The new krth

[ChannelFlipper]

I heard "Indian Reservation" on a local FM oldies station while in the car with another radio person around Jackson Hole, WY, about 10 years back. I recall, even a decade ago, thinking that the selection was insensitive in an area with a considerable Native American population.

On the other hand, Indian Lake is a town / area in the Poconos, IIRC. No more offensive than "Indian Wells" in CA (or its next adjacent neighbor, "Indio" [which means "Indian"]).

C'mon David, really - are you really going there??

"Indian Reservation" by Raiders is a song that simultaneously laments the history of the forced removal of the Cherokee tribes in the South while the singer proudly proclaims his Indian, which he calls "redman", heritage. The song is sung from the "redman's" point of view in the first person. Key verses include:

Though I wear a shirt and tie
I'm still part redman deep inside

Cherokee people, Cherokee tribe
So proud to live, so proud to die

But maybe someday when they learn
Cherokee nation will return

There is nothing more annoying than people making up reasons to be "offended" when none exist. To suggest that the song is offensive is to demonstrate a fundamental lack of understanding of the song. The Raider's version of the song dates to 1971, but other versions date back to the original that was recorded in 1959. In all those years, this is the first time I have ever heard anyone say that it is "offensive". Also towns cannot have "Indian" names, really?

 

[Willits]

I have enjoyed listening to KRTH in the past, but I will listen no more. They have turned into what WCBS 101.1 in New York is, an "adult hits" station.

You dont need to be over 60 years of age to enjoy a station like KRTH used to be. I am not even 1/4th of that and 50's and 60's oldies are what I want to hear on the radio. Unfortunately, I will never be able to raise my kids with oldies music ON the radio.

Like you, I prefer the oldies of the 50s and early 60s. Fortunately, we live in wonderful modern times with satellite radio where there's 50s on 5 and 60s on 6, stations that I have on almost all the time. There are also a multitude of online stations that play great music from that era on your computer or smartphone.

 

[davideduardo]

C'mon David, really - are you really going there??

Yes, quite definitely. We live in an era where sensitivities to different interpretations of things have to be respected.

"Indian Reservation" by Raiders is a song that simultaneously laments the history of the forced removal of the Cherokee tribes in the South while the singer proudly proclaims his Indian, which he calls "redman", heritage....
There is nothing more annoying than people making up reasons to be "offended" when none exist. To suggest that the song is offensive is to demonstrate a fundamental lack of understanding of the song.

I understand the song perfectly, and find it patronizing. Quite a few others I have spoken with find the same thing. It may have been a noble sentiment nearly 50 years ago but times have changed. Remember that this was the same era when African Americans were called "Negroes" which is a usage which has fallen out of disfavor.

Consider the current controversy about the names of the DC NFL team as evidence of changing times and values.

Also towns cannot have "Indian" names, really?

I said that such names were NOT offensive and gave examples of several others.

 

[DrAkbar]

Oh please, P.C. police...don't take away Mark Lindsay's driving vocals, Hal Blaine's incredible drum work, or the Hammond B3 organ ending!

 

[Mediafrog+]

Now Speedy Gonzalez, or Ahab the Arab.....those are songs you aren't going to hear too often, for good reason.

Another pair of songs that have shown up on Music Choice many times. In fact "Speedy Gonzalez" has probably been the most played Pat Boone song on MC, ahead of "April Love."

 

[semoochie]

Another pair of songs that have shown up on Music Choice many times. In fact "Speedy Gonzalez" has probably been the most played Pat Boone song on MC, ahead of "April Love."

The song is about a cartoon. If anyone is at fault, it's Warner Brothers!

 

[ChannelFlipper]

Yes, quite definitely. We live in an era where sensitivities to different interpretations of things have to be respected.



I understand the song perfectly, and find it patronizing. Quite a few others I have spoken with find the same thing. It may have been a noble sentiment nearly 50 years ago but times have changed. Remember that this was the same era when African Americans were called "Negroes" which is a usage which has fallen out of disfavor.

Consider the current controversy about the names of the DC NFL team as evidence of changing times and values.

