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The Big Man Goes Unmourned

SirRoxalot said:
A, you sound like a guy who's bitter that some air talent managed to extract deals from the consolidators.

In most cases, the talent didn't negotiate their deals. They were done by agents, who got a commission. The agents were the ones who extracted deals, and quite often those deals were not built around making good radio, or connecting with an audience, or serving the public interest. The deals were done to maximize commission. I understand what it's like to work on a commission. But if the goal is to make good radio, connect with an audience, or serve the public interest, it isn't accomplished by hiring an agent. As I said, a lot of what hurt radio in the years following consolidation was the way air talent lost contact with the audience. That was often something written in their contract. They don't have to do personal appearances any more. They don't have to meet the audience. All that was given to second bananas or "stunt boys" who did all the real work, leaving the host as a disconnected prima dona. That didn't help radio.

Once again, I don't live in Buffalo, so your experience may differ. But I worked in a lot of other markets and saw the same situation repeated. The audience began to question whether the host cared at all about the them, or if they were only interested in money and feeding their own ego. So when other options appeared, those hosts found themselves with fewer listeners. None of this was because of some ownership conspiracy. No consolidator wanted to overpay their hosts so they'd lose the support of their audience, or give them big staffs so they didn't have to do anything anymore. No one is that smart. But it happened, and was just another by-product of the growth of radio.

SirRoxalot said:
Unfortunately, it's the people in the trenches who have taken the hit during the "contraction".

As I said to Paul Warren, if you or anyone feels the suits have gotten rich off your hard work, then start your own business. That way you get to keep all the money. But things aren't going back to the way they used to be. That time was done a long time ago. Probably before you were born. Population has been leaving Buffalo since the 40s. Location used to be the source of Buffalo's wealth, and now it's a disadvantage. Few companies are starting in Buffalo. So you're left with aging businesses and employees. Very little new growth, very little for an ad-supported company to be based on. That's a very disheartening realization for a city that was once an industrial hub. Now it's exactly as you describe: A place where outsiders come to strip-mine. For the time being. Unless someone builds the next Rich Foods or something similar, the future doesn't look good.
 
TheBigA said:
...others had to pay for the greed of certain lucky air talent...

Big, I guess we'll have to differ on vocabulary. You see "greed" and "luck." I see "smart business decisions" and "talent." It wasn't other air talent who took the jobs away.
 
Paul_Warren said:
It wasn't other air talent who took the jobs away.

It's a combination of factors, and certainly depends on the specific station. But when you have a certain budget for staff, and one person or a group of people eat up a chunk of it, it leaves less for others, especially when all the audience and advertising are clumped in a specific section of the day, and those people expect a raise every year or two. At one point you may have been able to fund live & local in other weaker dayparts, but once the budget is tapped, and there's no revenue growth, that's when local jobs go away. The other factor now is the growth of digital. That budget has to come from somewhere. It's an investment now, so it's not bringing in what it will once the numbers show up. Once again, the money has to come from somewhere. They can keep on paying for talent in a daypart that's not growing, or divert the budget to a growth area.

But hey, I get it! That's why I suggest air talent hire an agent and start looking for product endorsements. That is a smart business decision that will ensure employment. It provides additional income for the talent without forcing management to take money from other areas. Just yesterday, I saw a station announced that its morning host was going to launch his own syndicated countdown show. Why? Because he just got a big raise to keep him from jumping to another market. His boss has to pay for it somehow, and so the talent gets a syndicated show. That show will replace live & local talent in markets around the country. Smart business for the one big talent, but not for anyone else. When you're in an industry that isn't growing, you just take money from someone else.
 
Radio_bored-Op said:
Bottom line. This is an item of interest to Rock fans. For a Rock (not Modern Rock but AOR/Classic Rock) or Classic Hits station to not have given Clarence his due this morning is to have missed the boat.

