When KSFO Had Shortwave Stations

[DavidKaye]

WOW! What am I doing up at 4:40am? I'm looking at the SF Public Library's photo collection. I'd been trying to find anything about KSFO's shorwave stations, KWID and KWIX from World War II. These stations later became the Voice of America. The transmitter site is in Butchertown on Islais Creek, east of 3rd Street. Today the KSFO plant has 2 towers (directional), but in those days they had 1 tower. It's on the right in the photo. The other towers are the array for KWID and KWIX.

Here's a link to the photo: http://www.flickr.com/photos/37986384@N00/8265992751/in/photostream

For more history of KWID/KWIX: http://www.bayarearadio.org//schneider/ksfo.shtml It's toward the bottom of the page, along with a staff photo in front of the transmitter building.

 

[LKellerIII]

Thanks, David - I will check that out.

I definitely recommend the SF Library's online photo collection. I live in Bernal Heights, and was very interested in the history of the neighborhood for awhile. Sure enough, the Library website had dozens of great photos of Bernal from around the turn of the 20th century forward. I even found a picture of my block (including my house) taken in 1940 after a big rain had washed out the street - which was unpaved at that time. Great stuff.

 

[landtuna]

Thanks, David - I will check that out.

I definitely recommend the SF Library's online photo collection. I live in Bernal Heights, and was very interested in the history of the neighborhood for awhile. Sure enough, the Library website had dozens of great photos of Bernal from around the turn of the 20th century forward. I even found a picture of my block (including my house) taken in 1940 after a big rain had washed out the street - which was unpaved at that time. Great stuff.

SFGate has an interesting write-up of Bernal Heights as well as other S.F. neighborhoods:

http://www.sfgate.com/neighborhoods/sf/bernalheights/

 

[DavidKaye]

Thanks, David - I will check that out.

The thing about SF's shortwave past and small station past is that few photographs are labeled. For instance, the photo I linked to says nothing about KWID/KWIX or KSFO. The only reason I happen to know that the towers are of those stations is because I recognize the landscape and it comes from a collection taken in the Butchertown neighborhood. KSFO has/had a meat rendering plant right next door, and until the early 1990s the place stunk so badly you'd get ill.

I had been looking for several years for photos of the shortwave part of the site, but really couldn't find anything because neither newspaper people nor historians took much note of radio stations that weren't all that popular with the masses. Sure, we can find stuff about the early days of KGO, KPO, KYA, etc., but not much about these.

SF has a bunch of connection to shortwave. The Voice of America Dixon plant was part of NBC's shortwave fleet that was operated from San Francisco. (KNBA, KNBC, KNBI, KNBX were the callsigns.)

The Japanese surrender in World War II was taken down in Morse code by an RCA receiving station on South Van Ness Avenue and Mission, where there's now a storage warehouse. I believe this was part of the Bolinas/Marshall shortwave complex.

And of course, there's KGEI, which had been built for the Treasure Island World's Fair in 1939, at a time when GE felt that shortwave (not FM) was the wave of the future. But, hedging their bet, GE also built the station that became KALW 91.7, and also presented it at that World's Fair. KGEI was moved to the NBC lot next door to KPO (KNBR), where it existed until 1994, and KALW was given to the SF school district, where it continues to operate 24 hours a day.

 

[Tom Wells]

The whole world wanted to use shortwave in the 1930s. I have a globe where the major shortwave stations of each city
are shown. Then world war two came along, and governments decided it was more important to control information
and create propaganda.

The United States government more or less seized control of all US shortwave facilities.

We like to think that such stations were relinquished "voluntarily", but such voluntary actions was actually backed by
threat of outright seizure.

The only existing example of "prior restraint of the press" was the VOA, in order to make sure that
there was no mixing of messages internally within the US versus externally.

I wish I could have heard what shortwave was like before WWII.
It must have been great while it lasted.

 

[DavidKaye]

We like to think that such stations were relinquished "voluntarily", but such voluntary actions was actually backed by
threat of outright seizure.

The story has it that FDR actually begged Wesley Dumm of KSFO to build KWID (aka Wesley I Dumm) and KWIX and then lease them to the government. This is what John Schneider says, anyway, and he's been very accurate with this stuff. From what I know, KWID/IX didn't exist prior to WWII.

I wish I could have heard what shortwave was like before WWII.
It must have been great while it lasted.

I can tell you what it was like in the mid-60s when WRUL (later WNYW and now Family's WYFR) was a commercial station. It was a CBS affiliate and did the hourly newscasts. As I remember they had a lot of cigar ads and ads from airlines. It wasn't an especially engaging station, just your basic full service station of the kind the KSFO and its ilk were in that era.

 

[Tom Wells]

We like to think that such stations were relinquished "voluntarily", but such voluntary actions was actually backed by
threat of outright seizure.

