Jewelz leaves Pulse 87 again!

[Dancerev889]

I find that everytime I try to listen to Pulse, I get my hopes us while they play "Day N Nite" and "Every Word" and some of the currents, but then when I hear,for example, Shannon's "Let the Music Play" from 1983, that is my cue to change the station, or put my IPOD on. Same reason that I found KTU unlistenable. Although I do admit that it took Pulse a helluva lot longer to play a song that prompted me to change the station.

My conclusion is, if I want currents I just listen to a European station online, such as Fun Radio.

If Pulse is trying to be the cutting edge station, why are they playing "Let the Music Play" by Shannon?

If you dont play songs like that, cut their listening audience in half. That song is a classic. NYC loves freestyle music as does the rest of jersey and Philadelphia. You cant come in playing just current dance music. It wont work. You need familiars to keep the audience listening.

 

[TonySantiago]

I find that everytime I try to listen to Pulse, I get my hopes us while they play "Day N Nite" and "Every Word" and some of the currents, but then when I hear,for example, Shannon's "Let the Music Play" from 1983, that is my cue to change the station, or put my IPOD on. Same reason that I found KTU unlistenable. Although I do admit that it took Pulse a helluva lot longer to play a song that prompted me to change the station.

My conclusion is, if I want currents I just listen to a European station online, such as Fun Radio.

If Pulse is trying to be the cutting edge station, why are they playing "Let the Music Play" by Shannon?

If you dont play songs like that, cut their listening audience in half. That song is a classic. NYC loves freestyle music as does the rest of jersey and Philadelphia. You cant come in playing just current dance music. It wont work. You need familiars to keep the audience listening.

On a 'KTU, people would expect that. I'd even hype that on 'KTU. But on a station that's supposed to be current leaning, at best maybe ONE classic freestyle track every 3 hours or so. Recurrents should be at 8 years max. I deal with the freestyle boards and as much as they would like for something new to appear, it can never happen if the classic sounds continue to hold the genre back (yeah, I'm talking fan based in that respect). Some familiars yes.....and 'KTU does that well. A few on Pulse, but as you know, Pulse "branded" itself as current leaning. Current pop remixes....fine. Edgier dance....fine. But not freestyle as if it was 1987 all over again.

 

[Dancerev889]

I find that everytime I try to listen to Pulse, I get my hopes us while they play "Day N Nite" and "Every Word" and some of the currents, but then when I hear,for example, Shannon's "Let the Music Play" from 1983, that is my cue to change the station, or put my IPOD on. Same reason that I found KTU unlistenable. Although I do admit that it took Pulse a helluva lot longer to play a song that prompted me to change the station.

My conclusion is, if I want currents I just listen to a European station online, such as Fun Radio.

If Pulse is trying to be the cutting edge station, why are they playing "Let the Music Play" by Shannon?

If you dont play songs like that, cut their listening audience in half. That song is a classic. NYC loves freestyle music as does the rest of jersey and Philadelphia. You cant come in playing just current dance music. It wont work. You need familiars to keep the audience listening.

On a 'KTU, people would expect that. I'd even hype that on 'KTU. But on a station that's supposed to be current leaning, at best maybe ONE classic freestyle track every 3 hours or so. Recurrents should be at 8 years max. I deal with the freestyle boards and as much as they would like for something new to appear, it can never happen if the classic sounds continue to hold the genre back (yeah, I'm talking fan based in that respect). Some familiars yes.....and 'KTU does that well. A few on Pulse, but as you know, Pulse "branded" itself as current leaning. Current pop remixes....fine. Edgier dance....fine. But not freestyle as if it was 1987 all over again.

If there demos are 18-34, the people that are 34 grew up listening to the freestyle. You were at Beatstock did you not notice the audience going wild when any of the freestyle acts went on? The lawn seats are made up of kids in their late teens and twenties. They love freestyle. Why on earth would a dance station not play that? You ask the majority of people who they have heard of Stevie B or Ben DJ, what do you think the answer would be? You have to play those familiars to gain an audience. Ive been to four sold out freestyle shows this past year. The majority of the people hit that Demographic to a "T" My station we brand ourselves current too, but we do play the classics. Thats why we are successful.

