Today's Warm 106.9 tweaks format

[boombox4]

I am a local, and often visit the Seattle board. A lot of the stations in other markets which are brought up here, are brought up by locals. They are comparing similar formatted stations to Seattle stations. Usually its in formats they follow. I've seen it happen over and over.

Such talk can sometimes be interesting. It can point out the differences between similarly formatted stations in Seattle and other markets.

Not everybody here is a pro in the industry. A lot of the guys just are listeners. Some, like myself, either worked in the industry years ago or want to work in the industry. What may be old hat to some is news, or interesting in some way, to many of the rest of us.

 

[davideduardo]

When you need to look things up, such as who owns "196.9," doesn't that say anything to you on your basic knowledge of the market?

Or, in this case, it means that something I typed did not get caught by spell check... for some dyslexics, it is hard to see errors like that because the round shaped letters are confusing. But I would have thought that your grand point could have avoided diving down to the level of the spell police.

The fact is, I know the dial positions of most significant AM and FM station in the larger rated markets, and a pretty good number of the ones in below market 100 sized towns. I'm still catching up with LPFMs and their bizarre channel based calls, though. I used to win money bets at NABs with that rather useless skill...

 

[Robert Biltmore Jennings]

Ironically, Van Morrison has publicly stated he hates Brown Eyed Girl. Even in concerts he plays an alternate arrangement like a slow jazz version. With the switch at WARM are there more 80s songs being played today than in the 80s on Seattle radio? KWSD, KRKO, KJR, KJAQ, KZOK, and KWRM. Not to mention KISM and KAFE out of Bellingham.

And that's because "Today's" music sucks. Let's just be honest. You got a bunch of no talent hip hop wannabe's with this mummble rap that all the songs sound the same and you can't understand a damn word.Over produced with auto tune. The tracks all sound like some kid in a basement with a Casio keyboard and a 8 bit drum machine made them my gosh. Weather it's "Young" somebody or "Lil" whoever or some stripper pole dancing hoochie momma turned rapper, doesn't matter, its the overall quality of the music and the message.

 

[TheBigA]

So having an "intelligent conversation about Seattle radio" does not preclude "outside opinions" because we far too often see the lack of a broader perspective so greatly influencing decisions that, otherwise, a bad premise may lead to a bad radio station.

Reminds me of friends of mine who got upset when Starbucks started expanding beyond the northwest. Rather than see it as a positive, they saw it as something that was once unique to their area that was now fairly common. One could say that about a lot of things. The growing tech industry in Seattle means a lot more outsiders will become locals. Get used to it.

 

[seatownmedia]

Reminds me of friends of mine who got upset when Starbucks started expanding beyond the northwest. Rather than see it as a positive, they saw it as something that was once unique to their area that was now fairly common. One could say that about a lot of things. The growing tech industry in Seattle means a lot more outsiders will become locals. Get used to it.

Seattle is indeed a different market. Some say Boston is quite provincial, but Seattle has them beat. And you see it on this thread! I think the ultimate answer is to understand national trends but also respect the basic principle that there are differences. Seattle has never been a copycat market with radio. Yes, more newcomers might make the market more generic, but to not understand the idiosyncrasies of the market is a fatal mistake.

 

[TheBigA]

Seattle has never been a copycat market with radio.

If that's true then The Breeze will be a big flop.

 

[boombox4]

One of the problems I see in trying to judge the difference in the Seattle market is that there have been "newcomers" in large numbers since the late 1980's. I mean, the population doubled in just 25 years, largely due to newcomers. It's already changing. For example: even though Seattle is a "rock town", Spokane has a sixth of Seattle's population and twice the number of rock stations -- and some of them have been on the air a while, staying alive with all that competition.

 

[Kelly A]

Seattle is indeed a different market. Some say Boston is quite provincial, but Seattle has them beat. And you see it on this thread! I think the ultimate answer is to understand national trends but also respect the basic principle that there are differences. Seattle has never been a copycat market with radio. Yes, more newcomers might make the market more generic, but to not understand the idiosyncrasies of the market is a fatal mistake.

Yeah, I don't buy that argument. Folks from Seattle, me being one, seem to think they're so unique and their radio stations follow the same model. Maybe back in the 60's and 70's that was true. Seattle was certainly a different, less racially-diverse town then, with stations owned by Northwest-based companies. Tacoma was a separate market that thought it was competing with Seattle. Once the areas were merged into one market and national group owners started buying up stations in 1996, any individuality went away. Profitable formats perform just as well in Market 13 as they do in Market 3.

 

[TheBigA]

Once the areas were merged into one market and national group owners started buying up stations in 1996, any individuality went away. Profitable formats perform just as well in Market 13 as they do in Market 3.

Agreed. It's also hard to talk about the nationalization of radio formats without also mentioning the internationalism of record labels that took place around the same time. RCA and Columbia were sold to foreign conglomerates in 1988, and Universal was sold five years later. The explosion of grunge music still had label support. That wouldn't happen now. There is still local music, but it doesn't have the impact it did before the labels were sold. So local musicians simply don't get the support they once received, and as a result, don't get the kind of radio airplay they might have received if everything was still either local or regional.

 

[Kelly A]

Agreed. It's also hard to talk about the nationalization of radio formats without also mentioning the internationalism of record labels that took place around the same time. RCA and Columbia were sold to foreign conglomerates in 1988, and Universal was sold five years later. The explosion of grunge music still had label support. That wouldn't happen now. There is still local music, but it doesn't have the impact it did before the labels were sold. So local musicians simply don't get the support they once received, and as a result, don't get the kind of radio airplay they might have received if everything was still either local or regional.

