A Change Coming to KGO

[michael hagerty]

What about KYNO 940 in Fresno, CA? Last year, they revived their old Boss Radio-era sound and retooled it into an oldies format. I don't know how they're doing ratings wise, but I do know that they're a full power 50kW station that I can hear as far north as Ukiah at night. I haven't tried this yet, but I think if I had a really good antenna system setup, I could probably receive it in the daytime too.

On the bright side, once all the commercial AMs go dead, it'll leave the dial wide open to low power AM experimenters. The FCC, then, might consider loosening the regulations somewhat, since at that point there would be nothing left to interfere with. Maybe even re-allocate the MW band for amateur radio use or something.

c

Never mind. I just saw David's answer.

 

[michael hagerty]

I do know that they're a full power 50kW station that I can hear as far north as Ukiah at night. I haven't tried this yet, but I think if I had a really good antenna system setup, I could probably receive it in the daytime too.

250 air miles at 940 on the dial? Not gonna happen no matter what your antenna. In the 70s, KFRC was good for 200 miles at 610 on the dial. And the noise floor is WAY worse now.

 

[Old Grey Coyote]

And they realized that and very quickly changed back to live & local talk. They even rehired some of the older talk hosts. And they STAYED that way for TEN MORE YEARS! How often did anyone listen then?

They rehired some of the old hosts, but not all. It wasn't the same station after 2010. Taliaferro's Early Show was gone. Bernie Ward was in jail. It just didn't feel like the same station.

They should have moved on before 2022.

 

[TheBigA]

Some, but not all. It wasn't the same station after 2010. Taliaferro's Early Show was gone. Bernie Ward was in jail. It just didn't feel like the same station.

You forgot to say that Gene Burns was dead. The point is the big bad corporation TRIED to satisfy the people. An attempt was made. But the people had discovered streaming. Where there are NO talk show hosts or DJs. And that's what people really want. Name all the legendary talk show hosts on Spotify. But once again, it's a different set of rules for them.

 

[michael hagerty]

They rehired some of the old hosts, but not all. It wasn't the same station after 2010. Taliaferro's Early Show was gone. Bernie Ward was in jail. It just didn't feel like the same station.

They should have moved on before 2022.

Since we're on page 32 (on a desktop computer---God knows what this is on a phone), I'll repost the Inside Radio piece about KGO from six years ago, which looks at the station's falling fortunes.

I'll also mention this for those who don't click through:

In 2009 (two years before the purge and the format change)---KGO's revenues dropped 25%--from 29 million to 22 million.

The station was in trouble before all the things people in this thread are saying killed it.

Nothing Sudden About Downward Shifts at KGO.

Headlines are heralding the “end of an era” for San Francisco’s KGO (810) after Cumulus Media gutted the news/talker last Thursday. But the once-mighty West Coast flame-thrower has, in fact,

www.insideradio.com

 

[asugeorge1]

Since we're on page 32 (on a desktop computer---God knows what this is on a phone), I'll repost the Inside Radio piece about KGO from six years ago, which looks at the station's falling fortunes.

I'll also mention this for those who don't click through:

In 2009 (two years before the purge and the format change)---KGO's revenues dropped 25%--from 29 million to 22 million.

The station was in trouble before all the things people in this thread are saying killed it.

Nothing Sudden About Downward Shifts at KGO.

Headlines are heralding the “end of an era” for San Francisco’s KGO (810) after Cumulus Media gutted the news/talker last Thursday. But the once-mighty West Coast flame-thrower has, in fact,

www.insideradio.com

This thread is 32 pages on a cell phone too. I always use a cell phone to read the threads on here!

 

[CTListener]

All this makes me wonder what the future holds for the two 50,000-watt AMs that have been part of my life for more than five decades -- WBZ and WTIC. I assume the audience for both is primarily 55+, and both are showing signs of erosion in the meaningless 6+ numbers (so why mention them, lol?), most markedly at WTIC. Neither has an FM translator, and both are owned by chains with no obvious existing FM station to simulcast them on without pulling the plug on a profitable, younger-skewing format. There is no alt station or unsuited-to-the-market country station to move them to, so do they just die a lingering death until the frequency is turned over to paid programming or religion?

 

[Old Grey Coyote]

You forgot to say that Gene Burns was dead. The point is the big bad corporation TRIED to satisfy the people. An attempt was made. But the people had discovered streaming. Where there are NO talk show hosts or DJs. And that's what people really want. Name all the legendary talk show hosts on Spotify. But once again, it's a different set of rules for them.

Since when in the corporate world does trying and not succeeding allow you to keep your job? Sounds like Cumulus bought a buggy whip factory at about the time streaming came along. Then they started changing the buggy whips while Henry Ford was cranking out cheap Model Ts. There are plenty of podcasts and left wing talk is on SiriusXM. The rules did change. They always do.

I miss the old KGO, but it's gone and it's not coming back. Change is inevitable.

 

[michael hagerty]

Since when in the corporate world does trying and not succeeding allow you to keep your job? Sounds like Cumulus bought a buggy whip factory at about the time streaming came along. Then they started changing the buggy whips while Henry Ford was cranking out cheap Model Ts. There are plenty of podcasts and left wing talk is on SiriusXM. The rules did change. They always do.

I miss the old KOA, but it's gone and it's not coming back. Change is inevitable.

You keep saying these call letters "KOA". I do not think they mean what you think they mean.

("My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my radio station. Prepare to die.")

 

[TheBigA]

Since when in the corporate world does trying and not succeeding allow you to keep your job?

Maybe you didn't hear about Lew Dickey. He was the founder of Cumulus. When the company crashed after buying the ABC stations (including KGO) he was fired from his own company. So yes the people in charge walked the plank.

The rules did change. They always do.

