This is why stations should kill oldies

[manwhore]

I like Phlash but, and I admit I haven't read this whole thread, I think saying he has a huge audience is just a wild guess. What percentage of XM listeners listen to Phlash is unknown. If ALL of them listen, it's less than listen to most large syndicated shows, who at least have ratings information. If Phlash were to manage 5 percent of their total subscribers, what's that, less than a half million, a number beaten by many major market local morning shows in one market. Of the ones who listen to Oldies on XM, do they all listen to Phlash? He may have a large audience, or he may be satcasting to you and Eduardo.

 

[ceaser]

The exceptional shows would be the weekly special programming that satellite offers. XM has Pink & Black Days ('50s Top 40), Cool Bobby B. (Doo Wop), Rockabilly Road Trip, The Strip (Rat Pack related), Hollywood Diner, Harlem (early '50s R&B), Wax Your Woodie (Surf music), and 3 hours of '50s Pop on Saturdays. All with hosts who actually know the music, not some twenty-something reading off of a script. Then there's Wolfman Jack and Chickenman. And that only covers TWO channels!!

I asked about TALENt, not music content. Most of those shows are done by very narrowly recognized announcers.

You are talking about shows with content that can not be sustained on terrestrial radio. Name talents that appeal to 18-49 or 25-54, not shows based on music for senior seniors.

"Wax your Woodie" sounds like something a guy would have done at a day spa.

P.S. The Wolfman is dead. I should have said "living talent" but forgot you are reliving the 50's.

RU crazy?What about norm n nite on sirius5 or cousin brucie on sirius 6,barry williams on sirius 7.Hardly unrecognizable names.Once again i'm 41 and love the oldies.Stop it with the stereo types please.People under 55+ could like oldies if they are done right.

 

[OldiesCat]

RU crazy?What about norm n nite on sirius5 or cousin brucie on sirius 6,barry williams on sirius 7.Hardly unrecognizable names.Once again i'm 41 and love the oldies.Stop it with the stereo types please.People under 55+ could like oldies if they are done right.

They're recognizable all right- especially if you grew up in New York City. In other words, a majority of radio listeners in America probably don't know them.

And, how could those under 55 like Oldies (we're talking traditional Oldies, late 50s to early 70s music span) "done right"? What is your definition of "done right"?

 

[TheFonz]

P.S. The Wolfman is dead.

So is terrestrial music radio. Just a coincidence? I think not.

 

[XM RADIO]

Oldiescat, wow you really get worked up. personally i wil continue to promote XM and Sirius and voice and air my thoughts which are genuine and i pay for a service that being Sirius and XM , which i swear by for entertainment purposes thats it! Yoy cant find anything like satelite radio, on The FM dial, here in the San francisco bay Area is immpossible to enjoy radio. Terrestrial is so poor, if it isnt the program its reception,,,XM and Sirius take care of that problem Crystal Clear and FM is a joke !!! Yes Im Sirius about radio, and your never going to hear Cousin Brucie,, Bill Rock,,Phlash Phelps,, Bobby Ocean, Marty With the Party, and "Mr Music Norm N Nite anywhere else, You will never kill off oldies or the way Satelite has taken over!! Yes at first i said i would never pay. then In late 2003 @ Circuit City in Concord the Sales Associate sold me on XM, installed in my Silverado, and totally satisfied! And I promote XM and Sirius every chance i get!! If you like a product you will tell people about it!! The only thing bad is Ive got 3 remotes 1 for XM, One for Sirius, and one for the Alpine,, This gives me 6 choices for Oldies and then add the Elvis Channel thats 7 commercial free outlets !!! And i will add Phlash Phelps has personality, and a real way with his listeners,, Who cares how many times hes fired thats his past.. Im into Future, and its Satelite!! And i see more and more stores piping in XM and Sirius in the bay Area,, Static free,, and its a bargain,, thats my story Oldiescat,, good luck with terrestrial Kenny in Concord

 

[AZJoe]

