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FUTURE JOCKS: THIS IS YOUR LIFE

There's nothing wrong with $10.00 an hour for weekenders who just wanna have fun. Full timers aren't making $10.00 an hour around here. The whole point of my post was for those starting out or who want to start out. Their future looks bleak. Except for that one in ten who shows promise in doing more than the basics I just can't imagine why anyone would think there's a goldmine for them in radio. And frankly most master the basics and go no further. It may not be all their fault. It's the stations too.

As far as people who have been doing it awhile but not really making much headway beyond just keeping a gig and making less than they should, you will never convince most radio people to walk away as long as they let radio define them. The obvious talented performers in every market are one thing. The other 75% are another thing entirely.
 
McRadio said:
There's nothing wrong with $10.00 an hour for weekenders who just wanna have fun. Full timers aren't making $10.00 an hour around here. The whole point of my post was for those starting out or who want to start out. Their future looks bleak. Except for that one in ten who shows promise in doing more than the basics I just can't imagine why anyone would think there's a goldmine for them in radio. And frankly most master the basics and go no further. It may not be all their fault. It's the stations too.

As far as people who have been doing it awhile but not really making much headway beyond just keeping a gig and making less than they should, you will never convince most radio people to walk away as long as they let radio define them. The obvious talented performers in every market are one thing. The other 75% are another thing entirely.
Click to expand...
Like any other job, though, if the mortgage is due or your kids are hungry, you do whatever it takes to get it done. If you get let go, where else do you go ? Look at how talented, well-known people (in this market), have struggled mightily just to stay on the air. There has to be a certain point, after you've used up all of your favors, where you have to throw in the towel, and face facts. I admire everyone who is hanging in there, in full-time radio, but I don't envy them, anymore. As much as I love this business, I had to realize the limitations that it had for me, as an individual. I could have stayed in radio, moved from city to city my whole life, and had nothing to show for it. I like it better, this way.
 
MarkAmbrose said:
You should be happy for JB, not waiting for the other shoe to fall, at that station.
Click to expand...

I am happy for JB. But when he said.... "Take it for what it is and don't think so high and mighty of yourself..You can be replaced."

This gave me the impression that he doesn't think that HE can be replaced. I'm just hoping that he isn't silly enough to believe that. There were some very good people at The SCORE who felt secure in their jobs as well. One of them posted here and said that THE SCORE wasn't going anywhere. Two weeks later he was out of a job. I don't think he's shown his face here since. Bottom line is that in most fields as long as you do a good job your position will still be there for you. But in radio you can be doing a great job and still get lynched. It's the sad truth that people thinking about a career in radio need to know about.
 
AMEN...unless you've got a family to support...

McRadio said:
There's nothing wrong with $10.00 an hour for weekenders who just wanna have fun.
Click to expand...

YOU BETCHA.

In 1995 -- after not-having-been-on-air 13 years -- I started doing fill-in DJ on WBIG-FM/Washington Oldies100...and IT WAS A BLAST.
(http://www.hollandcooke.com/wbig.ram)

I did it until I moved back to RI.
Very irregular schedule, since I'd just started consulting, and was traveling a lot.
Sometimes I did weekends, then I'd do afternoon drive for a week, etc.

I think they were only paying part-timers $20 or so at the time, although the full-time DJs did quite well.
But I did it for therapy.
And for "validation."
As TALENT, I was a medium market act, my biggest markets being Providence and Buffalo.
I did Washington as MANAGEMENT (like Tommy Lasorda, I coached-my-way-to the majors).
So even-just-being WBIG's "utility infielder" afforded me that moment I'd otherwise never have on Big City Radio.
LOTS of fun.

And, every-so-often, a thick New England accent would show-up on the request line.
Very flattering and wistful.

All my friends in Washington, who only knew me as a management suit, were amused and/or horrified at my-re-enacting-my-misspent-youth.

Good afternoon (here...evening there) from NAB2008/Las Vegas,
HC
www.HollandCooke.com
www.ListenToAmerica.com
 
Just because some people are not happy and have gotten burned does not mean it happens to everyone....sometimes you have to stop and take a self assessment and see if you are actually good enough. I did that after 8 years, I knew I could do the music; but was passable on the air...I got out as I knew my progress in the company was going to be stunted for the forseeable future and I had a fiance I knew I had to start thinking of. So I got out....a lot of what I see posted here is people that don't get it and shouldn't be in the game....

