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WABC ratings collapse

Gregg. said:
Several problems are happening at the same time to hurt Talk Radio.

1) The current crop of Talk hosts are aging. Younger listeners don't want to hear the steady diet of non-stop far-right conservative political talk. There's more to talk about than national politics. But because that's what Rush does, and he's been so successful, that's all you hear on Talk Radio, except for Dave Ramsey and Clark Howard doing family financial talk, on some stations.

2) Most Talk Radio stations are on AM. Young people will listen to AM when they have a product that appeals to them. KNBR San Francisco, home of the Giants baseball team, is currently #1 in that market and doing well 25-54. But in most places, there are almost no AM stations scoring any sort of 25-54 numbers. So that's why AM Talk Radio is filled with "You Kids Get Off My Lawn" older Talk programming.

3) Talk Radio does OK in medium and smaller markets, especially where there's no All-News station. Outside the top ten markets, the station that runs Rush also has the largest news team. If you're in Orlando or San Antonio, you almost have to listen to Rush and Hannity if you want top of the hour news, weather and traffic. But in large markets, Talk Radio loses badly to All-News stations.

4) In many large markets, Talk Radio also loses to the NPR station and All-Sports stations. Many of those stations are on FM while Rush and his clones are on AM. Younger people in more urban markets tune to All Things Considered, Morning Edition, Fresh Air, etc. instead of Hannity, Levin, Savage. And young men are getting their non-music programming from Sports stations, with local talk about local teams, plus Dan Patrick and Jim Rome.

5) Talk Radio has failed to produce any hosts of appeal to younger listeners. Even younger Talk hosts like Andy Dean and Rusty Humphries can sometimes talk about topics of interest to younger listeners. But they MUST have exactly the same political opinions as Rush. They might be 20 or more years younger. But because they're on All-Conservative-All-The-Time stations, they have to agree with Rush on nearly everything.

6) The Hot Talk format has failed even worse than conventional Talk Radio. Let's remember there used to be FM Hot Talk stations in many large markets, with Howard Stern as the morning show. When he left terrestrial radio, the Hot Talk format collapsed, with only a few Hot Talk stations, nearly all in Florida, still functioning. In some cases Sports radio has taken their place. But in medium and local markets, you got nothing.

7) There's also the Sunbelt problem. It seems nobody in the Sunbelt wants to listen to any sort of non-music programming on the radio, not Talk Radio, not NPR, not Sports. WSB is #1 in Atlanta but all that's about it. Cities like Houston, Dallas, Miami and Tampa have no non-music station in the top 15!
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Yet none of the liberal hosts have been successful.
 
That's right. It's the constant political drumbeat that's turning listeners off, I believe. To the trio of Rush, Hannity and Levin in particular, EVERYTHING has political overtones and the opposing party responsible for any and all problems connected with whatever story it may be. Air America was exactly the same, blaming the other political party.

The solution, IMO, isn't to go back to shows about relationships and gardening and home repair. There are plenty of interesting stories in the news every day, some national and some local, that can be discussed without all the shouting and finger-pointing. And with unique perspective and with humor! That's what NEWS-talk radio should be and, to a much greater extent, was a couple of decades ago.
 
wadio said:
That's what NEWS-talk radio should be and, to a much greater extent, was a couple of decades ago.
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What worked decades ago won't work now. Radio drama worked at one time too. It won't work now. So talking about issues on the radio, regardless of how you do it, has become obsolete. It was killed by message boards like this one.
 
Don't be too sure. Message boards are great for interactive discussion but people are intrinsically lazy (myself included) and want to be passively entertained, at least part of the time. You can't use a message board while actively working, driving, sleeping (or trying to.) There's room for both.
 
wadio said:
Don't be too sure. Message boards are great for interactive discussion but people are intrinsically lazy (myself included) and want to be passively entertained, at least part of the time.
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Unfortunately this kind of talk radio isn't entertaining. Not even passively entertaining.
 
No, not the way it's being done by the Rush-Hannity-Levin triple-threat.