You only allow the rules to change for digital. Broadcasting, according to you, must still operate as though it's the 80s.

 

[Old Grey Coyote]

You keep saying these call letters "KOA". I do not think they mean what you think they mean.

("My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my radio station. Prepare to die.")

Another station I liked to listen to at one time, but not anymore. I lived in California and Colorado at different times in my life. I get them mixed up.

So what. I'm old.

 

[Old Grey Coyote]

Maybe you didn't hear about Lew Dickey. He was the founder of Cumulus. When the company crashed after buying the ABC stations (including KGO) he was fired from his own company. So yes the people in charge walked the plank.



You only allow the rules to change for digital. Broadcasting, according to you, must still operate as though it's the 80s.

Do you think I work for the FCC, or maybe you think I am in Congress.

I don't get to change any rules. I just decide what I, as an individual, want to listen to. The big bad corporations don't really want my demographic anyway. They don't care if I stream, listen to their sports betting station, or die tomorrow of old age. I am not who they are looking for.

 

[TheBigA]

Do you think I work for the FCC, or maybe you think I am in Congress.

Not at all. And if you want to see a really big corporation, spend some time with one of the digital streaming companies. I'm going to spend part of my weekend with one. They have a lot more money than radio and they're a lot more bureaucratic. And they get to live with a lot fewer government regulations. They could buy iHeart tomorrow with spare cash and not even know they own it.

 

[Rusty Muck]

Canada allowed about 90% of its AMs to move to FM. Mexico moved about 75% to 80% to FM. Jamaica eliminated all AMs. In the many different jurisdictions of the Lesser Antilles, only two or three AMs are left.

In Ecuador, 50% of all AMs are gone, and in Chile and Peru they are going off permanently quite regularly. Brazil is moving as many AMs as it can to FM.

Europe has nearly no AMs left.

The US is worse than the rest, as we allowed so many useless daytimers, many very low power AMs and lots of stations so directional that they miss much of their market.

That’s the thing. In Cleveland, only one AM is usable around-the-clock in WTAM. All the other stations either have such horrible directional signals (WCCR 1260), signals literally overwhelmed and made uncompetitive by suburban sprawl (WJMO 1300, WHK 1420, WKNR 850 at night), completely degraded due to neglect (WHKW 1220), barely audible graveyards (WERE 1490) or awaiting final license cancellation (WWGK 1540). Plus a whole bunch of suburban and rural AMs in either direction.

Outside of WTAM, I wouldn’t know what AM in Cleveland is really worth saving. And it’s not like WTAM’s Brecksville tower is in the best of shape, either (tower dates to 1937, the building at its base to the mid-1970s).

 

[gr8oldies]

So they spend a bunch of money lobbying the government to change the ownership rules, borrow a bunch of money to buy up a bunch of stations and then when the profits don't come, they start cutting the budgets and firing people, thus creating an inferior product. When the listeners disappear into the Internet searching for a better quality product, the failure of the radio station is then the listener's fault?

And now they are sitting on a bunch of radio stations that aren't worth the money they borrowed to buy them. Some they actually give away to charity, some they program with cheap syndicated programming, and they wonder where all the listeners went? It looks like KGO is going to be a 24 hour infomercial for for BETMGM. Who knows how that will work out.

What would a different owner done differently under the same circumstances?If Telecom 96 had never happened, I believe a good share of AM stations would have gone off the air by 2000.

 

[TheBigA]

What would a different owner done differently under the same circumstances?If Telecom 96 had never happened, I believe a good share of AM stations would have gone off the air by 2000.

One of the reasons for TCA96 was concern about the future of AM. By the early 90s, AMs were already being eclipsed by FMs in the ratings. The thousand watters and daytimers were in trouble. The only thing saving them was conservative talk radio.

 

[Theater of My Mind]

All this makes me wonder what the future holds for the two 50,000-watt AMs that have been part of my life for more than five decades

Do you still watch a black-and-white TV? That's what the future holds.

 

[davideduardo]

What would a different owner done differently under the same circumstances?If Telecom 96 had never happened, I believe a good share of AM stations would have gone off the air by 2000.

I think you are a decade "too early" in your projection.

Two things: the SmartPhone in 2008/09 and the granting of FM translators for nearly half of all AM stations.

The SmartPhone obviated the need for many radio services and converted the cellular phone into a replacement for any portable music device, whether it be an iPod, a CD player or even a cassette player... and, of course, the radio.

FM translators gave new life to about half of all AM stations and there are about 4800 total translators now, some being null fills, some being under and HD channel but nearly half being the FM for an AM station.

 

[davideduardo]

One of the reasons for TCA96 was concern about the future of AM. By the early 90s, AMs were already being eclipsed by FMs in the ratings. The thousand watters and daytimers were in trouble. The only thing saving them was conservative talk radio.

Go back further. 1978 (typo fixed after it was pointed out) was the year when the compiled Arbitron national numbers showed FM tied with AM in listenership. See the Duncan reports that detail this at the link below.

Part of this change was due to the FCC limiting AM/FM duplication. Another part was the improvement in FM reception once the patents were freed up in the early 60's. And a bigger part was due to Arbitron taking over dominance in radio ratings in the early 70 and their creation of much larger survey areas than Pulse or Hooper had, giving the benefit to FM stations in most markets.

 

[Rusty Muck]

What would a different owner done differently under the same circumstances?If Telecom 96 had never happened, I believe a good share of AM stations would have gone off the air by 2000.

Talk radio hadn't been made obsolete yet by cable talk shows and Twitter in the late 1990s. The audience was by no means younger-skewing but they weren't literally aging out of salability and those AM stations could still operate with a profit, even if they were totally off the bird.

The only thing is that said audience never changed. It just got older and older.