CBS ever so slowly scaling back on the 60s

[davideduardo]

Hence Why I said one of the first
Was not aware of WMOD. Are They Still Doing Oldies?

Perhaps one of the first 50 or so. WMOD lasted until around '77 when it converted to country.

 

[RadioJunkieMike]

CBS is a good station in a market with quite a few good stations.

I was in NYC earlier this month for 10 days and I've gotta say 'CBS-FM seems to have deteriorated. The morning show was nearly unlistenable; radio for folks with ADD (yes I realize they're not unique in that regard, but the target demo isn't 12-year-olds) and Taylor's corny back-and-forth shtick with Mr G was quite painful. Musically, they seem to be back to where they were right before "Jack" -- the repetition was really annoying (and I only really listened in the mornings; lord knows how many times a week they must play "Dancing Queen"). Bob Shannon seems quite strait-jacketed compared to a couple years ago. And gawd is Sue O'Neal terrible. Made me sad.

 

[davideduardo]

If over half their cume is hispanic....then that could be the answer. Do you really think that some of this cume would have an adequate knowledge of older USA hits to really even know what "other" oldies KRTH is avoiding?

Who really cares? The point is that KRTH has smartly picked songs that the broad mix of people in LA want to hear.

I just took a look at a Top 40 chart from the station I listened to in some of my own teen years... Stevie Wonder, Dianna Ross, Elvis Presley, Beatles, Englebert, Bobby Sherman, Steam, Tommy Roe, Shocking Blue, Andy Kim.

And that Top 40 station was in Quito, Ecuador. And you ask if people would know the songs...

Growing up in the USA (as a hispanic or any nationality) and listening to 60's and 70's hits on hit radio then, is much different than arriving in the USA recently and accepting what classic hit radio has to offer today, without some in-depth hit music knowledge from the past.

We are not talking about folks who arrived this week... or even in the last decade or so, because most immigrants from Latin America arrive before they are 25. A classic hits station plays 60's and 70's and some 80's songs, meaning the audience is going to be over 45 for the most part.

If that's KRTH's target audience and cume then that would explain why only certain 60's and 70's get played to begin with and why those songs are played frequently. Those songs are accepted by their audience and is what KRTH plays today.

There is more of a chicken-and-egg thing here. Because LA is highly Hispanic, and has been since, oh, about the 1600's, there are plenty of Hispanics who have been here a while and who grew up on those 60's and 70's songs here. Or there are others who grew up on the songs in Guadalajara or San Salvador or Cali and like them here, too. And still more who simply grew into the songs because they were like the ones that CHRs in Spanish played at home, but just in a different language.

 

[recto101]

So if WCBS-FM and KRTH keeps deteriorating does this mean that oldies on CBS radio will dissapear soon like when KFRC 106.9 became KCBS news 106.9. Like when WCBS and KRTH must silmulcast their AM news format like KNX and WCBS.

 

[davideduardo]

So if WCBS-FM and KRTH keeps deteriorating does this mean that oldies on CBS radio will dissapear soon like when KFRC 106.9 became KCBS news 106.9. Like when WCBS and KRTH must silmulcast their AM news format like KNX and WCBS.

No, absolutely not.

What is happening is that stations called "classic hits" are constantly removing songs that, as years go by, are not relevant to that moment's 35-54 and 45-54 audience segments and replacing them with other songs that may be 10, 15, 20 years newer.

It's the same reason why you don't often see Burma Shave and Ipana on the shelves of your local drugstore.

 

[oldies76]

What is happening is that stations called "classic hits" are constantly removing songs that, as years go by, are not relevant to that moment's 35-54 and 45-54 audience segments and replacing them with other songs that may be 10, 15, 20 years newer.

Can you explain then, why our local AM station KWRP 690 Pueblo is adding more obscure oldies (mainly 60's and 70's) than ever before? Remember, the same music played on 690, is also heard on FM 100.3 in the same area. These guys mix up 50's through the 80's very, very nicely!

Too bad they don't stream yet, but this is ONE darn good station...hope they last long.
The AM signal is weak at night (too much interference) and the FM signal cannot be heard in Colorado Springs very well. Pueblo is only 40 miles south of us.

 

[oldies76]

It's the same reason why you don't often see Burma Shave and Ipana on the shelves of your local drugstore.

Do they still call stores...Drugstores....today??

 

[recto101]

It's the same reason why you don't often see Burma Shave and Ipana on the shelves of your local drugstore.

Do they still call stores...Drugstores....today??

No Drugstores are now called Pharmacy Store's Go figure. Why do you think Long's Drugs in San Francisco rename or mearge themselves as CVS Pharmacy .

 

[oldies76]

What is happening is that stations called "classic hits" are constantly removing songs that, as years go by, are not relevant to that moment's 35-54 and 45-54 audience segments and replacing them with other songs that may be 10, 15, 20 years newer.

