R
Rick Rose 2.0
Guest
Maybe only one commercial station but with .2 and .3 they have cbs, fox, abc and my network covered
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DMAs that should be merged into others
- Thread starter nomadcowatbk
- Start date
Victoria needs to placed in the Corpus Christi market despite the fact it does have a full power ABC and FOX station.
It could be a sub-market like Bryan is to Waco or Hagerstown is to Washington D.C.
I've always thought Carlsbad - Roswell - Hobbs should be it's own market separate from Albuquerque and Midland/Odessa.
It could be a sub-market like Bryan is to Waco or Hagerstown is to Washington D.C.
I've always thought Carlsbad - Roswell - Hobbs should be it's own market separate from Albuquerque and Midland/Odessa.
sthompson98 said:
Gotta disagee on that one. I think the Waco/Killeen/Bryan market should be split up. Bryan/College Station should be one market and Waco-Temple-Killeen another. Adding Victoria to Corpus would create the same kind of problems the stations in the Waco market have now. They can't get the kind of ratings they should because they have to share it with affiliates in the BCS area. It's too many stations chasing too few ad dollars. If you separated the stations so that they just get ratings in the areas they can actually be received you would wind up with two fairly vibrant markets instead of one confused one.
I always wonder why Lafayette Indiana has its own market, but only has 1 TV station, WFLI, a CBS affiliate. That market has to rely on WRTV for ABC, WTHR for NBC, WXIN for Fox, & the WTTK simulcast of WTTV for CW out of Indianapolis. The Indianapolis DMA has many counties in their market, & I can't see adding Tippacanoe, Benton, & Warren Counties into the Indianapolis market. As it stands, they have to rely on cable for network stations, except for CBS, though they also carry CBS affiliate WISH-TV from Indianapolis on cable in that market, along side WLFI (the local CBS affiliate). For PBS, they mainly rely on WFYI Indianapolis & maybe WIPB Muncie. They also carry WTTW from Chicago on cable too, along with WTTW subchannels WTTW Prime (PBS minus childrens programming), Create, & V-Me. It is possible to pickup Indianapolis stations with an outdoor antenna, but you need a deep fringe antenna, & even then, you only get the stations that broadcast north of Indianapolis. No one gets the stations that broadcast from the Trafalgar farm (or any other station that's licensed to Bloomington, nor get WIPB OTA.
If the reason to make Lafayette Indiana its own market to protect Indianapolis from Chicago sports blackouts, Lafayette is already 90 miles SE of Gary, IN (I've traveled I-65 between Gary & Lafayette & know the actual mileage), & the reason is moot, unless the blackout radius is larger than 75 miles. White County, which is close to the Lafayette DMA is actually part of the Indianapolis market, but close to Jasper County (part of the Chicago DMA).
If the reason to make Lafayette Indiana its own market to protect Indianapolis from Chicago sports blackouts, Lafayette is already 90 miles SE of Gary, IN (I've traveled I-65 between Gary & Lafayette & know the actual mileage), & the reason is moot, unless the blackout radius is larger than 75 miles. White County, which is close to the Lafayette DMA is actually part of the Indianapolis market, but close to Jasper County (part of the Chicago DMA).
Cape Girardeau MO and Paducah, KY (over 90 minutes drive) should not be in the same market
M.J. said:
Alpena has 3 of the Big 4 stations
11-1 CBS (HD)
11-2 FOX/MY (SD)
11-3 ABC (SD)
http://www.rabbitears.info/market.php?request=station_search&callsign=wbkb#station
Mankato, MN could be divested into Mpls if it could. They have only CBS (main) & Fox (subchannel). Cable gets all Minneapolis stations and only thing blocked is same Fox programming on KMSP 9 (Fox Mpls)....but only the SD version. The HD gets passed through as KEYC-DT2 is 480i widescreen.
But in an ironic twist there is a huge UHF "farm" in St James (30 miles away) that rebroadcasts all the Minneapolis stations (and KEYC) that with a good UHF antenna can pull in fine
But in an ironic twist there is a huge UHF "farm" in St James (30 miles away) that rebroadcasts all the Minneapolis stations (and KEYC) that with a good UHF antenna can pull in fine
Dave said:
I can't imagine Chicago sports blackouts would have any effect on the Lafayette situation. That said, sounds like a nice situation that they get both WTTW and CSN Chicago on cable (CSN isn't carried in the bulk of the Indy DMA despite Indy being in-market for three Chicago pro teams and Comcast being the dominant provider). Wasn't WGN's local feed carried on digital that far south at one time?