 

[JohnParker]

It's the same argument every few months. Pulse plays songs like "Let The Music Play" because it's a big Tri-State area classic and it people love it. That doesn't take away from anything else they do. If you can't sit through a classic once or twice an hour that's kind of your business. But the majority of people not only love those songs but they don't mind hearing them over and over again. It's a matter of taste.

To say that Pulse is a current leaning station is correct. The fact that they play classics a couple of times an hour doesn't change that. The very definition of "leaning" backs that up.

Pulse has shown growth since their inception. They do have a lot of things working against them as we all know. But at some point, a station has to show a potential for profit. If it does, it stays. If not, it doesn't. The clock is ticking on Pulse because the digital switch is taking place and while the LPTV stations haven't been effected yet they eventually will be. Be it next year or 5 years from now, it's going to happen.

My main hope would be that Joel can get the station to a point where another big player in the city would take notice and say hey why not give the format a shot here. A dance format that is similar to Pulse (classics included) could do well enough to stick around for a while on a good dial position. A dance format filled with nothing but music from the last 5 years would be gone in less than 18 months. Their just isn't a big enough fan base to allow that to happen.

jp

 

[lalumia]

my goodness, the same coversations overandoverand like.....like classic dance tracks on the radio;
Dance as a viable commercial format is dead and buried; get over it already.....

 

[DanceDiva3]

i hate those tired songs.. the freestyle and classics. leave them for Lite FM or something. They are burnt to a crisp and how many more times can I hear Shannon, "Let The Music Play"- How about "Let it NOT Play" and Samantha Fox ? what the F**? Those are just corny and i'm already 31. Imagine a 21 year old? They can't relate to it AT ALL !!!!

 

[Jeffrey]

The clock is ticking on Pulse because the digital switch is taking place and while the LPTV stations haven't been effected yet they eventually will be. Be it next year or 5 years from now, it's going to happen.

question......if LPTV stations will eventually be affected with the digital switch over, isn't it possible that WNYZ could apply for a license to broadcast as a radio station on it's current frequency?

 

[Morpheux]

i hate those tired songs.. the freestyle and classics. leave them for Lite FM or something. They are burnt to a crisp and how many more times can I hear Shannon, "Let The Music Play"- How about "Let it NOT Play" and Samantha Fox ? what the F**? Those are just corny and i'm already 31. Imagine a 21 year old? They can't relate to it AT ALL !!!!

Funny,when I play some of these "tired" songs on the dance floor I get a good reception. Nevermind that many of today's pop stars sample songs from the 80's.

 

[lalumia]

the handful of 'fanboys' on line are committed to the 'concept' of a new dance station, paying no mind to the zero public interest, lack of a 'star' to draw attention to the genre,and a slew of street records brealing big on the street and in the clubs,reflected by sales, itunes, etc...
it's all conceptual, no meat and potatoes; everyone needs a reality check

 

[TonySantiago]

I was away for a bit and there are SO many responses that I would like to address on this.

There is NO question about freestyle being hugely popular in New York City. The songs may have an average age of 20, give or take, but there's still a response; I can acknowledge that. Yet, how can people KNOW of a BenDJ if the 253,322,223th play of (insert freestyle artist and song of that era) gets in? Not that I have ANYTHING against freestyle, I really don't. Judy Torres came out with "Hell No" and I'd spin that! Carlos Berrios came out with a compilation of artists earlier in the year. There were a couple of tracks in there that I'd consider in order to bring a current aspect. That could bring the NEWER music to the 18-34 generation. I'm just saying.....how can things thrive down the road with a genre of dance whose population continues to get older and older with nothing new being given the chance to "breathe". And if the new material can tap to the 18-34 crowd as their "generation" of freestyle, then that's a beautiful thing!