"Matt Allen has got to get out of WPRO"
"Erica got screwed over by Fun"
"Imus is done in Radio"
All of these things have been bandied around these threads over the last year; but yet, time & again, it shows that those who say them don't really get what is going on.
Sure, JB could get let go; but why would you even bring it up? You still have no proof that the person who posted was Gresh himself. For those of you looking to start out in the industry, good luck to you, I'll give you the same advice I give friends that get into the mortgage industry....there are a lot of peaks and valleys; but if you are truly good at what you do, you will be able to find work at any time, you just might have to look in a different location and follow the money.
 
I truly am happy for anyone who is happy with their job. I don't wish misery on anybody. I just know that radio can be a mean game and I hate seeing people being taken advanatage of. Radio is a business where there is a very high percentage of people who are being taken advantage of...... and I hate it. I come here and appear harsh to many. But the truth is quite the contrary. I actually think I care to much. Perhaps if I cared a little less I wouldn't feel so stressed when I come here.

I don't know how you do it wknd92. You don't even work in the business anymore, but you happen to have an answer for every question. You happen to know the insides and the outs. I don't know who you talk to, but you seem to know just about every inside thing that is happening in the business. I see some Radio people on your Myspace. I guess they all report to you on a daily basis and just start spilling their guts. Hey... more power to you. Have fun. That's just a little to crazy for me though. I don't want to know every tiny little thing going on behind the scenes. I would need to spend more time at the therapist if I did. Information overload. I can't do it. But if that's your thing.. go knock yourself out.

Where was I? ... ... ....... Oh yeah, I don't even have anything else to add to this thread. I'm just going to watch it until it dies. I just wanted future talent to know what they are getting themselves into before it's to late. Radio can be a very rewarding career if you are one of the lucky few. But the ideal thing would be to use it as a stepping stone and then go into TV where the money is much better. That's my 2 cents. Good Luck people.
 
"Radio is not just a jukebox."

In his State of the Industry address yesterday, National Association of Broadcasters President & CEO David K. Rehr quoted a recent BusinessWeek article on radio, something Baby Boomers can relate to:

"I recall huddling with it [transistor radio] long past bedtime, the volume set low, hoping to hear something I loved."

Rehr called that "romance...longing...a connection...the magic of radio."

We-who-do/did send those sounds into-the-night get/got more than just our paycheck.
And if you're snickering about meeting-hot-babes-on-the-request-line, you're missing my -- and his -- point.
Making that connection is a big part of why-we-do-what-we-do.

Aloha from Las Vegas,
HC
www.HollandCooke.com
www.ListenToAmerica.com
 
Re: "Radio is not just a jukebox."

Holland Cooke said:
In his State of the Industry address yesterday, National Association of Broadcasters President & CEO David K. Rehr quoted a recent BusinessWeek article on radio, something Baby Boomers can relate to:

"I recall huddling with it [transistor radio] long past bedtime, the volume set low, hoping to hear something I loved."

Rehr called that "romance...longing...a connection...the magic of radio."

We-who-do/did send those sounds into-the-night get/got more than just our paycheck.
And if you're snickering about meeting-hot-babes-on-the-request-line, you're missing my -- and his -- point.
Making that connection is a big part of why-we-do-what-we-do.

Aloha from Las Vegas,
HC
www.HollandCooke.com
www.ListenToAmerica.com
Click to expand...
Truer words were never spoken. Hope you're enjoying Las Vegas, like I don't already know that you ARE, Holland.
The people who don't understand how we can talk about having FUN on the air, or working for the FUN of the business, are obviously the ones who have never opened a mic, or have done a live airshift. :-\
 
Re: "Radio is not just a jukebox."

MarkAmbrose said:
Truer words were never spoken. Hope you're enjoying Las Vegas, like I don't already know that you ARE, Holland.
The people who don't understand how we can talk about having FUN on the air, or working for the FUN of the business, are obviously the ones who have never opened a mic, or have done a live airshift. :-\
Click to expand...
Mark, they may have; but never realized that there is an actual business side of what they heard on the radio. Those that get both sides of it-you, Holland, Charlie Jefferds, Gio, Paul & Al, Charles, etc are either doing it F/T or as in your case P/T; but doing it because it is fun. Most of those that don't get it and never made "the connection" as Holland so eloquently put it tend to end up having the Utopian idea of what radio is/should be and sit and pout because it isn't.
Sure, the industry is a ton different than even 15 years ago as most of the Mom & Pop operations got eaten up by large corporations; but we shouldn't hate the corporations...they are just doing what the FCC allowed and then held the stations to a certain requirement in regards to profit because they answer to stockholders....
To quote a song yu and Holland must have played a zillion times "That's the way of the world"
 
Holland Cooke said:
I started doing fill-in DJ on WBIG-FM/Washington Oldies100...and IT WAS A BLAST.
Click to expand...

