How long until WPAT Switches format?

[davideduardo]

Assuming that SBS does not sell WPAT, they would probably want to continue offering some sort of format aimed at Spanish speaking listeners.
Can anyone think of one that could do well in this market, other than what is already being done on the other 3 Spanish language FM's? Might they do better if they returned to their softer a/c sound of a few years ago? Apparently no station is offering much for the many people from South America, Central America and Mexico that are not all that interested in tropical music.

Tropical in some form is just as popular everywhere in the Caribbean Basin as it is in the Greater Antilles. That means that Colombians, Venezuelans and most Central Americans will find the rhythmic blends of WXNY and WSKQ appealing... and that taste extends to Ecuador and even Perú in South America.

WPAT's problem is not the format, it is the execution. There are successful Hot AC / CHR stations like WMGE in Miami and WKAQ-FM in San Juan that show that a pop format can work. In fact, WMGE shows the appeal of the format in a market where 18-49 is less than half Cuban and the rest mixed between Puerto Rican, Dominican, Nicaraguan, Colombian, Ecuadorian and Venezuelan.

Softer AC is pretty much over unless they want to try an oldies based format, but stations doing that, like WIOA in San Juan, are also-rans now.

 

[reelyreal]

It's interesting to note, but not particularly surprising, that those trends mirror the trends in english-language formats. Hot AC/CHR can be huge, but execution is key. Soft AC is dead in the water, and oldies can be tricky.

 

[davideduardo]

You're kidding, right? New Christmas music doesn't have to come out every year for the songs to be recognized.

Unless you are targeting Puerto Ricans exclusively, you are going to be limited to a true handful of Christmas songs... with very little to add to the library each year.

How many times can you play "Feliz Navidad" "Ven a Mi Casa en Navidad" "El Pequeño Tamborillero" "El Burrito de Belén", a couple of villancicos (Peces en el Río) and some covers of Anglo Christmas tunes before it becomes nauseating?

 

[Barry]

Assuming that SBS does not sell WPAT, they would probably want to continue offering some sort of format aimed at Spanish speaking listeners.
Can anyone think of one that could do well in this market, other than what is already being done on the other 3 Spanish language FM's? Might they do better if they returned to their softer a/c sound of a few years ago? Apparently no station is offering much for the many people from South America, Central America and Mexico that are not all that interested in tropical music.

WPAT's problem is not the format, it is the execution. There are successful Hot AC / CHR stations like WMGE in Miami and WKAQ-FM in San Juan that show that a pop format can work. In fact, WMGE shows the appeal of the format in a market where 18-49 is less than half Cuban and the rest mixed between Puerto Rican, Dominican, Nicaraguan, Colombian, Ecuadorian and Venezuelan.

David, if you believe that WPAT already has a potentially successful format, what do you think is lacking in the manner that it is executing its programming?
Personally, it seems that in recent months, much of the music on WPAT sounds similar to what's played on the other two major Spanish stations. There does not seem to be much to differentiate it. They even play a considerable amount of salsa, something they had not done in the past.
Mia, on IHeartRadio (and formerly on WWPR HD2), is an example of a Spanish A/C that is less focused on tropical music. It reminds me of how WPAT used to sound, when it had decent ratings.

Mia:http://www.iheart.com/live/4451/

 

[Morpheux]

You're kidding, right? New Christmas music doesn't have to come out every year for the songs to be recognized.

Unless you are targeting Puerto Ricans exclusively, you are going to be limited to a true handful of Christmas songs... with very little to add to the library each year.

How many times can you play "Feliz Navidad" "Ven a Mi Casa en Navidad" "El Pequeño Tamborillero" "El Burrito de Belén", a couple of villancicos (Peces en el Río) and some covers of Anglo Christmas tunes before it becomes nauseating?

Feliz Navidad is an American Christmas classic. In Puerto Rico not so much. It's a product of the US via José Feliciano Please,get with the times!!It's like if I said how many times can you play " Slient Night" to represent current American Christmas music.

There are many merengue and bachata songs done by Dominican artists that will fit well on NY radio.Not only that but,Christmas music is not just an American tradition :. Christmas songs are on the radio all over Latin America. Anglo Christmas tunes? Sorry, I have to laugh at this one.

 

[davideduardo]

Feliz Navidad is an American Christmas classic. In Puerto Rico not so much.

Funny, but at every station I was at in Puerto Rico, where the song fit the format, it was the #1 played song over many decades.

It's a product of the US via José Feliciano Please,get with the times!!

José Feliciano is from Lares, Puerto Rico, and is a national treasure...

