If "Oldies" are dying then why..........

[XTalker]

You state "It's the ad agencies and the advertisers who won't support the format with their ad dollars." That's my point. If it's the ad agencies and advertisers that is causing the format change, then why isn't it happening across the US? You can go online and find so many stations that are still playing the "oldies" and doing great! Is it the advertisers and ad agencies completely or is it the combination of them and the radio stations? Or, is it the radio stations only and the ad agencies and advertisers are being blamed so the stations don't have to take the heat? I can't help but be suspicious especially when the oldies format is still doing so good in other parts of the US but not in Atlanta.

Then you lament should be posted on an advertising message board, not a radio one. I don't disagre with you about the format, but is pointed out, it is not radio people who are killing oldies as a format. Also understand that the restaurant could care less if anyone listens. Its just noise to mask the noise or a restaurant.

 

[Jay F]

Re: "Oldies" are dying

I would guess that it's because there a lot of retirees in Phoenix. Of course, with the 55+ generation growing every day there will soon be a lot of retirees EVERYWHERE.

KOOL is tied for #2 25-54, so their audience isn't all 55+ retirees. Much better demos than say a WDUV/Tampa which truly is a station for retirees.

 

[davideduardo]

Re: "Oldies" are dying

I would guess that it's because there a lot of retirees in Phoenix. Of course, with the 55+ generation growing every day there will soon be a lot of retirees EVERYWHERE.

The average age in PHX is no different than that in New York City or Chicago.

 

[TheFonz]

Re: "Oldies" are dying

The average age in PHX is no different than that in New York City or Chicago.

Wow......................those retirees are multiplying faster than I thought. And that means [terreisrial] music radio is becoming irrelevant to people faster than I thought.

 

[AZJoe]

KOOL's morning show and its local presentation and style make it a huge ratings success.

 

[XTalker]

Here is an interesting though. With the birth rate in America is now less than two children per couple, we are facing population decline over the next 30 years. What will that do to the popularity of the younger demos among ad agencies.

 

[quadraphonic]

Here is an interesting though. With the birth rate in America is now less than two children per couple, we are facing population decline over the next 30 years. What will that do to the popularity of the younger demos among ad agencies.

The ad agencies will work harder to reach and "superserve" the younger demos?
Except by then, all the 20-30 something ad agency people will be 50-70, so they probably won't?

Ah, who am I kidding?
It's all over for all demographic groups.
Every media is splintering and fracturing itself into oblivion already.
EVERY MAN FOR HIMSELF! ;D

 

[Frustrated Listener]

I live in the Atlanta Market and I can vouch for Oldiesfantoo that we don't have an oldies station or a classic rock station in town for that matter. I understand what everyone is saying about oldies reach older demographics etc. But, let's think outside of the box just for a moment. Are there many younger folks listening to radio? I'm in my early 40's and most younger people I know are listening to their I Pods or CD's when they're in their car. They wouldn't be caught dead listening to radio. (It's so what my parents did) The very demo that Corporate radio is trying to reach isn't listening anyway. Meanwhile, you have older folks who still primarily listen to radio for music aren't being catered to.

Why do you think CBS is consistantly the highest rated television network? They're still targeting an older audience. The other networks are trying to target viewers who are surfing the Net during prime time hours. They're not watching TV.

 

[davideduardo]

Are there many younger folks listening to radio?

Yes, within a couple of percent of how many were listening 20 years ago. The average listener does not care enough about it to post to message boards about radio, and such, so this group is not typical.

I'm in my early 40's and most younger people I know are listening to their I Pods or CD's when they're in their car.

Less than a third of listening ever took place in the car. In some cities, it is only about 25%.

They wouldn't be caught dead listening to radio. (It's so what my parents did) The very demo that Corporate radio is trying to reach isn't listening anyway.

Radio, corporate or otherwise (99% of stations are owned by corporations, and have been since the 50's), is seeking 18-54 year old listeners because that is what advertisers want.

Meanwhile, you have older folks who still primarily listen to radio for music aren't being catered to.

Advertisers in markets as big as Atlanta do not want to reach persons over 55. Never have.

Why do you think CBS is consistantly the highest rated television network? They're still targeting an older audience. The other networks are trying to target viewers who are surfing the Net during prime time hours. They're not watching TV.

CBS, of all viewing has only around 13%. The 4 major nets only have about 40%. The cable nets have 55%. TV reach is virtually 100% of all persons in every age group.

 

[OldiesCat]

"Oldies"

Why do you think CBS is consistantly the highest rated television network? They're still targeting an older audience. The other networks are trying to target viewers who are surfing the Net during prime time hours. They're not watching TV.

