Alt 92.3 to Become WINS Simulcast

[MarkW]

And, were he to have stayed until the PPM was introduced he would have seen his rank drop from first or second to 9th or 10th in the major markets. Stern saw this happening in the early PPM tests in Philadelphia and he got out before Arbitron rolled it out as currency.

6+ numbers don't matter, or are you referring to male demos whom Stern targets?

 

[CTListener]

The "general public" did not listen to Stern. His listener base was relatively small, but they listened a lot.

In fact, were the "general public" to be polled, we likely would have found that more people were glad he was no longer on the radio than those who missed him.

Conventional wisdom is that getting Stern saved Sirius from imminent bankruptcy and eventually enabled it to complete its takeover of rival XM. I wonder how many additional subscriptions from Stern fans -- especially in the NYC market -- Sirius actually gained.

 

[Theater of My Mind]

I wonder how many additional subscriptions from Stern fans -- especially in the NYC market -- Sirius actually gained.

Obviously enough for them to justify re-upping his contact repeatedly. SiriusXM knows the number and they would not be paying that much to keep Stern if his audience were "small."

 

[TheBigA]

Obviously enough for them to justify re-upping his contact repeatedly. SiriusXM knows the number and they would not be paying that much to keep Stern if his audience were "small."

Keep in mind that Stern is a huge Sirius stockholder. He was also a CBS stockholder when he worked there. He invests in himself and where he works. Not many others in radio do.

 

[CassChopper96]

Rock can work in NYC it just needs to be done right though

 

[Loverofradio]

And, were he to have stayed until the PPM was introduced he would have seen his rank drop from first or second to 9th or 10th in the major markets. Stern saw this happening in the early PPM tests in Philadelphia and he got out before Arbitron rolled it out as currency.

against weaker defenses in today’s nba, Michael Jordan may have averaged 35 points per game. but we’ll never know

 

[Marcos_C]

Rock can work in NYC it just needs to be done right though

Well, as we know too well from reading the threads about rock music radio, "right" is a subjective term.

 

[mikerock]

Well, as we know too well from reading the threads about rock music radio, "right" is a subjective term.

Irrelevant. NYC no matter the owner always does it differently and fails because of that. A good example showing that it can work was when WRXP simply took a playlist from a Chicago station for a month and got over a 3.0. Also look at the current ratings for WAXQ.

But for some reason NYC makes the absolute worst Rock/Alternative formats compared to anywhere else in the country and then we are supposed to be surprised when it fails while blaming the genre.

 

[TheBigA]

Rock can work in NYC it just needs to be done right though

It's being done "right" on the non-commercial stations. And on Q104.

But for some reason NYC makes the absolute worst Rock/Alternative formats compared to anywhere else in the country and then we are supposed to be surprised when it fails while blaming the genre.

The problem is that rock is a white suburban format that doesn't work in the more urban parts of the market, and that's where the bulk of the population is. The ad sellers are more focused on reaching the city people than the suburban folks. That's why country also fails in NY, but does well in Boston, Chicago, and Philadelphia.

There is no "right" way to do rock in New York given the market geography and demographics.

 

[Loverofradio]

The "general public" did not listen to Stern. His listener base was relatively small, but they listened a lot.

In fact, were the "general public" to be polled, we likely would have found that more people were glad he was no longer on the radio than those who missed him.

But did he not own every desired demo possible? Look at his following now. He’s on the voice, he’s everywhere now. In fact, radio should be begging him daily to come back to help cross promote radio in his current tv journey

 

[DarrenVision]

It's being done "right" on the non-commercial stations. And on Q104.

u forgot WFUV and WCBSFM

 

[Marcos_C]

[Howard Stern's] on the voice, he’s everywhere now.

I haven't found him anywhere lately except on SiriusXM, but I truly appreciate your exaggeration.

 

[davideduardo]

6+ numbers don't matter, or are you referring to male demos whom Stern targets?

I am talking about the amount of time his listeners reported in the diary vs the time they actually listened in the simultaneous PPM tests in Philadelphia.

 

[CTListener]

I haven't found him anywhere lately except on SiriusXM, but I truly appreciate your exaggeration.