Seriously, I'd love to see a programmer in NYC "proper" (whoever it is, Joel, Jeff Z, new "blood" to the market with experience) do a dance format with a strong lean to a "BPM" (before the merger). Such a station would NOT purge itself in 18 months. Not in New York City anyway. Pulse can be thanked for that since they have played currents! It would have the edgier currents, the pop-remixes, even hip-hop as long as there's a bit of a dance lean to it. And yes, being a NYC station, FREESTYLE! It's just a matter of artists getting back to the studios and produce new, original, freestyle material. If freestyle already has that familiarity with the audience that craves it, then if K7 or Cynthia came out with something spank new for 2009, people would be able to accept and open to it....the same way I saw the audience open up to Judy Torres at Webster Hall when she did "Hell No". If anything, it would be a refreshing change for those that are sick and tired of the same old songs and a revitalization of that specific dance genre.

And with new tracks coming from the "legends", it also opens up a new generation of artists (in their 20's) to come along and they get radio airplay in the process. Win Win! Get in the new and merge in from the old. And with freestyle being as popular now as it was then, no station would take a negative "hit" on this. I mean hey, all of those 20 year old freestyle classics were once SPANK NEW. And how did that happen???

 

[Dancerev889]

I was away for a bit and there are SO many responses that I would like to address on this.

There is NO question about freestyle being hugely popular in New York City. The songs may have an average age of 20, give or take, but there's still a response; I can acknowledge that. Yet, how can people KNOW of a BenDJ if the 253,322,223th play of (insert freestyle artist and song of that era) gets in? Not that I have ANYTHING against freestyle, I really don't. Judy Torres came out with "Hell No" and I'd spin that! Carlos Berrios came out with a compilation of artists earlier in the year. There were a couple of tracks in there that I'd consider in order to bring a current aspect. That could bring the NEWER music to the 18-34 generation. I'm just saying.....how can things thrive down the road with a genre of dance whose population continues to get older and older with nothing new being given the chance to "breathe". And if the new material can tap to the 18-34 crowd as their "generation" of freestyle, then that's a beautiful thing!

Seriously, I'd love to see a programmer in NYC "proper" (whoever it is, Joel, Jeff Z, new "blood" to the market with experience) do a dance format with a strong lean to a "BPM" (before the merger). Such a station would NOT purge itself in 18 months. Not in New York City anyway. Pulse can be thanked for that since they have played currents! It would have the edgier currents, the pop-remixes, even hip-hop as long as there's a bit of a dance lean to it. And yes, being a NYC station, FREESTYLE! It's just a matter of artists getting back to the studios and produce new, original, freestyle material. If freestyle already has that familiarity with the audience that craves it, then if K7 or Cynthia came out with something spank new for 2009, people would be able to accept and open to it....the same way I saw the audience open up to Judy Torres at Webster Hall when she did "Hell No". If anything, it would be a refreshing change for those that are sick and tired of the same old songs and a revitalization of that specific dance genre.

And with new tracks coming from the "legends", it also opens up a new generation of artists (in their 20's) to come along and they get radio airplay in the process. Win Win! Get in the new and merge in from the old. And with freestyle being as popular now as it was then, no station would take a negative "hit" on this. I mean hey, all of those 20 year old freestyle classics were once SPANK NEW. And how did that happen???

You are speaking like a fan and not like a programmer. One of the reasons Pulse plays a classic record is because it is KTU's bread and butter. So now a listener of KTU is driving in their car and scanning the FM dial and they come across 87.7 and hear TKA Maria, they are going to stay and listen. Its good marketing. After TKA they can play Ben DJ. If Pulse plays lets say 13 songs an hour and 4 are gold records, thats still 9 records that are new. Whats the problem with that? BPM is a niche station. A current only dance station right now wont work. Where is the core artist to help push it? If Pulse did that they would have shut the doors on the station last April because it wont work. The hardcore dance fan audience is small, but the causal fan is a lot larger.