Couple of points to ponder:

a) it's not CBS or any TV network (or radio station's) responsibility to cater to audience that can't get them solid viewership or help generate ad revenue.

b) people use TV differently than they use radio. It's a horrible comparison

 

[warm590]

OK, lets think outside the box. we don't use an agency; we have our own sales people. What about the good old fashioned auto repair shop with a good reputation, where people can trust the person working on their cars. The small town bakeries and deli's.
Local businesses that people trust that are owned by older businessmen. It works for us...this isn't rocket science....


warm590 ;D

 

[davideduardo]

OK, lets think outside the box. we don't use an agency;

Stations don't "use an agency" to sell. They call on agencies, who represent clients, produce the creative, prepare campaigns.

Very small stations with low numbers seldom get any agency business, anyway.

we have our own sales people. What about the good old fashioned auto repair shop with a good reputation, where people can trust the person working on their cars. The small town bakeries and deli's.
Local businesses that people trust that are owned by older businessmen. It works for us...this isn't rocket science....

If you are in a small market, suburban or low rated, that is the only alternative: local direct. In larger markets, a signficant portion of buys come from agencies, and you can not make money without them.

 

[XTalker]

The ratings of a station are used to justify the higher cost of advertising of those who play the ratings game.

I think warm590 is right to a great degree. There are hundreds, thousands, of businesses in even large cities that can't afford to buy advertising from ratings based media.

And because most radio stations have abandonded their local communities for the larger metro areas, there are few real sales people in the business anymore. Now, before you get the hair up on your neck, stay with me. Yes, there are lots of people who have honed the craft of negotiating buys based on ratings, but honestly they are not radio advertising sales people like we once knew.

If a station is not ratings competitive in the metro, there are still millions of advertising dollars out there. Right now, that money goes to the coupon mailers, geograpically targeted newspaper inserts, and the weekly free lifestyle papers.

The radio station needs to:

+ select a geograpic area they can effectively provide with a city grade signal;
+ develop an on-air product that can draw an audience in that geographic area;
+ idenfy all of the small businesses in that area;
+ learn how they advertise their business;
+ price airtime competitively with that medium;
+ and find a group of face to face sellers who will call on those business and explain why the small station can be effective.

Let's take a small car dealer for an example. They guy has 30 or 40 cars on his lot. He needs to sell three or four a week to make a nice living for himself and cover his expenses. How many customers does he need to make the four sales? Can he sell 10? That means he needs 30 to 40 potential customers a week.

Now, how much cume (within the reasonable trading area of the car lot) does a station need to deliver 40 customers a week.

Bottom line - if you have a station that is not performing very well, a well done oldies format with some local information and involvement can bring you enough cume to provide that little car dealer with enough custometrs.

 

[OldiesCat]

Local businesses that people trust that are owned by older businessmen. It works for us...this isn't rocket science....

In market rank...what?

 

[amfmsw]

OC...it doesn't matter. Big, Medium, Unrated, you and ED keep blowing the "it's just business, make a profit" horn. Well, they're turning a profit. Or is that wrong now too?

And please don't keep bringing up "in the major markets I work" crap. It belittles you as a snob. There's some great talent in the smaller markets that settled down with families and are very happy NOT being in major cities.

 

[semoochie]

Something just occurred to me: If there are no agency buys over age 55 then is the 35+(formerly 35-64)Committee successful at all? Has anything improved since they were formed? Thanks!

 

[OldiesCat]

35+

No.

 

[Marc Rougee]

Classic rock oldies does NOT have to die. Why not give the other just as good songs on these legendary albums some heavy airplay rotation?? We all know those 60s and 70s bands and how they sound--and we are well aware of the historic anthems that made them superstars in their day. I don't see the harm in playing their other good songs; I think doing so is a bold step in the right direction.

And God knows: radio needs to do something original.......

 

[TheFonz]

Classic rock oldies does NOT have to die. Why not give the other just as good songs on these legendary albums some heavy airplay rotation?? We all know those 60s and 70s bands and how they sound--and we are well aware of the historic anthems that made them superstars in their day. I don't see the harm in playing their other good songs; I think doing so is a bold step in the right direction.

And God knows: radio needs to do something original.......

It has to die when its audience reaches age 55. Remember, radio doesn't program to 55+.

 

[AZJoe]

....and the 55+ can buy ipods, subscribe to Sirius or XM and tune in internet radio. 55+ age demos mean nothing to Sirius and XM, 1,000,000 old farts over 55 that spend $12.99 a month are accepted and wanted just as much as 1,000,000 20 something year olds who spend the same 12.99. Sat radio doesnt have to care about ads for music channels- there arent any- they just want numbers, and so far 15 million isnt too bad.