Sat radio has more known personalities than terrestrial... since when is being a legend in the radio business - yes Norm N. Nite, Cousin Brucie, Pat St John, Bill Rock, and many others considered no talents and unknown to anyone> DE & OC you are living in a dream denial world!!! You bitch about sat radio having no talent, and then you say some of the biggest names of the past and in the biggest market in the nation mean nothing, get a clue for heaven's sake!! You cant have it both ways. Terrestrial oldies is a washed up, so be it, but when legends in that format work at Sirius or XM, you say it means nothing- yeah to an 18 yr old, but that isnt who the oldies are playing to. Get a clue please!! You moan and gripe there is no one of any talent or name, and when its shown there is, you say nobody knows them, name someone in your universe of Terrestrial oldies radio who is better or more known!! MY gads!!!! I think you'd argue with God if he appeared just to be negative and self righteous!!

 

[davideduardo]

RU crazy?What about norm n nite on sirius5 or cousin brucie on sirius 6,barry williams on sirius 7.Hardly unrecognizable names.Once again i'm 41 and love the oldies.Stop it with the stereo types please.People under 55+ could like oldies if they are done right.

Outside of New York, few know Cousin Brucie, and fewer know Mr. Williams.

People under 55 do like oldies, but most are in their late 40's and early 50's, and are ageing into the usalsable 55+ age group.

 

[davideduardo]

Sat radio has more known personalities than terrestrial...

No, it does not. It has a few old oldies jocks from New York, but very few talents known nationally.

Terrestrial radio has talents in every market, over hundreds of markets. Essentially none of the satellite announcers have a national profile.

since when is being a legend in the radio business - yes Norm N. Nite, Cousin Brucie, Pat St John, Bill Rock, and many others considered no talents and unknown to anyone>

They are rembered by some people who like one kind of music in one market. They have very little name value anywhere else.

 

[XM RADIO]

You hit the nail on the head DavidEdauardo, well sort of ,I never heard of Cousin Brucie, Bill Rock, Pat St John Norm N Nite or Phlash Phelps till i subscribed to XM and Sirius, at 54 and being a San Francisco Bay Area native,, And never hearing their shows before, It was fresh, new, and a "Big Change" from the way KFRC dictated it! Norm N Nite on Sirius is a show i never miss, especially when he spotlites a certain year,, after a lifetime of KFRC and hearing Dock of the Bay, Brown Eyed Girl,, Build me up Buttercup,, Norm N nite and Cousin Brucie play songs KFRC would never play! Songs ive never heard!! These guys have real knowledge of 50s 60 s and 70s obscure rarely played songs! The songs they have introduced me too are worth my Subscription plus!!! After 14 years of one oldies station, KFRC 99.7 fm and Cammy Blackstone and Ron PARKER,,,Its A great change to hear Phlash Phelps or Bill Rock,,KFRC would never do a single DJ in the morning,, these guys fly solo and do radio the way it was meant to be!! The Bay Area sure got gyped by not getting to hear these guys!! Look how CBS lost Bobby Ocean to XM,, you gotta wonder, they did the same thing to cousin Brucie at the CBS station in NY!! Now hes heard all over the USA !!! Bobby Ocean all over the USA! Bill Rock all over the USA!! CBS sure lost some legends! Kenny in Concord :

 

[AZJoe]

Sat radio has more known personalities than terrestrial...

No, it does not. It has a few old oldies jocks from New York, but very few talents known nationally.

Terrestrial radio has talents in every market, over hundreds of markets. Essentially none of the satellite announcers have a national profile.

since when is being a legend in the radio business - yes Norm N. Nite, Cousin Brucie, Pat St John, Bill Rock, and many others considered no talents and unknown to anyone>

They are rembered by some people who like one kind of music in one market. They have very little name value anywhere else.

Name a terrestrial radio star that is known nationwide... and who cares about name value for other markets- they know their oldies and come from huge markets. THEY ARE QUALITY,that is the bttm line, they dont need to appeal to your 18-49 yr olds, no reason to. You admit oldies is washed up , then why do you rag on it for sat radio so much? Sat radio doesnt play to the ad market game- great place for oldies to "retire " to.... you keep saying over and over they are not relevant- only in terrestrial, internet and sat- HUGE!

