Bye bye Indie. It was nice knowing you.

[davideduardo]

So why did Entravision stick with Indie for so long? Why didn't they go to a Spanish format earlier? Five years is quite a logn time for a format that never cracked a decent Arbitron number.

Entravision bought the signals to simulcast KSSE 97.5, but when they got 107.1 the need was gone. They looked for opportunities, and Clear Channel provided the best at the time.

At the beginning, they had a JSA with Clear, which guaranteed them revenue and profits. Clear had more inventory to sell, and put a little thorn in KROQ's sandals.

Then, the FCC rueled the JSA made Clear over the market quota in new rulemaking on market definition. Indie went with a JSA to the group that operates KDAY. They billed nicely and made money.

That JSA ended, and the manager of Indie left... sales declined. It was no longer profitable.

(This is the simplified version, of course)

 

[Neel]

can anyone confirm what's on 103.1 HD now?

I took a listen in my friend's car this evening that has HD radio built in and it didn't sound like dance music on 103.1-2. Couldn't really tell what it was before I lost the signal but it might have been some kind of rock en espanol.

 

[MarkO]

Why did Entravision stick with Indie for so long? I read somewhere in Indie’s early days that Entravision’s CEO was a particular lover of alternative rock (despite his company’s overall hispanic orientation). I also heard that Indie’s Power Ratio (ability to attract listeners within a specific, focused demographic, and to convert those listeners into station revenues) was outstanding. Presumably those supporting factors were eroding with the general meltdown in the advertising market, Indie’s lousy PPM results, and the carving up of the non-KROQ audience caused by the transition of KYSR to alternative/active rock and KSWD’s new modern-leaning AAA format.

 

[SuperRadioFan]

Why did Entravision stick with Indie for so long? I read somewhere in Indie’s early days that Entravision’s CEO was a particular lover of alternative rock (despite his company’s overall hispanic orientation). I also heard that Indie’s Power Ratio (ability to attract listeners within a specific, focused demographic, and to convert those listeners into station revenues) was outstanding. Presumably those supporting factors were eroding with the general meltdown in the advertising market, Indie’s lousy PPM results, and the carving up of the non-KROQ audience caused by the transition of KYSR to alternative/active rock and KSWD’s new modern-leaning AAA format.

"Modern-leaning"? Huh?

 

[scooty430]

David ur problem with the now dead indie 1031 seems to me you simply did not like the format. Now i hate kiss format but i don't critisize them. You seem to fault indie for everything. the only thing i did not like was that god awful suicide girls on sunday nights.

I have no issue with Indie's music... nor with that of KDAY or KROQ or KBIG or any other station. Each supposedly appeals to a specific group of listeners. And that is what radio is supposed to do.

It does not matter whether any particular station plays music or does programming I like.

The issue with Indie was perhaps being too cool for the room, as well as trying to do a niche format on a niche signal... a guarantee of low, low ratings. And since ad rates are set based on listener delivery, that is what it is all about.

I think what people are referring to is that your posts about Indie over the years seemed to go beyond objective analysis, as if you had a personal grudge against the station, and those that enjoyed it. Part of that seemed to stem from your not really knowing or understanding the music that well. Even people that said, "Hey, I know Indie has no chance, but I love it," were attacked. It was kinda odd, frankly.

 

[scooty430]

Why did Entravision stick with Indie for so long? I read somewhere in Indie’s early days that Entravision’s CEO was a particular lover of alternative rock (despite his company’s overall hispanic orientation). I also heard that Indie’s Power Ratio (ability to attract listeners within a specific, focused demographic, and to convert those listeners into station revenues) was outstanding. Presumably those supporting factors were eroding with the general meltdown in the advertising market, Indie’s lousy PPM results, and the carving up of the non-KROQ audience caused by the transition of KYSR to alternative/active rock and KSWD’s new modern-leaning AAA format.

"Modern-leaning"? Huh?

If you think Simon and Garfunkel are "modern-leaning," then yes, The Sound was indeed modern-leaning.

 

[Doctah]

So why did Entravision stick with Indie for so long? Why didn't they go to a Spanish format earlier? Five years is quite a logn time for a format that never cracked a decent Arbitron number.

