Who Won The Auction?

[oldiesfan6479]

So...who won the auction for the "big" 1190? ;D

 

[Radio_Eng]

David,

I'm a major market broadcaster. I dreaded today's radio problems back in the 80s when corporate consolidation and its implications began to raise its monstrous head. I understood when I saw broadcast stations taken over by Investment Entities, that over time we would witness a terrible loss of humanity and creativity in broadcasting, and would see the dissollution of our proud profession. The loss of jobs for real talent in every phase of radio is truly lamentable. The poverty of basic skills in broadcasting is glaringly apparent. In the 80s, warnings to our new Corporate Masters were predictably unheeded. So, welcome to the new world! My nightmare then is your reality now.

What corporate culture has done to our country is cheapen it in nearly every manner possible. Radio is only one small reflection of what that culture has done to us as a people. The "lowest common denominator" is a valid accusatory expression. In Broadcasting, the "Last DJ" is the guy who made a difference by adding the personal human element to radio. He's all but dead, replaced by cookie cutter models with little redeeming social value; some of which are furthering the "dumbing down" of our nation.

While there are a precious few local voices who could make the grade if left to their own as broadcasters, without "up-and-comers" in local markets, these last few will simply fade away, leaving behind the further encroaching, amoebic, entropic hum of corporate automating machines.

For those of us who know better, we can only be thankful that we lived in radio when it was full of human beings who were fun, exciting, sometimes frustrating, but always meaningful and local. For me, my entry into broadcasting was a life-changing and stimulating experience. Early on, I also worked for some tough, but also some excellent "mom and pop" stations, the bulk of which were vital expressions in their respective communities. Today though, I consider it likely that they have evolved into nationally-connected vending machines.

Seriously David, I appreciate your experience and knowledge, but I also recognize that you are not on the same planet as I. Maybe your planet is happier and blissful. If so, good for you.

By the way, "Elitist" is a code word in the RNC media for "Liberal."

Bill, Two Thumbs Up! Thanks for taking the time to word-smith your views here.

This thread got started with a struggling KNUV. We can only wish them luck in spite of the odds.

 

[Bill Drake]

Sorry, Davy, but you appear to be the one making things up on the fly. Accordingly I am cancelling my participation In this discussion with you. It's like we are talking on two different planes. I see this quite frequently with people on the Reich.

Sorry you had to spend so much time cutting and pasting replies to my last post. After seeing that you are totally oblivious to the Crud Channel 10% personnel cut - saying I made it up and it's not that bad (tell that to someone who lost their job); it's time for this silliness to end.

You are too close to the problem radio faces; also I would recommend you stay away from debating. Hint: just because you post something in an online forum doesn't make it a fact.

Here are more links about the death of radio. Oh yes. I know your standard fare. Because you don't agree with the article, you will attack the messenger. Saw that in your last post. It only diminishes your credibility.

You know what? I spent some time today trying to verify anything you have posted and mostly I just wasted time in my life.

http://longtail.typepad.com/the_long_tail/2005/04/media_meltdown.html



http://www.interesting-people.org/archives/interesting-people/200408/msg00316.html



http://www.businessinsider.com/2008/7/radio-tumbling-faster-than-wall-street-can-track



http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/29/AR2008052903285.html



http://www.allbusiness.com/marketing-advertising/marketing-techniques-media/11792031-1.html



http://insidemusicmedia.blogspot.com/2008/03/radios-losing-strategy.html



http://www.helium.com/items/841311-radio-reviews-assessing-rush-limbaughs-talk-show



http://www.mediapost.com/publications/?fa=Articles.showArticle&art_aid=107357



multiple links in article

http://sideshow.me.uk/annex/Airwaves.htm

Here's one about KINT whipping XEROK

http://www.cramster.com/reference/wiki.aspx?wiki_name=XEROK-AM


Doesn’t mean I didn’t like the station or am demeaning their effort. Just that facts and your orbit don't seem to intersect.

Contact Michael Hagerty about KRIZ. Don't know if he is at Ch. 3 anymore or not. But I am sure he can correct your distorted and inaccurate world view about that station's ratings.


I invite others to respond to this thread, but Dave you and I are finished. Have a nice day.

My apologies to any and all who have had to endure this lengthy but futile attempt at a discussion.

 

[Bill Drake]

David,

I'm a major market broadcaster. I dreaded today's radio problems back in the 80s when corporate consolidation and its implications began to raise its monstrous head. I understood when I saw broadcast stations taken over by Investment Entities, that over time we would witness a terrible loss of humanity and creativity in broadcasting, and would see the dissollution of our proud profession. The loss of jobs for real talent in every phase of radio is truly lamentable. The poverty of basic skills in broadcasting is glaringly apparent. In the 80s, warnings to our new Corporate Masters were predictably unheeded. So, welcome to the new world! My nightmare then is your reality now.