 

[davideduardo]

Name a terrestrial radio star that is known nationwide...

Rush Limbaugh, for starters. Art Bell. Casey Kasem. Paul Harvey.

But in most cases, terrestrial radio is local. So talents that are very well known, like Gary Burbank and his near 20-share on WLW, are unknown outside of the Ohio River Valley. But in each market, there are multiple talents that are locally famous... as much so as Cousing Brucie and those other guys were in New York... even though nobody outside their market knows them.

and who cares about name value for other markets- they know their oldies and come from huge markets. THEY ARE QUALITY,that is the bttm line, they dont need to appeal to your 18-49 yr olds, no reason to.

The point is that they WERE good on AM tip 40's 40 years or so ago... they have no real appeal to anyone who has never heard them and they are not particulary good any more. Satellite is not a place where you can find much talent.

 

[OldiesCat]

P.S. The Wolfman is dead.

So is terrestrial music radio. Just a coincidence? I think not.

According to...whom?

 

[AZJoe]

Name a terrestrial radio star that is known nationwide...

Rush Limbaugh, for starters. Art Bell. Casey Kasem. Paul Harvey.

But in most cases, terrestrial radio is local. So talents that are very well known, like Gary Burbank and his near 20-share on WLW, are unknown outside of the Ohio River Valley. But in each market, there are multiple talents that are locally famous... as much so as Cousing Brucie and those other guys were in New York... even though nobody outside their market knows them.

and who cares about name value for other markets- they know their oldies and come from huge markets. THEY ARE QUALITY,that is the bttm line, they dont need to appeal to your 18-49 yr olds, no reason to.

The point is that they WERE good on AM tip 40's 40 years or so ago... they have no real appeal to anyone who has never heard them and they are not particulary good any more. Satellite is not a place where you can find much talent.

Too funny, if we just go by age, even if someone as you say "WERE good", then I bet you are irrelevant now too as you are much older. Since when does age have to do with no longer being good? These are all simply your opinions and they count for no more than those with a different view. Everytime you post your view , you cant expect it to be taken for gospel. Oh yeah, Casey Kasem, Howard Stern, Opie & Anthony, Mark Goodman, Alan Hunter, Nina Blackwood, Carol Miller, Emenim, George Clinton, D-Train, Bobby Jay, Willie Nelson, Gamble & Huff, Ophrah, Ken Spyder Webb, Bobby Bennett, Norm N. Nite, Cousin Brucie, Pat St John, Tony Hawk, and on & on all are on Sirius or XM- all great radio people and known in this field and nationwide for many of them, and there are many, many more. You hate sat radio, good, but take care your own backyard before you start complaining about your competitors, who say are irrelevant or doomed. The customer satisfaction rate with sat radio is much higher than than of terrestrial radio.

 

[OldiesCat]

Too funny, if we just go by age, even if someone as you say "WERE good", then I bet you are irrelevant now too as you are much older. Since when does age have to do with no longer being good? These are all simply your opinions and they count for no more than those with a different view.

I don't think the spirit of David's reply was about talent or quality but about current relevance. On the NY board, there has been an outcry (exclusively by radio people) to bring Cousin Brucie and other legends back to CBS-FM. Those guys are indeed radio legends but they represent where CBS-FM was, not where they're going. You might reply, "yeah, but if they're that great..."- they're that great, mostly to people 55 and older. To somebody in their early to mid 40s, they represent a previous (maybe even their parents') generation. They are not "legends" to a 42 year old, any more than "The Shoop Shoop Song" is.

First rule in top 40 radio (courtesy of the great Gordon McLeandon) is "speak the listeners' language". A 70 year old disk jockey can't usually connect well with comebody 25-30 years younger.

 

[AZJoe]

Too funny, if we just go by age, even if someone as you say "WERE good", then I bet you are irrelevant now too as you are much older. Since when does age have to do with no longer being good? These are all simply your opinions and they count for no more than those with a different view.

