The CW Affiliate Apocalypse of 2016

[dave73]

Re: WGN (Was: Re: The CW Affiliate Apocalypse of 2016)

If they don't renew their agreements or CW shuts down, what will they fill primetime with?

In Chicago, WGN-TV would simply place some off-network syndicated programming, or movies in primetime. They still have the rights to a number of sportscasts for the Chicago Cub & White Sox during the summer, The Chicago Bulls for fall, winter, & spring, & the Blackhawks during the winter. For WGN-TV, the Cubs broadcast deal is up in 2014, & the Ricketts family is talking about moving the broadcasts to cable exclusively.

As for who might take the CW affiliation, should it remain around in 2016, I doubt Weigel Broadcasting will take the affiliation, as I believe they're happy with WCIU 26.1 & 26.2 being an independent. If they did agree to pick up the affiliation, it would likely end up as a subchannel to either WWME-LD or WMEU-CD, rather than WCIU (they simulcast MeTV & MeToo (Chicago's MeTV) on WCIU 26.3 & 26.4 to reach the entire market & This TV on 26.5 for now, plus the U Too on 26.2). CW would have to pay WJYS to carry the CW primetime lineup, since they broker out their timeslots, & I don't see CW doing that. I believe CBS O&O WBBM would be forced to carry it as a subchannel if everyone else took a pass. I definitely don't see Fox picking up the network, as they normally don't do subchannels, & they already have My Network TV on sister station, WPWR-TV, & adding Movies on 50.2 by the end of this month.

If the Cw became available, I could see Weigel picking it up as 26.1 and 26.2 could be combined and I think they would be happier if they had a network as other than one station they have all network affiliates.

Also back in the day wasn't WCIU Chicago's home for kids WB as I recall WGN did not want to air the block?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WCIU-TV#1994.E2.80.932004

I still don't see Weigel picking up CW in 2016, should they still be around on WCIU 26.1 If they agree to pick it up, it would most likely end a subchannel to either WWME-LD or WMEU-CD. Back in the day with WB Kids, that was only 1 day a week (if I'm not mistaken) on Saturday mornings, whereas they would have to air CW programming 5 nights a week , if it were on WCIU 26.1. I believe they're happy being an independent on the main channel & on 26.2. Prior to 1995, they only affiliated with Univision part-time, & refused to be a full affiliate. Even if just 2 hours a night & 1 hour in the afternoons during the week for CW, I still stand firm Weigel likes being an independent.

(WGN-9) still (has) the rights to a number of sportscasts for the Chicago Cub & White Sox during the summer..............For WGN-TV, the Cubs broadcast deal is up in 2014, & the Ricketts family is talking about moving the broadcasts to cable exclusively.

WGN is a superstation available on many cable systems across the country (under the brand name "WGN America"), although the CW programs and many of the syndicated shows they run locally in Chicago can't appear nationally (and neither can the Blackhawks under the NHL's current national TV deals).

If WGN loses the Cubs, or if a future MLB national TV deal prevents WGN from putting Cubs and White Sox games on the WGN America service, then the future of WGN America might be iffy. The reason it's even a superstation at all is the Cubs.

I never even brought up WGN America, because we're only talking about local Tribune stations carrying CW, & I was only talking about WGN-TV. WGN America overall has a completely different schedule from WGN-TV. The only parts of the programming that overlap are with noon - 1pm portion of the midday news, 9pm news, the Illinois Lottery drawings, & sportscasts that Tribune can air on both stations. Anyway, if CW does go under, or Tribune doesn't renew the affiliation agreement in 2016 if CW stays around, they have no problems filling the 7 - 9pm timeslots. Other than sportscasts, movies can be a viable option, along with off-network syndicated shows. I personally don't even see a future for WGN America, since a lot of the programming is available on other networks (whether OTA or on pay TV). BTW, the only people who can watch WGN America in the Chicago market are those with DirecTV or Dish Network. Cable isn't allowed to carry WGN America in the Chicago market.

 

[nomadcowatbk]

Well let me turn this question around a bit.

In what markets, which Tribune owns a station, would the Tribune be able to get a better deal elsewhere than the CW?

For example I know ABC is weak in St Louis, while the CW is on the Tribunes KPLR, which was a powerhouse independent in its day. Could the Tribune seek out ABC in that case? Now I don't know if they would, I was using that as an example of my question.

Even under Koplar ownership until Tribune bought them in 2001, ABC has pretty much been do anything to get on KPLR, to deaf ears, and is stuck on KDNL surrounded with syndicated product more appropriate for a CW affiliate. I suspect because the latest KDNL deal expires in August 2015, whoever gets the Tribune stations will finally make an attempt to get ABC on KPLR; St. Louis is one of the few markets where the CW can easily beat ABC in a few time periods.

