Would a 2nd CHR work in New York City?

[MarcR]

But the current urban-leaning direction gets great ratings, so what do I know?

It doesn't garner "great ratings" in the suburbs. As more and more white youth abandon Hip Hop, Z-100's close identification with that genre might entice a competitor to take it on and siphon off even more suburban listeners.

 

[MarcR]

As much as I am enjoying the new Hot Hits 95.7 in Houston it's still no Z-100 WHTZ is one of the LEAST vulnerable CHRs you'll find anywhere. I mean, can you pinpoint any weaknesses that it may hold?

Do you check the ratings for the suburban counties of New York City CHRles? If you did, you might ascertain as well that Z-100, with its urban lean, is quite vulnerable in those locations.

 

[CHRles]

Z-100 targets the immediate suburbs of New York, ie northern Jersey and Long Island, as well as of course the 5 boroughs (Brooklyn!) NOT Monmouth-Ocean counties where it's actually up to a 3 share.
Furthermore, Z-100 is far from what I would call an Urban leaning CHR. In fact, I find that statement to be funny
Oh, and suburban white kids are all over Rhythmic music. There's even Rhythmic stations nowadays in places like Poughkeepsie, Peoria, and a bunch of other towns that start with a P

Let's compare CHRs from the nation's major markets
http://www.mediabase.com/mmrweb/AllAccess/Stations.asp?c_let=WHTZ-FM

That's Z-100 where you'll notice the Top 10 includes Sara Bareilles, Daughtry, and Flyleaf, and plenty of Pop titles, which you're confusing with Urban.

Here's the playlist for KIIS-FM in L.A.
http://www.mediabase.com/mmrweb/AllAccess/Stations.asp?c_let=KIIS-FM

No Rock records in the Top 10. The closest thing to Rock are the Jonas Brothers who aren't even Top 10. Hell, even hugely popular Pop titles by the likes of Leona Lewis aren't on KIIS FM's Top 10 yet.

Let's round things off with Chicago's 103.5 Kiss FM:
http://www.mediabase.com/mmrweb/AllAccess/Stations.asp?c_let=WKSC-FM

Hmmmm, no Rock records inside the Top 20 on Kiss FM Chicago, the biggest city in the Midwest. Oh look, they're playing Cascada and Miley Cyrus...records Z-100 already had in it's Top 10 a couple of months ago and helped break nationally :

What about San Francisco? Oh I forgot San Francisco doesn't have a CHR/Pop station. Fine then, we'll move to the biggest CHR in the South - 106.1 Kiss FM Dallas. KHKS is ranked first in its market, and is very similarly formatted to Z-100, customized for Dallas of course:
http://www.mediabase.com/mmrweb/AllAccess/Stations.asp?c_let=KHKS-FM

 

[OldSchoolWoman]

Just to compare if possible, what was the closest WMCA ever came to WABC in the ratings? Did any Top 40 ever really threaten WABC even in one book?

 

[XCountry285]

Z 100 can do without leaning Urban. I can't stand rhythmic leaning CHRs. I wanna hear Rock Leaning CHRs. What NYC really needs is an Alternative Rock Station. I wish they had a station that played: Kanye West, Fall Out Boy, 30 Seconds To Mars, Seether, Three Days Grace, Lifehouse, Jason Mraz, Maroon 5, Foo Fighters, Blink 182, Nickelback, Breaking Benjamin, The Academy Is, Creed, Daughtry, The Fray, Gwen Stefani, Paramore, Pearl Jam, Jack Johnson, T-Pain, Rascal Flatts. All in one station. What kind of format would that be? Modern Rock? what station does that sound like 2 u?

 

[CHRles]

XCountry, your favorite type of format seems to be Modern AC for the most part. Unfortuantely for you that format is dying. Rock stations don't play Rascall Flatts, Creed aren't exactly Alternative, and Rock stations don't play Jason Mraz or Daughtry either. A station that by and large focuses on these artists won't be a CHR but rather some type of Adult station.

There was a pretty cool station in Monterrey, California for about a year that played Alternative rock and some male friendly Hip Hop. Due to low ratings its flipped formats. CHR radio targets first and foremost 18-34 WOMEN not men. The better you'll do with the ladies the better you'll end up doing with the guys. It's not exactly a secret.

Let's take a look at what's hot nowadays on Modern and Active Rock radio:
http://www.radioandrecords.com/Formats/Charts/Alt_Chart.asp
http://www.radioandrecords.com/Formats/Charts/AR_Chart.asp

Now let's take a look at the CHR/Pop chart
http://www.radioandrecords.com/Formats/Charts/CHR_Top40_Chart.asp

Holy crap! It looks like Z-100 really is a true hit music station and is playing all the big hits on...the CHR/Pop chart.

Okay, so let's go back to the original post in this thread that mentioned the new Hot 95.7 in Houston, which is pitted against 104 KRBE Houston. Have any of you listened to KRBE? It's a very conservative sounding CHR that is late on adding new records, especially Rhythmic ones. Its playlist is dictated by corporate, and more specifically by Jan Jaffries. As such, it's very vulnerable to a new CHR that'll focus on what the CHR audience in Houston really wants to hear.
Z-100 on the other hand is very active as far as which records to add, which recurrents to play, and always seems to pay attention to trends in New York as well as nationally.