Maybe he was referring to Howard's band of goodwill ambassadors, the cretinous "Baba Booey" cult who find humor in tricking C-Span call screeners into letting them on air during one of the phone-in shows just to mention their enabler's name and yell "Baba Booey" before getting cut off.

 

[davideduardo]

But did he not own every desired demo possible?

No, he was big with 18-34 men and not much else.

Look at his following now.

He reaches less than a third of what he reached when he was on terrestrial radio. But he still would have failed if he had stayed on terrestrial after the PPM rolled out.

 

[MarkW]

I disagree. Less success than before does not equate to "failure."

Stern also earned terrific male 25 to 54 numbers in many markets on terrestrial. To suggest his success was largely confined to 18 to 34 is simply untrue.

 

[macattack]

It's being done "right" on the non-commercial stations. And on Q104.



The problem is that rock is a white suburban format that doesn't work in the more urban parts of the market, and that's where the bulk of the population is. The ad sellers are more focused on reaching the city people than the suburban folks. That's why country also fails in NY, but does well in Boston, Chicago, and Philadelphia.

There is no "right" way to do rock in New York given the market geography and demographics.

This is where you and I have conflict. I think there is one, hyper-specific "right" way to do Alt or rock in NYC. However, I don't blame you or anyone else for thinking it can't work in this day and age. We can just agree to disagree on that aspect.

However, I do see interest in alternative and rock growing with younger demos. Believe it or not, Steve Lacy's "Bad Habit" is classified as Alt despite being in the 30's on the alternative chart, as was about half of Harry Styles' recent album. New wave, for better or worse, is linked to both Alternative and rock, and modern variations of that genre seem to be pleasing people of all races, and the retro elements make older folks happy while younger people hear something completely fresh. I would not call melodic music or rock/alt dead yet when melodic songs linked to rock and alternative, if not outright explicit examples, are hitting #1 on the Hot 100. It's not just white people that are listening.

 

[TheBigA]

I would not call melodic music or rock/alt dead yet when melodic songs linked to rock and alternative, if not outright explicit examples, are hitting #1 on the Hot 100.

I agree, and as I said, I'm hearing alternative & rock acts on country radio. If they can play their instruments and write good songs, there's room for them on country radio. But of course that STILL won't change the situation in NYC.

 

[davideduardo]

This is where you and I have conflict. I think there is one, hyper-specific "right" way to do Alt or rock in NYC. However, I don't blame you or anyone else for thinking it can't work in this day and age. We can just agree to disagree on that aspect.

There is no way in NYC to make that format work. The format itself is fragmented from within, and the interest among those under 45 in rock is diminished to nearly nothing in today's rhythmic world in NYC.

Those who have tried to make the station work have done research and seen the fragmentation of the genre. They have tried using mostly older songs with high commonality, and even that does not work where the format just does not have enough core partisans... and those are in polarized subsets.

However, I do see interest in alternative and rock growing with younger demos. Believe it or not, Steve Lacy's "Bad Habit" is classified as Alt despite being in the 30's on the alternative chart, as was about half of Harry Styles' recent album. New wave, for better or worse, is linked to both Alternative and rock, and modern variations of that genre seem to be pleasing people of all races, and the retro elements make older folks happy while younger people hear something completely fresh. I would not call melodic music or rock/alt dead yet when melodic songs linked to rock and alternative, if not outright explicit examples, are hitting #1 on the Hot 100. It's not just white people that are listening.

The point is that the vast majority of younger demos in big cities are into the rhythmic zone. One or two good songs can't make a format where essentially all of the people no longer have an interest in rock at all.

 

[davideduardo]

I disagree. Less success than before does not equate to "failure."

In the PPM it does. When he was #1 in the diary in Philly, he was around 10th in the PPM tests in the same market. That data was not publicly released, but the group of us who were on the evaluation committee saw it every week.

Stern also earned terrific male 25 to 54 numbers in many markets on terrestrial.

Yes, based on the 25-34 part of 25-54.

To suggest his success was largely confined to 18 to 34 is simply untrue.

Wrong. It was predominantly 18-34 men. Everything else was ground clutter.