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$42 Million for KMXE

Re: (David secretly likes baseball)

>
> I don't get your point.... Baseball fans DON'T CARE about
> ratings!

Ratings are not intended to be of any use or interest to lisetenrs.

Ratings are intended to be a sales tool, so advertisers have a metric on which to measure listening vs. cost of advertising.

> If the games are on, they will listen, even if
> reception is marginal.

There is no evidence of this in ratings. And since commercial radio stations exist to make money, that is all that is important. And it has been seen that sports listeners are good diary keepers, so there is no "hidden" or phantom cume here.

Obviously, when the owner of the station is the owner of a team, this changes a little. The station becomes promotion for the team, but to do that, it has to be listenable.

> In fact speaking as a sports fan who
> grew up in Central New Jersey, I remember having to listen
> to New York Knicks games and New York Rangers games on 1050
> WHN with a terrible directional signal away from New
> Brunswick. When the Mets switched from WABC to WHN in 1964
> I had the same problem. I put up with all the QRM. If the
> OWNER of the team (Arte Moreno) also owns the radio station,
> he WILL put on the games as he has SAID he will do in the
> 2006 season (in Spanish). How long are you going to debate
> this point, 'til the 2099 season?

Unless he puts the games on in English, this is a moot point. The Angels have so little following among Spanish speakers (we carried them, and did research... there are literally no Spanish domiant Angels fans) that, until they put the games in English on KMXE and make the station fully English, this whole station is a ratings zip.
 
Re: (David secretly likes baseball)

> >
> > I don't get your point.... Baseball fans DON'T CARE about
> > ratings!
>
> Ratings are not intended to be of any use or interest to
> lisetenrs.
>
> Ratings are intended to be a sales tool, so advertisers have
> a metric on which to measure listening vs. cost of
> advertising.
>
> > If the games are on, they will listen, even if
> > reception is marginal.
>
> There is no evidence of this in ratings. And since
> commercial radio stations exist to make money, that is all
> that is important. And it has been seen that sports
> listeners are good diary keepers, so there is no "hidden" or
> phantom cume here.
>
> Obviously, when the owner of the station is the owner of a
> team, this changes a little. The station becomes promotion
> for the team, but to do that, it has to be listenable.
>
> > In fact speaking as a sports fan who
> > grew up in Central New Jersey, I remember having to listen
>
> > to New York Knicks games and New York Rangers games on
> 1050
> > WHN with a terrible directional signal away from New
> > Brunswick. When the Mets switched from WABC to WHN in
> 1964
> > I had the same problem. I put up with all the QRM. If
> the
> > OWNER of the team (Arte Moreno) also owns the radio
> station,
> > he WILL put on the games as he has SAID he will do in the
> > 2006 season (in Spanish). How long are you going to
> debate
> > this point, 'til the 2099 season?
>
> Unless he puts the games on in English, this is a moot
> point. The Angels have so little following among Spanish
> speakers (we carried them, and did research... there are
> literally no Spanish dominant Angels fans) that, until they
> put the games in English on KMXE and make the station fully
> English, this whole station is a ratings zip.
>
David I DON'T CARE!! I'd love for the English language broadcasts to move to 830 AM. I live in Mission Viejo and the 830 night signal is SUPERIOR to that of 710 so I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!

ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!

(now which part did you not understand?)
 
Re: (David secretly likes baseball)

> David I DON'T CARE!! I'd love for the English language
> broadcasts to move to 830 AM. I live in Mission Viejo and
> the 830 night signal is SUPERIOR to that of 710 so I DON'T
> CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T
> CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T
> CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T
> CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!I DON'T CARE!!
>
> ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
> ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
> ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
> ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
> ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
> ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
> ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
> ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
> ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
> ANGELS FANS DON'T CARE!!!
>
> (now which part did you not understand?)

<u>I</u> understand that you have taken this much too far.<P ID="signature">______________


</P>
 
So Shoot Me

> I understand that you have taken this much too far.
>
Yes I have... I let him get under my skin again. I am passionate KM and can you not see that no matter what anyone says, David always seems to have a rebuttal, thus the "I don't care" mantra... That is as an Angels fan, I just want to be able to hear the games.

