Thank you, Oldies 103

[Garrett]

I liken WODS's seemingly limited playlist to going into Freindly's and ordering a vanilla ice cream cone. Many people like vanilla, it's safe, noncontroversial. But there are a lot of other flavors, some people ARE tired of the Doobies, the O'Jays etc. They've probably heard the same damn song 1K times or more.
I listened to their format last night for 30 min or so. Not 1 good song. Just the same tired old "hits."
My next car will have satelite, one can always give up the Starbucks or Dunken Donut coffee and use an antique called a thermos.

Actually, giving up DUNKIN'DONUTS is the third most difficult thing of living in the part of Texas that I am in.

 

[johnster]

Actually, giving up DUNKIN'DONUTS is the third most difficult thing of living in the part of Texas that I am in.

That should be your cue to get the franchise there.

 

[GovtMule1979]

Once you go PINK you never go back...try some Marylous Coffee... And just to stay on topic, it's a shame if kids can't use their seek butten and stumble across some old Buddy Holly, Chuck Berry, Fats Domino...ets.

 

[Ed101]

...
It is a throwback to great radio of the 50's & 60's. He plays it ALL!!!! Doo-wop, 50's, 60's & '70's rock & roll plus he takes requests and dedications on demand both by toll-free phone and via email. It doesn't seem that he has any playlists....just pick and play....its a breath of fresh air.

Even within its current format [late 60s - 70s] Oldies 103 is limited. As an example: when is the last time they played "Another Park Another Sunday" by the Doobies?

It seems to me that several years ago they at least played a "Barry Scott" Lost 45 once in a while during PM drive...

Even the original WZLX when it started out (Cream, Hendryx, The Who) used to play a "Hall of Famer" (Chuck Berry, Bo Diddley, etc...) once in a while.

 

[chitchatjf]

WODS's sister station WCBS-FM in New York admitted to the entire world that what they did three years ago was nothing short of stupid when they dumped the oldies. When they returned, they retooled the original 'CBS-FM format to include the 80's. But more than that, they never forgot the original sound of rock's first 10 years. It's doing quite well with a classic hit or two from the pre-Beatle era every hour. I know many people, not just radio geeks, under the age of 30 were happy as a clam to hear 'CBS-FM came back and they love it. I love the new 'CBS-FM/101.1 and listen to it quite often and also have WLS-FM 94.7 as a preset as well.

No doubt, Oldies 103.3 had to include the 80's to satisfy the younger demographics. But even with the younger demos, guaranteed they would not have any turn-offs if they threw in an upbeat pre-Beatles tune twice an hour, like what 'CBS-FM and the new WLS-FM are doing NOW. No "Teen Angel" stuff, no sad songs, just some really upbeat tunes that happen to be from the pre-Beatle era. You'd find that a lot of people with a lot of spending power would come back to WODS. I say, make it special and who knows, some of us Sirius listeners might venture back to FM and 103.3.

That is sort of what I have been saying. WODS should generally be a clone of CBS-FM.

 

[flaradiofan]

...
It is a throwback to great radio of the 50's & 60's. He plays it ALL!!!! Doo-wop, 50's, 60's & '70's rock & roll plus he takes requests and dedications on demand both by toll-free phone and via email. It doesn't seem that he has any playlists....just pick and play....its a breath of fresh air.

Even within its current format [late 60s - 70s] Oldies 103 is limited. As an example: when is the last time they played "Another Park Another Sunday" by the Doobies?

It seems to me that several years ago they at least played a "Barry Scott" Lost 45 once in a while during PM drive...

Even the original WZLX when it started out (Cream, Hendryx, The Who) used to play a "Hall of Famer" (Chuck Berry, Bo Diddley, etc...) once in a while.

WODS's sister station WCBS-FM in New York admitted to the entire world that what they did three years ago was nothing short of stupid when they dumped the oldies. When they returned, they retooled the original 'CBS-FM format to include the 80's. But more than that, they never forgot the original sound of rock's first 10 years. It's doing quite well with a classic hit or two from the pre-Beatle era every hour. I know many people, not just radio geeks, under the age of 30 were happy as a clam to hear 'CBS-FM came back and they love it. I love the new 'CBS-FM/101.1 and listen to it quite often and also have WLS-FM 94.7 as a preset as well.

