C
crow
Guest
When the all Pavarotti format becomes financially viable on terrestrial radio let me know.
BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Brilliant!
BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Brilliant!
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What Format is Lubbock Most in Need of?
- Thread starter DMcCloy
- Start date
C
cspotrun
Guest
CTHank said:Did anyone ever come up with the answer (or even a viable suggestion) to the original question?
i would pick a format that isn't Duplicated, right now of the existing formats there is only ONE that is NOT duplicated...can you guess which one?
as far as Hispanic stations, YA there ARE TOO many and the REASON i say that is BECAUSE NO ONE APPEARS TO BE LISTENING TO THEM!!! if there were only ONE hispanic station it MIGHT be in the top 4 or 5 of stations, but look at the dismal numbers ALL these hispanic stations get, i don't know how they can pay the light bill..
Back to the original topic....some of my random thoughtsCTHank said:Did anyone ever come up with the answer (or even a viable suggestion) to the original question?
1) As the original post stated, a modern rock station seems to be the biggest format hole to take a dent out of FMX. Seems that a lot of younger males listen to FMX out of default since they are the only station to play current rock. Could work in a college town like Lubbock. However, the state of modern rock is not all that great. The format has lost stations in New York and Chicago during July.
2) Some sorta rhythmic station to compete with 104.9 The Beat. When a "rimshot" station gets better ratings than most of the Class C1 stations with transmitters in the city limits tells me there is room for competition for a similar station, either directly or as a flanker. 97.3/104.3 had some moderate ratings going head to head with The Beat a few years ago. The rhythmic AC fad seems to have come and gone. Would Lubbock support an urban or urban AC that targets African-Americans?
3) Adult/Variety hits to compete with Cool 98, which is gradually filtering more 80s product. Walker did this on a rimshot circa 2008 with the syndicated Jack FM format. I enjoyed listening to that, but had a marginal signal. The identical format has been getting pretty decent ratings up the road in Amarillo. Since Mix 100 is no longer playing any 80s (they used to frequently do Totally 80s Weekends before heading toward CHR) and few 90s titles, there is now more of a hole for 80s and 90s pop/rock.
4) AAA would be a nice addition, but would be very skeptical it would work. Commercial AAA doesn't seem to work anywhere in Texas, outside of Austin. Perhaps a AAA/Hot AC hybrid could work to make it seem more mainstream and commercially appealing than most AAAs.
C
cspotrun
Guest
and don't get me wrong i don't care HOW MANY Hispanic stations Lubbock has, it just means THAT MANY more stations who will NOT be competing for MY audience! or my stations revenue.
its kind of funny actually, most of the stations in the top 6 or 7 have a LARGER Hispanic audience than the majority of Hispanic stations vying for that demographic, but yet NONE of these stations 'Get It"! hope they never change.
formats... The "Jack" experiment failed for several reasons not so much the music...it was because it was "CANNED" without Live-Local-Personalities and the approach was "Snarky".
it might work otherwise here.
no one will make any money or get ratings with AAA- let the colleges do it.
by the way... shouldn't someone pull the plug on "Stars"... the lights seem to be out at Ramar.
its kind of funny actually, most of the stations in the top 6 or 7 have a LARGER Hispanic audience than the majority of Hispanic stations vying for that demographic, but yet NONE of these stations 'Get It"! hope they never change.
formats... The "Jack" experiment failed for several reasons not so much the music...it was because it was "CANNED" without Live-Local-Personalities and the approach was "Snarky".
it might work otherwise here.
no one will make any money or get ratings with AAA- let the colleges do it.
by the way... shouldn't someone pull the plug on "Stars"... the lights seem to be out at Ramar.
The "Jack" experiment failed for several reasons not so much the music...it was because it was "CANNED" without Live-Local-Personalities and the approach was "Snarky".
it might work otherwise here.
[/quote]
The "jack" format failed because that is the Jack format ......not localized, canned, no live personalities, and snarky ...if you license this format, that is what it is ..
it might work otherwise here.
[/quote]
The "jack" format failed because that is the Jack format ......not localized, canned, no live personalities, and snarky ...if you license this format, that is what it is ..
WhoDat! said:formats... The "Jack" experiment failed for several reasons not so much the music...it was because it was "CANNED" without Live-Local-Personalities and the approach was "Snarky".
it might work otherwise here.
Jack seems to work well 'canned' in Dallas, "snarky" and all. http://ratings.****************/cgi-bin/rol.exe/arb024
I liked it here in Lubbock, perhaps it failed for other reasons here.