New freestyle songs for the most part are awful. Thats why Judy has gone in different direction

 

[TonySantiago]

You are speaking like a fan and not like a programmer. One of the reasons Pulse plays a classic record is because it is KTU's bread and butter. So now a listener of KTU is driving in their car and scanning the FM dial and they come across 87.7 and hear TKA Maria, they are going to stay and listen. Its good marketing. After TKA they can play Ben DJ. If Pulse plays lets say 13 songs an hour and 4 are gold records, thats still 9 records that are new. Whats the problem with that? BPM is a niche station. A current only dance station right now wont work. Where is the core artist to help push it? If Pulse did that they would have shut the doors on the station last April because it wont work. The hardcore dance fan audience is small, but the causal fan is a lot larger.

New freestyle songs for the most part are awful. Thats why Judy has gone in different direction

Thank God I am a fan!

Brett, from my end the New York Dance Music Coalition has always been about getting the entire dance music "collective" under one umbrella to push awareness with dance music with the intention of getting more radio airplay on the FM dial.` It has expanded, since its "humble beginnings", to include online streamers, podcasters, as well as emerging technologies (aka smartphones, 3G car stereos, etc).

In the beginnings this WAS a fan based organization only. I did some college radio (though not enough) to have some inkling of what radio is about. When the coalition started, I knew off the bat that just people saying "we want dance music" wasn't enough. So I had gathered up as much information about radio as possible, wrote newsletters and sent them around to the dance oriented record stores (this all done BEFORE the Internet took off as it did) as well as the media. Along the way, DJ's, clubs, promoters, record labels, radio industry, and artists joined us in support of what we were trying to do and it was clear then that in order for things to prosper, we had to look into our own "house" to see how things could possibly change and improve, since there wasn't the huge money that larger labels could afford.

I approach things in the manner that I do, certainly not apolgetic for it, because despite my thoughts, rants, studies, etc., I am still a fan deep down. As such, when fellow dance music fans talk to me, I listen and try to be as fair-minded as possible. We've created that "outlet" because there was no central source in the past. And it all goes under the basic logic that one person alone can't succeed, but as a group we can accomplish more. So, whatever I say post in here and other boards (and not just radio), more or less, come direct from the fan's mouth based on feedback they are giving me, since they either DON'T know who to turn to or fear that whatever they say will fall on corporate "deaf ears". The only numbers that matter to the coalition are the amount of people in our group.

I had to go into that large intro first since this isn't the first time you had gotten to me about being a fan vs. a programmer. I've known you here for quite awhile and am well aware of your reputation, which is positive. I'm not out to step on your toes at all; I thought we were, at the very least "amicable" towards one another. We may not always agree on things but we do want what is best for dance music as a whole.

Getting back to post, I'm not suggesting that freestyle be TOTALLY thrown out of the window. Yeah, Pulse and 'KTU get listenership via freestyle. And for 'KTU being a 25-54 station with most of the listeners that grew up with that sound from the Hot 97 days, it makes perfect sense. The majority of people AT Beatstock were still 'KTU fans...some weren't even aware, even at 6 months that there was a Pulse 87, because of their anomalies. But for Pulse being current, I don't think they should harp on freestyle to the extent that they do. Not saying NEVER play it, but for what it is...not like 1988 (yeah, I'm repeating myself on this). And regarding "gold" records, there are other dance tracks that could be heard from other genres but aren't; I always have realized that recurrents play a role. however, those 4 gold records don't ALL have to be freestyle. And I would say the same thing on that....don't harp on it as if we were living in that "time". 9 currents within there, fine!

BPM, before the merger, came off with a Z-100 style playlist of currents. That's eventually the direction I would like to see for dance music and hopefully down the road, it will. Core artist? I thought Cascada was it. But if it has to take R&B remixes to establish a core for dance in this country, I would not have any problem seeing Chris Brown, Beyonce or Akon "represent".

Regarding new freestyle, I've heard a few. Yeah, there are tracks that I would never want to hear ever again, but there are others that deserve a chance. And if the "freestyle legends" did something current and caught the attention of fans at a Beatstock event, radio would perhaps open up to it. I wish for next year those legends can do more and be able to perform new material, if they have it.