Sounds like respect is a one-way street. If the singer wants to call himself a "redman" (who is PROUD of his "redman" status) you are not going to respect his voice and censor it from the radio and public discourse because it hurts your sensitivities. Amazing.

I should like to point out to you that what many consider to be the leading voice for black people is an acronym that stands for the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People, a name that is also from a different age that they have chosen not to change. But I suspect you're now going to speak for them and tell them and the public at large that their name is "offensive". Amazing again.

 

[davideduardo]

Sounds like respect is a one-way street. If the singer wants to call himself a "redman" (who is PROUD of his "redman" status) you are not going to respect his voice and censor it from the radio and public discourse because it hurts your sensitivities. Amazing.

I should like to point out to you that what many consider to be the leading voice for black people is an acronym that stands for the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People, a name that is also from a different age that they have chosen not to change. But I suspect you're now going to speak for them and tell them and the public at large that their name is "offensive". Amazing again.

We are talking, in radio, about songs that may create different emotional responses among listeners.

In general, songs that use terms that have become... rightfully or foolishly... politically incorrect will be removed from airplay.

That's because some, and not necessarily all, listeners may object.

An African American organization that chooses to use an older term in its name is not relevant. Radio "pushes" to a largely anonymous audience, and certain basic sensitivities are called for. Each station may choose to apply its criteria differently but in this particular case it would seem inappropriate today to play "Indian Reservation" on a variety of levels out of respect for currant language usage and rather patronizing tone of the song.

On a personal level, the song does not push my sensitivities one way or another... it's just a song I never liked irrespective of its lyrics. So don't involve "hurting my sensitivities" in the discussion... it's about whether today such a song is, or should be, playable today.

 

[davideduardo]

The song is about a cartoon. If anyone is at fault, it's Warner Brothers!

In fact, I can think of countless jocks with the last name "González" who have used "Speedy" as their airname.

With "González" being, in México, as common as Jones or Smith, that's a lot of opportunities.

 

[Thomps2525]

In the 15th century, many Europeans referred to the Asian subcontinent as India or the Indias or Indies. When Columbus reached the Antilles in 1492, he called the inhabitants "Indians." The name, while completely wrong and inappropriate, began to be used for aall the inhabitants of the Americas. That's one big mistake. The second big mistake was creating a holiday to honor someone who gets credit with "discovering" a country which was already inhabited. Hey, remember when we were discussing KRTH?

 

[ChannelFlipper]

We are talking, in radio, about songs that may create different emotional responses among listeners.

In general, songs that use terms that have become... rightfully or foolishly... politically incorrect will be removed from airplay.

That's because some, and not necessarily all, listeners may object.

An African American organization that chooses to use an older term in its name is not relevant. Radio "pushes" to a largely anonymous audience, and certain basic sensitivities are called for. Each station may choose to apply its criteria differently but in this particular case it would seem inappropriate today to play "Indian Reservation" on a variety of levels out of respect for currant language usage and rather patronizing tone of the song.

On a personal level, the song does not push my sensitivities one way or another... it's just a song I never liked irrespective of its lyrics. So don't involve "hurting my sensitivities" in the discussion... it's about whether today such a song is, or should be, playable today.

David, in an earlier post you said "I understand the song perfectly, and I find it patronizing."

Now you say, "On a personal level, the song does not push my sensitivities one way or another."

You are contradicting yourself, unless you are now going to try to convince us that you can simultaneously find the song to be "patronizing" without "pushing you sensitivities", or something.

Regardless, what you are really calling for is censorship, pure and simple. You couch it by saying each station should make its own decision, but then truly tip your hand when you say it is "inappropriate on a variety of levels", which is to be understood by all to mean that if one were to be actually insensitive enough to play it, that person should be considered an unenlightened stooge at best and a racist at worst - according to you.

I never was a big fan of the song either. But I am even less of a fan of censorship. I happen to have it on several of my Groovy Hits of the Super 70's CDs, which I plan to whip it out and play it loud. If only I had a radio station, I would play it like KRTH plays "Brown Eyed Girl". I celebrate the "redman" singer and his Cherokee heritage, just as he does. I want his voice to be heard, as he intended it, not as you so mistakenly choose to interpret it. This is the essence of tolerance, which we are getting so little of from the people who like to talk about it the most.