It's like if I said how many times can you play " Slient Night" to represent current American Christmas music.

But there are hundreds and hundreds of Christmas songs familiar to "Americans" and many have been done in versions that fit every format, from AC to CHR to Country.

There are not hundreds and hundreds of Spanish language Christmas songs known to people from diverse national and cultural backgrounds.

There are many merengue and bachata songs done by Dominican artists that will fit well on NY radio.

As I said, not a lot of music beyond what I mentioned that will appeal also to the Puerto Ricans, Colombians, Ecuadorians, Central Americans, etc. that are part of the "tropical" or rhythmic audience in New York.

Not only that but,Christmas music is not just an American tradition :. Christmas songs are on the radio all over Latin America.

No, they are not. At Christmastime in Argentina, I heard no Christmas songs on the radio and there was never a suggestion by the staff of the station I was with that we might play Spanish language Christmas music. Likewise, when I was in Ecuador, we never played any Christmas music. While a few stations may play a few isolated songs, and Christmas eve may be peppered with villancicos and the traditional Tunas and Estudiantinas, there is no significant tradition of playing Christmas music on the radio in much of Latin America.

In fact, the only place where Christmas music has considerable significance is Puerto Rico, where Christmas music is really party music with often silly or double entendre songs in the style of traditional Puerto Rican music by such greats as Tavin Pumarejo and his Tuna Fish.

Anglo Christmas tunes? Sorry, I have to laugh at this one.

Obviously, you don't know that English language music of any kind is referred to by record labels and radio stations alike in Latin America as "anglo" (as in the terms Anglophone and Francophone in English).

 

[davideduardo]

David, if you believe that WPAT already has a potentially successful format, what do you think is lacking in the manner that it is executing its programming?

Bad music selection including playlists that look nothing like the actual hists of the format from all over Latin America, coupled with erratic and inconsistent execution of the format.

Personally, it seems that in recent months, much of the music on WPAT sounds similar to what's played on the other two major Spanish stations. There does not seem to be much to differentiate it.

It's got enough stiffs and low appeal library stuff to drive any significant TSL away.

They even play a considerable amount of salsa, something they had not done in the past.

Now, there's a great move. Play salsa, which appeals mostly to 35+ or even older mixed in with pop, that is supposed to appeal to 18-34 and 18-49.

Mia, on IHeartRadio (and formerly on WWPR HD2), is an example of a Spanish A/C that is less focused on tropical music. It reminds me of how WPAT used to sound, when it had decent ratings.

Mia is fine for iHeart. But it's doing something that has not gotten ratings on OTA radio for about a decade or more.

 

[Morpheux]

Feliz Navidad is an American Christmas classic. In Puerto Rico not so much.

Funny, but at every station I was at in Puerto Rico, where the song fit the format, it was the #1 played song over many decades.

It's a product of the US via José Feliciano Please,get with the times!!

José Feliciano is from Lares, Puerto Rico, and is a national treasure...

It's like if I said how many times can you play " Slient Night" to represent current American Christmas music.

But there are hundreds and hundreds of Christmas songs familiar to "Americans" and many have been done in versions that fit every format, from AC to CHR to Country.

There are not hundreds and hundreds of Spanish language Christmas songs known to people from diverse national and cultural backgrounds.

There are many merengue and bachata songs done by Dominican artists that will fit well on NY radio.

As I said, not a lot of music beyond what I mentioned that will appeal also to the Puerto Ricans, Colombians, Ecuadorians, Central Americans, etc. that are part of the "tropical" or rhythmic audience in New York.

Not only that but,Christmas music is not just an American tradition :. Christmas songs are on the radio all over Latin America.

No, they are not. At Christmastime in Argentina, I heard no Christmas songs on the radio and there was never a suggestion by the staff of the station I was with that we might play Spanish language Christmas music. Likewise, when I was in Ecuador, we never played any Christmas music. While a few stations may play a few isolated songs, and Christmas eve may be peppered with villancicos and the traditional Tunas and Estudiantinas, there is no significant tradition of playing Christmas music on the radio in much of Latin America.

In fact, the only place where Christmas music has considerable significance is Puerto Rico, where Christmas music is really party music with often silly or double entendre songs in the style of traditional Puerto Rican music by such greats as Tavin Pumarejo and his Tuna Fish.

Anglo Christmas tunes? Sorry, I have to laugh at this one.

Obviously, you don't know that English language music of any kind is referred to by record labels and radio stations alike in Latin America as "anglo" (as in the terms Anglophone and Francophone in English).