F
FreddyE1977
Guest
unclehonkey said:
Alpena, Michigan. Population 10,483. SAAAA-LOOOOOT!!
Disagree. Neither one of them is a big enough market (by itself) to support ALL of the "big three" networks, although Cape also picked up a FOX affil with KBSI in 1987. And by air miles, they really aren't that far apart.nomadcowatbk said:
Furthermore, they are both over 100 miles from St. Louis, and over 150 miles from Memphis.
WLFI was an early station from the 50s. Like most of these markets, locals and politicians wanted to make sure they got a TV station. WLFI was owned by the same people who had stations in Bloomington, IN and Fort Wayne. Add to that Northern Indiana was certain to be a UHF island(s) and you wanted coverage.
In this case with Bloomington farther south of Indy, I'm thinking they wanted some coverage on the northern end of the market, the station owners, that is.
DMAs suffer from huge population shifts, especially out West. You see the East Coast having too many, and the Western half is still pretty isolated. But San Diego for instance was only allotted two VHFs. Los Angeles was allotted SEVEN COMMERCIAL VHFs. That wouldn't have happened if San Diego was a major city back them. Same for San Jose.
If you look in the Midwest you have a lot of mid sized towns, that are too small for more than one station and are too far apart to be combined. Look at Champaign-Springfield, IL market. It's too spread out and the networks need two channels each to cover it. It should be two markets.
Lafayette is also home to about 40,000 college students and an additional 5,000+ teachers.
They probably thought at one time Lafayette could be big enough to support at least two networks, NBC and CBS.
In this case with Bloomington farther south of Indy, I'm thinking they wanted some coverage on the northern end of the market, the station owners, that is.
DMAs suffer from huge population shifts, especially out West. You see the East Coast having too many, and the Western half is still pretty isolated. But San Diego for instance was only allotted two VHFs. Los Angeles was allotted SEVEN COMMERCIAL VHFs. That wouldn't have happened if San Diego was a major city back them. Same for San Jose.
If you look in the Midwest you have a lot of mid sized towns, that are too small for more than one station and are too far apart to be combined. Look at Champaign-Springfield, IL market. It's too spread out and the networks need two channels each to cover it. It should be two markets.
Lafayette is also home to about 40,000 college students and an additional 5,000+ teachers.
They probably thought at one time Lafayette could be big enough to support at least two networks, NBC and CBS.
Mark said:
Bloomington has always been considered part of the Indy TV market. Even going back to when WTTV was on Channel 10, that channel was actually allocated to Indy in the late '40s. And WFAM-TV was never a satellite of WTTV, but they did carry some of Channel 4's local programming, notably kids shows and IU/Purdue basketball.
San Diego also had Tijuana and its allocations to deal with.
Lafayette has never had more than one commercial allocation, although WFAM-TV carried both CBS and NBC early-on.
Part of the reason WFAM/WLFI was able to stay on the air with a CBS affiliation is that, until the '80s (?) WISH-TV transmitted from the southeast side of Indy, rather than the NW side where they are now, and where WFBM/WRTV and WLWI/WTHR always were. WISH wasn't viewable in Lafayette without a good antenna or cable.
B
Bob1370
Guest
The most obvious example of two markets that should be one, is Washington, DC and Baltimore, MD. The two cities are about 35 air miles apart (not much further apart than Dallas and Fort Worth, which are part of a single market) and could easily be covered by a single group of signals from one transmitter site in Maryland halfway between the two along I-95. It's also pretty obvious who would get 3 of the big 4 network affiliations (4 would get NBC, 5 would be Fox, and 13 would be CBS for the combined market) and only ABC would be up for grabs...whoever sold his station to the Mouse would be the winner.
At one time in the early 1950s right after the FCC allowed major increases in signal power for TV stations, there was some talk of unifying the markets, but the networks couldn't get together on which stations ought to be the surviving affiliates and which would have to go indie or go dark. Politicians and business people in Baltimore also wanted to hold on to their separate market status and probably still do.