No doubt, Oldies 103.3 had to include the 80's to satisfy the younger demographics. But even with the younger demos, guaranteed they would not have any turn-offs if they threw in an upbeat pre-Beatles tune twice an hour, like what 'CBS-FM and the new WLS-FM are doing NOW. No "Teen Angel" stuff, no sad songs, just some really upbeat tunes that happen to be from the pre-Beatle era. You'd find that a lot of people with a lot of spending power would come back to WODS. I say, make it special and who knows, some of us Sirius listeners might venture back to FM and 103.3.

You guys are right on the money! That's why I got hooked on this show on Saturday afternoons. Like many folks, I listen on the internet since this comes out of a station in Florida. Give it a listen at www.seaviewam960.com from 1-5PM Eastern Time on Saturdays. He plays literally thousands of songs from the first 20 or so years of rock & roll. I keep say thinking to myself while I am listening "I haven't heard that in so long and its a great song". I wish other stations would take a cue from this guy in Florida. Then maybe radio would be fun to listen to again.

 

[dumber than a box of hair]

Wrong, no one is expecting it to replace analog especially in the short run....it doesn't have to "take off". It's going to end up like a station web pages. (Have they "taken off"?) The HD technology that allows multiple streams and data will be there as an added benefit, added value, and an added place to make some money.....like a stations web page.

Wrong. How are you going to run the secondaries with no audience? Where's the money going to come from to defray programming costs?

Wrong, most stations aren't spending much money on HD...again, it's an ancillary service stations see for added value, bonus, promotion, time to sell.

Once again with feeling: How do you sell time on a stream with no listeners?

So was the demand for FM...until cars starting coming with it stock.

No car manufacturer is putting HD radios in as standard equipment. Some are offering it as optional equipment...and they're meeting with resounding apathy.

I'm also old enough to remember engineers complaing that the stereo pilot reduced coverage area. It's only a problem for DX-ers....and those listening outside of protected contours.

Wrong. Plenty of *documented* cases of interference are occurring within the interference-free nighttime contours of the stations being interfered with. The person who formally complained to the FCC is getting interference from a first-adjacent 50-kW HD station at a distance of 351 miles, and has already lost a substantial amount of local business at night because of it.

Wrong, they're back on.

Wrong, they're not.

 

[spilot113]

Wrong, no one is expecting it to replace analog especially in the short run....it doesn't have to "take off". It's going to end up like a station web pages. (Have they "taken off"?) The HD technology that allows multiple streams and data will be there as an added benefit, added value, and an added place to make some money.....like a stations web page.

Wrong. How are you going to run the secondaries with no audience? Where's the money going to come from to defray programming costs?

Wrong: There are almost no programming costs.

Wrong, most stations aren't spending much money on HD...again, it's an ancillary service stations see for added value, bonus, promotion, time to sell.

Once again with feeling: How do you sell time on a stream with no listeners?

Once again with business sense: It's called value added. Just like the thousands of other things that radio does. Again, you're expecting the secondary streams to turn into another radio station. It's not.

So was the demand for FM...until cars starting coming with it stock.

No car manufacturer is putting HD radios in as standard equipment. Some are offering it as optional equipment...and they're meeting with resounding apathy.

Would you like to be informed before you make such blanket incorrect statements?

Did you even read the USA Today article that was mentioned in this thread?

#1.) "Volvo is going to offer HD Radio standard on most models early next year."

#2.) For the others.....there are lots of things that are "options" that are ending up on the lot. Many dealers buy cars "loaded"...and the "XL" versions usually have all the options. Many of the "optional equiment" isn't chosen by the individual buyer. It's chosen by the dealer.

#3.) Many dealers will follow Volvo's lead in the years ahead.

I'm also old enough to remember engineers complaing that the stereo pilot reduced coverage area. It's only a problem for DX-ers....and those listening outside of protected contours.

Wrong. Plenty of *documented* cases of interference are occurring

Where's the documentation?

Simply lodging a "complaint" does not constitute any validity of the facts.

Again, there are plenty of radio-types complaining. No real uproar from listeners.

Wrong, they're back on.

Wrong, they're not.

Here's the quote I received from my source at ABC/Citadel when I asked about Citadel ordering all of it's AM stations to halt IBOC at night:

"Citadel recinded that...and most of their stations
are broadcasting IBOC/HD day and night..... "

 

[12 In a Row]

First off, Volvo like Audi, BMW, etc. account for less than 5% of U.S. sales.

If Toyota, Honda, Ford, GM were to offer it as standard equipment, HD might have a future.
The trickle down technology from high end to everyday car is 4-7 years.
Lets say it catches on, HD might be offered in the 2013 Ford Focus, sooner if the demand is high.
Factor in another 4-7 years, which is the average turnover time from present car to new.
Who knows, by then gasoline may be 10 bucks a gallon.