No kidding.I know the meaning of Anglo. You obviously didn't comprehend what I wrote. It was in reference to your statement that most Christmas music in Latin America are covers of Anglo Christmas tunes. That statement is laughable at best. Spanish language Christmas music is not just popular in Puerto Rico but also Mexico,Venezuela and the Dominican Republic. Sure,it does not have the fervor as here in the states,nevertheless it is a growing market. As for Mr. Tavin Pumarejo,my dad likes his music. I might listen to one or two of his songs because I am geek that way. But no one in my generation(I'm 35) or younger would listen to him. Most of the today's popular artists in Salsa,Merengue and Bachata have recorded Christmas music.The music has evolved since Pumarejo's days just like it has in the U.S.Take a listen for yourself. There's nothing silly or double entedre about this song:http://hechoconsaborapr.com/las-canciones/mi-pequeno-amor
And its not like we don't have silly Christmas songs in English.Of course, the party Christmas music will be there.It's Christmas in the Caribbean. Why would it not be festive?

When I mentioned that Feliz Navidad is a product of the U.S. via José Feliciano, that's exactly what I meant. The song was recorded in the U.S. for primarily an American audience.It's still played to this day and as of four or five years ago it was the most played Christmas song in the states. In Puerto Rico the song has not retain the same popularity. And for the record,I know his bio.

Back to the topic at hand,why no tmix up some of the playlist to include a selection of Christmas music at WPAT? What is there to lose at this point?

 

[davideduardo]

No kidding.I know the meaning of Anglo. You obviously didn't comprehend what I wrote. It was in reference to your statement that most Christmas music in Latin America are covers of Anglo Christmas tunes.

The misunderstanding lies in your belief that I said "most Christmas music... are covers of anglo Christmas tunes". I simply said that the songs known in every country consisted of a small number of contemporary (post-1960) Latin American or Spanish titles, remakes of traditional villancicos, and an assortment of US and European songs and carols.

Which is the truth.

That statement is laughable at best. Spanish language Christmas music is not just popular in Puerto Rico but also Mexico,Venezuela and the Dominican Republic.

In Mexico, few stations play any Christmas music, and those that do play just a couple of songs. For example, I looked at the BDS reports for Mexico today, a time when many US stations have gone all-Christmas and other music stations have added seasonal tunes to the rotation, I found no Christmas songs at all.

Another piece of information: the leading "set" of Mexican-targeted adult hits stations in the US has only about 50 total Christmas songs, and only about 25 different titles that are played sparingly over the three weeks leading up to Christmas... and that group has four to five decades of songs to draw upon.

As mentioned, the "Christmas" music of PR and the DR is really holiday party music, and is as often as not laden with humor, double entendres (like the the famous "Sin agua y sin gas" song of the 80's) and such.

Remember, in much of Latin America, Christmas was, until relatively recently, when one went to Mass at midnight. No Santa, no snow, no pine trees with ornaments. The festivities were on Three Kings Day... when gifts were given. My kids left grass for the camels, not cookies for Santa.

Sure,it does not have the fervor as here in the states,nevertheless it is a growing market.

No, it's not. While the record companies tried in the 70's and 80s to´create multiple "Feliz Navidad" and "Ven a mi Casa..." like hits to create a new market opportunity, but aside from the already existent market in Puerto Rico, all the Pandora and Sparxx and Yuri Christmas material just didn't sell. So today, there is practically no Christmas music being issued in most genres.

Of course, the party Christmas music will be there.It's Christmas in the Caribbean. Why would it not be festive?

When I mentioned that Feliz Navidad is a product of the U.S. via José Feliciano, that's exactly what I meant. ...In Puerto Rico the song has not retain the same popularity.

It's played as much as ever on the stations where it fits the format. It was never played on Salsoul and Zeta in the past, so saying they don't play it now means "no change."

Back to the topic at hand,why no tmix up some of the playlist to include a selection of Christmas music at WPAT? What is there to lose at this point?

They should worry about fixing the main playlist. Playing the Juanes Christmas song a couple of times a day is not going to fix anything.

You can't fix a broken station by adding a bunch of out-of-format music.

 

[Morpheux]

I'll think I 'll just let the music speak for itself. Btw December 25th is officially celebrated as the birth of Christ in many Latin American countries so it makes no difference whether Santa is acknowledged.Navidad just simply means nacimiento (birth) and January 6th is celebrated as the epiphany but better known as Three Kings Day.January 6th being the end of the Christmas season.Here is just a short sampling of songs mainly with Navidad in the title.Emphasis on current artists to show that it wouldn't be so out of place in the NY market.