How many markets does the CW station big a Big 4 station?

 

[Morgan Wick]

Re: WGN (Was: Re: The CW Affiliate Apocalypse of 2016)

(WGN-9) still (has) the rights to a number of sportscasts for the Chicago Cub & White Sox during the summer..............For WGN-TV, the Cubs broadcast deal is up in 2014, & the Ricketts family is talking about moving the broadcasts to cable exclusively.

WGN is a superstation available on many cable systems across the country (under the brand name "WGN America"), although the CW programs and many of the syndicated shows they run locally in Chicago can't appear nationally (and neither can the Blackhawks under the NHL's current national TV deals).

If WGN loses the Cubs, or if a future MLB national TV deal prevents WGN from putting Cubs and White Sox games on the WGN America service, then the future of WGN America might be iffy. The reason it's even a superstation at all is the Cubs.

I never even brought up WGN America, because we're only talking about local Tribune stations carrying CW, & I was only talking about WGN-TV. WGN America overall has a completely different schedule from WGN-TV. The only parts of the programming that overlap are with noon - 1pm portion of the midday news, 9pm news, the Illinois Lottery drawings, & sportscasts that Tribune can air on both stations. Anyway, if CW does go under, or Tribune doesn't renew the affiliation agreement in 2016 if CW stays around, they have no problems filling the 7 - 9pm timeslots. Other than sportscasts, movies can be a viable option, along with off-network syndicated shows. I personally don't even see a future for WGN America, since a lot of the programming is available on other networks (whether OTA or on pay TV). BTW, the only people who can watch WGN America in the Chicago market are those with DirecTV or Dish Network. Cable isn't allowed to carry WGN America in the Chicago market.

I believe Joseph brought up WGN America on his own, intentionally, without any Chicago carriage of it being relevant, because the idea the Cubs might go cable-only was new to him and it made him wonder what it might mean for WGN America, which you seemed to mostly agree with him on (ie, it's dead without the Cubs). And I think the fate of WGN America is still relevant to the question of what Tribune wants to do with WGN-TV.

 

[newsmark]

Re: WGN (Was: Re: The CW Affiliate Apocalypse of 2016)

I believe Joseph brought up WGN America on his own, intentionally, without any Chicago carriage of it being relevant, because the idea the Cubs might go cable-only was new to him and it made him wonder what it might mean for WGN America, which you seemed to mostly agree with him on (ie, it's dead without the Cubs). And I think the fate of WGN America is still relevant to the question of what Tribune wants to do with WGN-TV.

Let's hope Trib can create some quality original programming for all their local stations and WGN America. There are too many choices already for old shows. But that's if Trib or anyone will spend the money to create something new and worth watching.

 

[Casey]

Re: WGN (Was: Re: The CW Affiliate Apocalypse of 2016)

Let's hope Trib can create some quality original programming for all their local stations and WGN America. There are too many choices already for old shows. But that's if Trib or anyone will spend the money to create something new and worth watching.

They're not willing. It is because of Tribune that Legend of the Seeker got cancelled and they only had to pay a small portion of the expenses to make that show.

 

[Kent]

Even under Koplar ownership until Tribune bought them in 2001, ABC has pretty much been do anything to get on KPLR, to deaf ears, and is stuck on KDNL surrounded with syndicated product more appropriate for a CW affiliate. I suspect because the latest KDNL deal expires in August 2015, whoever gets the Tribune stations will finally make an attempt to get ABC on KPLR; St. Louis is one of the few markets where the CW can easily beat ABC in a few time periods.

It didn't factor into the last negotiations, but KPLR largely avoided ABC because it had the Cardinals. Since losing them a few years ago, the ratings have been dreadful. Plus, after Local got KTVI, attempts to take KPLR out of competition, like moving the news from 9 to 7, haven't worked. Hard to say if this is that perfect storm that makes KPLR finally affiliate with ABC, but it seems more likely than before.

 

[CleveFan]

If the CW or MyNetworkTV goes dark (or switches to cable or online only), what would also happen with the stations affiliated that are not owned by News Corp or Tribune? I could see WUAB or WBNX in Cleveland going back to being a full-time independent station.

 

[Brother]

If the CW or MyNetworkTV goes dark (or switches to cable or online only), what would also happen with the stations affiliated that are not owned by News Corp or Tribune? I could see WUAB or WBNX in Cleveland going back to being a full-time independent station.