Actually, not much has been added on classic hits stations...a touch more 80's and more 70's...you don't or very rarely hear any 90's on these stations. If anything, mainly 50's has been diminished to about '64. Many stations, especially AM's play lot's of 60's and 70's. And of course, KRTH is stuck on it's group of 60's music.

I don't see a classic hits station skewing to just the 80's and 90's as hits, for many, many years to come. At that point, why call them classic hits....it'll sound like a Jack format.

 

[oldies76]

It's the same reason why you don't often see Burma Shave and Ipana on the shelves of your local drugstore.

But Slinky, Lincoln Logs, Lite Brite, Barbie, Monopoly, Candyland, Hot Wheels and Pac-Man hand-held joysticks are still very popular and are sold in 2011. Toys from the pre 60's - 80's still appeal very well, just like music.

 

[davideduardo]

But Slinky, Lincoln Logs,

If you read Bloomberg Business Week, you'll know that the people who buy nostalgia toys are grandparents who had them as kids, and who somehow think that their grandkids will like them.

Lite Brite,

You got me there. Before googleing it, I had no idea what that is or was. Apparently they are not made any more, but there is an iPad/iPhone app...

Barbie,

Dolls have been big "sellers" for thousands of years. The Barbie is simply the application of technology (plastic injection molding, flexible plastics, etc) that became available in the very late 50's. But the doll has kept pace with social and lifestyle trends to stay relevant.

Terrestrial radio has not kept up as well as Barbie has. Thus we have Pandora, the pureplays and Bob Pittman planning strategy at Clear.

Monopoly, Candyland, Hot Wheels and Pac-Man hand-held joysticks are still very popular and are sold in 2011. Toys from the pre 60's - 80's still appeal very well, just like music.

Yeah, lets look for a Vue-Master at Walmart or maybe a Lionel or American Flyer train. Or an Erector Set. Certain things have nostalgia value, mostly by old farts, and others have been dramatically updated or are timeless (toys that look like people and toys that look like current transportation systems).

But most current generation people today are not much interested in 99% of the stuff that is identical to the way it was in the 50's or 60's.

 

[davideduardo]

Actually, not much has been added on classic hits stations...a touch more 80's and more 70's..

Since the whole classic hits morphing is only about a half-decade old, there is not much you could see. The change from oldies to classic hits, pushed by PPM awareness, was more about dropping lots of songs and years, and adding a much more intensive 70's core. After that, each year brings maybe a 3% to 5% change in library... which is a direct function of the math of a station that plays 20 years, give or take, of music.

If you did a 2005 to 2015 comparison in a few years, the differences would be noticeable. But a 2010 to 2011 comparison is minimal.

you don't or very rarely hear any 90's on these stations.

But you will in the future. And you won't hear Supremes and Beatles. Or Brown Eyed Girl, either.

If anything, mainly 50's has been diminished to about '64.

Late 50's and early 60's are a component of oldies, and are not part of classic hits. Oldies is a format of desperate stations today... mostly AMs that were left out of the talk niches due to signal, and a few rimshot FMs in larger markets or target-less stations in unrated markets.

And of course, KRTH is stuck on it's group of 60's music.

And KRTH is likely the only big, big market classic hits station where the audience is more than half Hispanic, making it near-unique in nature.

I don't see a classic hits station skewing to just the 80's and 90's as hits, for many, many years to come. At that point, why call them classic hits....it'll sound like a Jack format.

As I said, the change is gradual. Ten or twelve years ago, we used to find amusement in the AC's that said "... 70's, 80's, 90's and today" when all they played from the 70's was one Chicago cut. But the elimination of the 70s' was so gradual that the average person in the moving target demos did not notice.

Stations that maintain success are like an amusement park ride. As many folks exit as enter, but most of the entrances are by new people. With each year that goes by, a station targeting 35-54 will say goodbye to trying to appeal to those who became 55 and will try to welcome those who moved into the youngest years of the target. It's very gradual, and only by looking at long-time successes can we see how enormous the change is over full decade comparisons.

 

[davideduardo]

What is happening is that stations called "classic hits" are constantly removing songs that, as years go by, are not relevant to that moment's 35-54 and 45-54 audience segments and replacing them with other songs that may be 10, 15, 20 years newer.


Can you explain then, why our local AM station KWRP 690 Pueblo is adding more obscure oldies (mainly 60's and 70's) than ever before?

Simple explanation: a daytimer (24 watts is not a viable night signal) with a translator that does not even put a 60 dbu over downtown Pueblo has to do something unduplicated on a better signal.

KWRP and its FM sister are being transferred from Exodus in an assumption of debt deal... essentially a short sale as I read it. Not a real poster child for your favorite format.

Remember, the same music played on 690, is also heard on FM 100.3 in the same area. These guys mix up 50's through the 80's very, very nicely!

And ran out of cash very nicely while they made you and 11 other people happy (exaggeration... the cume of the station is just over 5,000 people, or about 3% of the metro, while focused stations like CBS FM or KRTH get around 20% cume).