Entravision bought the signals to simulcast KSSE 97.5, but when they got 107.1 the need was gone. They looked for opportunities, and Clear Channel provided the best at the time.

At the beginning, they had a JSA with Clear, which guaranteed them revenue and profits. Clear had more inventory to sell, and put a little thorn in KROQ's sandals.

Then, the FCC rueled the JSA made Clear over the market quota in new rulemaking on market definition. Indie went with a JSA to the group that operates KDAY. They billed nicely and made money.

That JSA ended, and the manager of Indie left... sales declined. It was no longer profitable.

(This is the simplified version, of course)

The JSA ended in 2005 though -- and alot of us assumed the station was toast at that point. However, it continued for another nearly four years after that -- so I still don't understand why Entravision stuck with it so long. (Don't get me wrong, I'm glad they did -- but once Clear Channel was out of the picture, what stopped them from reverting back to the dance format, or going Spanish immediately?)

 

[davideduardo]

The JSA ended in 2005 though -- and alot of us assumed the station was toast at that point. However, it continued for another nearly four years after that -- so I still don't understand why Entravision stuck with it so long. (Don't get me wrong, I'm glad they did -- but once Clear Channel was out of the picture, what stopped them from reverting back to the dance format, or going Spanish immediately?)

Read it again, Sam.

The CCU JSA was replaced with another, this time with the operator of KDAY and the arrangement was quite profitable until it was ended by a reorganization at KDAY and the departure of the KDLD manager to Tribune. At that point, it was not a good model, and they moved to flip the format.

 

[JimmyJames]

So in that regard, at least financially, Indie could actually be called.. successful?

 

[Doctah]

The JSA ended in 2005 though -- and alot of us assumed the station was toast at that point. However, it continued for another nearly four years after that -- so I still don't understand why Entravision stuck with it so long. (Don't get me wrong, I'm glad they did -- but once Clear Channel was out of the picture, what stopped them from reverting back to the dance format, or going Spanish immediately?)

Read it again, Sam.

The CCU JSA was replaced with another, this time with the operator of KDAY and the arrangement was quite profitable until it was ended by a reorganization at KDAY and the departure of the KDLD manager to Tribune. At that point, it was not a good model, and they moved to flip the format.

Ahh, sorry, missed that second part. Indeed, the end of the KDAY JSA spelled doom for the station. That's too bad.

Anyone know if KDLD is still playing dance on HD-2? My question is, why wouldn't they put the Indie web feed on HD-2, particularly since they're still programming it with some in-studio specialty shows?

 

[gunterm]

The interesting part of this is to see if anyone actually follows them to the internet, it would be nice to see this actually work, because the other stations that did this never succeeded.

 

[Robnoxious]

The interesting part of this is to see if anyone actually follows them to the internet, it would be nice to see this actually work, because the other stations that did this never succeeded.

KNAC.com would like a word with you. It's turning ten years old this year.

 

[SuperRadioFan]

The interesting part of this is to see if anyone actually follows them to the internet, it would be nice to see this actually work, because the other stations that did this never succeeded.

KNAC.com would like a word with you. It's turning ten years old this year.

So KNAC.com came on in 1999? I thought it was earlier than that. In any case I know for sure they went off the air 105.5 FM on Feb 15, 1995. So there was a gap between over-the-air and the Internet broadcasts. gunterm I'm sure was talking about going directly from the air to the Internet as Channel 103.1 did in Sept 2000.

 

[gunterm]

The interesting part of this is to see if anyone actually follows them to the internet, it would be nice to see this actually work, because the other stations that did this never succeeded.

KNAC.com would like a word with you. It's turning ten years old this year.

So KNAC.com came on in 1999? I thought it was earlier than that. In any case I know for sure they went off the air 105.5 FM on Feb 15, 1995. So there was a gap between over-the-air and the Internet broadcasts. gunterm I'm sure was talking about going directly from the air to the Internet as Channel 103.1 did in Sept 2000.

