Fybush: Lost 45s gone from WROR?

[Wimmmex]

Thank you for the "welcome," you're about 34 years too late.

A lot has changed in those 34 years.

It truly is a "stand alone" product regardless of the station that exists around it.

The very words that are another reason that todays programmers are less inclined to use it.

Suddenly a new management arrives (presumably from out-of-town) and declares that this show is "out of place" amongst the rest of the station.

Or....a new management comes in that understands the new challenges of the marketplace and PPM. And new management didn't act immediately. They have probably been looking at research and focus groups for the last year before making the decision.

Will replacing the show with "regular format," most likely voicetracked, INCREASE ratings and revenue for this daypart? Unless there is a "secret weapon" under their trenchcoats, then, yes, I would maintain that this new management is clueless;

One of the things that you either miss...or dismiss...is that the audience that likes Barry's show and selections might NOT like the stations format...and vice versa. The 'regular format' and Barry's show might have polar audiences....working against each other. (Circular firing squad, death spiral, stop digging to get out of a hole...use any analogy you want). It's folly to think of "Sunday Night" as an island all to itself. That's old-line thinking.

clueless about the stations heritage, clueless about their history, and clueless about their audience. Thoughts, anyone?

My thoughts are that you are summarily dismissive of proven executives with tons of research, tons of experiences, other market experience and have been successful programming in the new media environment......all based on your "gut'?

 

[frnkp2000]

<<"A lot has changed in those 34 years.">>

And I worked in the business for 32 of them, rolling with all the "changes". One thing has not changed: the adage "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." Is it really broke?

<< (Me):It truly is a "stand alone" product regardless of the station that exists around it.
(YouThe very words that are another reason that todays programmers are less inclined to use it.>>

Or...maybe it will attract listeners who wouldn't ordinarily listen to a Classic Rock format, but are within the target demographic. What is the age difference between those who listen to Classic Rock, and "Lost 45s" anyway? This is a specialty show on a Sunday night, fer cryin' out loud.



<< "Or....a new management comes in that understands the new challenges of the marketplace and PPM. And new management didn't act immediately. They have probably been looking at research and focus groups for the last year before making the decision.">>

The key word here is "probably". But isn't it stated in an earlier post that it was determined that the show "didn't fit" the rest of the station? Either that was their sole reasoning, or ratings and revenue didn't justify keeping it. I've worked with plenty of New Management From Out Of Town types who totally missed the uniqueness of the Boston radio market. For example: at one station, the GM (from NYC) would constantly complain about the tightness of commercial sets--he wanted one-second pauses between spots. He soon learned that was a "New York Thing", after scanning the dial and hearing that "that's how we do things here", and relented to permitting the usual.

<<One of the things that you either miss...or dismiss...is that the audience that likes Barry's show and selections might NOT like the stations format...and vice versa. The 'regular format' and Barry's show might have polar audiences....working against each other. (Circular firing squad, death spiral, stop digging to get out of a hole...use any analogy you want). It's folly to think of "Sunday Night" as an island all to itself. That's old-line thinking. >>

And just maybe, that car radio or home radio that was tuned to Barry Scott the night before will be turned on and tuned in to Loren & Wally in the morning, and those same folks, of the same age, (how can that possibly be "polar"?) might find a new morning show of their liking? Sunday nights and AM Drive are hardly the same thing, but apparently someone upstairs thinks the Sunday night time slot is SO important, that they're willing to toss an audience who might not otherwise sample their product? HOW is that "old-line thinking?"

<<My thoughts are that you are summarily dismissive of proven executives with tons of research, tons of experiences, other market experience and have been successful programming in the new media environment......all based on your "gut'?>>

No, based on experience, trial and error, success and failure. One thing remains constant, and that is that on Sunday nights, cumes are lower than most other dayparts. Specialty shows are a way to counter that. How many Barry Scott listeners are going to fire up their computers instead to hear the show? That remains to be seen. Just like all those people who threw out their radios when Stern and O&A moved to satellite, right? Program in the "new media" environment by being innovative and different. If the numbers and dollars are showing in the daypart, leave it alone! Otherwise, that's the ONLY reason to consider a change. Your station image is not going to be hurt by one weekly specialty show on Sunday night. I cannot think of a case where that has ever happened, either.