I don't think the spirit of David's reply was about talent or quality but about current relevance. On the NY board, there has been an outcry (exclusively by radio people) to bring Cousin Brucie and other legends back to CBS-FM. Those guys are indeed radio legends but they represent where CBS-FM was, not where they're going. You might reply, "yeah, but if they're that great..."- they're that great, mostly to people 55 and older. To somebody in their early to mid 40s, they represent a previous (maybe even their parents') generation. They are not "legends" to a 42 year old, any more than "The Shoop Shoop Song" is.

First rule in top 40 radio (courtesy of the great Gordon McLeandon) is "speak the listeners' language". A 70 year old disk jockey can't usually connect well with comebody 25-30 years younger.

Bingo Oldies Cat!! Youre finally getting it!! A jock for an oldies format doesnt need to connect or be relevant to 25-42 yrs olds-- they want to be relevant for the demo that likes the format- yes the older crowd!! They need to know the format, love the music and connect with the old guys 50+!! And they do!!! Since terrestrial has written off oldies as a lost cause, we simply are saying it is available elsewhere, and it is a good presentation- minus the ads, which the ad people dont want oldies anyways!! Its a win- win situation!! The old legends are still legends and enjoyed by the demos that like this type of music! The 40 yr olds who might like oldies will still enjoy a quality jock whether they have heard of them or not, quality goes beyond years. Many good jocks know their stuff and havent been known by everyone, but will be accepted based on their quality- not their age or where they are only known at. Experience DOES count in oldies formats! If I have my choice of a jock who was there when the oldies were new, knows many of the artists and introduced the Beatles to the USA, or listen to a 22 year old that is trying to be hip to a 60s tune that came out 20 years before he was born, I'll pick the 70 yr old!! Oh, so will my 25 year old son! The way some of you are coming across is, oldies is dead on terrestrial but we want it dead on internet and sat radio too, even tho they dont play to the ad agencies, and your rules for being relevant dont apply to this other alternate radio option. Your bias is so obvious!

 

[davideduardo]

Too funny, if we just go by age, even if someone as you say "WERE good", then I bet you are irrelevant now too as you are much older. Since when does age have to do with no longer being good?

In most cases, beyond a certain age, the voice starts to go. There is no Viagra for vocal chords. And most people do not want to relive the past, over an over. So the styles of 60´s just sound outdated today to most people.

Oh yeah, Casey Kasem, Howard Stern, Opie & Anthony, Mark Goodman, Alan Hunter, Nina Blackwood, Carol Miller, Emenim, George Clinton, D-Train, Bobby Jay, Willie Nelson, Gamble & Huff, Ophrah, Ken Spyder Webb, Bobby Bennett, Norm N. Nite, Cousin Brucie, Pat St John, Tony Hawk, and on & on all are on Sirius or XM- all great radio people and known in this field and nationwide

Many are very short shows or they are porerecords.

Nite, Brucie, St John, Tony Hawk, and such are not known nationwide. There are a number of names on your list I have never heard, in fact, and I am in radio. XM nd Sirius have nearly 300 channels between them, and you name a dozen people, many of whom were known only in one market.

for many of them, and there are many, many more. You hate sat radio, good, but take care your own backyard before you start complaining about your competitors, who say are irrelevant or doomed. The customer satisfaction rate with sat radio is much higher than than of terrestrial radio.

Folks love sattelite so much that the two companies lost a billion and a half last year, and the companies are saying they can not survive without merging. The churn rate is increasing dramatically, and satellite has taken only a small tidbit of listening. WiMax is a threat (or opportunity) but satellite is not.

 

[AZJoe]

Too funny, if we just go by age, even if someone as you say "WERE good", then I bet you are irrelevant now too as you are much older. Since when does age have to do with no longer being good?

In most cases, beyond a certain age, the voice starts to go. There is no Viagra for vocal chords. And most people do not want to relive the past, over an over. So the styles of 60´s just sound outdated today to most people.

