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WGN America Vs. Local
- Thread starter oldiesfan6479
- Start date
JayR said:
I remember the Philadelphia TV Guide book would have listings for WWOR like "Kojak" ["Arsenio Hall" may air here]. It was only the last year, before the feed discontinued, that the listings split into 9 and WOR. WOR aired a number of shows like "Night Heat", "Baretta", "Emergency" that I would never have heard about otherwise. I think WGN and WPIX aired more comedies and familiar classics like "Honeymooners" but also a lot of non-classic stuff. The truly suck period was when WCAU 10 (CBS) had rights for "The Cosby Show" when it first came out in syndication, ran it at 4:30 for a year, but ran it after midnight later, WOR couldn't air Cosby b/c of syndex, even though the local NY WWOR aired it, so the entire Philadelphia market except for Trenton and maybe Allentown, was deprived of Cosby for about 4 years until it moved to WTXF 29, and Ch.29 aired it a normal time.
WWOR is available to some Dish Network customers.
ding12 said:
I grew up watching Baretta and Emergency when it aired on the broadcast networks.
Night Heat aired on CBS Late Night but I never knew about it until it aired on WWOR-AEC (where I watched weeknights at 7:00 pm ET).
ding12 said:
Yes. It is available as part of the Superstation Package.
ding12 said:
I have a Hartford / New Haven TVG that was like that -- carrying listings for both the EMI service and the "real" WWOR.
ding12 said:
Apparently, it was a local blackout, as I recall the EMI service carrying Cosby after the feed started. A few years later, however, the EMI feed no longer had Cosby, but it was still on WWOR locally.
b344077 said:
It's funny that you say that, because Comcast in Champaign, Illinois (about 150 miles south) carries both local WGN and WGN America (WGN-A on basic and HD, WGN-L on Digital). Other than that, anyone that carries local WGN outside the Chicagoland area will probably keep it, since WGN is also a CW affiliate and they might not have the network in their local market.
Prais said:
I think the only area of Michigan that gets WGN's local feed is near Benton Harbor in the *extreme* southwestern corner of the state, directly across Lake Michigan from the Loop.
I didn't know there were areas outside the Chicago DMA that carry the local feed, but I have no idea why any company that carries that would switch to WGN America. The local feed is superior in pretty much every way to the superstation, from programming to, you know, actually focusing on Chicago!
cutelittlecaramelkid said:
Most markets carry CW, whether on a regular channel, digital subchannel or cable-only. Champaign has a CW affiliate: WBUI.
schmave said:
The same reason why WGN started a national feed: Syndication Exclusivity.
We'll take the example of WPIX (CW affiliate for NYC). It's available on cable in the Atlantic City/Pleasantville area (part of the Philadelphia tv market). It's blacked out most of the time (save for the news programs). If a SyndEx-proof feed was created for that market or if Comcast, the cable provider, was allowed to fill in the blacked out portions with their choice of programming, it wouldn't be a waste of space. But it is. Instead of shifting WPIX from the analog to the digital lineup, Comcast should have dropped it completely.
If you have to black out a whole bunch of shows on WGN, then I can see it. The Champaign poster didn't say if that's the case. And heck, I'd even put up with that just to be able to see all the Chicago news and sports at my leisure rather than the sub-par programming force-fed to WGN America viewers.
cutelittlecaramelkid said:
Time Warner in Milwaukee and Comcast in Rockford only carry WGN America. If there's surrounding markets that could get away (in a matter of speaking) in carrying the local WGN (and WGN America), it's those two. Milwaukee and Rockford are close enough (at least 85-90 miles away), that could pull in the OTA signal on Channel 9. Of course, those markets already have their own CW affiliates--WVTV in Milwaukee and WREX-DT2 in Rockford. My late grandmother's apartment building in Rockford used one of those MATV systems (circa 1987-88), and not only could pull in her locals (and at the time, there were only four operating in town--WREX, WTVO, WIFR, and WQRF), but also WISC from Madison and local WGN. Oddly enough, an upstairs neighbor not only could receive those mentioned stations, but also three Chicago UHFs (WFLD, WPWR, and WGBO), something my grandma couldn't do.
I would say those two plus South Bend could do it. For markets as far out as Champaign, Fort Wayne and the Quad Cities, it would take some work.
I remember seeing the TV Guide edition that serviced northern Indiana years ago, and it had listings for both WGN-Chicago and the superstation. In those days, the channels weren't nearly as distinct as now, but they were there.
If I'm not mistaken, the local WGN is seen one county away from both Milwaukee and Rockford, but not in those cities themselves.