Good point. In the 80's and barely spanning into the early 90's there were many more independent record labels. Most of the successful small indie labels sold-out to larger labels, who then were merged or sold to foreign conglomerates. Some independent labels of the day hitched their wagon to one or two artists. Once those artists faded into aged obscurity, so did the label. Fast forward in time to today; Pop and Rock artists are getting followers from producing YouTube videos from their bedrooms.

 

[TheBigA]

Fast forward in time to today; Pop and Rock artists are getting followers from producing YouTube videos from their bedrooms.

Exactly. They can make a pretty good living from YouTube royalties and continuous touring, but local radio airplay isn't part of their plan. Radio promotion is time consuming and expensive. All the bands want is to drive viewers to their videos and people to their club dates. Maybe lock in a slot at Coachella. It's a completely different culture from 30 years ago. That relationship that once existed between radio and records really only exists now in country music.

 

[davideduardo]

That relationship that once existed between radio and records really only exists now in country music.

And also in all forms of Spanish language music in the US and Latin America as well as with much of the Urban and Urban AC forms.

 

[TheBigA]

Having said all that, when you have a station such as KEXP that does outreach into the musical community, there is a direct relationship that can be built that bypasses the record label. That's what makes that station so unique. However, we see similar things with WFUV in New York and other non-coms around the country. All of it exists directly between radio and music, and requires the staff to be in the demo and life group, which is hard to do in the commercial world. The lack of record label support and the lack of national ownership keeps the music from having the larger impact it might have received 30 years ago.

 

[seatownmedia]

Yeah, I don't buy that argument. Folks from Seattle, me being one, seem to think they're so unique and their radio stations follow the same model. Maybe back in the 60's and 70's that was true. Seattle was certainly a different, less racially-diverse town then, with stations owned by Northwest-based companies. Tacoma was a separate market that thought it was competing with Seattle. Once the areas were merged into one market and national group owners started buying up stations in 1996, any individuality went away. Profitable formats perform just as well in Market 13 as they do in Market 3.

Yes, Kelly, the market has indeed changed. But I still maintain there are certain differences that some operators should be aware of. The market is still mostly made up of a caucasian population, with asian as the the second largest racial segment. Could this explain why "The Sound" is doing well? Seattle also still tends to be a passive/aggressive area, so "in your face", or "aggressive" formats don't do as well here. Just some thoughts...

 

[AM FM listener]

Regarding differences between markets, I recently moved from LA to Seattle. Here are my initial observations. Seattle is one of the few large US metro areas with a predominantly non-hispanic white population. As such, Spanish language and Urban formats have insignificant shares of this market. There are two Rhythmc stations of note (KUBE and KHTP) but that's about it. So, that leaves room on the dial for two maintream AC's (KWRM and KSWD), two Country's (KKWF and KNUC), and two Rock's (KISW and KZOK) to battle with each other. Don't see that in LA. There are also highly rated NPR, Sports and Christian stations up here...also not in LA. To me, Seattle and LA, the cities and the radio, have very little in common. But, that is what makes my move so interesting. Seattle is a whole new adventure, in radio, and in general! Viva la difference!

 

[crainbebo]

Well, there's a couple things in common - they both have awful traffic all day, every weekday, and in whole the metropolitan area leans liberal (thus the high ratings for KUOW). Speaking of, I wonder why Pacifica has never had a Seattle station? 102.9 is in the trust, it would be an easy place to put an affiliate, ala KPFK in L.A.
Young, city folk listen to country music nowadays, thus the fight between 100.7 and 98.9. You don't see a lot of teenagers growing up on farms, that go to Florida Georgia Line concerts. Now the suburban young adults and teens love it. It's been that way since Garth started his career and it won't change.
The Spanish population is growing, but it's not like the population here in central Washington. 20% of Burien is Hispanic, and there's large populations south of Seattle and in places like Monroe.
And then there's the pillow fight of The Sound and WARM. I never would have thought seeing 94.1 beating 106.9 in a format that wasn't country, let alone Soft AC with plenty of 1980s and 1970s music.

 

[davideduardo]

Speaking of, I wonder why Pacifica has never had a Seattle station? 102.9 is in the trust, it would be an easy place to put an affiliate, ala KPFK in L.A.

Pacifica is in an era of hard financial times. Their NYC station had to move off the ESB because they could not pay the rent. They don't have money, and they have very few listeners.

 

[davideduardo]

Could this explain why "The Sound" is doing well?

Miami is over 50% Hispanic. WFEZ, the original of this format's current breed, has nearly 60% Hispanic listeners. Over 80% of them are Spanish dominant.

 

[TheBigA]

I wonder why Pacifica has never had a Seattle station? 102.9 is in the trust, it would be an easy place to put an affiliate, ala KPFK in L.A.

KBCS has a lot in common with a typical Pacifica station, although it's owned by Bellevue College. They run Democracy Now, which is the flagship Pacifica news program (although not actually owned by Pacifica). People who might listen to Pacifica in LA would likely enjoy KBCS. As noted, Pacifica itself doesn't have the funds to actually buy radio stations any more. They're struggling to keep the five they own on the air.

 

[semoochie]

Pacifica is in an era of hard financial times. Their NYC station had to move off the ESB because they could not pay the rent. They don't have money, and they have very few listeners.

This is a little bit strange: There is no indication that the construction permit was ever built out at Four Times Square. The only 302 is for an auxiliary location at ESB but that flies in the face of not being able to afford space there!