1. Those affected stations would likely plug in syndicated programs, be it talk shows, court shows, reruns, movies, etc.
2. The station nicknames would change.
3. Half of us TV geeks would be fascinated that station X airs program Y at a different time than another city.
4. The other half would be outraged that independent stations aren't programming exactly how they did 30 years ago.
5. The average viewer, meanwhile, likely wouldn't notice any difference (or in the case of Cleveland, call up WJW every weekday since 1994 wondering why they're not showing the CBS soap operas that afternoon).

 

[Morgan Wick]

If the CW or MyNetworkTV goes dark (or switches to cable or online only), what would also happen with the stations affiliated that are not owned by News Corp or Tribune? I could see WUAB or WBNX in Cleveland going back to being a full-time independent station.

Something would come along to give them a "network" so they don't have to come up with an original branding or something to plug into primetime, even if it makes MyNet look substantial.

 

[nomadcowatbk]

If the CW or MyNetworkTV goes dark (or switches to cable or online only), what would also happen with the stations affiliated that are not owned by News Corp or Tribune? I could see WUAB or WBNX in Cleveland going back to being a full-time independent station.

Something would come along to give them a "network" so they don't have to come up with an original branding or something to plug into primetime, even if it makes MyNet look substantial.

how many true indie stations are left? (ones without network branding of any kind)

 

[nomadcowatbk]

Even under Koplar ownership until Tribune bought them in 2001, ABC has pretty much been do anything to get on KPLR, to deaf ears, and is stuck on KDNL surrounded with syndicated product more appropriate for a CW affiliate. I suspect because the latest KDNL deal expires in August 2015, whoever gets the Tribune stations will finally make an attempt to get ABC on KPLR; St. Louis is one of the few markets where the CW can easily beat ABC in a few time periods.

It didn't factor into the last negotiations, but KPLR largely avoided ABC because it had the Cardinals. Since losing them a few years ago, the ratings have been dreadful. Plus, after Local got KTVI, attempts to take KPLR out of competition, like moving the news from 9 to 7, haven't worked. Hard to say if this is that perfect storm that makes KPLR finally affiliate with ABC, but it seems more likely than before.

Cardinals have been off and on KPLR, KSDK had them for a while, when CW launched, KPLR was only airing Sunday afternoon Cardinals games, they're now exclusively on FSN Midwest. Would Local TV be allowed to own two Big 4 stations in a Top 40 market (assuming they get the Tribune stations)?

 

[nomadcowatbk]

No show on CW has the buzz with middle school girls that WB shows like Dawsons Creek ever did, and the affiliates don't get any $ from the netflix deal, might CW eventually drop original programming or just turn into a syndication service like MYnetTV?

 

[Morgan Wick]

Even under Koplar ownership until Tribune bought them in 2001, ABC has pretty much been do anything to get on KPLR, to deaf ears, and is stuck on KDNL surrounded with syndicated product more appropriate for a CW affiliate. I suspect because the latest KDNL deal expires in August 2015, whoever gets the Tribune stations will finally make an attempt to get ABC on KPLR; St. Louis is one of the few markets where the CW can easily beat ABC in a few time periods.

It didn't factor into the last negotiations, but KPLR largely avoided ABC because it had the Cardinals. Since losing them a few years ago, the ratings have been dreadful. Plus, after Local got KTVI, attempts to take KPLR out of competition, like moving the news from 9 to 7, haven't worked. Hard to say if this is that perfect storm that makes KPLR finally affiliate with ABC, but it seems more likely than before.

Cardinals have been off and on KPLR, KSDK had them for a while, when CW launched, KPLR was only airing Sunday afternoon Cardinals games, they're now exclusively on FSN Midwest. Would Local TV be allowed to own two Big 4 stations in a Top 40 market (assuming they get the Tribune stations)?

Remember, Local TV is on the block itself, and I believe FCC rules enjoin against owning two of the top four regardless of network affiliation.

 

[Kent]

Would Local TV be allowed to own two Big 4 stations in a Top 40 market (assuming they get the Tribune stations)?

KPLR hasn't been in the top-4 for at least five years. If KPLR were to affiliate with ABC, it would probably become a top-4 station, but, until its first ratings in the top-4, it could be bought by pretty much anyone who doesn't already have a duopoly partner. So, at this point Local could buy it, but, as another poster mentions, Local is itself for sale. So, I wouldn't expect that to happen.

 

[Brother]

Would Local TV be allowed to own two Big 4 stations in a Top 40 market (assuming they get the Tribune stations)?

KPLR hasn't been in the top-4 for at least five years. If KPLR were to affiliate with ABC, it would probably become a top-4 station, but, until its first ratings in the top-4, it could be bought by pretty much anyone who doesn't already have a duopoly partner. So, at this point Local could buy it, but, as another poster mentions, Local is itself for sale. So, I wouldn't expect that to happen.