The story has it that FDR actually begged Wesley Dumm of KSFO to build KWID (aka Wesley I Dumm) and KWIX and then lease them to the government. This is what John Schneider says, anyway, and he's been very accurate with this stuff. From what I know, KWID/IX didn't exist prior to WWII.

I wish I could have heard what shortwave was like before WWII.
It must have been great while it lasted.

I can tell you what it was like in the mid-60s when WRUL (later WNYW and now Family's WYFR) was a commercial station. It was a CBS affiliate and did the hourly newscasts. As I remember they had a lot of cigar ads and ads from airlines. It wasn't an especially engaging station, just your basic full service station of the kind the KSFO and its ilk were in that era.

From about 1936, the movement toward "government controlled" shortwave increased.

It's quite believable that FDR would be happy to have commercial networks build shortwave facilities.
By the mid thirties it must have been clear to governments that they would need them to influence world opinion.

I do remember what radio was like in the 1960s, but the only good example I know of a 1930s aircheck was WJSV Washington DC, that recorded
a whole day's worth of radio in something like 1936. It's fascinating. I bought a 12 cassette album at the Smithsonian Institute.
I especially like the live remote ballroom dance bands near the end of the broadcast.

 

[DavidKaye]

It's easy to understand that a government would want to control international broadcasting during wartime. In fact, during World War I, the Department of Commerce shut down or commandeered what there was of radio stations at the time. San Jose Calling (KQW, KCBS) was one such station shut down during that period.

Still, shortwave was never a great success as a commercial medium. After the war, some stations were turned back to private use such as KGEI, KWID/KWIX, etc. KGEI was run as a radio ministry because as a commercial broadcaster under GE ownership it just couldn't make it. WINB Red Lion sold/sells time to Bible programs and hucksters. WRUL couldn't succeed as a commercial station under numerous owners, and finally was sold to Family.

Latter-day SWBCers such as KUSW in Salt Lake City and WRNO in New Orleans, tried valiantly with rock formats, which were actually very good (especially KUSW) and both had good signals over the U.S., but they couldn't make a go of it, either.

KUSW: http://www.deseretnews.com/article/136380/LA-FIRM-BUYS-SUPERPOWER-KUSW-FOR-2-MILLION.html?pg=all

KGEI, of course, was simply dismantled and its equipment sold or given away by FEBC because the station's allocation and goodwill had no value.

Here's a great story about KGEI, including the forgotten phone line that linked KGEI to the VOA headquarters, where it was used during the Cuban missile crisis. http://www.mattmanos.com/radio/KGEI_history.pdf

 

[landtuna]

The Japanese surrender in World War II was taken down in Morse code by an RCA receiving station on South Van Ness Avenue and Mission, where there's now a storage warehouse. I believe this was part of the Bolinas/Marshall shortwave complex.

There is quite a distance between Van Ness Ave & Mission Blvd and the little towns of Bolinas and Marshall in western Marin County.

How could they have existed together back in the 40's to form a shortwave "complex"?

During the 60's I worked for PacTel in Marin and the old-timers used to tell stories of telephone plant in far west Marin in the "old days" and best I can remember they used exposed copper pairs and the whole plant was manual. Even in the 60's there was but one very small unmanned "central office" out there that served the whole very rural area.

 

[KeithE4]

It's easy to understand that a government would want to control international broadcasting during wartime. In fact, during World War I, the Department of Commerce shut down or commandeered what there was of radio stations at the time. San Jose Calling (KQW, KCBS) was one such station shut down during that period.

The Federal government also prohibited the use of radio receivers by the public during WW1. Civilian use of radio wasn't reauthorized until April 1919, several months after the end of the war.

 

[Tom Wells]

From what I've read, amateur radio operators actually had to turn over their equipment to the government for the
duration of world war one, and it was returned afterward.

 

[KeithE4]

From what I've read, amateur radio operators actually had to turn over their equipment to the government for the duration of world war one, and it was returned afterward.

Correct. So did the commercial operators and private (non-ham) receiver owners. Anything that the Navy or War Departments couldn't use was sealed. And, of course, some of it didn't survive the war.

 

[DavidKaye]

There is quite a distance between Van Ness Ave & Mission Blvd and the little towns of Bolinas and Marshall in western Marin County.

How could they have existed together back in the 40's to form a shortwave "complex"?

Remote control of radio stations wasn't a new thing in the 1940s. Shortwave and longwave stations, especially, often had separate transmitter and receiver sites. There's the pairing of Marshall and Bolinas; there is also the pairing of Palo Alto and the site along Highway 1 a few miles south of Half Moon Bay.

Here's relevant info from the SFhistory website:

"The RCA commercial shortwace station was headquartered in the RCA Overseas Communications building on the southeast corner of Mission St. and Van Ness Ave., South, in the South-of-Market district of San Francisco. The transmitter was in Marin County.