Oh yeah, Casey Kasem, Howard Stern, Opie & Anthony, Mark Goodman, Alan Hunter, Nina Blackwood, Carol Miller, Emenim, George Clinton, D-Train, Bobby Jay, Willie Nelson, Gamble & Huff, Ophrah, Ken Spyder Webb, Bobby Bennett, Norm N. Nite, Cousin Brucie, Pat St John, Tony Hawk, and on & on all are on Sirius or XM- all great radio people and known in this field and nationwide

Many are very short shows or they are porerecords.

Nite, Brucie, St John, Tony Hawk, and such are not known nationwide. There are a number of names on your list I have never heard, in fact, and I am in radio. XM nd Sirius have nearly 300 channels between them, and you name a dozen people, many of whom were known only in one market.

for many of them, and there are many, many more. You hate sat radio, good, but take care your own backyard before you start complaining about your competitors, who say are irrelevant or doomed. The customer satisfaction rate with sat radio is much higher than than of terrestrial radio.

Folks love sattelite so much that the two companies lost a billion and a half last year, and the companies are saying they can not survive without merging. The churn rate is increasing dramatically, and satellite has taken only a small tidbit of listening. WiMax is a threat (or opportunity) but satellite is not.

Too funny DE, I got a chuckle out of that last one!! LOL Voice goes? LOL None of the above mentioned have lost the voice, but you might have lost something--- sound judgement!! I heard too many years of believing your own posts does that!! Sorry the styles of the 60s are what makes radio popular still, and I know many people in the biz who offer contrary opinions to yours. Sorry again, Norm N. Nite, Pat St John, and especially Tony Hawk (good gads this shows how little you know) are very well known nationally. I think you got left behind somewhere- youd better google Tony Hawk!!! LOL And next, love of sat radio has nothing to do with making a profit, sat radio has grown faster in its first 6 years than the DVD players or VCR players did, and continue to grow by nearly a million subs per quarter! 15.4 million customers is bigger than NYC or LA markets. The churn rate IS NOT increasing dramatically ( I just talked to the person in the know at Sirius about this very thing this past week), and the renewal rate and customer satisfaction rate at both XM and Sirius remain very high ( higher that the rate of satsifaction for your wonderful terrestrial radio). And neither company said they cannot survive with out a merger, in fact that is a direct contradiction, they both have said they CAN & WILL survive without it, but it will be easier to with the merger!!(wishful thinking on your part?) Tsk tsk DE, spreading such falsehoods, shame!!

 

[davideduardo]

Too funny DE, I got a chuckle out of that last one!! LOL Voice goes? LOL None of the above mentioned have lost the voice,

They sound like representatives of a bygone era... like Dikensian English would sound in today's Liverpool.

Sorry the styles of the 60s are what makes radio popular still, and I know many people in the biz who offer contrary opinions to yours.

The fact that, prior to starting to disappear or morph to classic hits, oldies stations in most markets got shares in the 3 to 5 range, means that at any one tome, less than one person in 20 to 25 listend to oldies. Most people in the oldies demos have moved on to something that is not a replay of the school prom.

Sorry again, Norm N. Nite, Pat St John, and especially Tony Hawk (good gads this shows how little you know) are very well known nationally.

The first two have scant, if any, national recognition. Hawk is recognized for skateboards, not for an entertaining radio show. Putting marquee names from other fields on the satellite does more to promote the businesses of the outsiders than to generate audience. What next, Le Iococca doing a Car Guys imitation?

I think you got left behind somewhere- youd better google Tony Hawk!!!

Yeah, lets do a show with Mark Cuban, too. Cult heroes do not make good radio talents.

sat radio has grown faster in its first 6 years than the DVD players or VCR players did, and continue to grow by nearly a million subs per quarter!

I suggest that you listen to the analyst conference calls. Since these have to comply with SEC rules, they do not have the hyperbole of the press releases and publicists. Churn is increasing, and subscriber rates have slowed to considerably less than they were in the first half of last year.

15.4 million customers is bigger than NYC or LA markets.