But you can't lump them in with Curtis & Kuby, Jerry Doyle, Michael Savage, Jon Grayson, John Gambling, Lisa Wexler, Larry Kudlow, Mike Gallagher and others who can actually get through a segment without ascribing blame to those they perceive to be the enemy.

The elephant in the room is why Rush-Hannity-Levin get consistently higher ratings than hosts who actually know how to entertain and inform.

But if we take off the rose-colored glasses and have a hard look at talk radio of yesteryear, there were only a few great shows on the air at any given time.
 
Like TheBigA mentioned -- I wonder how much the politicization of the internet, especially social media like Facebook (where there are lots of people slinging political mud about), has contributed to political burnout amongst radio listeners.
 
You don't have to wait for your call to be answered in order to express your opinion. It's quick and immediate. Like radio once was. And they don't hang up on you if they don't like what you're saying.
 
But what I'm thinking is people may also encounter politics overload. After you get off the internet, having dealt with a bunch of politics there, how many people want to switch on their radio and hear more of the same? There has to be a point where they just want to tune it all out. Maybe for an increasing number that point where they want to tune all the politics out is when they switch on the radio.
 
mikerock said:
I wonder how much WABC signal contributes to the problem. Anyone else here a constant annoying tone, like they are slightly off frequency?
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I've noticed that heterodyne-like tone on WABC (from a distance) even going back to the Musicradio era. Not sure if it's something that's receiver generated or ?
 
I tend to think the Ratings Drop for this format is related to the fact that the audience is aging and younger folks are not coming in to replace those that are A. No longer here or B. So old they are no longer counted. Same reasoning as updating a Music Format...why do most OLDIES Stations no longer play Pre-Beatles while adding Early 80's on the other end? DEMO's To replace those Older Listeners with New Listeners. Programmers had to realize at some point they'd need to begin to engage folks in their 40's & 50's to replace those who were 50 yrs old 25 years ago.This was inevitable and it is all about CONTENT.
 
Radio is dead...and we know who killed it. Lou Dickey and Bob Pitman to name two!
 
Unregistered said:
Radio is dead...and we know who killed it. Lou Dickey and Bob Pitman to name two!
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Pittman almost blew up WNBC in the late 70s, and somehow he still kept getting hired - always with disastrous results - and getting hired yet again.
 
JPlainJohn said:
I tend to think the Ratings Drop for this format is related to the fact that the audience is aging and younger folks are not coming in to replace those that are A. No longer here or B. So old they are no longer counted. Same reasoning as updating a Music Format...why do most OLDIES Stations no longer play Pre-Beatles while adding Early 80's on the other end? DEMO's To replace those Older Listeners with New Listeners. Programmers had to realize at some point they'd need to begin to engage folks in their 40's & 50's to replace those who were 50 yrs old 25 years ago.This was inevitable and it is all about CONTENT.
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Yes! Problem is 20 plus years ago radio management got addicted to right-wing talk a la Rush. Other styles and hosts were purged. Sports talk was spun off but that's it. And ever since radio management has been unwilling to update the format. Tweak it. Or improve it. The one exception is NJ 101.5 which (until lately) did draw younger listeners and not alienate half the potential audience on purpose. But nobody really wants to give it a real chance. Just like nobody really wanted to give progressive talk a real chance.
 
FredLeonard said:
Just like nobody really wanted to give progressive talk a real chance.
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If you look at the time and money spent on Air America, you'd find that statement to be inaccurate.

At one point, AA had affiliates ranging from 50 kw stations in LA and Miami to 250 watters in Key West. In a few markets, like Portland, it did well for a while, but had a relatively fast fade-out. In others, it never got significant traction. But in all cases, it had a "real chance" because there are simply more reasonably good second tier AMs looking for a viable format than there are options... thus making the will to have progressive talk succeed quite strong.

The problem lies in the extent of the failure when Air America made its attempt: this discourages any further attempt at creating a version that is right for 2014. Add to this the difficulties talk is having from coast to coast in any variant and the outlook for innovation, whether centrist or progressive, looks bleak.
 
FredLeonard said:
Pittman almost blew up WNBC in the late 70s...
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You mean when all music AMs died?

1977, the year Pittman was hired at WNBC, was also the year when national FM shares first topped AM shares.
 
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