The station had relayed thousands of important messages during the war, including Army messages between Honolulu and Washington immediately following the attack at Pearl Harbor. It also relayed correspondent reports for NBC and CBS from the Pacific Theater of Operations. "

 

[LKellerIII]

SFGate has an interesting write-up of Bernal Heights as well as other S.F. neighborhoods:

http://www.sfgate.com/neighborhoods/sf/bernalheights/

Thanks for that, Landtuna. Nice article. There's one thing I found curious - "In the 1980s Bernal Heights had a reputation as a dangerous place to venture, notorious as a place to dodge crackheads or at least get your car radio stolen."

If Bernal had that reputation, nobody ever told me. I've been there since 1978, and I never even saw a crackhead, much less had to "dodge one." Never lost a car radio either, though I had one neighbor who had her car stolen. We had a couple of serious gun-toting criminals mugging people in the neighborhood, but that was about 2010 and they were caught.

 

[MC]

didn't ksfo make up part of the early adf navigation system? ?? http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/basic-nav-general.htm

 

[DavidKaye]

If Bernal had that reputation, nobody ever told me. I've been there since 1978, and I never even saw a crackhead, much less had to "dodge one." Never lost a car radio either, though I had one neighbor who had her car stolen. We had a couple of serious gun-toting criminals mugging people in the neighborhood, but that was about 2010 and they were caught.

I lived in Bernal from 1994 to 2001 and the place was notorious for crime. Lots of stores on Cortland had bars on their windows. In fact the JC Laundry still has a vertical steel pipe across the door to keep people from walking off with their clothes baskets. I remember when Nikko's, now the Moonlight Cafe, had bars across their windows.

But meanwhile, back to San Francisco Radio: Bernal Heights no longer has the radio/TV relay towers they used to have up at the top, those microwave scoops that were notorious from the 1950s until recently. Why not? Broadcasters no longer use that technology to relay their shows. Used to be that telco had to have microwave relay towers about every 26 to 30 miles across the country just to relay programming.

Suddenly one day about a year ago I noticed that a lot of junk had been taken off AT&T's antenna farm at the top of Bernal. I was amazed. I checked in with a friend who does microwave towers and he said yes, they've been dismantled all over.

This is what I'm talking about: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Hogg_horn_antennas.jpg

 

[weav]

Suddenly one day about a year ago I noticed that a lot of junk had been taken off AT&T's antenna farm at the top of Bernal. I was amazed. I checked in with a friend who does microwave towers and he said yes, they've been dismantled all over.

This is what I'm talking about: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Hogg_horn_antennas.jpg

Yup, pretty much everything's on fiber now.

 

[landtuna]

What's really amazing is those microwave repeaters worked on a quarter-watt to about 2.5 watts.

 

[cd637299]

Concerning the former WNYW.....I thought that the US gubmint banned advertising on SW from WWII until the heyday of WRNO, who I thought "found a loophole" to find a way to advertise.

I have a relative who listened to WNYW in the late 60s (somewhere in the 15 MHz range), and I vaguely remember the station, but I sure don't recall any commercials. Any airchecks available online?

BTW does anybody recall, right after WNYW went off, maybe about 1970, where there was only a loop announcement---sounded like a middle aged woman, saying something like "................This station is located in New York City." If anyone remembers, what was said prior to that, in the loop? And, was that indeed the ex WNYW, or another station altogether?

cd

 

[DavidKaye]

Concerning the former WNYW.....I thought that the US gubmint banned advertising on SW from WWII until the heyday of WRNO, who I thought "found a loophole" to find a way to advertise.

Nope, after the Korean War in 1953 the government cancelled their agreements (which were in effect LMA agreements or leases) with many stations and the stations went various ways. Wesley Dumm of KSFO/KWID said in 1971 that given the failure of both NBC and CBS to make any money on shortwave, he decided to dismantle his shortwave and sold it all to FEBC (later owner of KGEI). GE operated KGEI between 1953 and its sale to FEBC in 1960, but I can't find any info about anything they did on the station except for some kind of radio classroom thing in connection with Stanford.

WRUL (aka WNYW) went back to commercial broadcasting.

I am just old enough to remember when the VOA was still using the callsigns of its formerly commercial stations. "This is the Voice of America transmitter WLWO, Bethany Ohio" and "This is the Voice of America transmitter, KCBR, Delano California". Now, in 1963 they dropped the callsigns, but I'm not sure if that was because they bought the stations at the time or they had bought them previously and just kept legacy callsigns. I believe 1963 was also the year VOA Greenville went on the air, and they never had a callsign. I also believe that Greenville and Monrovia Liberia were the only two VOA sites actually built by the VOA rather than acquired from a commercial broadcaster or leased from a government agency in another country.