 

[Wimmmex]

<<"A lot has changed in those 34 years.">>

One thing has not changed: the adage "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." Is it really broke?

The old adage is..."Is it helping us or hurting us?"

I would trust the guys with the research to decide that.

<< (Me):It truly is a "stand alone" product regardless of the station that exists around it.
(YouThe very words that are another reason that todays programmers are less inclined to use it.>>[/QUOTE]

Or...maybe it will attract listeners who wouldn't ordinarily listen to a Classic Rock format, but are within the target demographic.

Remember, its more than a set of age groups....it's about lifestyle groups. And maybe it will detract/deter the main core P1's who like the station. Remember on PPM means a lot...especially nights weekends.

This is a specialty show on a Sunday night, fer cryin' out loud.

The day of the specialty program and block programming are over.

But isn't it stated in an earlier post that it was determined that the show "didn't fit" the rest of the station?

Someone speculated so.

Either that was their sole reasoning, or ratings and revenue didn't justify keeping it.

Or does it help the brand or detract from it.

I've worked with plenty of New Management From Out Of Town types who totally missed the uniqueness of the Boston radio market. For example: at one station, the GM (from NYC) would constantly complain about the tightness of commercial sets--he wanted one-second pauses between spots. He soon learned that was a "New York Thing", after scanning the dial and hearing that "that's how we do things here", and relented to permitting the usual.

And just maybe, that car radio or home radio that was tuned to Barry Scott the night before will be turned on and tuned in to Loren & Wally in the morning, and those same folks, of the same age,

Well, thats the decision that management has to weigh...is it bringing more people in.....or detracting from our "brand". and they did. You just didn't like their answer. ;-)

(how can that possibly be "polar"?)

WROR is most a rock station these days. Barry show is more of a pop show.

Sunday nights and AM Drive are hardly the same thing, but apparently someone upstairs thinks the Sunday night time slot is SO important, that they're willing to toss an audience who might not otherwise sample their product?

Or it was important enough (in this era of smaller promotional and marketing budgets) that they didn't want people tuning in getting the wrong idea about the station.

HOW is that "old-line thinking?"

Remember, it's all about "the brand" these days.

<<My thoughts are that you are summarily dismissive of proven executives with tons of research, tons of experiences, other market experience and have been successful programming in the new media environment......all based on your "gut'?>>

No, based on experience, trial and error, success and failure.

Will you put up your experience, trial, error, sucess, failure rate up against the executives that made the decision? I'l bet their track record looks better.

One thing remains constant, and that is that on Sunday nights, cumes are lower than most other dayparts. Specialty shows are a way to counter that.

Again, old-line thinking. If it deters from the brand, then it is not a productive way to counter that.

If the numbers and dollars are showing in the daypart, leave it alone!

You are assuming that numbers and dollars in that daypart were OK

Your station image is not going to be hurt by one weekly specialty show on Sunday night.

Have you ever been in a focus group?

 

[WLYNWAZNgm]

Curious about the business model for Lost 45's. Does he buy the time, and sell his own sponsors,
or does the station pay for the program upfront?

 

[MarcB]

Curious about the business model for Lost 45's. Does he buy the time, and sell his own sponsors,
or does the station pay for the program upfront?

This might answer any questions you might have. http://www.compassmedianetworks.com/common/programmingdetail.jsp?chartID=198&pos=657069465371256258

 

[WLYNWAZNgm]

Compass Media page - does not readily answer the question...

 

[Unregistered]

Okay...

Compass Media page - does not readily answer the question...

Soooooo...Call the number on the page and ask the question to...whomever picks up the phone...yourself?

 

[Unregistered]

Second time...

Compass Media page - does not readily answer the question...