Yeah, I am a fan...but one that will give his right arm for the music if it helps!

 

[TonySantiago]

To add, I don't think a station like "Area" on Sirius XM could ever work on terrestrial.

"Area" is a bit TOO strong. I'll tune in but you definitely won't get the casual or even certain core fans wanting to flock to this type of station on an FM dial.

 

[JohnParker]

question......if LPTV stations will eventually be affected with the digital switch over, isn't it possible that WNYZ could apply for a license to broadcast as a radio station on it's current frequency?

I'm not really qualified to answer that but maybe somebody else with more knowledge or the FCC rules could. Any takers?

 

[JohnParker]

There is NO question about freestyle being hugely popular in New York City. The songs may have an average age of 20, give or take, but there's still a response; I can acknowledge that. Yet, how can people KNOW of a BenDJ if the 253,322,223th play of (insert freestyle artist and song of that era) gets in?

If you know how to properly program a station it's real easy. When you play a classic twice an hour you leave 10 - 12 other slots for newer music. It keeps your upper demos happy and you can satify the fans of the genre.

I'm just saying.....how can things thrive down the road with a genre of dance whose population continues to get older and older with nothing new being given the chance to "breathe". And if the new material can tap to the 18-34 crowd as their "generation" of freestyle, then that's a beautiful thing!

Any station that tries to cater to dance fans and then limits them to a demo of 18-34 will be in business for a very short period of time, if they ever even get the shot to program. Their isn't enough support. As for allowing new music a chance to breathe, see above. 10 - 12 slots an hour for music from the last 4 years is more than enough room.

Seriously, I'd love to see a programmer in NYC "proper" (whoever it is, Joel, Jeff Z, new "blood" to the market with experience) do a dance format with a strong lean to a "BPM" (before the merger). Such a station would NOT purge itself in 18 months. Not in New York City anyway. Pulse can be thanked for that since they have played currents!

Brooklyn is NYC proper so you pretty much already have that in Pulse (with the classics added) and I'd bet that if you asked any of those programmers, that you mentioned, they would tell you that you need to program familiar music. Joel and Jeff were in NYC programming and both did it that way(Classics added). And guess what, it worked. If it didn't they wouldn't have played the classics.

I'm sure that with the PPM in place if there was such a big demand for this kind of station, a station like Pulse would be able to capitalize on it but guess what, they still play classics. Why? I'm guessing the their PPM reponses are showing them it's a good bet.

Plus if there is such a call for new, unfamiliar dance music at the radio level shouldn't there be a booming NYC club business where all these people would be going to hear it? I speak with NYC club owners regularly at the cities biggest venues and the business is no where near what it was years ago. And that was before the economy collapse.

And yes, being a NYC station, FREESTYLE! It's just a matter of artists getting back to the studios and produce new, original, freestyle material. If freestyle already has that familiarity with the audience that craves it, then if K7 or Cynthia came out with something spank new for 2009, people would be able to accept and open to it....the same way I saw the audience open up to Judy Torres at Webster Hall when she did "Hell No". If anything, it would be a refreshing change for those that are sick and tired of the same old songs and a revitalization of that specific dance genre. And with new tracks coming from the "legends", it also opens up a new generation of artists (in their 20's) to come along and they get radio airplay in the process. Win Win! Get in the new and merge in from the old. And with freestyle being as popular now as it was then, no station would take a negative "hit" on this. I mean hey, all of those 20 year old freestyle classics were once SPANK NEW. And how did that happen???

As someone that has fought hard to give exposure to freestyle artists new music by signing them, I can tell you that people are interested in the classics first and then to a much lesser extent, something new from the artist. I've worked with the best and this is true in every case. Never confuse a club reaction to what would work at radio. It's like picking songs for your station based on requests alone. Do that and you'll make a very small portion of your audience happy and possibly annoying a good deal of them. You can use requests as one part of the equation, nothing wrong with that.