 

[oldies76]

To me, it should be played. I don't have a problem with it at all. It's a classic from 1971, it made #1 nationally and on KHJ. It was the times (remember the teary Indian in the Keep America beautiful commercial from the early 70's?) and that was a big song then and it should be played as a classic today. We're there any people offended in 1971?? So, why would there be today? It does not make any sense.

 

[michael hagerty]

We're there any people offended in 1971?? So, why would there be today? It does not make any sense.

Seriously?

You don't think people's perceptions and sensitivities might have changed in 42 years?

 

[Thomps2525]

Let's ask how many people still enjoy hearing Larry Groce's Junk Food Junkie or Johnny Wakelin's Black Superman - Muhammad Ali...or how many people are offended by the lyrics of Matchbox 20's Push.

Today KRTH played Feliz Navidad. Let the burned-out tiresome secular holiday songs begin!

 

[oldies76]

You don't think people's perceptions and sensitivities might have changed in 42 years?

Since that song is from 1971, the folks listening to that song then as a current hit, should not have a problem with it today. They bought the record, it topped the charts, they should not any issues with it 42 years later. It's a classic to them.

To new and younger Native American listneners hearing it for the first time today, that's another story. If they find something wrong and offensive with it's lyrics today then that's their issue. To the original listeners, now approaching 60, it should not be a problem. I don't see how it could. But I guess, anything is possible in today's world.....

 

[oldies76]

Today KRTH played Feliz Navidad. Let the burned-out tiresome secular holiday songs begin!

Overplayed yes, but it's one of my favorite Christmas songs and I actually enjoy hearing it today. What I don't want to hear, is that one by Elton John. As much as I like his regular hit music, that one Christmas tune is not so great.......at all.

 

[michael hagerty]

Since that song is from 1971, the folks listening to that song then as a current hit, should not have a problem with it today. They bought the record, it topped the charts, they should not any issues with it 42 years later. It's a classic to them.

To new and younger Native American listneners hearing it for the first time today, that's another story. If they find something wrong and offensive with it's lyrics today then that's their issue. To the original listeners, now approaching 60, it should not be a problem. I don't see how it could.

Two things:

One: Who do you think is going to play it on the radio for original listeners, now approaching 60?

Two: Are you telling me that you really think that people don't re-evaluate opinions or have growth or evolution in tastes they hold over a period of more than 40 years? That you don't?

Man, the arguments I could have if you put 1971 me in front of me right now.....

 

[Thomps2525]

I'm sorry, Mister oldies76---what did you say? I was watching a rerun of game 1 of this year's Braves-Dodgers NLDS and doing the "tomahawk chant" along with all the fans when B.J. Upton came up to bat. "Ohhh-oh-ohhhh, ohhh-oh-ohhhh." Not the least bit offensive.

 

[Thomps2525]

Ah yes, 1971. That was when we thought the Bells' Stay Awhile was dirty. Little did we realize how filthy the music would become in the 1990s! But how could anyone not still appreciate the Osmonds' Yo-Yo or Donny Osmond's remake of Go Away Little Girl or Mac & Katie Kissoon's Chirpy Chirpy Cheep Cheep?

Oh wait.....maybe those aren't the best examples.

 

[michael hagerty]

Ah yes, 1971. That was when we thought the Bells' Stay Awhile was dirty. Little did we realize how filthy the music would become in the 1990s! But how could anyone not still appreciate the Osmonds' Yo-Yo or Donny Osmond's remake of Go Away Little Girl or Mac & Katie Kissoon's Chirpy Chirpy Cheep Cheep?

Oh wait.....maybe those aren't the best examples.

No, but here's one.

I was 15 in 1971...and thought The Chairmen Of The Board's "Pay To The Piper" was a great record.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=da5Zh9ZJ2GU

Sometime after 15, the taming of hormones, growth in knowledge and experience and having been the father of a girl, I consider those to be some of the most reprehensible lyrics committed to vinyl. Worse than "Blurred Lines", because while Robin Thicke is (if he's to be believed) coaxing the freak out of his girl, the Chairmen clearly don't care. They picked up the dinner tab and that gets them an all-access pass to their date.

See the point, Oldies?