What corporate culture has done to our country is cheapen it in nearly every manner possible. Radio is only one small reflection of what that culture has done to us as a people. The "lowest common denominator" is a valid accusatory expression. In Broadcasting, the "Last DJ" is the guy who made a difference by adding the personal human element to radio. He's all but dead, replaced by cookie cutter models with little redeeming social value; some of which are furthering the "dumbing down" of our nation.

While there are a precious few local voices who could make the grade if left to their own as broadcasters, without "up-and-comers" in local markets, these last few will simply fade away, leaving behind the further encroaching, amoebic, entropic hum of corporate automating machines.

For those of us who know better, we can only be thankful that we lived in radio when it was full of human beings who were fun, exciting, sometimes frustrating, but always meaningful and local. For me, my entry into broadcasting was a life-changing and stimulating experience. Early on, I also worked for some tough, but also some excellent "mom and pop" stations, the bulk of which were vital expressions in their respective communities. Today though, I consider it likely that they have evolved into nationally-connected vending machines.

Seriously David, I appreciate your experience and knowledge, but I also recognize that you are not on the same planet as I. Maybe your planet is happier and blissful. If so, good for you.

By the way, "Elitist" is a code word in the RNC media for "Liberal."

Bill, Two Thumbs Up! Thanks for taking the time to word-smith your views here.

This thread got started with a struggling KNUV. We can only wish them luck in spite of the odds.

Thank you for your kind words. I know that many here probably view me as a sarcastic and somewhat dry SOB with my frequent pokes at the current state of the industry. I only do this because when I first got into radio way back in the 1970's, I quickly learned about the supreme effort and talent it took to run a station. I most appreciated the station engineer(s), because being a Top 40-phile, I knew the efforts of a good engineer could make a station sing. I also appreciated the people who worked their hearts out doing news, sales, and sports play by play (which is probably one of the rarest arts even though I am not into the genre at all).

Remember when you could tap on the window of a station at 3:00 in the morning and there would be a jock, a news person and maybe even an engineer there? Remember when you could call a station and it wasn't an 800 number that went to a corporate phone bank somewhere?

I have mentioned frequently about the reelradio website. Besides the exhibits there, one can find extremely intelligent and informative posts about hundreds of stations that are now just memories; and the people that made radio what it once was. BTW I do not own or have anything to do with that site.

Yes I am old school about things like a licensee serving the community; about local control and/or ownership. About all the things that broadcasters used to have to do just to keep that license.

I saw stations with a 50 share. yes, you read that right. A 50 share. Stations that owned the city they were in. Stations that you didn’t need a radio to hear because everywhere you went, someone else had it tuned in.

I have also read all the excuses about stations with marginal coverage not being able to cut it. That’s another cop out. Most marginal stations offer marginal programming. Why would anyone flock to hear something of no value?

All of that is gone now. Of those who listen, most have a music station tuned in to break the monotony of work or whatever else they might be doing. There are no loyal listeners anymore. Why should there be? Radio has sunk to its lowest common denominator (can you say "homogenized?"). There is no effort made on upgrading, instead everything is done on the cheap and the people who are left to make it work are expendable.

It is inevitable that other forms of entertainment would give radio a run for its money. However that does not mean radio has to throw in the towel by sinking to the level it has today.

Radio has killed itself, or rather the industry has been consumed by the mantle of corporate greed. Radio is just another one of its victims. In the end, it is we the people who have been short changed and who suffer from the actions of the corporatists.

 

[KeithE4]

Speaking as a listener, not as a broadcasting professional, I have one silly question: Other than the requirement for an FCC license, exactly what is the difference between a radio station and any other business, especially those who's parent companies are traded on the stock exchanges?

From what I can see, absolutely nothing. Wall Street today demands huge profits, therefore the revenue has to exceed expenses by what is probably much more than in years past. Therefore, some companies cut the quality of their product and cut their staff to the bone. Customers get mad, take their business elsewhere (Too bad "elsewhere" is doing the exact same thing), and we end up in the s***hole we're currently in. Profit Uber Alles just doesn't work. Profit based on quality products and services does work. The net profit might be less in the short term, but your company will be there for the long term.