I am NOT PERSONALLY replying to the death of the "big man"
( as this was before my era, barely, but it was) but perhaps...
as I stand by my original post: . . . .time moves forward, and
while unfortunate was he forgotten, MAYBE .....I dont want to
be insensitive, but perhaps, he wasn't individually as significant
as BRUCE himself passing away, or HIS IMPACT would be bigger
if the general public more educated.
OR: more of a SOLO CAREER would have helped.
the first person I think of when u sax,
is David Koz, or kids today would answer Kenny G
-
ok - folks, CHICAGO is a MOMUMENTAL AMERICAN BAND
in the umtimely death of ________ their saxophone player,
Name Him...
(no google) ,

This is blasphemy! The Big Man was Master of the Universe - not to be compared to these chumps!
 
bbb said:
Radio_bored-Op said:
Bottom line. This is an item of interest to Rock fans. For a Rock (not Modern Rock but AOR/Classic Rock) or Classic Hits station to not have given Clarence his due this morning is to have missed the boat.

I am NOT PERSONALLY replying to the death of the "big man"
( as this was before my era, barely, but it was) but perhaps...
as I stand by my original post: . . . .time moves forward, and
while unfortunate was he forgotten, MAYBE .....I dont want to
be insensitive, but perhaps, he wasn't individually as significant
as BRUCE himself passing away, or HIS IMPACT would be bigger
if the general public more educated.
OR: more of a SOLO CAREER would have helped.
the first person I think of when u sax,
is David Koz, or kids today would answer Kenny G
-
ok - folks, CHICAGO is a MOMUMENTAL AMERICAN BAND
in the umtimely death of ________ their saxophone player,
Name Him...
(no google) ,

This is blasphemy! The Big Man was Master of the Universe - not to be compared to these chumps!

Well said, bbb! Radio Bored Op- "Kenny G"? ;D Ok, if you're in the dentist chair and about to have a tooth yanked out, maybe Kenny G wouldn't be a bad choice. :D "Chicago is a momumental (nice spelling btw ;) ) American Band"? Chicago? Yes, in the late 60s and early 70s I would agree with that. David Koz? ??? I have no clue who he is. If Mr. Koz were to pass away (I don't know him, I don't wish him ill) I wonder if U2 and Eddie Vedder would mention/honor him in their concerts? Ok, I feel better now. :)
 
RBO: Chicago's sax (and woodwind) player is Walter Parazaider. No Google or check of my CDs required, but I hope I have the spelling of his last name right. I could probably come up with the entire Chicago lineup past and present without Google also, but then, they are "in" my time not before.

But I do get your point. Even so, have some respect for your elders. Someone you might have heard of, last name "Gaga," did and the Big Man played sax on her latest. I might have to think about getting it now. There is a loooooong history of musicians from different places and times collaborating with each other, and not just via sampling.

Dave Koz has an outstanding track called "Start All Over Again" on his latest CD. I'll be diplomatic here and only state that I am not a big Kenny G fan, but he was OK with The Rippingtons.

Meanwhile, I am not sure of the actual setup but I wonder whether Bruce's arrangement with Columbia Records, at least now, is that he owns the recordings and Columbia distributes them. I believe that the copyright on the label of some of my LPs is to "Bruce Springsteen" not to "Columbia Records."

I'll treasure my autographed copy of "Rescue," obtained personally from the Big Man himself at the House of Guitars, but then I already did.
 
umtrr-author said:
RBO: Chicago's sax (and woodwind) player is Walter Parazaider. No Google or check of my CDs required, but I hope I have the spelling of his last name right. I could probably come up with the entire Chicago lineup past and present without Google also, but then, they are "in" my time not before.

But I do get your point. Even so, have some respect for your elders. Someone you might have heard of, last name "Gaga," did and the Big Man played sax on her latest. I might have to think about getting it now. There is a loooooong history of musicians from different places and times collaborating with each other, and not just via sampling.

Dave Koz has an outstanding track called "Start All Over Again" on his latest CD. I'll be diplomatic here and only state that I am not a big Kenny G fan, but he was OK with The Rippingtons.

Meanwhile, I am not sure of the actual setup but I wonder whether Bruce's arrangement with Columbia Records, at least now, is that he owns the recordings and Columbia distributes them. I believe that the copyright on the label of some of my LPs is to "Bruce Springsteen" not to "Columbia Records."