Again, the amount of people that are "sick and tired of the same old songs" are in the grand minority. Case in point, WKTU's numbers haven't been this good in 10 years. The annual Freestyle show sells out Madison Square Garden every year for the past 3, maybe 4, years. How many current dance music/electronica/trance/electro shows have done that? I'm thinking zero. At the Beatstock shows, who do people come to see? It's the classic artists and that's why they are there every year. And it's also why the stadium empties after the Freestyle portion.

jp

 

[nd2023]

10,000 people, including me, attended Party 105's Mega Jam last summer.

 

[JohnParker]

10,000 people, including me, attended Party 105's Mega Jam last summer.

Vic has always done great shows with Party but it all fairness it should be noted that this past summers Mega Jam was part of a 3 day balloon festival and there is no way to actually know who was there just for the Party show, the balloon festival or the other rock acts that were performing that day.

My favorites were the shows that Party used to do at the Brookhaven Amputheatre.

jp

 

[lalumia]

well,you certainly let the air out of those balloons, JP....lol...

 

[Morpheux]

Don't want to beat a dead horse,they just had Freestyle Explosion @ Nokia theater in Los Angeles. The place looks like it was sold out. All ages. I would say 60% were in the 20's and the rest 30 or above. Expose still looks great.

http://www.newyorkfreestyle.com/freestyle/showthread.php?p=37690#post37690

 

[FM Free NY]

Two thought's on this thread. As per Julia leaving for sunny pastures, much luck to her at the CBS Radio sta. in Tampa. Now not bash on the dear woman, but her choice in roation for the station was very soo leaning very AC Rythmic as oppose to being "NY's Dance Music Leader". When one here's that, it can mean anything with a beat behind to the avg listener. But to the core music folks or Radio head's, it would be carbon copy of what WKTU has been using as their positioning statement for years..

Now we all have to remember when WKTU relaunched on to the 103.5 Freq. there was atleast 2-3yr's of Dance Music being NOT played on FM NY radio, though Glenn Friscia was still playing them on QHT/HOT97 as mix show til '96 as the station was already All Urban/Hip hop. There was no outlet for it. An come that Febuary afternoon when we all heard C&C being played on the radio followed by another dance song then another.. We all knew, ok Dance was here again, and so all the music "The New KTU" was playing were records that were released from 1993-1996. So to the club scene those records were old, to radio in NY it was brand new.

An as the station grew the library did aswell, mind you we all know the succession of KTU and to some it's demise.. Now as to 87.7 I personaly see it going the way of QHT/Hot back when it was launched in 1986. It was very progressive from Summer 1986 through it's Freq Swop back in Sept of 1988. Come late '89/early '90 the station was leaning more Mainstream and less progressive. Now I'm not saying Pulse will go all CHR/Mainstream. But as to the music selection of of Urban records one would think it's trying to appeal to 18-34, aswell 25-54..

We all have our ideal's as to what the direction musically the station should go in. But if I may throw in my "two cents", as per the Music Rotation a True CHR station will not play a "Gold" aka Old song from out of the past 10yr's in rotation. It's 2009, meaning song's from 1989-1999 should be a rarity on station like that. An be alocated to mix show or a special feature ie a "Flashback Tune" played maybe once per shift. Now song's from 1999-2006 should be peppered into the Current's aswell as doing a "Fresh out the Create" feature of playing a fresh off the pressing new artist or song from over seas.. As per there Dance mixes of Urban-Pop/Dance freindly song's, they aswell should be sprinkled in. For you have to remember you have Z1OO during it's mixshows playing them and KTU aswell in rotation.

Now nothing against Freestyle or Classic House, I am Die hard fan of it. But in order to keep "Dance Music" alive, "we gotta push the feeling on" in the word's Nightcrawlers.. And by playing Freestlye on CHR station defeat's the premise of being CHR. Had 102.7 still gone the route of Being AC/Rythmic to go up against KTU, then there would've been two proper outlets for it.. Remember folks it may have felt like 1989 was like 10yr's ago.. sadly it's now 20! Music has to evolve as does the station playing that form of music.