Too bad they don't stream yet, but this is ONE darn good station...hope they last long.

Let's see what the new owners do when the deal is approved.

The AM signal is weak at night (too much interference) and the FM signal cannot be heard in Colorado Springs very well. Pueblo is only 40 miles south of us.

The usable day signal only covers about 130,000 persons adequately, and the FM really only adds night coverage in some areas... its 60 dbu only covers 22,000 persons. Again, I point this out as it is a terrible example... bad signals, daytime AM, very limited translator, very low revenue market (#275) and a sale based on assumption of nonperforming debt. Add to that the fact that less than a third of the Pueblo listening is to local commercial stations and it's even a worse example.

 

[only1moore]

No Drugstores are now called Pharmacy Store's Go figure. Why do you think Long's Drugs in San Francisco rename or mearge themselves as CVS Pharmacy .

...Not in Hawaii. CVS kept the Long's name here.

 

[lalumia]

we will always hear Supremes and Beatles....ALWAYS....
there is no desire to hear the tripe that was churned out in the 90's..if there were,
such a station would be thriving already;moving in that direction equals doom for
whatever foolish mortal moves in that direction..
I Have Spoken!

 

[uncamark]

we will always hear Supremes and Beatles....ALWAYS....
there is no desire to hear the tripe that was churned out in the 90's..if there were,
such a station would be thriving already;moving in that direction equals doom for
whatever foolish mortal moves in that direction..
I Have Spoken!

Oh, Prunella.

Somehow, I recall John Records Landecker on WLS in 1986 saying that the 70s was the worst period for music ever. Mr. Landecker now hosts the syndicated program "Into the 70s."

Nice to see that people like lalumia are sounding just like our parents.

 

[lalumia]

the 90's was 20 years ago;
by the 90's, the 70's was already hip again, from disco to punk, to 16 Magazine bubblegum from the Osmonds/Jacksons'
no such similar activity happening now for Paula Abdul and Milli Vanilli records...(some of which I like,actually)
the mindset for that non nostalgic generation is miles from those who grew up in the 50's,60's,70's and 80's...
MTV changed everything..just the way it is

 

[adma]

Yeah, lets look for a Vue-Master at Walmart or maybe a Lionel or American Flyer train. Or an Erector Set. Certain things have nostalgia value, mostly by old farts, and others have been dramatically updated or are timeless (toys that look like people and toys that look like current transportation systems).

But most current generation people today are not much interested in 99% of the stuff that is identical to the way it was in the 50's or 60's.

Well, they can be--in fact, even more so than their equivalents back in the 50s and 60s. Just like the trends t/w tastes for vintage/retro fashion, shows like "Mad Men", or opting to live in older urban nabes over the boomburbs. Those aren't "old fart" generated; not at all.

However, it *is* more of a refined, boutique, conoisseurish taste, i.e. the younger people who may be "into it", aren't necessarily into the primitive, all too often absent-minded old means of consumption. To take an earlier example, if they're "into" Sinatra, it isn't through a 60s MOR radio-type frame of reference, or through the token "New York New York" or Bono-duet (or "Married With Children" theme) token showboating of the 80s and 90s. They may be "into the old", but by means of the infinite, scaleable resources of the present. They know who Nelson Riddle is. By nature, they're Internet-age creative consumers of history.

Thus we come back around to DavidEduardo's earlier quote:

Terrestrial radio has not kept up as well as Barbie has. Thus we have Pandora, the pureplays and Bob Pittman planning strategy at Clear.

It's not about the music--it's about radio. And to those these days who're younger and who opt for the old, the terrestrial commercial oldies radio way of doing it seems kind of...malformed and extinct, in a bingo-parlor-and-OTB way.

 

[oldies76]

the 90's was 20 years ago;
by the 90's, the 70's was already hip again, from disco to punk, to 16 Magazine bubblegum from the Osmonds/Jacksons'
no such similar activity happening now for Paula Abdul and Milli Vanilli records...(some of which I like,actually)
the mindset for that non nostalgic generation is miles from those who grew up in the 50's,60's,70's and 80's...
MTV changed everything..just the way it is

Exactly....90's music will never be as popular as "oldies" to a new generation, as the 50's, 60's, 70's & early 80's are to most of us. It will not have the same appeal. Today in 2011, we still hear late 50's and 60's. In 2020-2030, we will not hear the 90's as oldies to such a degree. In fact, we'll still hear the staple 50's & 60's music on select stations.

 

[oldies76]

But you will in the future. And you won't hear Supremes and Beatles. Or Brown Eyed Girl, either.

50's, 60's and 70's key music will always be played for many, many years to come. Late 80's, 90's and 00's music will not have the same appeal as oldies to today's generations as the older music has to us.

Earlier rock 'n roll has more appeal (instruments, lyrics, rhythms) than today's computer generated noise, as classics.