I speak from experience, just not in broadcasting. My employer has gotten heavily in debt (and is just now beginning to get out of it) after acquiring 3 competitors in the last 5 years. Newsflash: Debt is BAD!!!! Really BAD!!!! That's what's killing American business today - the "shark" mentality of the last 10-15 years, where CEOs and Boards of Directors were convinced that you had to grow to survive, regardless of the consequences or the means (or the lack thereof) and whether you could afford it or not.

Trouble is, these companies (in radio and otherwise) didn't have the cash-flow to buy, so they borrowed to the hilt. It's payback time now. Revenue is down but those loan payments still have to be paid. And everybody loses - employees, customers, and stockholders alike.

Consider yourself lucky if your company only cut 10% of its staff. Mine cut 60% of our staff and now I do the work of three people (the other two were part of the 60%), and took a pay cut on top of it. Beats having no job at all. Broadcasting and nearly every other business is in the same boat, and will be for awhile.

Now, as far as how to save the radio industry, I can't see it happening until the dust settles and either the debts are paid or bankruptcies declared and companies die if necessary. Then they can start over, probably as privately-held companies. I'm not talking specifically about AM, FM, or HD (although AM can be considered all-but-dead). I'm talking about programming and advertising.

I'm not a programming expert, but something new will have to be developed. I don't know what that "something" is, but smarter people than me should be able to come up with something. Just like radio invented the Disk Jockey 60 years ago when TV started taking away their previous product, it needs to replace the DJ now. The heyday of the DJ was approximately 1950-1990. The great ones from that era have either died (OK, 104-year-old Dick Biondi is still around, but few others are anymore), moved to talk radio, went into TV, or just got out of the business. Sorry, Mr. Dee Jay, your day is done, just like Fibber McGee & Molly's day ended in the early 1950s. And it's not just kids who are annoyed by what passes for "personalities" today. I find them rather annoying myself, and I'm certainly no kid.

Now, as far as ad dollars are concerned, I don't understand to this day why radio hates us old f*rts. We may be more set in our ways, but we do buy cars, beer, and jewelry and lots of them. And I don't want to hear the words "Agencies don't buy old folks." When I hear that, I think "Lazy sales-drones who won't get their fat butts away from their desks and sell their stations."

If the programming is good, the station should be able to sell itself. For the remaining stations that cater to us geezers, why can't KOY (for example) be successful if Clear Channel's sales-people get off their keisters and sell it? Sounds to me like they don't try very hard.

Again, I'm not in the broadcasting industry, but I do work for a living and see parallels between radio and office phone systems (which my employer manufactures). You have to have money and spend it to make money. If your money is tied up servicing debt, then you have a problem. But the surviving stations/companies should be able to come up with some kind of new, interesting programming and should be able to sell it to advertisers, even if it means going door-to-door the old fashioned way.

 

[Bill Drake]

I would stress two points about radio. It uses the commons, (the broadcast spectrum) which gives it unique opportunities as well as responsibilities. Those responsibilities are being neglected in the name of profits.

Mr. D.J. has largely been replaced by voice tracked or homogenous satellite delivered programming. I am speaking more to music formats than talk. Syndicating a talk show across the nation isn’t the same as delivering canned music programming to a location. People who listen to radio for music (used to) interact with a station. Not any more. Music radio (of most genres) is more like filler.

You are correct about the indebtedness of the industry. Paying all those millions to gobble up stations and now the bill has come due.

Want to see change? Reestablish ownership limits. Force corporations to sell off their hundreds of stations within a short time frame. After the dust settles you would see a totally different market than what exists today. A lot of stations would be gone. No loss. It might also be time to think about culling out all those marginal AM stations: meaning the pea-watt and daytimers. Fifty years ago a daytime station could serve a rural or small community just fine. Everyone got up at or slightly before sunrise and went to bed with the chickens. I know. I grew up in an environment like that. No one listened after dark. How does a daytime station offer anything in our 24/7 society that we have today? It's just a thought....

 

[davideduardo]

Newsflash: Debt is BAD!!!! Really BAD!!!!

Managable debt is what has financed American business for more than a hundred years. We use loans to finance seasonal inventory, to open a branch in a new part of town, to install more modern equipment to keep pace with the times...

What has affected this country lately is debt taken on by people who could not repay. Hint: "subprime mortgages" are those given to people who can't repay them.

If a business has a 10% margin, and can borrow for 5%, it makes sense to borrow money so that a business can insure its future.

Trouble is, these companies (in radio and otherwise) didn't have the cash-flow to buy, so they borrowed to the hilt.

Again, there is nothing wrong with debt if it is managed. A person who makes $100 k a year buys a $200 k home, and pays for it over 30 years. It would take 10 years to save the $100 k, and by then the house would cost $120 k or more. So you buy now, confident that the salary will cover the mortgage, and you slowly build equity rather than flushing rent money away. Debt, managed and acquired with intelligence, is a good thing.