Most satellite receivers are in cars. Less than a third of radio listening is in the car, so each listener counts as if they were 1/3 of a terrestrial only listener... the listening is a tiny percentage of all radio listening... less, in fact, than the listening of the first few NY radio stations combined.

The churn rate IS NOT increasing dramatically ( I just talked to the person in the know at Sirius about this very thing this past week), and the renewal rate and customer satisfaction rate at both XM and Sirius remain very high ( higher that the rate of satsifaction for your wonderful terrestrial radio).

The Q2 calls should still be online. Christmas 2006 was a disaster, and the subscriptions did not pay for the promotion that failed to make satellite a hit gift item. There will be more iPhones sold by the end of next year than satellite got in its first 5 years.

And neither company said they cannot survive with out a merger, in fact that is a direct contradiction, they both have said they CAN & WILL survive without it, but it will be easier to with the merger!!(wishful thinking on your part?) Tsk tsk DE, spreading such falsehoods, shame!!

They said that it was unlikely the business model could survive without the merger, and they said it at the Congressional hearings. Togehter, they lost a billion and a half last year.

 

[AZJoe]

Ford lost alot last year too, but has turned it around this year, same thing with XM & Sirius, THIS year, they are cutting losses and showing positive cash flow. You go on and be just like the the NAB, claiming sat radio isnt competition, yet at every turn they are condemming it and fighting it, wishing for its demise. Can everyone guess why? I stand by my facts. Have a nice day!!

 

[OldiesCat]

Too funny DE, I got a chuckle out of that last one!! LOL Voice goes? LOL None of the above mentioned have lost the voice,

They sound like representatives of a bygone era... like Dikensian English would sound in today's Liverpool.

Sorry the styles of the 60s are what makes radio popular still, and I know many people in the biz who offer contrary opinions to yours.

The fact that, prior to starting to disappear or morph to classic hits, oldies stations in most markets got shares in the 3 to 5 range, means that at any one tome, less than one person in 20 to 25 listend to oldies. Most people in the oldies demos have moved on to something that is not a replay of the school prom.

Sorry again, Norm N. Nite, Pat St John, and especially Tony Hawk (good gads this shows how little you know) are very well known nationally.

The first two have scant, if any, national recognition. Hawk is recognized for skateboards, not for an entertaining radio show. Putting marquee names from other fields on the satellite does more to promote the businesses of the outsiders than to generate audience. What next, Le Iococca doing a Car Guys imitation?

I think you got left behind somewhere- youd better google Tony Hawk!!!

Yeah, lets do a show with Mark Cuban, too. Cult heroes do not make good radio talents.

sat radio has grown faster in its first 6 years than the DVD players or VCR players did, and continue to grow by nearly a million subs per quarter!

I suggest that you listen to the analyst conference calls. Since these have to comply with SEC rules, they do not have the hyperbole of the press releases and publicists. Churn is increasing, and subscriber rates have slowed to considerably less than they were in the first half of last year.

15.4 million customers is bigger than NYC or LA markets.

Most satellite receivers are in cars. Less than a third of radio listening is in the car, so each listener counts as if they were 1/3 of a terrestrial only listener... the listening is a tiny percentage of all radio listening... less, in fact, than the listening of the first few NY radio stations combined.

The churn rate IS NOT increasing dramatically ( I just talked to the person in the know at Sirius about this very thing this past week), and the renewal rate and customer satisfaction rate at both XM and Sirius remain very high ( higher that the rate of satsifaction for your wonderful terrestrial radio).

The Q2 calls should still be online. Christmas 2006 was a disaster, and the subscriptions did not pay for the promotion that failed to make satellite a hit gift item. There will be more iPhones sold by the end of next year than satellite got in its first 5 years.

And neither company said they cannot survive with out a merger, in fact that is a direct contradiction, they both have said they CAN & WILL survive without it, but it will be easier to with the merger!!(wishful thinking on your part?) Tsk tsk DE, spreading such falsehoods, shame!!

They said that it was unlikely the business model could survive without the merger, and they said it at the Congressional hearings. Togehter, they lost a billion and a half last year.

Game, set, match.