You've been told twice now to call the number on the page to the link that that individual provided. They should be able to answer your questions.

 

[chitchatjf]

96.9 would be a possible place for Barry and co.

 

[nowradioguy]

96.9 would be a possible place for Barry and co.

Seriously doubt it, since 96.9 and 105.7, Barry's last on-air gig in Boston, are co-owned (by Greater Media) and fall under the same Director of Programming.

 

[Wimmmex]

You've been told twice now to call the number on the page to the link that that individual provided. They should be able to answer your questions.

Wow....talk about abrupt! LOL!

Be easier if someone could answer the question here...after all, it is a discussion board...with the give and take of information.

 

[lost45]

The Lost 45s

Doubtful this decision had any connection to 'research.' To say "The Lost 45s" -- which only plays the big charted hits from the 60s, 70s & 80s-- doesn't fit the "greatest hits of the 60s, 70s & 80s" format, is disingenuous to say the least. The show features 95% of those hits, while they play about 5%. Little Steven, which followed in that time slot, plays 50s tunes and some very obscure records. After over 25 years on the air in Boston, 850+ artist interviews, crazily avid listener support--three hours a week to play the rest of the hits doesn't seem much to ask. Luckily, their decision has made me feel the show is better than ever, perhaps too good for most terrestrial radio stations. I got into radio because I loved music, never anticipating a day where there would be over-researched lab-coated ‘brand managers’ in charge of formats they know nothing about; with no love for the product or any desire to create fun radio. Call me old fashioned, but "The Lost 45s" is damn good, fun radio--and still heard on my web site and well-programmed radio stations around the country. Just not in Boston, where radio continues to be so boring. It's better up here in Portsmouth, NH!

 

[nowradioguy]

Doubtful this decision had any connection to 'research.' To say "The Lost 45s" -- which only plays the big charted hits from the 60s, 70s & 80s-- doesn't fit the "greatest hits of the 60s, 70s & 80s" format, is disingenuous to say the least. The show features 95% of those hits, while they play about 5%. Little Steven, which followed in that time slot, plays 50s tunes and some very obscure records. After over 25 years on the air in Boston, 850+ artist interviews, crazily avid listener support--three hours a week to play the rest of the hits doesn't seem much to ask. Luckily, their decision has made me feel the show is better than ever, perhaps too good for most terrestrial radio stations. I got into radio because I loved music, never anticipating a day where there would be over-researched lab-coated ‘brand managers’ in charge of formats they know nothing about; with no love for the product or any desire to create fun radio. Call me old fashioned, but "The Lost 45s" is damn good, fun radio--and still heard on my web site and well-programmed radio stations around the country. Just not in Boston, where radio continues to be so boring. It's better up here in Portsmouth, NH!

Way to go, Barry! Nicely articulated. Thank you.

 

[Unregistered]

Barry should have a spot

Everybody knows it.

 

[lost45]

Way to go, Barry! Nicely articulated. Thank you.

Thanks for all of your kind support over the years, either as co-workers or members of this board. When radio programmers don't appreciate, acknowledge or even understand what you are trying to accomplish with a specialty radio show, you know that you have something special to fight for. I fight for the listeners who love the real songs they grew up with: those that know there is more to Classic Hits radio than "Born in The USA"--and those records and artists themselves; as I grew up with those tunes along with "Carry On Wayward Son."

 

[lost45]

"The Lost 45s" on over 30 stations now...just not Hometown of Boston.

Luckily, our first book at Townsquare Media's WSHK & WSAK "The Shark" Portsmouth, NH & Auburn ME vaulted the stations from #24 to #2 in our Saturday night time slot and online listening at my web site has been up 200%. I guess fans of "Classic Hits" from the 70s & 80s do want to hear these songs and interviews with over 850 artists, if only for 3 hours a week. They know there's more to that era than the 5% of the records that ROR keeps playing over and over. Sad when a 'brand manager' brought in-house with CHR/Urban experience feels they need to meddle in all the stations without any real knowledge. The ratings prove it's never a good thing.