Now, as far as ad dollars are concerned, I don't understand to this day why radio hates us old f*rts. We may be more set in our ways, but we do buy cars, beer, and jewelry and lots of them. And I don't want to hear the words "Agencies don't buy old folks."

Agencies don't buy anything that the client did not specify. And clients these days audit agencies on their buys, too. Companies like P&G may spend hundreds of millions researching the consumer, and part of the value of the research is that they know what to instruct their agencies to buy against... and it is essentially never 55+ because there is no ROI on radio advertising to that demo.

A seller can call on the agency every day. The agency has been told by its client what to buy. What agency is going to disobey the client dictate? The agency would be released, and the buyer fired. Save a few rare instances, the agency media buyer has absolutely no ability to change buy demos.

When I hear that, I think "Lazy sales-drones who won't get their fat butts away from their desks and sell their stations."

If you are going to sell a 55+ audience, it will be to local direct. Lower rates, more bad debts, more collection delays, more demands on production, traffic, continuity, etc. If you have a marginal signal, it may make sense, as no big signal will do it. But you will not make much money, if any, in most markets.

For the remaining stations that cater to us geezers, why can't KOY (for example) be successful if Clear Channel's sales-people get off their keisters and sell it? Sounds to me like they don't try very hard.

I'm sure they really do try. But this is the "selling refrigerators to eskimos" situation... nobody wants to buy, because they know that advertising most accounts to 50+ is not cost effective. The client knows their business, and knows who gives the best return on the ad dollar.

 

[99KTKT]

Sorry, Mr. Dee Jay, your day is done, just like Fibber McGee & Molly's day ended in the early 1950s. And it's not just kids who are annoyed by what passes for "personalities" today. I find them rather annoying myself, and I'm certainly no kid.

"....Dingo!...and the BABY!!!"

Seth MacFarlane is like a baseball slugger--he swings and misses a lot, but also hits a lot of home runs. This one was out of the park...

 

[Bill Drake]

So...who won the auction for the "big" 1190? ;D

I'd give some Tecate and an old sombrero ;D

 

[Radio_Eng]

I saw stations with a 50 share. yes, you read that right. A 50 share. Stations that owned the city they were in. Stations that you didn’t need a radio to hear because everywhere you went, someone else had it tuned in.

Indeed. In the late 60s I worked for such a station...pulled a 67 on my show. I still recall when, through an open control room window on a warm Summer Saturday afternoon, I experienced the surreal thrill of hearing my voice echoing from dozens of cars on the downtown streets below during my weekly top 40 countdown show. That AM station was a powerful presence in a situation that will never be repeated.

 

[Bill Drake]

Indeed. The one I am thinking of was one of two Top 40 stations in a market of about 250,000 people. There were two 50KW flame throwers in the same market and a couple of other smaller 5kw & 1 kw stations plus the usual Class IV 1kw-250w graveyard station in the 'burbs.

One of the top 40 stations had a higher dial position with 5 kw full time. The smaller top 40 operation had a middle dial position with a rather anemic 1 kw/500w DA-2 operation. Even though it had horrible holes in the city-wide coverage, it always managed to eek out higher ratings than its top 40 competitor.

In the winter/spring of 1967, the smaller top 40 station finally got too lazy and ran too many commercials and filled up too much of each hour with clutter. They were finally beaten by the bigger top 40 station. Incidentally, both stations pulled very good numbers over the much larger 50 kw stations and this was in a very conservative city.

Then around April or so of '67 the smaller station went with the Drake format. I mean the real thing. Not a "fake Drake" clone. I was always surprised that Bill Drake took this station on because he always insisted that any station consulted by him had to have a good city grade signal. This decision came after he got a 'whooping in Cincinnati because he placed his format on a totally marginal station.

Well, within a few months this station blew the doors off every other station in town. It was just like you described: everywhere you went, you could hear a radio playing this station. It stayed a solid number one until the whole Drake/RKO thing fell apart. When that happened, the one of two non-RKO Drake stations found itself left with no more consultancy.

But it was a hell of a good 5 years or so.

Now that I have given enough clues, any intrepid historian of Top 40 can easily find out what station and city this was ;D

No, I never had the privilege of working there. But it would have been awesome to have had that chance!

 

[oldiesfan6479]

Now that I have given enough clues, any intrepid historian of Top 40 can easily find out what station and city this was ;D

Tulsa.