The only recent St. Louis ratings news I could find via a brief search were for the 10 pm weeknight newscasts this past February:
1. KMOV 5.0
2. KSDK 4.9
3. KTVI 3.3
4. KDNL 0.9

Still, that's just 30 minutes of a 24-hour day and doesn't include reruns on KPLR. KDNL surpassing KPLR in the overall ratings wouldn't seem a huge shock. People tend to focus solely on KDNL's lack of original news content, and understandably so, but one would think ABC network programming would bring Channel 30's numbers up a bit over the CW on Channel 11. But then, these numbers can be easily manipulated to suit anyone's needs.

One owner probably wouldn't be allowed to own both KTVI and KPLR, but they could certainly operate both, and in a much closer relationship than KTVI and KPLR are now. If Sinclair is allowed to own/operate three stations in Baltimore, the FCC will sign off on anything. Again, something that can be easily manipulated.

On a random note: the naughty side of me would love to see Sinclair take over Local TV LLC, creating an unofficial triopoly in St. Louis (KTVI/KPLR/KDNL), just to see posters' heads explode.

 

[dave73]

If the CW or MyNetworkTV goes dark (or switches to cable or online only), what would also happen with the stations affiliated that are not owned by News Corp or Tribune? I could see WUAB or WBNX in Cleveland going back to being a full-time independent station.

Something would come along to give them a "network" so they don't have to come up with an original branding or something to plug into primetime, even if it makes MyNet look substantial.

how many true indie stations are left? (ones without network branding of any kind)

I know in Chicago, there are only 2 independents left, when you factor only full power stations: WCIU & WJYS. WCIU 26.1 & 26.2 are programmed by Weigel Broadcasting (the same people who program MeTV & until this fall, This TV), & feature a lot of talk, court, & news magazine shows, plus some off-network syndicated shows. WJYS brokers out their timeslots on 62.1 & 62.4, while they lease out 62.2 to the people that operate WEDE-CA (who still operates their Class A station in analog).

 

[Kent]

Still, that's just 30 minutes of a 24-hour day and doesn't include reruns on KPLR. KDNL surpassing KPLR in the overall ratings wouldn't seem a huge shock. People tend to focus solely on KDNL's lack of original news content, and understandably so, but one would think ABC network programming would bring Channel 30's numbers up a bit over the CW on Channel 11. But then, these numbers can be easily manipulated to suit anyone's needs.

KDNL consistently beats KPLR during primetime due to the improving quality of ABC and the always lackluster showing of the CW (which I like to refer to as the "Crap Watch") and the poor performance of KPLR's 7 PM news. In fact, when the two networks were still fairly new, KPLR's CW programming was beaten by My affiliate WRBU at least a couple nights a week during primetime. On those nights, reruns on WRBU beat KPLR's 9 PM newscast before it was moved to 7!

One owner probably wouldn't be allowed to own both KTVI and KPLR, but they could certainly operate both, and in a much closer relationship than KTVI and KPLR are now. If Sinclair is allowed to own/operate three stations in Baltimore, the FCC will sign off on anything. Again, something that can be easily manipulated.

So long as there are at least 8 independent voices and at least one station isn't in the top-4, they can be co-owned. Divestiture is not required if both stations end up in the top-4 after an ownership change. However, the two stations will have to be sold to separate buyers if sold again.

 

[Lord Zedd 93]

If the CW or MyNetworkTV goes dark (or switches to cable or online only), what would also happen with the stations affiliated that are not owned by News Corp or Tribune? I could see WUAB or WBNX in Cleveland going back to being a full-time independent station.

WKCF CW 18 in Orlando has This TV on it's second channel, They could move THIS TV to the main channel or move ME TV (on it's sister network WESH) to the main channel. Both are Hearst stations.

 

[nomadcowatbk]

Would Local TV be allowed to own two Big 4 stations in a Top 40 market (assuming they get the Tribune stations)?

KPLR hasn't been in the top-4 for at least five years. If KPLR were to affiliate with ABC, it would probably become a top-4 station, but, until its first ratings in the top-4, it could be bought by pretty much anyone who doesn't already have a duopoly partner. So, at this point Local could buy it, but, as another poster mentions, Local is itself for sale. So, I wouldn't expect that to happen.

KDNL ranks in the top 4?

 

[Kent]

KDNL ranks in the top 4?

KDNL has been in the top-4 since at least 2006. It's usually a distant 4th, but it's well-ahead of KPLR, WRBU and every other 2nd and 3rd tier station in the market. St. Louis has long been dominated by KMOV and KSDK. Those two have usually been pretty competitive. KTVI has been #3 pretty much forever. It was usually #3 as an ABC affiliate, and that hasn't changed much since switching to Fox in '95.