WBIG is down the hall from me... they're classic hits now though... "Big 100.3"

There's still careers available in radio - but radio is changing... Holland's been pitching online, youtube, on-demand, web content for months on this board now... And he's right... online is the wave of the future for this industry... I left Providence and on-air/programming for online programming in DC radio... hopefully I got onboard before the train completely leaves the station on this one...

(By the way, Holland, I've read your descriptions of WTOP radio news over the past few months... I have to say, now that I had a chance to settle in down here, they're great! The "glass enclosed nerve-center" is part of my morning routine everyday...)
 
"And the winner is..."

APPLAUSE to WTOP, and HC client WDEL/Wilmington, winners of the prestigious Edward R. Murrow awards announced here yesterday.

NOT off-topic to the-topic-at-hand here on the Providence board.

These Murrows, which recognize excellence in station-produced news, generally end up on the wall at stations that make -- and PAY -- money. Good on-air content (accent on the first syllable) tends to come from content (accent of the second syllable) employees...staffers who are encouraged to go-for-it, and whose work resonates with listeners, thus advertisers.

Less-happy campers produce less-productively.
And, at too many stations, there are NO campers left.

Good afternoon (here, evening there) from Vegas,
HC
www.HollandCooke.com
www.ListenToAmerica.com
 
Re: "Radio is not just a jukebox."

MarkAmbrose said:
Holland Cooke said:
In his State of the Industry address yesterday, National Association of Broadcasters President & CEO David K. Rehr quoted a recent BusinessWeek article on radio, something Baby Boomers can relate to:

"I recall huddling with it [transistor radio] long past bedtime, the volume set low, hoping to hear something I loved."

Rehr called that "romance...longing...a connection...the magic of radio."

We-who-do/did send those sounds into-the-night get/got more than just our paycheck.
And if you're snickering about meeting-hot-babes-on-the-request-line, you're missing my -- and his -- point.
Making that connection is a big part of why-we-do-what-we-do.

Aloha from Las Vegas,
HC
www.HollandCooke.com
www.ListenToAmerica.com
Click to expand...
Truer words were never spoken. Hope you're enjoying Las Vegas, like I don't already know that you ARE, Holland.
The people who don't understand how we can talk about having FUN on the air, or working for the FUN of the business, are obviously the ones who have never opened a mic, or have done a live airshift. :-\
Click to expand...




Coudn't be furthur from the truth....mark, if you are great at your craft, and your CAREER, then as a human being, you want to be apprieciated and compensated for a life time of hard work. Get paid what your worth. If you are at the beginning of your career and need work, then you get paid that level. Manny Ramirez has FUN, should he get paid less cause it is? He brings things to the table, and the ownership recognizes that. Air talent brings things to the table....at least the good ones do.

You work at a station that has mostly no live shifts....you bring to the table a live body, and years of expierence.and give or take a dollar or two, you get what a newbie would get if he was on the air.
 
Re: "Radio is not just a jukebox."

RadioNut said:
MarkAmbrose said:
Holland Cooke said:
In his State of the Industry address yesterday, National Association of Broadcasters President & CEO David K. Rehr quoted a recent BusinessWeek article on radio, something Baby Boomers can relate to:

"I recall huddling with it [transistor radio] long past bedtime, the volume set low, hoping to hear something I loved."

Rehr called that "romance...longing...a connection...the magic of radio."

We-who-do/did send those sounds into-the-night get/got more than just our paycheck.
And if you're snickering about meeting-hot-babes-on-the-request-line, you're missing my -- and his -- point.
Making that connection is a big part of why-we-do-what-we-do.

Aloha from Las Vegas,
HC
www.HollandCooke.com
www.ListenToAmerica.com
Click to expand...
Truer words were never spoken. Hope you're enjoying Las Vegas, like I don't already know that you ARE, Holland.
The people who don't understand how we can talk about having FUN on the air, or working for the FUN of the business, are obviously the ones who have never opened a mic, or have done a live airshift. :-\
Click to expand...




Coudn't be furthur from the truth....mark, if you are great at your craft, and your CAREER, then as a human being, you want to be apprieciated and compensated for a life time of hard work. Get paid what your worth. If you are at the beginning of your career and need work, then you get paid that level. Manny Ramirez has FUN, should he get paid less cause it is? He brings things to the table, and the ownership recognizes that. Air talent brings things to the table....at least the good ones do.