There is little or no demand for it. Consumers are looking for fuel efficent cars, not more toys.

 

[dumber than a box of hair]

Would you like to be informed before you make such blanket incorrect statements?

Did you even read the USA Today article that was mentioned in this thread?

#1.) "Volvo is going to offer HD Radio standard on most models early next year."

#2.) For the others.....there are lots of things that are "options" that are ending up on the lot. Many dealers buy cars "loaded"...and the "XL" versions usually have all the options. Many of the "optional equiment" isn't chosen by the individual buyer. It's chosen by the dealer.

#3.) Many dealers will follow Volvo's lead in the years ahead.

Citing USA Today as some sort of authority on the business world is a little like opening The Wall Street Journal to read the latest Hollywood gossip. USA Today's singluar talent in the business section is rewriting press releases. I know enough people in the car-selling business to know that car buyers aren't interested in HD. Stating that Volvo and BMW are setting a trend by offering HD radios, with vanishingly small market shares, is irrelevant. Further, given the terrible job radio is doing on educating the public as to what HD is all about, it can be accurately predicted that car HD radios will be returned in droves, once the driver experiences the short signal range of the HD1 signals and the abrupt drop-outs of the HD2s and HD3s with no analog signal to back them up.

Where's the documentation?

Simply lodging a "complaint" does not constitute any validity of the facts.

Again, there are plenty of radio-types complaining. No real uproar from listeners.

Just because you've never seen it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Besides the WYSL complaint to the FCC, backed by copious amounts of engineering data, the engineering message boards and remailers are full of them. These aren't DXers or AM-stereo freaks complaining. These are highly qualified and experienced engineers who can easily recognize when they're being snowed. It's no wonder that iBiquity markets HD directly to upper management, bypassing engineers.

Here's the quote I received from my source at ABC/Citadel when I asked about Citadel ordering all of it's AM stations to halt IBOC at night:

"Citadel recinded that...and most of their stations
are broadcasting IBOC/HD day and night..... "

My source at Citadel says the memo from Martin Stabbert was never rescinded.

 

[BRNout]

Here's the quote I received from my source at ABC/Citadel when I asked about Citadel ordering all of it's AM stations to halt IBOC at night:

"Citadel recinded that...and most of their stations
are broadcasting IBOC/HD day and night..... "

Maybe the small ones are, but stations like WABC, WJR and WLS are not broadcasting in HD at night. For which I am quite thankful.

CBS, on the other hand, has no problem obliterating much of the am dial between 1000 kHz and 1070 kHz with competing 50 kw stations that do blast the IBOC splatter all over the place. Stuff like this will kill off what's left of am's audience.

Argue what you will about the benefits of IBOC on FM, which involves weighing band interference versus benefit, but IBOC on AM is a dreadful mistake. Personally, I tend to side with Peter George in saying that a different technological standard should have been adopted; perhaps involving frequencies vacated with the switch to digital TV (a technology that has CLEAR benefits).

Also, 'dumber than a box of hair' is dead on about the time it's taking for HD Radio to take off. You cannot compare this with the advent of FM radio. Times have changed and so has the marketplace. Hot new technology evolves very rapidly now and consumers snap it up like crazy.

Do you watch Seinfeld reruns? That show is between 10 and 17 years old (not all that old), yet none of the main characters carried a cell phone until the very last episode. That's because cell phones were a luxury item back them...and were still twice as bulky as now. In the intervening time period, almost everyone has them and they now have a lot more applications (texting, music) than before. One decade made a profound difference when it came to that technology.

OTOH, we have HD Radio. Five years and hardly a peep. Consumers hear HD radio ads and yawn. Sorry guys, maybe some of you are too close to this business to be objective, but it's NOT taking off. There's no interest among the general public. They don't care to "upgrade" to an HD radio.

IF, the HD advocates manage to get HD radios put into a broad swath of cars - as standard equipment - over the next several years, then maybe a little interest may be developed. However, WiMax is coming on waaaay too fast and that actually does have some consumer interest. By the time a few consumers get an HD radio, chances are good that they'll be able to pick WiMax/internet radio instead. And, that one is a no-brainer. Not to mention that the under-30 crowd is far more comfortable with all things internet and not so much with "old fashioned" radio. So, on the whole, it doesn't look good for HD.

HD needed to take off about 10 years ago. With a big flourish. And, it might have. At that time. Now, it's too late. Too many other (more impressive) technologies are out there. It will NEVER take 20-30 years like FM stereo. As others have been so eager to point out here: times have changed.