Yep I was, there was the story of that other OTA station that went directly to the internet and sold the terrestrial property, however they've gone under twice. Fact is, as little money as there is on terrestrial now, there's NONE to be had in internet radio. After 5 years of doing this I haven't made a dime.

 

[SuperRadioFan]

The interesting part of this is to see if anyone actually follows them to the internet, it would be nice to see this actually work, because the other stations that did this never succeeded.

KNAC.com would like a word with you. It's turning ten years old this year.

So KNAC.com came on in 1999? I thought it was earlier than that. In any case I know for sure they went off the air 105.5 FM on Feb 15, 1995. So there was a gap between over-the-air and the Internet broadcasts. gunterm I'm sure was talking about going directly from the air to the Internet as Channel 103.1 did in Sept 2000.

Yep I was, there was the story of that other OTA station that went directly to the internet and sold the terrestrial property, however they've gone under twice. Fact is, as little money as there is on terrestrial now, there's NONE to be had in internet radio. After 5 years of doing this I haven't made a dime.

Matt, I remember you, we've exchanged e-mails (long time ago). You had/have that oldies station that had "stereo" versions of 'Good Vibrations' and 'Gimme Some Lovin'. Hope you can hang in there!!

 

[Carmine5]

Gary Lycan in the OC Register hinted that the personalities who are continuing to do shows with Indie1031 online, are doing it for free in order to keep the format and brand alive.

As Mark Ramsey has frequently pointed out, anymore it isn't just how large a number of listeners a station attracts that alone determines success but how engaged and passionate they are about the format and the way the station puts it together.

As we know, Indie 103.1 had a sizable, devoted fan base. Perhaps this is one online station that can succeed financially as those fans transfer to the web.

C5

 

[davideduardo]

As we know, Indie 103.1 had a sizable, devoted fan base. Perhaps this is one online station that can succeed financially as those fans transfer to the web.

In the Arbitron diary survey, Indie had a cume of around 0.25 million in a market with nearly 11 million 12+ persons. That's not a "large" fan base, particularly since "passionate" users are only about a third of a station's cume.

 

[Carmine5]

As we know, Indie 103.1 had a sizable, devoted fan base. Perhaps this is one online station that can succeed financially as those fans transfer to the web.

In the Arbitron diary survey, Indie had a cume of around 0.25 million in a market with nearly 11 million 12+ persons. That's not a "large" fan base, particularly since "passionate" users are only about a third of a station's cume.

I wasn't referring to just the LA market. Indie 103.1 was known, written about and respected all over the country as well as in many parts of the world.

That's why I say it may succeed online.

C5

 

[radioresearcher]

As we know, Indie 103.1 had a sizable, devoted fan base. Perhaps this is one online station that can succeed financially as those fans transfer to the web.

In the Arbitron diary survey, Indie had a cume of around 0.25 million in a market with nearly 11 million 12+ persons. That's not a "large" fan base, particularly since "passionate" users are only about a third of a station's cume.

I wasn't referring to just the LA market. Indie 103.1 was known, written about and respected all over the country as well as in many parts of the world.

That's why I say it may succeed online.

C5

Yes - they won the illustrious "Rolling Stone Station Of The Year Award" - while KROQ was the BIA station of the year for highest billing station of the year. I'll take the latter.

It's like Arrested Development winning tons of Emmys and American Idol being the #1 show. Awards mean nothing - audience does.

 

[4UH8SIMBKAGN]

Gary Lycan in the OC Register hinted that the personalities who are continuing to do shows with Indie1031 online, are doing it for free in order to keep the format and brand alive.

As Mark Ramsey has frequently pointed out, anymore it isn't just how large a number of listeners a station attracts that alone determines success but how engaged and passionate they are about the format and the way the station puts it together.

As we know, Indie 103.1 had a sizable, devoted fan base. Perhaps this is one online station that can succeed financially as those fans transfer to the web.

C5

Good luck. Entravision will give up on this loser very fast. It will be their next "fat" to cut. The economy isn't going to get better, they'll never be able to sell it, have no staff to do so and as a spanish language radio company, are not devoted to it. I give it 2 or 3 months until they pull the plug.