I'll treasure my autographed copy of "Rescue," obtained personally from the Big Man himself at the House of Guitars, but then I already did.

U-A: Very well said. I'll turn my rhetoric down a notch and acknowledge we all have our own tastes and time frames that we draw from. For my money Clarence was an integral part of the live best band there will ever be. I saw Bruce and the ESB a number of times including their last 3 1/2 hour Buffalo performance in Nov. 2009. Luckily for us Bruce and ESB fans there are a large number of CD and DVD performances already available and hopefully more concert DVDs to come.
 
I mentioned that Lady Gaga had Clarence play on one of her latest songs. The track "The Edge of Glory" is apparently one of his last contributions to music.

Here is the video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeWBS0JBNzQ

As well put by Spinner.com...

Among his many, many lifelong accomplishments, let it also be said that Clemons just got a nation of die-hard Springsteen fans to sit down and watch a complete Lady Gaga video. Way to go, Big Man.
 
umtrr-author said:
I mentioned that Lady Gaga had Clarence play on one of her latest songs. The track "The Edge of Glory" is apparently one of his last contributions to music.

Here is the video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeWBS0JBNzQ

As well put by Spinner.com...

Among his many, many lifelong accomplishments, let it also be said that Clemons just got a nation of die-hard Springsteen fans to sit down and watch a complete Lady Gaga video. Way to go, Big Man.

Great texture in this song. This will be the track from Born This Way that sticks.
 
John C said:
umtrr-author said:
RBO: Chicago's sax (and woodwind) player is Walter Parazaider. No Google or check of my CDs required, but I hope I have the spelling of his last name right. I could probably come up with the entire Chicago lineup past and present without Google also, but then, they are "in" my time not before.

But I do get your point. Even so, have some respect for your elders. Someone you might have heard of, last name "Gaga," did and the Big Man played sax on her latest. I might have to think about getting it now. There is a loooooong history of musicians from different places and times collaborating with each other, and not just via sampling.

Dave Koz has an outstanding track called "Start All Over Again" on his latest CD. I'll be diplomatic here and only state that I am not a big Kenny G fan, but he was OK with The Rippingtons.

Meanwhile, I am not sure of the actual setup but I wonder whether Bruce's arrangement with Columbia Records, at least now, is that he owns the recordings and Columbia distributes them. I believe that the copyright on the label of some of my LPs is to "Bruce Springsteen" not to "Columbia Records."

I'll treasure my autographed copy of "Rescue," obtained personally from the Big Man himself at the House of Guitars, but then I already did.

U-A: Very well said. I'll turn my rhetoric down a notch and acknowledge we all have our own tastes and time frames that we draw from. For my money Clarence was an integral part of the live best band there will ever be. I saw Bruce and the ESB a number of times including their last 3 1/2 hour Buffalo performance in Nov. 2009. Luckily for us Bruce and ESB fans there are a large number of CD and DVD performances already available and hopefully more concert DVDs to come.

You're a man after my own heart, John C......I was there, too. Somebody just sent me the DVD of that show, and I'm looking forward to watching it......I saw them 16 times from '99-'09, and they were just as good, if not better, than when I saw them for the first time in 1980.

Chicago, etc. could never have the Hollywood stars, etc. and $500 tickets that that concert had.
 
bbb said:
John C said:
umtrr-author said:
RBO: Chicago's sax (and woodwind) player is Walter Parazaider. No Google or check of my CDs required, but I hope I have the spelling of his last name right. I could probably come up with the entire Chicago lineup past and present without Google also, but then, they are "in" my time not before.

But I do get your point. Even so, have some respect for your elders. Someone you might have heard of, last name "Gaga," did and the Big Man played sax on her latest. I might have to think about getting it now. There is a loooooong history of musicians from different places and times collaborating with each other, and not just via sampling.

Dave Koz has an outstanding track called "Start All Over Again" on his latest CD. I'll be diplomatic here and only state that I am not a big Kenny G fan, but he was OK with The Rippingtons.