You work at a station that has mostly no live shifts....you bring to the table a live body, and years of expierence.and give or take a dollar or two, you get what a newbie would get if he was on the air.
Click to expand...
It IS WHAT IT IS, RadioNut. You take what they pay you, and be happy with it. If not, then you leave, or do something else for a living. That's what I did. I got a "real" job in 1981, and do this broadcasting job, for FUN. Why is that so tough to understand...that it can actually be fun, even if you don't make $100 per hour ??? I have over 20 years experience, but who cares ? If I hold out for "pay commensurate with experience", I'll be holding out until my face turns blue. :(
Why all the whining and moaning...you can write a book about all of the "injustices" that are happening in radio in 2008, but no one really cares. Most people in radio are doing several jobs, and probably aren't even being compensated adequately for their original job description. Every position has a pay scale. You either accept it, or not, or try to go somewhere where a union can get you slightly more (until you subtract union dues).
You either accept this, or plan on doing something else for a living. Unfortunately, this isn't 1978 or 1985, and we're not in Kansas anymore, Toto...life is full of disappointments. You just have to make the best of them. Why do so many people on this board think that the world owes them something ? Radio is what it is...if you can't live with it, find another profession.
As Jeff Lynne once said, so eloquently, DON'T BRING ME DOWN :mad: !!!
 
alright alright....go have your fun....i can plainly see you LOVE IT, just from all the B-101 markings on your post. It is CLEAR, ABSOLUTELY CLEAR, that you would almost work FOR FREE cause you love it so much. I would try the bold letters, but i'm too lazy to lazy to do it.

Why is is so hard to understand that people who do work well, and MAKE MONEY for owners should be paid. I see it everyday with businesses, people of quality get compensated all over. Radio is a business like ANY OTHER business and there is no reason things can't start swinging the other way, and they will. I guess it will just take longer if people continue to work for FUN
 
RadioNut said:
alright alright....go have your fun....i can plainly see you LOVE IT, just from all the B-101 markings on your post. It is CLEAR, ABSOLUTELY CLEAR, that you would almost work FOR FREE cause you love it so much. I would try the bold letters, but i'm too lazy to lazy to do it.

Why is is so hard to understand that people who do work well, and MAKE MONEY for owners should be paid. I see it everyday with businesses, people of quality get compensated all over. Radio is a business like ANY OTHER business and there is no reason things can't start swinging the other way, and they will. I guess it will just take longer if people continue to work for FUN
Click to expand...
I can see that you are a man of principles, RadioNut. You could probably be elected president of your local union, with that stump speech. I agree that talented people should be compensated what they are worth, but these are just our opinions. We have no influence in getting them acted upon. Working a 4-hour shift, once a week, and having FUN, isn't the reason that people don't get paid what they're worth. Don't try to pin this one on me. Just because I enjoy what I do, and also get paid for it, doesn't make me a bad person  :)
I also am amazed at how many people using this site, hide their true identities, like Super Heroes. What's the big deal about having an opinion, and standing by it ? Try getting a letter to the editor published, without signing your name. Maybe some of the big talkers here would be a little kinder and gentler, if we were actually able to see the man behind the curtain  ::)
 
I see your point mark, i really do. I run a company, and i wish that my employees would work for much less than they are worth cause they love it, but it just ain't gonna happen.

Read Cooke's post....good pay, good morals, and a good working atmosphere made for productive employees. Perhaps you are the exception, you don't require those things. I think you have been out of radio for so long, that this is awesome for you. I"ll check back in with you in august when the meat of your sunday's in the summer is taken up with doing your shift as you pay more in gas than you collect to get there. If you last through that, then you certainly love it.
 
RadioNut said:
I see your point mark, i really do. I run a company, and i wish that my employees would work for much less than they are worth cause they love it, but it just ain't gonna happen.

Read Cooke's post....good pay, good morals, and a good working atmosphere made for productive employees. Perhaps you are the exception, you don't require those things. I think you have been out of radio for so long, that this is awesome for you. I"ll check back in with you in august when the meat of your sunday's in the summer is taken up with doing your shift as you pay more in gas than you collect to get there. If you last through that, then you certainly love it.
Click to expand...
I think I can afford the gas. My full-time profession allows for that. I also volunteer. That's when you give your time, and don't get paid for it. People should do a lot more of that, too. Life isn't just about money.
For the love of money
People will steal from their mother
For the love of money
People will rob their own brother- O'Jays, Spring 1974
 
Skynet74 said:
Time is worth money. Accepting low pay is just agreeing that you don't think your time is worth much.
Click to expand...
Posting on this board is like climbing a frozen waterfall  :mad:
I'm glad that people like Alan Shawn Feinstein don't base their life work on Skynet's principle.
What would happen to all philanthropists, volunteerism, and charities, if they all figured that their time is worth money ? Christmas a humbug, Uncle Scrooge ?
 
When you give your time to a charity or organization, its usually because said organization can't afford to pay top dollar for everything.

Example, would you donate your time to exxon and work for them almost for free? probably not

Would you donate your time to help a non-profit organization? probably yes

Is clear channel a non-profit?
 
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