So, if you want to make an analogy for HD radio, perhaps AM stereo is a better one. Except AM stereo didn't interfere with broadcasters and generally disrupt the broadcast bands in the way that HD does. It cost owners some money and was easily forgotten by most. HD will have done more damage than that.

Changing back to the original topic, I too find WODS' playlist to be too confined and also too heavy with lighter titles. The specialty shows are great and the jocks are top notch. But the music? Zzzzzzzzz. WBOQ's music is preferable for me. And, a lot of the 60s music is far better than what followed it in the 70s. It should be re-emphasized, as its good stuff. You cannot compare the 60s-70s time period with those before it (like standards) because this particular period of music manages to transcend the age barrier. A lot of younger people like the Beatles, the Stones, the Temptations and others. You cannot just do the "if you were 17 in 1966, you're out of the demo now" thing. That shows locked-in-the-box thinking. Gee, do you have the same logic for classical music? Would you say: "if you were 17 in 1755, you're 253 now and ads won't be effective on you"? Think about it.

History will show that the Baby Boomer generation will stand out as a unique cultural group that is not as easily brushed aside as its ancestors. The same will hold true of their music.

 

[dumber than a box of hair]

Hot new technology evolves very rapidly now and consumers snap it up like crazy.

Just one example makes the point: In the same amount of time that HD radio has been available, Apple sold apx. 68 million iPods (launched on 10/23/2001, cf. 2006-4th quarter). iBiquity won't release receiver sales figures, but the best industry guess I've seen in the trades is somewhere between 500,000 and one million so far. With 800 million analog radios in the hands of consumers (iBiquity's own estimate), there is a looooooooong way to go before HD makes any kind of dent...if it ever will.

 

[Keith321]

-

 

[spilot113]

Would you like to be informed before you make such blanket incorrect statements?

Did you even read the USA Today article that was mentioned in this thread?

#1.) "Volvo is going to offer HD Radio standard on most models early next year."

Citing USA Today as some sort of authority on the business world is a little like opening The Wall Street Journal to read the latest Hollywood gossip.

Did you or did you you not state definitively that "No car manufacturer is putting HD radios in as standard equipment. "

Is it not true that Volvo is offering it?

You were proven incorrect.

Did you even read the USA Today article that was mentioned in this thread?

I'm gonna guess the answer is no...

Where's the documentation?

Simply lodging a "complaint" does not constitute any validity of the facts.

Again, there are plenty of radio-types complaining. No real uproar from listeners.

Just because you've never seen it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Besides the WYSL complaint to the FCC, backed by copious amounts of engineering data....

WYSL is a 500 watter with a crazy directional pattern that barely reaches it's target area after dark.

The owner is delusional thinking he should get more coverage than he does.

So far the FCC has seen no validity in his claim.

Here's the quote I received from my source at ABC/Citadel when I asked about Citadel ordering all of it's AM stations to halt IBOC at night:

"Citadel recinded that...and most of their stations
are broadcasting IBOC/HD day and night..... "

My source at Citadel says the memo from Martin Stabbert was never rescinded.

If it wasn't rescinded...why are most of them back on?

Possibly your source is wrong.

(I posted a direct quote from the email I received.)

Maybe you should think about that before make more blatant errors.

 

[BRNout]

If it wasn't rescinded...why are most of them back on?

Possibly your source is wrong.

(I posted a direct quote from the email I received.)

Maybe you should think about that before make more blatant errors.

Again, Citadel's big AM flamethrowers are not broadcasting in HD at night. No matter what the memo says. Flip on an AM radio and check out 760, 770 and 890 and hear for yourself. When WJR and WABC were broadcasting in HD at night, they wiped each other out. And, they still flip off the exciter after dark. Maybe their smaller stations are back on (and they have lots of those), but the big ones are not.

 

[spilot113]

[q

If it wasn't rescinded...why are most of them back on?
Possibly your source is wrong.
(I posted a direct quote from the email I received.)

Again, Citadel's big AM flamethrowers are not broadcasting in HD at night. No matter what the memo says.

Again, most of Citadel's AM stations are back to broadcasting HD 24/7, day and night.

The original directive halted all IBOC on all AM Citadel Properties TFN.

That memo (that ordered the halt to all nightime IBOC) is no longer in effect.
(My source at Citadel is correct.)

Flip on an radio and check it out.

 

[dumber than a box of hair]

Did you or did you you not state definitively that "No car manufacturer is putting HD radios in as standard equipment. "

Is it not true that Volvo is offering it?