At one time in the early 1950s right after the FCC allowed major increases in signal power for TV stations, there was some talk of unifying the markets, but the networks couldn't get together on which stations ought to be the surviving affiliates and which would have to go indie or go dark. Politicians and business people in Baltimore also wanted to hold on to their separate market status and probably still do.
I think WISH-TV broadcast from the southeast side until 1997 or 1998, when they signed on WISH-DT (RF 9). By that time, I think LIN TV owned both WISH and WLFI.KeithE4 said:
By my rough measurements, it was more than 100 air miles from the old WISH-TV site to the state line in Warren county at the edge of the Lafayette market. The rest of the stations (and the new WISH site) are about 15 miles closer.
PTBoardOp94 said:
I'm taking a guess that WISH built on the SE side of Indy because the northwest side of the city was short-spaced to Peoria IL. Peoria had a Channel 8 allocation in the '50s, with a never-built CP for WIRL-TV, until that allocation was moved to Moline sometime around 1960. They probably saw no need to move until they built their DTV facilities. Is that right or wrong?
WISH analog was on at the new site on the northwest side before WISH-DT signed on...but only by a few years.
As for DC/Baltimore, that ship sailed many decades ago. The FAA turned thumbs-down on a proposal for a tall community tower northeast of DC circa 1970, and that was probably the last time a merger might even have been theoretically possible. There's now 65 years of separate ad marketing and TV news coverage for Baltimore and DC, not to mention a whole lot of suburbia on each side that's grown far beyond the area a theoretical joint site could serve.
Dallas-Fort Worth notwithstanding, the trend continues to be very much toward separate smaller DMAs wherever possible. Sure, an Alpena or Lafayette or Glendive might be barely large enough to have supported one TV station back when "a TV station" meant a separate fully-manned master control and transmitter and tower. But in 2013, it's barely more difficult or expensive to run three or four "TV stations" in one building than to run a single network. At least for now, I'd bet that a multi-network operation like the ones in Lima or Victoria or even Glendive is probably a reasonably profitable venture. Where's the incentive at the station or the network level to abandon that model and force mergers into larger markets?
As for DC/Baltimore, that ship sailed many decades ago. The FAA turned thumbs-down on a proposal for a tall community tower northeast of DC circa 1970, and that was probably the last time a merger might even have been theoretically possible. There's now 65 years of separate ad marketing and TV news coverage for Baltimore and DC, not to mention a whole lot of suburbia on each side that's grown far beyond the area a theoretical joint site could serve.
Dallas-Fort Worth notwithstanding, the trend continues to be very much toward separate smaller DMAs wherever possible. Sure, an Alpena or Lafayette or Glendive might be barely large enough to have supported one TV station back when "a TV station" meant a separate fully-manned master control and transmitter and tower. But in 2013, it's barely more difficult or expensive to run three or four "TV stations" in one building than to run a single network. At least for now, I'd bet that a multi-network operation like the ones in Lima or Victoria or even Glendive is probably a reasonably profitable venture. Where's the incentive at the station or the network level to abandon that model and force mergers into larger markets?
Fybush is right, as usual. WISH-TV moved to their current tower site in March, 1996. WISH-DT signed on from the same tower in 1999.
He's also right about Baltimore and DC. Baltimore's stations broadcast from the rather studly "Television Hill" tower at 1550 ft HAAT. Hard for them to get a more expansive signal.
He's also right about Baltimore and DC. Baltimore's stations broadcast from the rather studly "Television Hill" tower at 1550 ft HAAT. Hard for them to get a more expansive signal.
firepoint525 said:
but the stations only seem to cover news in one state or another, the NBC affiliate is Kentucky centric while the CBS stations is Missouri centric
nomadcowatbk said:
Isn't that SOP when a DMA has stations in more than one state? WEAR Pensacola, FL is Florida centric while WKRG, WALA, and WPMI Mobile are Alabama centric. Likewise, WLOS Asheville, NC is North Carolina centric; WYFF Greenville and WSPA Spartanburg are South Carolina centric. Yet I don't hear anyone wanting to split Mobile and Pensacola into separate markets, nor Asheville as separate from Greenville and Spartanburg.
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