C
cspotrun
Guest
DMcCloy said:well, i guess Dallas is a "Snarky" town, and it doesn't look like it displaced KLUV. i think the music is fine with the format, its the presentation i've never liked, and appearantly Lubbock agrees. if someone put a LOCAL spin on it here it might work. there is only ONE format NOT CHALLENGED here as far as i can tell.WhoDat! said:formats... The "Jack" experiment failed for several reasons not so much the music...it was because it was "CANNED" without Live-Local-Personalities and the approach was "Snarky".
it might work otherwise here.
[/quote
Jack seems to work well 'canned' in Dallas, "snarky" and all. http://ratings.****************/cgi-bin/rol.exe/arb024
I liked it here in Lubbock, perhaps it failed for other reasons here.
WhoDat! said:well, i guess Dallas is a "Snarky" town, and it doesn't look like it displaced KLUV. i think the music is fine with the format, its the presentation i've never liked, and appearantly Lubbock agrees. if someone put a LOCAL spin on it here it might work. there is only ONE format NOT CHALLENGED here as far as i can tell.
KLUV classic hits CBS Radio, Inc. - - 5.0 4.7 4.7 1,235,600
KJKK adult hits CBS Radio, Inc. - - 4.1 4.2 4.4 1,246,100
They're from the same company and Jack has a higher cume. I don't imagine displacing KLUV is on their top priority list. They're 5th in the market with a 1.24 million cume.
There have been several discussions in different threads about why Walker dumped Jack in favor of country here in Lubbock. All I'm saying is I enjoyed it and sad it's gone. Having said that, I enjoy the Texas Country station that Walker replaced it with, also. It's live, local and unique. I just wish I could have them both here.
C
cspotrun
Guest
thats a snapshot from i don't know, 1 book & nobody can make it on just cume but regardless, i never saw the logic in cbs running Jack against KLUV, and we know cbs bailed out of Jack in NYC.
when the format came out i always felt it was some kind of "Short Term Fix" for owners who wanted to cut costs, and it has turned out that way, the syndicatged "Jack" doesn't have staying power for the long run, and some of those who have kept the format moved away from the syndication of it and developed a local station with on-air people and some have done ok. one example, indianapolis i think the calls are wjjk(cumulus) the oldies station went away and they have picked up their audience and are in the top 5 or 6 in the market, that is the best example i know, maybe the only example.
as far as Lubbock, all the viable formats are taken with too many Country stations and some of those are sucking air, with younger demo's finding other places to get music, chr is soft along with A/C the Rhythmic stations have taken over most all of the contemporary market.
availible audience older demo's will be the last to leave radio, and they have not yet. news talk is doing well along with nostalgia & Country. i still say there are some nice signals wasted with hispanic formats that are pulling 1's & 2's, i guess they like poverty or losing.
when the format came out i always felt it was some kind of "Short Term Fix" for owners who wanted to cut costs, and it has turned out that way, the syndicatged "Jack" doesn't have staying power for the long run, and some of those who have kept the format moved away from the syndication of it and developed a local station with on-air people and some have done ok. one example, indianapolis i think the calls are wjjk(cumulus) the oldies station went away and they have picked up their audience and are in the top 5 or 6 in the market, that is the best example i know, maybe the only example.
as far as Lubbock, all the viable formats are taken with too many Country stations and some of those are sucking air, with younger demo's finding other places to get music, chr is soft along with A/C the Rhythmic stations have taken over most all of the contemporary market.
availible audience older demo's will be the last to leave radio, and they have not yet. news talk is doing well along with nostalgia & Country. i still say there are some nice signals wasted with hispanic formats that are pulling 1's & 2's, i guess they like poverty or losing.
WhoDat! said:thats a snapshot from i don't know, 1 book & nobody can make it on just cume but regardless, i never saw the logic in cbs running Jack against KLUV, and we know cbs bailed out of Jack in NYC.
when the format came out i always felt it was some kind of "Short Term Fix" for owners who wanted to cut costs, and it has turned out that way, the syndicatged "Jack" doesn't have staying power for the long run, and some of those who have kept the format moved away from the syndication of it and developed a local station with on-air people and some have done ok. one example, indianapolis i think the calls are wjjk(cumulus) the oldies station went away and they have picked up their audience and are in the top 5 or 6 in the market, that is the best example i know, maybe the only example.
as far as Lubbock, all the viable formats are taken with too many Country stations and some of those are sucking air, with younger demo's finding other places to get music, chr is soft along with A/C the Rhythmic stations have taken over most all of the contemporary market.
availible audience older demo's will be the last to leave radio, and they have not yet. news talk is doing well along with nostalgia & Country. i still say there are some nice signals wasted with hispanic formats that are pulling 1's & 2's, i guess they like poverty or losing.
First, each 'book' is a month in Dallas and you see three months in that 'snapshot.' It is obviously a big ratings station in both share and cume there.