You were proven incorrect.

"Is." Present tense. Not "will be"...as in, Fall 2008. "Is." Nothing on Volvo's web site indicates that the radios are *currently* available.

Can't wait to see how many will be returned as defective. If it's anything like the return rate for the table radios, Volvo will rethink their decision pretty quickly. Warranty returns are a large money-loser for auto companies.

I'm gonna guess the answer is no...

Guess again. The same story is available from multiple sources, which don't consist of rewritten press releases.

WYSL is a 500 watter with a crazy directional pattern that barely reaches it's target area after dark.

The owner is delusional thinking he should get more coverage than he does.

So far the FCC has seen no validity in his claim.

A very predictable response for the "I don't care whose living HD interferes with" crowd. The FCC promised in several news releases that they would investigate any claims of interference resulting from HD. WYSL filed one months ago. The result has been silence. Damaging a man's business apparently doesn't matter to them...or to you.

If it wasn't rescinded...why are most of them back on?

Possibly your source is wrong.

(I posted a direct quote from the email I received.)

Maybe you should think about that before make more blatant errors.

Most? Name them. Every one of them. Along with their HD status.

Keeping HD off at night on their 50-kW stations (otherwise known as: keeping them from interfering with each other) is the story here.

Take a step back and look at what you're defending: An expensive, defective product whose manufacturer lies through its teeth about its capabilities (yes, they're still pushing "sounds like a CD" for their FM product), which the radio business can't even promote without insulting someone and can't program with any compelling content, which charges license fees bordering on the extortionate that most non-group-owned stations can't afford.

 

[spilot113]

Did you or did you you not state definitively that "No car manufacturer is putting HD radios in as standard equipment. "

Is it not true that Volvo is offering it?

You were proven incorrect.

"Is." Present tense. Not "will be"...

Thank you president Clinton...we can now have a discussion of what the meaning of the word is...is.

I'm gonna guess the answer is no...

Guess again. The same story is available from multiple sources, which don't consist of rewritten press releases.

I'm still guessing that you didn't read it, since most of what you posted were simply your feelings with your facts wrong.

WYSL is a 500 watter with a crazy directional pattern that barely reaches it's target area after dark.

The owner is delusional thinking he should get more coverage than he does.

So far the FCC has seen no validity in his claim.

A very predictable response for the "I don't care whose living HD interferes with" crowd. The FCC promised in several news releases that they would investigate any claims of interference resulting from HD. WYSL filed one months ago. The result has been silence.

So, apparently they don't see any merit (at least yet) in his complaint.

If it wasn't rescinded...why are most of them back on?

Possibly your source is wrong.

(I posted a direct quote from the email I received.)

Maybe you should think about that before make more blatant errors.

Most? Name them. Every one of them. Along with their HD status.
[/quote]

You're funny. Still can't admit when you are wrong, huh?

Why don't you name the ones that are off? Every one of them. Along with their HD status?

It would be easier to name the ones that are NOT using IBOC.

Someone mentioned WABC, WJR and WLS.

Or else you can go thru their 200 stations and make your own list. I'm not helping you out of your mess off incorrect statements.

 

[ZRXOA 5248]

as part of the XM / Sirius merger, there is a move by the Government to require open source radios that will receive XM/Sirius and HD radio signals. GM and Toyota who are allied with XM went on the record this week in a filing with the FCC to be against any mandate to install them as standard equipment

the article is here http://www.fmqb.com/Article.asp?id=787584 but here is a small FAIR USE ALLOWED section to illistrate my point..

"In a joint letter to the FCC, GM and Toyota oppose the HD-satellite combo, calling it an "unprecedented requirement." In the letter, the automakers write, "HD is already penetrating the automotive sector without a mandate. Several manufacturers are either currently offering HD or have announced plans to make HD radio standard or optional in future models. Nothing in our companies' respective agreements with XM inhibits our ability to offer HD radio." GM and Toyota add that if "consumers continue to show an interest in HD technology," then automakers will "take notice and adjust their strategies."

 

[dumber than a box of hair]

So, apparently they don't see any merit (at least yet) in his complaint.

Won't wash. The owner at least deserved to be told that there was no merit. Instead, he was met with silence. There's no excuse for it, especially since the agency promised to look into all such complaints.

Why don't you name the ones that are off? Every one of them. Along with their HD status?...I'm not helping you out of your mess off incorrect statements.

It's not up to me to prove or disprove your statements. YOU were the one who said most were back on. Prove it.