If I'm at the game, I want to listen to a CLEAR broadcast of the post-game show and Angel Talk on ESPN Radio 710 after the game while driving home to South Orange County. One night while leaving the PARKING LOT at Angel Stadium and turning left onto Orangewood Avenue I hit a null of the 710 signal and they were stepped on by a Spanish language station...

IF the game were on a better signal (FOR ME that's 830 AM) THAT would be better for me AND countless numbers of fans. This is a VERY BIG complaint by so many Angels fans I talk with both in person and online in the Angels Fan Forum. THEY don't care about Arbitron ratings.

Arte Moreno just bought a radio station and he is going to put the games on it in Spanish. Later he MIGHT put the games on in English. SOMEHOW 1540 The Ticket has been on the air with an even poorer signal than anyone can imagine and they have been on the air for --- what--- five years at least??? I have heard their spots, lots of toll-free 800#s for their sponsors etc so somehow they are maintaining. I don't give a hoot if 830 AM makes 0.0 ratings as long as I can hear the games clearly and with their 20kw night signal that works fine in ALL of Orange County... I know I LIVE in Orange County and being a crazy radio fan as well I know how the reception is on most stations.

So yes I am passionate about it and it is very annoying to me that Mr Gleason has to rebut almost every sentence. I am sure I am not the only one who feels that way. There's not much you can do about him, so you have to admonish me. I understand where YOU are coming from.
 
Consider Yourself Shot :)

> So yes I am passionate about it and it is very annoying to
> me that Mr Gleason has to rebut almost every sentence. I am
> sure I am not the only one who feels that way. There's not
> much you can do about him, so you have to admonish me. I
> understand where YOU are coming from.

David's style, like my own, is well-known and often derided. I can only suggest the same tactic when dealing with either of us: Know when to let it go.

Both of us -- but David slightly more than myself -- will be contentious to the death of a thread if we see something that goes against what we know. So long as someone wants to defend such a position in the face of all reasonable rebuttals, we keep going.

I do understand that you have a very passionate argument, and I also understand that the Angels will end up on KMXN as soon as it is legally possible. And the question isn't about ratings, it is about whether or not Moreno makes money from the deal. Given that the Angels are contractually bound to KSPN, Moreno can certainly experiment with Spanish-language broadcasts of the games until he can move the English-language broadcasts to 830. And obviously, both cannot co-exist as live broadcasts unless he tries some weird bilingual hybrid. ("Los Angels ... en Spanglish!")

Personally, I don't think <u>anything</u> is going to get ratings on 830. As far as I'm concerned, they could keep the transmitter turned off when there wasn't a game on (while I don't see the Angels being a big ratings draw, I don't see that as a factor in Moreno's decisions). So, unless Moreno has some great new format in mind, I'd bet on brokered or ethnic.

Are we all happy now?<P ID="signature">______________


</P>
 
Re: Consider Yourself Shot :)

> Are we all happy now?
>
KM I appreciate your response!! Thanks

BTW I really was sincere when I wished David a Happy Birthday last month :>)
 
Re: Consider Yourself Shot :)

What about running C-Quam on 830....

put the spanish in the left channel, and the engish in the right channel.

it won't work with IBOC, though, cause those of us that don't have IBOC radios (which are more of us, I'm sure, than those of us that don't have C-Quam radios), can't separate the two broadcasts out.

Or, how about running two co-carrier-channel SSB operations, one USB carrying english, and one LSB carrying spanish?
 
Re: So Shoot Me

> I
> don't give a hoot if 830 AM makes 0.0 ratings as long as I
> can hear the games clearly and with their 20kw night signal
> that works fine in ALL of Orange County...

The fact remains that if the station gets no ratings (such as what they got on KTNQ... zero) it will not be successful and be sold again, as it has been about six times since Danny Viallnueva put it on the air. Whether the listeners care about ratings is not material to the discussion. Stations keep formats if they get income from ad sales. In LA, that means having ratings.
 