 

[radiolives]

Z 100 can do without leaning Urban. I can't stand rhythmic leaning CHRs. I wanna hear Rock Leaning CHRs. What NYC really needs is an Alternative Rock Station. I wish they had a station that played: Kanye West, Fall Out Boy, 30 Seconds To Mars, Seether, Three Days Grace, Lifehouse, Jason Mraz, Maroon 5, Foo Fighters, Blink 182, Nickelback, Breaking Benjamin, The Academy Is, Creed, Daughtry, The Fray, Gwen Stefani, Paramore, Pearl Jam, Jack Johnson, T-Pain, Rascal Flatts. All in one station. What kind of format would that be? Modern Rock? what station does that sound like 2 u?

But to be CHR Top 40 you need to have a mix. I saw in your list you just listed two Rhythmic singers T-Pain and Kanye West. Also I like how you put Blink 182 on the list, when have they made any new music? Anyways your list seems to be Top 40, could even fit Hot AC but then you would have to get rid of T-Pain - Buy You A Drank. Some Kanye songs would be ok. So where does "This Is Why Im Hot", "Chevy Ridin High", "Its Going Down", etc go into the playlist if you want more or a rock leaning CHR? I think CHR's can place 3 or 5 hit hip hop songs in a hour list of music along with the rest of the music from rock to pop and everything else.

 

[icycool7227]

XCountry, your favorite type of format seems to be Modern AC for the most part. Unfortuantely for you that format is dying. Rock stations don't play Rascall Flatts, Creed aren't exactly Alternative, and Rock stations don't play Jason Mraz or Daughtry either. A station that by and large focuses on these artists won't be a CHR but rather some type of Adult station.

There was a pretty cool station in Monterrey, California for about a year that played Alternative rock and some male friendly Hip Hop. Due to low ratings its flipped formats. CHR radio targets first and foremost 18-34 WOMEN not men. The better you'll do with the ladies the better you'll end up doing with the guys. It's not exactly a secret.

Let's take a look at what's hot nowadays on Modern and Active Rock radio:
http://www.radioandrecords.com/Formats/Charts/Alt_Chart.asp
http://www.radioandrecords.com/Formats/Charts/AR_Chart.asp

Now let's take a look at the CHR/Pop chart
http://www.radioandrecords.com/Formats/Charts/CHR_Top40_Chart.asp

Holy crap! It looks like Z-100 really is a true hit music station and is playing all the big hits on...the CHR/Pop chart.

Okay, so let's go back to the original post in this thread that mentioned the new Hot 95.7 in Houston, which is pitted against 104 KRBE Houston. Have any of you listened to KRBE? It's a very conservative sounding CHR that is late on adding new records, especially Rhythmic ones. Its playlist is dictated by corporate, and more specifically by Jan Jaffries. As such, it's very vulnerable to a new CHR that'll focus on what the CHR audience in Houston really wants to hear.
Z-100 on the other hand is very active as far as which records to add, which recurrents to play, and always seems to pay attention to trends in New York as well as nationally.

Are you talking about CD 93 in Monterey which has now changed over frequencies to 101.7 The Beach? I loved that station! If not, which station exactly are you talking about?

I think it would be cool if there were two rock stations in NYC - now that'd be wild. And WRXP does not count - need alternative rock!

 

[CHRles]

I was actually referring to X-103.9 Monterrey.

 

[neo11]

We're talking about a straight-up CHR. There hasn't been anyone that has done so and taken on Z100 in close to two decades.

Ever think there might be a reason for that.... Would you want to invest your life savings into a radio station to try and compete with the Flag Ship CHR radio in the number one radio market in the U.S... I dont think I would..


[/quote]

Why not? So many people were clamoring for a competitor to Lite FM, and Fresh is doing relatively well and has damaged Lite's numbers, if not its position in the market, a bit. Hot 97 was once neck-and-neck with Lite FM for #1 in the market (12+ of course, as meaningless as those numbers are overall), but they haven't come close since Power came on the scene and they split the audience. I don't understand why it made sense for AC and urban but it doesn't make sense for CHR.

 

[TonySantiago]

Let's go back to 23 years or so where we did have 2 CHR stations (Z-100 and Power 95 (WPLJ/WWPR)) It WAS fierce competition in those days. The Z Morning Zoo was the hottest thing on radio (this was before Howard Stern went on mornings) and basically both stations were formatted the same...just the top 40 hits of the time. Then later you had Hot 103, which was the third CHR but had the rhythmic lean to it. All stations had close numbers to each other but as you see now, Z-100 has maintained itself all those years...through the good and bad (I think they came DANGEROUSLY CLOSE to flipping a format around 1995 when the station was mainly grunge/alternative and didn't crack ratings).

In effect we do have the 2nd CHR out of Pulse 87, although it has the rhythmic lean that Z doesn't....which actually WORKS for Z not doing that (gotta admit). If someone is going to compete hard against a Z-100 they'd better have a powerful/established morning show and good music/jocks the rest of the day.

 

[CHRles]

Z-100 actually did really well at first with its Modern Rock lean in 93-94. It was brilliant, especially the liners, and was voted as the best station in the country in Rolling Stone magazine. In the ratings they went up to second place. At some point Q-104.3 went Active Rock so some of the younger male listeners left. What really did it in for the Modern Rock lean was that Z was becoming less and less CHR sounding by 95, and then of course KTU was resurrected with a Dance/Pop sound, and 92.3 K-Rock went Modern Rock. Z did the right thing by moving back in the direction of a true CHR/Pop station.