhawk1160]

The thing to do, I think, is to give 'em something every time you crack the mic, but make it brief. The old 'on and gone' is more imortant than ever. But you simply must have the fun and humanity coming through the speaker(s) or it becomes an I-Pod.

I agree, John. However, with the conglomerates that are voice-tracking dayparts, they're not having their talents do that. I personally voice-track my own shift, but we always have enough promotions going on, as well as the syndicated showprep and concert information that make everything relevant to what our listeners want to hear. I try to keep my breaks between 40 and 60 seconds (occasionally less), but everything I have to say has substance. I try to prep for about an hour beforehand, so that I can review the playlist and see what I can say that ties our music in with what we're doing. You don't have that with a structure where one talent voice-tracks five stations in five markets.

 

[johnsummers]

Clarke,
It would be quite a challenge to do what you ask, sadly. WDVE seems to be an aberration, but they still have to count in the 'plus' column. I've also heard a good amount of content on B94 and some on Kiss. However, when I'm visiting the 'burg, most of my time is spent on AM 770, so I may not be the best one to ask. ;D....

Kenhawk, it sounds like you're doing a great prep job for VT and I don't know if any of your stations are are rated using PPM, but in that world, unless it's enormously compelling, a :60 second break is too long, at least, that's what they (arb) tell us. I'll admit to doing it myself sometimes, especially if our traffic person gets involed etc....again, we'll see on Nov. 5th.

 

[Parttimer]

So if people are gone as soon as the music stops, what do we think can be done?

Maybe a lot more walking on intros and "less is more" style quick commercial messages? If you're getting feedback that even imaging causes people to tune out, do they perceive talking up an intro any differently?

Certainly the clocks with a "dark side of the moon" mega-break after a long music sweep are unworkable under these conditions.

 

[cingram]

It would be quite a challenge to do what you ask, sadly. WDVE seems to be an aberration, but they still have to count in the 'plus' column. I've also heard a good amount of content on B94 and some on Kiss. However, when I'm visiting the 'burg, most of my time is spent on AM 770, so I may not be the best one to ask.

WDVE is a unique station. I have a number of thoughts on 'DVE, most of which will never see the light of day.

B-94 and Kiss -- well, maybe. I think they're trying (although my definition of "trying" would likely be different than theirs) and I have not spent enough time with either station lately to be sure of where the live jocks end and the voice-tracking begins.

I find Pittsburgh radio awfully boring, and it's a shame, considering the long and storied history we have had of making great radio.

C.

 

[clangham]

I find Pittsburgh radio awfully boring, and it's a shame, considering the long and storied history we have had of making great radio.

C.

I agree on that 100% Clarke!

Radio is boring everywhere I have traveled to over the past few years, which includes all over PA, WV, VA, OH, NJ, NY.

The old days of real radio (jingles, posting, back tracking, 45's, 33's, cart machines, reel to reels, are gone! Plus the instant notification of late breaking events (severe weather, etc) by a live jock.
THOSE were the REAL days of radio!

 

[cingram]

The old days of real radio (jingles, posting, back tracking, 45's, 33's, cart machines, reel to reels, are gone! Plus the instant notification of late breaking events (severe weather, etc) by a live jock.
THOSE were the REAL days of radio!

I don't know if I miss the old days of 45's, 33's, carts, and reel-to-reel machines, although those are sometimes in play at 620/770.

What I do miss is content.

Here's 90% of today's content (not counting talk formats):

1. Let's talk about Da Stillers, again.

2. Let's read a liner card for a client.

3. Let's talk about sex, either the sex you're having, or the sex other people are having, or your private parts, or somebody else's private parts (or, if that doesn't work, let's read some celebrity gossip).

4. Let's play a sweeper.

5. Let's mock someone!

Bleh.

C.

 

[trefdawg]

;D WHAT WE NEED IS MORE STUFF LIKE THIS!!!!!!! ;D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Imh-HiSPaDE

 

[Boss Radio]

So now we're not programming to excite or entertain listeners, but rather to exploit the ratings methodology. Yikes.

 

[Parttimer]

To quote Saul Frischling, "If they're not giving me good ratings, what am I paying them for?"

 

[Raymond]

Here's 90% of today's content (not counting talk formats):

1. Let's talk about Da Stillers, again.

2. Let's read a liner card for a client.

3. Let's talk about sex, either the sex you're having, or the sex other people are having, or your private parts, or somebody else's private parts (or, if that doesn't work, let's read some celebrity gossip).

4. Let's play a sweeper.

5. Let's mock someone!

Bleh.

C.

What you just described is the DVE Morning show. I think the KISS morning show is like this, but less with the sexual content. They do make fun of others a lot. I haven't listened to the B lately, but would imagine they are along the lines of KISS, too.

Sad, really. Especially in the case of DVE, where I believe their morning show has dropped about 20 notches since Paulsen left a while back.

 

[Boss Radio]

To quote Saul Frischling, "If they're not giving me good ratings, what am I paying them for?"

I don't disagree with that. Radio was all about selling soap 60 years ago, too, but we just didn't realize it. Used to be that a good entertaing show brought ratings. Now it seems as though that's secondary to manipulating the PPM process.

 

[cingram]

So now we're not programming to excite or entertain listeners, but rather to exploit the ratings methodology. Yikes.

I am all for exploiting the ratings methodology (every station I programmed used the words "write it down" until Arbitron changed their rules) but it seems to me that if we excited and entertained the listeners, the ratings would surely follow.

C.

 

[MsMusicRadio]

Radio in Tampa may actually be worse than Pittsburgh, but Pittsburgh is catching up