What about 1540 The Ticket

> The fact remains that if the station gets no ratings (such
> as what they got on KTNQ... zero) it will not be successful
> and be sold again, as it has been about six times since
> Danny Viallnueva put it on the air. Whether the listeners
> care about ratings is not material to the discussion.
> Stations keep formats if they get income from ad sales. In
> LA, that means having ratings.
>
OK how do you explain all the USC football and basketball games on KMPC 1540 The Ticket for the last couple of years? How does THAT station stay on the air? BTW they also carry the Galaxy soccer games in English (with about 50 listeners). They've kept the format for about five years with zero ratings never made a book or trend.
 
830 History

> The fact remains that if the station gets no ratings (such
> as what they got on KTNQ... zero) it will not be successful
> and be sold again, as it has been about six times since
> Danny Viallnueva put it on the air.

I'm trying to remember how many formats this turkey has had since it went on the air ... which was only 20 years ago ... I can only remember four:

Radio Aahs
(something else)
Spanish language All-News
(something else)
Hot Talk
Mexican Talk (the current format, which originates in Mexico, I believe)<P ID="signature">______________


</P>
 
Re: 830 History

> > The fact remains that if the station gets no ratings (such
>
> > as what they got on KTNQ... zero) it will not be
> successful
> > and be sold again, as it has been about six times since
> > Danny Viallnueva put it on the air.
>
> I'm trying to remember how many formats this turkey has had
> since it went on the air ... which was only 20 years ago ...
> I can only remember four:
>
> Radio Aahs
> (something else)
> Spanish language All-News
> (something else)
> Hot Talk
> Mexican Talk (the current format, which originates in
> Mexico, I believe)
>
IIRC 830 AM came on around 1991 or 1992... You remember the Poorman had a show on them... Didn't they also have a dance format for a little whlie?
 
Re: 830 History

> > The fact remains that if the station gets no ratings (such
>
> > as what they got on KTNQ... zero) it will not be
> successful
> > and be sold again, as it has been about six times since
> > Danny Viallnueva put it on the air.
>
> I'm trying to remember how many formats this turkey has had
> since it went on the air ... which was only 20 years ago ...
> I can only remember four:

It started as La Voz, under Danny Villanueva's owenrship.

>
> Radio Aahs

> (something else)

Catholic radio, organized by John Lynch of SD, followed by brokered as an outlet for a bunch of, I think, Premiere shows.

> Spanish language All-News

All news was KHJ in about 1996. Lated a year, roughly. 03 share.

> (something else)
> Hot Talk
> Mexican Talk (the current format, which originates in
> Mexico, I believe)

No, it comes out of studios in the Sherman Oaks Galleria, and was supposed to be the flagship station for a talk network in Spanish which never really materialized. Steve Lehman, formerly of Premiere, was the principal.

The issue, in no small part, is that the station has an inadequate signal.
 
Re: 830 History

> >
> IIRC 830 AM came on around 1991 or 1992...

It came on as La Voz, Spanish talk, and was owned by danny Villanueva, former NFL star and later manager of Channel 34 in LA.

> You remember the
> Poorman had a show on them... Didn't they also have a dance
> format for a little whlie?

Yes, out of Minnesota with, and I can not remeber the name of the well know dance proponent who did it, and this was a fill when radio Aahs went bankrupt and was awaiting a transfer. I had forgotten that... it was strange to hear electronic dance on a narrow band AM directional.
 
Re: 830 History

> > >
> > IIRC 830 AM came on around 1991 or 1992...
>
> It came on as La Voz, Spanish talk, and was owned by danny
> Villanueva, former NFL star and later manager of Channel 34
> in LA.
>

Am I right about the year or was it 1989 or 1990?

> > You remember the
> > Poorman had a show on them... Didn't they also have a
> dance
> > format for a little whlie?
>
> Yes, out of Minnesota with, and I can not remeber the name
> of the well know dance proponent who did it, and this was a
> fill when radio Aahs went bankrupt and was awaiting a
> transfer. I had forgotten that... it was strange to hear
> electronic dance on a narrow band AM directional.
>

Was that dance proponent the Swedish Egil??
 