Meanwhile, I am not sure of the actual setup but I wonder whether Bruce's arrangement with Columbia Records, at least now, is that he owns the recordings and Columbia distributes them. I believe that the copyright on the label of some of my LPs is to "Bruce Springsteen" not to "Columbia Records."

I'll treasure my autographed copy of "Rescue," obtained personally from the Big Man himself at the House of Guitars, but then I already did.

U-A: Very well said. I'll turn my rhetoric down a notch and acknowledge we all have our own tastes and time frames that we draw from. For my money Clarence was an integral part of the live best band there will ever be. I saw Bruce and the ESB a number of times including their last 3 1/2 hour Buffalo performance in Nov. 2009. Luckily for us Bruce and ESB fans there are a large number of CD and DVD performances already available and hopefully more concert DVDs to come.

You're a man after my own heart, John C......I was there, too. Somebody just sent me the DVD of that show, and I'm looking forward to watching it......I saw them 16 times from '99-'09, and they were just as good, if not better, than when I saw them for the first time in 1980.

Chicago, etc. could never have the Hollywood stars, etc. and $500 tickets that that concert had.

You'll enjoy the DVD, bbb! I acquired one from Ebay shortly after the show and though not studio quality it still brought back a lot of found memories. One of the sad things about Clarence's passing as like you I really believe Bruce and the ESB were still at a high point. Knowing how much material Bruce can create (and has already created) I felt like they had another tour or two in them. It will be interesting to see what Bruce does next. Whatever he does, it won't be the same without Clarence. :'(
 
It definitely won't be the same. I was coming back from Pittsburgh last night and I hadn't had my XM radio in my car in a long time, but it gave me a chance to listen to E Street Radio (Is there a Chicago or Kenny G Radio?).

Not sure if it was on purpose, but so many of the songs and live bits were very Clarence centric. It really hit home that things will never be the same.
 
bbb said:
It definitely won't be the same. I was coming back from Pittsburgh last night and I hadn't had my XM radio in my car in a long time, but it gave me a chance to listen to E Street Radio (Is there a Chicago or Kenny G Radio?).

Not sure if it was on purpose, but so many of the songs and live bits were very Clarence centric. It really hit home that things will never be the same.

Little Steven's Underground Garage has a tribute show to Clarence. http://undergroundgarage.com/radio-show-2/for-clarence.html
 
Props to 97-Rock for playing the actual last concert of the E Street Band recorded in Buffalo. I hope you didn't miss it last Friday night.
 
SirRoxalot said:
Props to 97-Rock for playing the actual last concert of the E Street Band recorded in Buffalo. I hope you didn't miss it last Friday night.

Agreed, Rox! A lot of times 97 Rock will play live versions of the setlist for their "concert replay" but not the actual concert. As you mentioned, Friday night was different. Of course they had to make sure they didn't pass along any "f-bombs" from that memorable evening. ;)
 
SirRoxalot said:
Props to 97-Rock for playing the actual last concert of the E Street Band recorded in Buffalo. I hope you didn't miss it last Friday night.

I did, unfortunately - was out of town, set up a timer to record it at home while I was away, but 97 Rock wasn't making it to the east side of Rochester clearly on Friday night. :mad:

Anybody aircheck it and willing to share a dub? Will trade for Tower Site Calendars...
 
Scott Fybush said:
SirRoxalot said:
Props to 97-Rock for playing the actual last concert of the E Street Band recorded in Buffalo. I hope you didn't miss it last Friday night.

I did, unfortunately - was out of town, set up a timer to record it at home while I was away, but 97 Rock wasn't making it to the east side of Rochester clearly on Friday night. :mad:

Anybody aircheck it and willing to share a dub? Will trade for Tower Site Calendars...

I did not aircheck it but did recently stumble across a Springsteen sight that you might want to check out. http://www.springsteenliveinconcert.com/search-results
I did a search under HSBC and came up with some decent samples. There are also some Blue Cross Arena shows as well...
 
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