There has to be some agreement in place that even if somewhere is close enough to pull in Channel 9's OTA signal, the local feed can't be shown on cable (in the U.S.) outside the Chicago DMA. Otherwise I think it'd be shown across a much wider swath of land than it is. Heck, some cable systems in southwest Michigan carry many of the broadcast channels from Chicago (such as 2, 5, 7 and 32) but have WGN America, not 9.
I remember seeing the TV Guide edition that serviced northern Indiana years ago, and it had listings for both WGN-Chicago and the superstation. In those days, the channels weren't nearly as distinct as now, but they were there.
If I'm not mistaken, the local WGN is seen one county away from both Milwaukee and Rockford, but not in those cities themselves.
There has to be some agreement in place that even if somewhere is close enough to pull in Channel 9's OTA signal, the local feed can't be shown on cable (in the U.S.) outside the Chicago DMA. Otherwise I think it'd be shown across a much wider swath of land than it is. Heck, some cable systems in southwest Michigan carry many of the broadcast channels from Chicago (such as 2, 5, 7 and 32) but have WGN America, not 9.
schmave said:
I think the issue is pretty clear: most of the programming on WGN-TV is purchased and licensed exclusively for distribution within the Chicago DMA, and the syndicators who sell that programming sell separate syndication rights to other stations in the South Bend, Rockford, Milwaukee, etc. DMAs.
So if cable systems in those DMAs carried WGN-TV, even on a legacy basis, they'd be compelled to black out (syndex) any programming that's duplicated on local stations within their DMAs. That would include the prime-time CW hours, which WCWW and WVTV would surely insist on blacking out.
Scott Fybush said:
Absolutely. When our cable system in Columbus carried WUAB out of Cleveland for many years, eventually it got to the point where it was blacked out more often than not. All news and sports were in the clear, of course, which is the only reason I could see a cable system within reach of pulling in WGN's OTA signal carrying that instead of the superstation.
Quote:
<<<I remember seeing the TV Guide edition that serviced northern Indiana years ago, and it had listings for both WGN-Chicago and the superstation. In those days, the channels weren't nearly as distinct as now, but they were there.>>>
We had the same thing with the TV Guide distributed in Milwaukee. I always found it interesting to see when the local and superstation feeds had identical programming. (As time went on, there were fewer and fewer similarities, with the exception of sports and the noon and 9 p.m. newscasts.)
Quote:
<<<If I'm not mistaken, the local WGN is seen one county away from both Milwaukee and Rockford, but not in those cities themselves.>>>
The local WGN is not carried in Milwaukee. I might be wrong, but I believe the Time Warner system in Kenosha, Wis., carries the local feed. I know they carry many of the Chicago locals, in addition to the Milwaukee ones. (I'm jealous of them!)
<<<I remember seeing the TV Guide edition that serviced northern Indiana years ago, and it had listings for both WGN-Chicago and the superstation. In those days, the channels weren't nearly as distinct as now, but they were there.>>>
We had the same thing with the TV Guide distributed in Milwaukee. I always found it interesting to see when the local and superstation feeds had identical programming. (As time went on, there were fewer and fewer similarities, with the exception of sports and the noon and 9 p.m. newscasts.)
Quote:
<<<If I'm not mistaken, the local WGN is seen one county away from both Milwaukee and Rockford, but not in those cities themselves.>>>
The local WGN is not carried in Milwaukee. I might be wrong, but I believe the Time Warner system in Kenosha, Wis., carries the local feed. I know they carry many of the Chicago locals, in addition to the Milwaukee ones. (I'm jealous of them!)
JayR said:
In the digital space, it takes up less space. I don't why Comcast kept it though. I know WPIX news has some appeal, but its still from over 80-100 miles away (50-70 range is different (Lehigh Valley is different).
From a business standpoint, I think it'd be Fios, that could likely come up with the idea for carrying WWOR and WPIX in some of the east coast markets. Carry WWOR and WPIX on a number of adjacent market lineups, run a blue slate during syndex hours and put some light jazz MusicChoice music in the background. Atleast they'd be offering the news and local programming (WWOR has some targeted to NJ). Fios is all about boosting the channel count, promotions, to try to chip away marketshare from cable, DirecTV, Dish. They carry the national YES feed in South Jersey but its just Yankees documentaries, pre-game, post-game and no live sports (because we're in Phillies territory).
ding12 said:
I am also assuming that in the wintertime, no live Nets games because you are in Sixers territory, also?
milwaukee_dave said:
You are correct. According to the Time Warner Website, the local WGN is carried in Kenosha and Racine. Matter of fact, 6 Chicago stations (WBBM, WMAQ, WLS, WGN, WTTW and WFLD, the CBS, NBC, ABC, CW, PBS and FOX stations, respectively) are carried on Time Warner's basic cable.
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