I think the Dallas Jack is a good indicator of Jack's viability in the new PPM radio landscape. Jack ran much lower in the overall books in Dallas in the years before PPM, but now runs in the top 5. As for why CBS runs them against each other, they both draw huge ratings which means more agency and national dollars. Why not run them both when they're both doing well?
CBS bailed on Jack in NY because it replaced a NY tradition in WCBS. Jack in Dallas didn't start out with such negative press and they gave Jack in Dallas time to develop. Again, they ran in the top 20 before PPMs and now are in the top 5.
The Jack in Salt Lake City is similar to the one you describe from Indiana. When I drove through SLC I listened and didn't care much for it. The DJ was nothing more than a time and temp guy and it killed the flow. That Jack is 19th in the market.
C
cspotrun
Guest
i think the fact that Jack was "Much Lower" before PPM speaks volumes about PPM which is NOT being embraced by the majority of radio,& PPM is
NOT everywhere, and may not be, the jury is out on that for now. for me Jack & KLUV are going after nearly the same demographic, with KLUV's music trending a little "Younger"- if Jack were not around KLUV might lead the market.
with Jack's eclectic music mix i doubt if it would lead the market if KLUV were not around. many "Oldies" station are ranked #1 with PPM i've yet to see a Jack station do that. with or without Oldies competition. but whatever...
Lubbock and the original question ANYTHING NEW in this market would gain attention, and for those sucking air and wasting electricity right now with nothing to lose...GO FOR IT!
NOT everywhere, and may not be, the jury is out on that for now. for me Jack & KLUV are going after nearly the same demographic, with KLUV's music trending a little "Younger"- if Jack were not around KLUV might lead the market.
with Jack's eclectic music mix i doubt if it would lead the market if KLUV were not around. many "Oldies" station are ranked #1 with PPM i've yet to see a Jack station do that. with or without Oldies competition. but whatever...
Lubbock and the original question ANYTHING NEW in this market would gain attention, and for those sucking air and wasting electricity right now with nothing to lose...GO FOR IT!
WhoDat! said:i think the fact that Jack was "Much Lower" before PPM speaks volumes about PPM which is NOT being embraced by the majority of radio,& PPM is
NOT everywhere, and may not be, the jury is out on that for now. for me Jack & KLUV are going after nearly the same demographic, with KLUV's music trending a little "Younger"- if Jack were not around KLUV might lead the market.
with Jack's eclectic music mix i doubt if it would lead the market if KLUV were not around. many "Oldies" station are ranked #1 with PPM i've yet to see a Jack station do that. with or without Oldies competition. but whatever...
Lubbock and the original question ANYTHING NEW in this market would gain attention, and for those sucking air and wasting electricity right now with nothing to lose...GO FOR IT!
Like them or not, PPMs are reality in the top 50 and the future for everyone else. So if you were running CBS Radio in Dallas, would you drop Jack FM while it's rated #5 in the market with a cume of 2.4 million people just because its sharing listeners with KLUV?
C
cspotrun
Guest
Like them or not, PPMs are reality in the top 50 and the future for everyone else. So if you were running CBS Radio in Dallas, would you drop Jack FM while it's rated #5 in the market with a cume of 2.4 million people just because its sharing listeners with KLUV?
[/quote]
PPM's everywhere? like i said the Jury is still out on that one.
OK, you've captured the Old Geezer demographic using TWO STATIONS, am i the ONLY one who doesn't see the logic in this?
ok then... explain to me CBS flipping Jack to go oldies head to head against WLS-FM in Chicago? so far that isn't working out well.
[/quote]
PPM's everywhere? like i said the Jury is still out on that one.
OK, you've captured the Old Geezer demographic using TWO STATIONS, am i the ONLY one who doesn't see the logic in this?
ok then... explain to me CBS flipping Jack to go oldies head to head against WLS-FM in Chicago? so far that isn't working out well.
WhoDat! said:Like them or not, PPMs are reality in the top 50 and the future for everyone else. So if you were running CBS Radio in Dallas, would you drop Jack FM while it's rated #5 in the market with a cume of 2.4 million people just because its sharing listeners with KLUV?
PPM's everywhere? like i said the Jury is still out on that one.
OK, you've captured the Old Geezer demographic using TWO STATIONS, am i the ONLY one who doesn't see the logic in this?
ok then... explain to me CBS flipping Jack to go oldies head to head against WLS-FM in Chicago? so far that isn't working out well.
[/quote]
Jack FM plays 50% 80's music. Hardly 'Old Geezer.' http://www.dial-global.com/index.php?option=com_wrapper&view=wrapper&Itemid=28
You didn't answer my question. If you were running CBS in Dallas would you drop Jack, the number #5 station in the market?