KAKC 970 1/.5
KELI 1430 5
KRMG 740 50
KVOO 1170 50

"...7 o'clock on the Lee Bayley Show." (Bootleg Top 40, Vol. 1)

 

[Bill Drake]

Right you are, buckaroo! "The Big 97" ruled for years. Before that it was KAKC "The station that's all heart" with its -- check this out -- "KAKC 970 News, At Nine Minutes Seventy Seconds Before The Hour." Duh.

And the engineering there was flawless. You could sense you were coming to a red hot station as you tuned your old analog radio in to 970 kHz (or back then kcs). The audio was pumped. Don't know how they did it, but no hideous and quite audible potting down when the jocks did their intros. Plus I was there one night in the studio and saw how you could pot the level almost all the way down and it didn't affect the air signal at all. Plus hah talk about a winner! At their 51st & Peoria studios (the xmitter was way north in Osage County in the boonies) at night you could hear WAVE Louisville in the background - .....

And there was the unmentioned KOME 1300 with a cloverleaf nighttime pattern that you could drive in and out of over and over in just a few miles. And they played classical music with a signal like that????? That station now carries the KAKC calls. The old KAKC (now the property of Jesus & Co. ) finally got a power increase, which they applied for in the early '70's. But by the time they actually got it, it was too late. They had peaked and lost to an FM and, of all things KELI with its hideous heterodyne squeal and muddy audio with NO highs at all.

Bill Drake always said that Tulsa would be the perfect middle America test market. All the other Drake stations were in sophisticated big eastern and western cities (well, except for Fresno ~~~~~). But if his format could work in a town like Tulsa, it would work anywhere. And it did.

Oh yeah I got the thrill of interviewing Lee Bayley for my school paper too. He was an awesome PD and ended up working for Drake Chenault's automated service in Topanga Canyon, CA.

 

[Radio_Eng]

Now that I have given enough clues, any intrepid historian of Top 40 can easily find out what station and city this was ;D

Tulsa.

KAKC 970 1/.5
KELI 1430 5
KRMG 740 50
KVOO 1170 50

"...7 o'clock on the Lee Bayley Show." (Bootleg Top 40, Vol. 1)

What fun it was! And still fun to remember. There were lots of Mid West top 40s that were constantly up against big 50kw Flamethrowers, like KOMA, WLS, and the like...so much the better because station jocks really felt the presence of those big guys along with local competition. And, of course, the local stations often copied the big gorillas. 20/20 News, anyone? What a blast! (From the Past.) Jock meetings and impromptu parties, and there were plenty, sometimes consisted of little more than beer and airchecks.

Ok...coffee's done. It's time to go to "work."

 

[j henry waugh]

Yes I am old school about things like a licensee serving the community; about local control and/or ownership. About all the things that broadcasters used to have to do just to keep that license.

I saw stations with a 50 share. yes, you read that right. A 50 share. Stations that owned the city they were in. Stations that you didn’t need a radio to hear because everywhere you went, someone else had it tuned in.

I have also read all the excuses about stations with marginal coverage not being able to cut it. That’s another cop out. Most marginal stations offer marginal programming. Why would anyone flock to hear something of no value?

All of that is gone now. Of those who listen, most have a music station tuned in to break the monotony of work or whatever else they might be doing. There are no loyal listeners anymore. Why should there be? Radio has sunk to its lowest common denominator (can you say "homogenized?"). There is no effort made on upgrading, instead everything is done on the cheap and the people who are left to make it work are expendable.

It is inevitable that other forms of entertainment would give radio a run for its money. However that does not mean radio has to throw in the towel by sinking to the level it has today.

Radio has killed itself, or rather the industry has been consumed by the mantle of corporate greed. Radio is just another one of its victims. In the end, it is we the people who have been short changed and who suffer from the actions of the corporatists.

This.

I grew up a radio freak, with the transistor radio under the pillow — listening to music, talk shows (yes, there were political talk shows when the Fairness Doctrine was in effect…)…

Today, my iPhone is my "radio" — with Podcasts and Pandora, it's replaced the AM/FM band, though I still check in intermittently too see what I'm not missing — 20 plus minutes of commercials + non-content, news updates on the half/hour more suited for a world of 30+ years ago, shrill "he said, she said" right wing "angry white man" incitement, ranting clowns not interested in actually learning about issues and legislation…

AM/FM radio still possesses inherit advantages — immediacy and ubiquity — and still could justify a place in the media suite…

 

[Bill Drake]

there is intelligent political talk radio but you probably will not hear it in most markets with conservabots holding a 95% margin on the field. Once you have heard one of them, it's pretty obvious they are all reading from the same script (faxed daily courtesy of the RNC).