Anthony Santos - Grito En Navidad (Mambo 2012)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeUXyHktl4o

TITO EL BAMBINO - FELIZ NAVIDAD (Not a cover)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBSNI68Khb8

Johnny Ventura - Dejalo Pa' Enero
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Jln2-p8T0l8#!

Alejandro Fernández & Ednita Nazario | Triste Navidad & Tequila (A ballad)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQ0LlIpUcSo

TOBY LOVE - Esta Navidad
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_MKsF-3dzc


DJ LAZ - Mi Burrito Sabanero (Remix)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVDghYgdv5s

 

[davideduardo]

I'll think I 'll just let the music speak for itself. Btw December 25th is officially celebrated as the birth of Christ in many Latin American countries so it makes no difference whether Santa is acknowledged.Navidad just simply means nacimiento (birth) and January 6th is celebrated as the epiphany but better known as Three Kings Day.January 6th being the end of the Christmas season.Here is just a short sampling of songs mainly with Navidad in the title.Emphasis on current artists to show that it wouldn't be so out of place in the NY market.

Anthony Santos - Grito En Navidad (Mambo 2012)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeUXyHktl4o

TITO EL BAMBINO - FELIZ NAVIDAD (Not a cover)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBSNI68Khb8

Johnny Ventura - Dejalo Pa' Enero
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Jln2-p8T0l8#!

Alejandro Fernández & Ednita Nazario | Triste Navidad & Tequila (A ballad)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQ0LlIpUcSo

TOBY LOVE - Esta Navidad
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_MKsF-3dzc


DJ LAZ - Mi Burrito Sabanero (Remix)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVDghYgdv5s

All of those are examples of songs that might appeal to one group and not to another...

You've totally missed the point that, besides not being anywhere near as strong a tradition in most countries, the lesser amount of Christmas music that is available does not appeal to everyone in every country.

And if the best you can come up with includes the 693rd recorded version of El Burrito de Belén, then the point is pretty well proven.

 

[Morpheux]

We can go back and forth forever. Quite frankly,I'm bored. I posted the DJ Laz remix of Burrito Sabanero because it does well on Power 96 in Miami and all around with bilingual and English speaking Latinos. There's a hundred other songs I can post that fit well with the WPAT audience.But why should I? Let the consultants who get paid do their job.

 

[davideduardo]

We can go back and forth forever. Quite frankly,I'm bored. I posted the DJ Laz remix of Burrito Sabanero because it does well on Power 96 in Miami and all around with bilingual and English speaking Latinos. There's a hundred other songs I can post that fit well with the WPAT audience.But why should I? Let the consultants who get paid do their job.

SBS does not have any consultants...

I don't see any Christmas music on WPOW yet, and when they do play some, I'd almost guarantee you that a DJ Laz remix is not going to be among the ones Pio plays.

 

[Barry]

Been listening to WPAT, Amor 93.1 FM over the past few days. Apparently the programming has been tweaked again. I believe it sounds much better than it has in a long time.
Basically, Amor has apparently returned to the Spanish A/C type programming they used to offer when their ratings were much higher than they have been in recent years. They are playing a wide variety of Spanish music that could appeal to the large amount of Hispanic people that are not from the Caribbean, or are not into the rather narrow tropical focus of La Mega and X96.3.
I believe that in the past few years, the music played on Amor was too similar to what was offered on the other Spanish music stations. That could have been one of the main reasons their overall ratings have been so low. Now they sound very different, as they did years ago.

 

[davideduardo]

Been listening to WPAT, Amor 93.1 FM over the past few days. Apparently the programming has been tweaked again. I believe it sounds much better than it has in a long time.
Basically, Amor has apparently returned to the Spanish A/C type programming they used to offer when their ratings were much higher than they have been in recent years.

Tito El Bambino, Grupo Gale, Joey Montana, Don Omar, Elvis Crespo, Zachaarías Ferreira, Lucky Reyes and Daddy Yankee (to name 8 out of the top 20 most played songs this last week) is hardly a change to traditional AC. WPAT-FM is a Caribbean-leaning pop/rhythmic station.

 

[Barry]

WPAT 93.1 Amor's overall ratings are on the right track. Over the past couple of months, they have rebounded from a 1.0, to 2.1.
As I had stated in my recent post above, to my ears the music mix they have been recently been playing sounds better than what they have offered in quite some time.
SBS may be glad that WPAT stayed the course with Spanish A/C, rather than jumping to the more bilingual approach of sister stations in Miami and Los Angeles.