Re: 830 History

> > > >
> > > IIRC 830 AM came on around 1991 or 1992...
> >
> > It came on as La Voz, Spanish talk, and was owned by danny
>
> > Villanueva, former NFL star and later manager of Channel
> 34
> > in LA.
> >
>
> Am I right about the year or was it 1989 or 1990?

I thought it was earlier than that, even. I'm thinking 1986?<P ID="signature">______________


</P>
 
Re: (David secretly likes baseball)

> 6 AM to 7 PM, all year long for day power
> or for daytimers. Part of this is the fact
> that days are much closer to the same length
> all year long in most of Mexico.

Can stations be on day power before 0600 and
after 1900 during periods of the year when
sunrise/sunset is earlier/later?

The 0600 benefits AM drive, to wit:

Mexico City (MEX)
19d26m07s N, 99d04m22s W
sunrise/sunset
02/08/06: 0709-1833 CST
04/02/06: 0729-1951 CDT
06/20/06: 0659-2017 CDT

A lot of AM drive would otherwise be buried
in the night pattern...but do they give up
part of summer evenings? I guess that's
quite a reasonable trade for having your three
prime dayparts on the big stick.
 
Re: 830 History

>
> Am I right about the year or was it 1989 or 1990?

I believe it was late 1991 as KPLS. It was licensed as KSRT in 1986, but I thought it never went on till Villanueva bought it in Julr, 1991 for $600 thousand.

> a
> > fill when radio Aahs went bankrupt and was awaiting a
> > transfer. I had forgotten that... it was strange to hear
> > electronic dance on a narrow band AM directional.
> >
>
> Was that dance proponent the Swedish Egil??
>

No... he had a real last name...
 
Re: (David secretly likes baseball)

> > 6 AM to 7 PM, all year long for day power
> > or for daytimers. Part of this is the fact
> > that days are much closer to the same length
> > all year long in most of Mexico.
>
> Can stations be on day power before 0600 and
> after 1900 during periods of the year when
> sunrise/sunset is earlier/later?
>
> The 0600 benefits AM drive, to wit:
>
> Mexico City (MEX)
> 19d26m07s N, 99d04m22s W
> sunrise/sunset
> 02/08/06: 0709-1833 CST
> 04/02/06: 0729-1951 CDT
> 06/20/06: 0659-2017 CDT
>
> A lot of AM drive would otherwise be buried
> in the night pattern...but do they give up
> part of summer evenings? I guess that's
> quite a reasonable trade for having your three
> prime dayparts on the big stick.
>

SR and SS are standard all year.

There are no drive times as we know it in Mexico, where over 85% of the population uses mass transportation. More listening in 10-3.
 
Re: 830 History

> The issue, in no small part, is that the station has an
> inadequate signal.
>

An inadequate signal? I hear them JUST FINE on pretty much EVERY radio here in El Cajon.

I understand they are 50kW non-directional daytime, and 20kW directional at night.

Do they have an inadequate signal day, night, or 24/7? And where do they have an inadequate signal? (btw AFAIK their COL is "Orange, CA", and I've gotten a rock-solid signal day and night when I've gone by there on I-5 (as in Orange would be between me and KMXE's transmitter).

So if they really do have an inadequate signal, what can they do to improve their signal where they would want to improve it, WITHOUT REDUCING COVERAGE IN ANY DIRECTIONS (for example putting a null with 10kW ERP where before it was 50kW ERP)? Move the transmitter to an area of better ground conductivity? (I assume they already have 120 evenly-spaced 1/2-wave radials around the base of each tower.) Change to 1/2-wave antennas, or maybe even something like KFBK's antennas, plus a good ground system?
 
Re: 830 History

> Do they have an inadequate signal day, night, or 24/7? And
> where do they have an inadequate signal? (btw AFAIK their
> COL is "Orange, CA", and I've gotten a rock-solid signal day
> and night when I've gone by there on I-5 (as in Orange would
> be between me and KMXE's transmitter).


Whatever part of LA Metro that does not get a minimum 10 mv/m has an inadequate signal per diary analysis for this and other markets.

They can not improve the signal much more due to protection requirements.
 
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