C
cspotrun
Guest
Like them or not, PPMs are reality in the top 50 and the future for everyone else. So if you were running CBS Radio in Dallas, would you drop Jack FM while it's rated #5 in the market with a cume of 2.4 million people just because its sharing listeners with KLUV?
[/quote]
PPM's everywhere? like i said the Jury is still out on that one.
OK, you've captured the Old Geezer demographic using TWO STATIONS, am i the ONLY one who doesn't see the logic in this?
ok then... explain to me CBS flipping Jack to go oldies head to head against WLS-FM in Chicago? so far that isn't working out well.
[/quote]
1Jack FM plays 50% 80's music. Hardly 'Old Geezer.' http://www.dial-global.com/index.php?option=com_wrapper&view=wrapper&Itemid=28
well, its still 30 year old music and KLUV is playing some 80's as wellwhy does dallas need 2 stations playing the SAME Billy Joel or CCR tunes? in the SAME cluster? i just think you are splitting hairs on the same head.
You didn't answer my question. If you were running CBS in Dallas would you drop Jack, the number #5 station in the market?
[/quote]
i'll answer your question if you answer mine...Yes, either kluv or jack should go, making one of these stations a Monster... i would put my money on kluv trending more 80's... hey, i don't have a dog in this discussion, i'm just trying to understand the demographic duplication...
NOW answer mine...why did cbs flip Jack in Chicago to go head to head with WLS-FM oldies vs oldies? if jack is so great?
[/quote]
PPM's everywhere? like i said the Jury is still out on that one.
OK, you've captured the Old Geezer demographic using TWO STATIONS, am i the ONLY one who doesn't see the logic in this?
ok then... explain to me CBS flipping Jack to go oldies head to head against WLS-FM in Chicago? so far that isn't working out well.
[/quote]
1Jack FM plays 50% 80's music. Hardly 'Old Geezer.' http://www.dial-global.com/index.php?option=com_wrapper&view=wrapper&Itemid=28
well, its still 30 year old music and KLUV is playing some 80's as wellwhy does dallas need 2 stations playing the SAME Billy Joel or CCR tunes? in the SAME cluster? i just think you are splitting hairs on the same head.
You didn't answer my question. If you were running CBS in Dallas would you drop Jack, the number #5 station in the market?
[/quote]
i'll answer your question if you answer mine...Yes, either kluv or jack should go, making one of these stations a Monster... i would put my money on kluv trending more 80's... hey, i don't have a dog in this discussion, i'm just trying to understand the demographic duplication...
NOW answer mine...why did cbs flip Jack in Chicago to go head to head with WLS-FM oldies vs oldies? if jack is so great?
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bhenslee
Guest
You have 2 stations in the Top 5 in market #5...you'd be crazy to mess with that...you leave them alone. In today's environment you have to think more as a cluster, and less as individual stations. CBS/Dallas is doing that. Jack and KLUV make a great tandem. KLUV focuses mainly on the 70s with some 60s and little bit of 80s. Jack focuses on the 80s with a fair amount of 90s and a small amount of 70s. Sure, they share a few titles, but overall they're quite different.
As a 37 year-old male, both Jack and KLUV are in my top 5 Dallas FM presets...Clear Channel has the other 3 (KZPS, KEGL, KDGE). However, unlike the CC stations, Jack and KLUV are also appealing to women, as well.
As a 37 year-old male, both Jack and KLUV are in my top 5 Dallas FM presets...Clear Channel has the other 3 (KZPS, KEGL, KDGE). However, unlike the CC stations, Jack and KLUV are also appealing to women, as well.
C
cspotrun
Guest
but really, if you are cbs wouldn't you rather see KVIL as #5(with younger sellable demographics) than Jack, 3 tenths of a point away from your other upper end station KLUV?Cousin Artie said:You have 2 stations in the Top 5 in market #5...you'd be crazy to mess with that...you leave them alone. In today's environment you have to think more as a cluster, and less as individual stations. CBS/Dallas is doing that. Jack and KLUV make a great tandem. KLUV focuses mainly on the 70s with some 60s and little bit of 80s. Jack focuses on the 80s with a fair amount of 90s and a small amount of 70s. Sure, they share a few titles, but overall they're quite different.
sure, like a GMC pick-up is different than a Chevy pick-up
As a 37 year-old male, both Jack and KLUV are in my top 5 Dallas FM presets...Clear Channel has the other 3 (KZPS, KEGL, KDGE). However, unlike the CC stations, Jack and KLUV are also appealing to women, as well.
WhoDat! said:but really, if you are cbs wouldn't you rather see KVIL as #5(with younger sellable demographics) than Jack, 3 tenths of a point away from your other upper end station KLUV?
Three tenths of a point doesn't really mean that much, especially when you are talking the 12+ numbers. As long as you can sell both of them, why would you change?
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